From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 09:13:15 1997 Date: Tue, 01 Jul 1997 09:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "Todd B Peer" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. X-Mailer: MailRoom v2.1e >1) I took the MSF course this weekend. I did not pass. What I got instead was >a LOT of experience picking up a Rebel. (It's actually fairly easy, but then >it was a 250.) Instructors said that I had good potential, and felt my >problems were: > a) being 4'11" and having a hard time reaching the controls > b) no experience on a bicycle - ie I didn't have that balance thing going > c) the Rebel is a tough bike to learn on > >So here's the problem. I bought a '96 Shadow 600. She's georgous. She's >showroom. She's heavy as a water buffalo. Even with a lowering package and >bent-back handlebars (not yet installed), is it reasonable for me to start on >her? No. By what you've said previous to your question of being reasonable, the answer must be no. Sorry, I empathize and understand your dilemma. If there is a way for you to keep the bike, and learn on something lighter and less a worry to drop now and then, do it. Squeakers wrote: I personally think that if the rebel 250 was difficult to begin with, then the Shadow 600 will be EXTREMELY difficult. Agreed I started out on a Sporty. When I ordered the bike, I signed up for the MSF classes. They didnt have ANY bikes for us vertically challenged folks at that time, so I had to learn on a bike that kept me up on my toes. Luckily, I passed. 'course, then I got on the Sporty and promptly dropped it. Then I got on it again. And dropped it again. A heavy bike was just too much for me to learn on. Agreed again. However, you will probably agree that now that you've got some miles, the heaviness is a secondary concern to once it was primary. You have to remember, that since you arent used to riding ANYTHING, you not only have to get the feel of "balance", but ALSO of using throttle thingys and clutch thingys and the weight of a bike all at once. And "leaning" and "looking kewl" etcetcetc.... We went looking around, and found me a used (i.e. cheap) rebel 250 to practice on. Im only 5 feet flat, and not the most muscle bound woman on earth, had never ridden or driven anything that wasnt equipped with "automatic" and hadnt ridden a bicycle in... I dont care to discuss how many years. After trying out a few different bikes, and talking to a LOT of OTHER height challenged women, I learned that, in actuality, the Rebel 250 is the easiest of all the bikes to learn on. Its light, very low and handles very easily. The Savage 450 also got alot of high marks, but that was mostly for women that were a tad over 5 feet. You really do need to be able to master and feel comfortable on a smaller bike like the Rebel BEFORE you try riding a bigger, heavier bike that could easily overpower you. You need to keep up the determined attitude to accomplish everything you have a desire to do. But with riding, we also have to balance determination with safety. An accident on a bike can be, and unfortunately often is.... catastrophic. Take it easy. Start slow. Work up. I figure if *I* can do it, then anyone can! :) I cant stress enough my opinion on this. If the bike is too big and heavy to feel comfortable on, and you're JUST learning, then please please please consider a smaller used bike. Life's too short to shorten it even more. Well. You know what they say about opinions. :) Yes we do. And I agree with your points exactly. FYI, I am 5'-8" w/a 30" inseam. I have over 10 years and 75,000 miles experience. My first real road bike was an '83 500 Shadow which I still have. It's not in the best shape anymore, but she's an old love I can't seem to give up :-) My next real road bike purchase was a '92 CB750 Nitehawk. Because of its greater weight (than the 500), it was intimidating to me. After about a month though I was acclimated to it and discovered the joy of motorcycling again as if I'd never been riding! Such a strange phenomena. Just recently I purchased a 700lb ST1100 that has a 32" saddle height and I can tell you that even with the experience, I was even more intimidated by this bike than the 750. If not for my sense of balance developed over time on other 'lighter' motorcycles, I surely would have gotten a LOT of experience picking up an ST shortly after buying it. But, again after about a month of riding this bike, that big Sh**-eating grin that comes with re-opening the doors of new experience was/is pasted square on my face. This is not a woman/man thing. It is a practice thing and it is a learning thing that never ends. As long as you have the bug and you take the time to understand this sport, you will progress over and over again. Good luck Sharon. Todd PS. I walked over to my 500 the other day to move it around in the garage. There was a time that I considered this bike "heavy as a water buffalo" too. The thought that came to mind while moving it was "it's such a toy, so light". Well, with time our perspectives change to, eh? From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 09:49:00 1997 X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.00.00 Date: Tue, 01 Jul 97 09:25:51 -0800 From: "Joe Snider" To: Subject: FS: 1980 Yamaha 400 Special MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 1980 Yamaha XS400SG "Special" - 12,500 miles, new rear tire, new chain, new rear brakes, new plugs. Good condition, runs well. Includes cover, and possibly saddle bags if I can be talked into it. I am selling for a variety of personal reasons, not because I want to part with the bike. The only major problem is the electric starter does not work well, but it has a kick start which has been perfectly fine for me. Supposedly it is the brushes, which Crossroads Cycles quoted me about $230 to replace. Also included in the package is the Haynes manual which shows how to do this. Joe Snider joe_snider@XXXXXX h: 703-920-6347 w: 703-873-2916 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 10:08:25 1997 X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Tue, 01 Jul 97 10:07:38 -0500 From: "Mehran Firouzbakht" To: , , , , Subject: Re[2]: Help! 2 questions. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My wife took the MSF course and she dropped the rebel 3 times in one day. She did although catch on and finally pass the course with flying colors. She is only 5' tall. The first bike I ever bought her was a Suzuki GS850. It was low enough for her to handle. Her first time on the bike, she drove it all the way to Ocean City, Nonstop. She never once dropped her bike. Six months later she finally fessed up and admitted that the bike was too heavy to pull in and out of tight spots. So I bought her a 250 Ninja. She loves the fact that she can move it around so easily. My point is that if you practice long enough and don't let the bike intimidate you, any old bike can make you wanna fly as long as you can keep your feet on the ground or atleast touch the ground. PS. We've moved our bikes inside of a van before and all we used were normal tie downs. The van was equipped with holes and spots to use those tie downs though. We put a piece of plywood and a mattress between the bikes to prevent any damage. >1) I took the MSF course this weekend. I did not pass. What I got instead was >a LOT of experience picking up a Rebel. (It's actually fairly easy, but then >it was a 250.) Instructors said that I had good potential, and felt my >problems were: > a) being 4'11" and having a hard time reaching the controls > b) no experience on a bicycle - ie I didn't have that balance thing going > c) the Rebel is a tough bike to learn on > >So here's the problem. I bought a '96 Shadow 600. She's georgous. She's >showroom. She's heavy as a water buffalo. Even with a lowering package and >bent-back handlebars (not yet installed), is it reasonable for me to start on >her? Or do I need to give her up and get a smaller junk bike to learn on? >Finances will probably not allow keeping her and buying another. > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 10:37:13 1997 Date: Tue, 01 Jul 1997 10:35:54 -0700 From: Bill Schmidt X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Barbelle14@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mehran Firouzbakht wrote: > > PS. We've moved our bikes inside of a van before and all we used were > normal tie downs. The van was equipped with holes and spots to use > those tie downs though. We put a piece of plywood and a mattress > between the bikes to prevent any damage. > One additional suggestion is to make sure that you fasten the tie downs tight enough to compress the suspension part way to keep the bike(s) from walking. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 10:46:34 1997 Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 10:20:05 -0400 X-Sender: squeaks@XXXXXX X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: "Todd B Peer" , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Squeakers Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. >I started out on a Sporty. >When I ordered the bike, I signed up for the MSF classes. They didnt have >ANY bikes for us vertically challenged folks at that time, so I had to learn >on a bike that kept me up on my toes. Luckily, I passed. 'course, then I got >on the Sporty and promptly dropped it. Then I got on it again. And dropped >it again. A heavy bike was just too much for me to learn on. > > Agreed again. However, you will probably agree that now that > you've got some miles, the heaviness is a secondary concern to > once it was primary. > Yup! :) I can ride the Sporty now with NO problems. I just needed a year of riding the little bike to get the feel of riding, and all the mechanics down to where I dont have to conciously think... "clutch in" "brakes on the right foot" "gears on the left foot" "lean into this turn" etcetc. The only part that I still have to adjust to is putting the bike down on the kickstand. The little Rebel is so light I can just kick the stand down and practically throw the bike down on it. Not so with the Sporty. NOT...SO..... :) Squeakers From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 11:14:54 1997 X-Sender: cnorloff@XXXXXX X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 01 Jul 1997 11:09:45 -0400 To: Barbelle14@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Chris Norloff Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. In-Reply-To: <970630214437_-1696335759@emout16.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >1) I took the MSF course this weekend. I did not pass. What I got instead was >a LOT of experience picking up a Rebel. (It's actually fairly easy, but then >it was a 250.) Instructors said that I had good potential, and felt my >problems were: > a) being 4'11" and having a hard time reaching the controls A fellow instructor was about that height, and she had no problem. Be sure the rear springs are adjusted so the bike sits as low as it goes. Be sure the handlebars and the hand levers are adjusted for your arms. > b) no experience on a bicycle - ie I didn't have that balance thing going None? If you can't balance a bicycle easily and comfortably, then I wouldn't even try to teach you how to ride a motorcycle. Balancing a two-wheeler must be second-nature before you can take on the added complexities of operating controls with both feet & both hands, and watching for road hazards, and watching to other traffic, and choosing your route. > c) the Rebel is a tough bike to learn on Nonsense. I taught hundreds of students over 8 years of teaching in Maryland, on Rebels. They're fine bikes. >So here's the problem. I bought a '96 Shadow 600. She's georgous. She's >showroom. She's heavy as a water buffalo. Even with a lowering package and >bent-back handlebars (not yet installed), is it reasonable for me to start on >her? Or do I need to give her up and get a smaller junk bike to learn on? Pass that MSF course. Use their bike to drop. If you can't control a 300-lb. 250cc bike, you will be unable to control a 450-lb (or whatever) 600cc bike. > SBL theory says if you want it badly enough you can do it - and I am >*not* the quitting type. But I feel that given my height and (lack of) >experience I need to be realistic about this. Practice on a bicycle until you have two-wheel balance down pat. Take the MSF course again. Tell the instructor(s) about your concern, and ask that they adjust the rear springs, handlebars, and hand levers for YOU. It's easy, and takes only a couple minutes. 99% of the instructors I taught with and who worked for me would go out of their way to help a student who needs extra help and who specifically asks for something (like adjusting the bike). >2) We are moving to Pheonix (look for mail, Sian!) from Wash. DC. We need a >van for furniture, plus have two cars and two bikes (his Ninja and my >Shadow). I am not capable of riding a bike crosscountry *yet*. How the hell >do we get everything there? Is there a way to lock down the bikes within the >moving van? Then we could tow one car behind the van (him driving) and I'll >drive the other car. If so, how do you keep stuff from falling on the bikes >inside? Tow one car with the truck (get a dolly so the car rolls on the un-driven wheels). Drive the other car. Tow the bikes in a trailer behind the car, or rent a bigger truck and tie the bikes inside the truck. Rental trucks have tie-down rails on both sides of the cargo area. Pack securely, pad everything (get twice as many furniture pads as you think you'll need). I just tied my bike inside the back of the truck (just inside the rear door) and then put stuff on each side of it. Did great. Chris Norloff From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 11:59:37 1997 From: Amit Chatterjie To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" Subject: RE: Help! 2 questions. Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 11:58:52 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) > ---------- > From: Barbelle14@XXXXXX[SMTP:Barbelle14@XXXXXX] > Sent: Monday, June 30, 1997 9:44 PM > To: wist@XXXXXX; sbl@XXXXXX; dc-cycles@XXXXXX > Subject: Help! 2 questions. > > Hi! This is Sharon again. I have two dilemmas, and I'm hoping all you > wise > women out there can help! Well... and the short guys on sbl. Oh, and I > guess > *everyone* on DC-Cycles. You're allowed. :-) > As a man with 27yrs riding in 4 continents I may not qualify for your selection criteria but I'll go ahead anyway. Presumptious right? Right. I think everyone has answered question 2 sufficiently. As for question 1, I started out on a moped. I learnt 2 important things. 1) Balance 2) How to crash. I know many people regard crashing as this unknown thing or something they never want to experience. Fact is, there is a high probability it will happen. Fear plays a big factor in hampering your learning curve. So, I would take my moped (once I felt comfortable with it) out on a dust path (or someplace with less traction than a wet road) and try corners practicing skids, slides, somersaults (just kidding), etc. er...proper attire is required. I practiced crashing with rolls, slides. This built up my confidence so that when a crash occured on the road I would not close my eyes and leave it up to fate. My personal feeling is that 80% of injuries by accidents can be reduced or avoided by reducing panic just prior and during an accident. Takes practice. Anyway, back to the subject. My reccomendation is buy a moped & practice till you feel VERY comfortable. It shouldn't cost you much so you should be able to keep your main ride. Then you will be as confident as my friend in Italy who used to ride a Honda CB750 in the 70's. He couldn't reach the ground so he always had to stop at sidewalks. At traffic lights he used to have to get off the bike to hold it! Happy Ridin, Amit CBR1000 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 12:47:44 1997 From: Dark Hacker Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 12:47:25 -0400 (EDT) To: Todd.B.Peer@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. My two cents, When I started riding, I decided to buy a motorcycle only AFTER I had convinced myself that riding a motorcycle was something I could do without killing myself and that meant successfully passing the MSF course. My favorite bike in the course was the Nighthawk 250... a nice general purpose training vehicle. After a couple years of riding experience I've discovered that balance, intuition for lean and motion, and the ability to work a bike's controls fluidly and unconciously are all necessary. If you don't have a handle on the balance and motion of riding a bicycle, you probably won't do well on a motorcycle. I've also found that riding isn't about strength and manhandling that 600 lbs of machinery around corners. It actually takes very little strength to manuever a motorcycle. Good riders learn how to make the *bike* do all the work with a minimal amount of input. - Hacker From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 13:40:55 1997 From: FakeTree@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 13:39:35 -0400 (EDT) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Bent Back Handlebars Somehow, I missed the beginning of this thread, but...I noticed that you have some bent back handlebars for your Shadow. My wife is a petite 5'3" and also recently purchased a beautiful 1996 Shadow. She is an experienced rider (learned and rode a Rebel for about a year), but I think she would be more comfortable with bent backs. Can you tell me where you got them? Thanks! JB Haller 1990 Suzuki VX-800 FakeTree@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 14:32:20 1997 X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.00.00 Date: Tue, 01 Jul 97 14:16:50 -0800 From: "Joe Snider" To: , Subject: Re[2]: FS: 1980 Yamaha 400 Special MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Whooops. Sorry about that. I am asking $500. Thought I had put that in there. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: FS: 1980 Yamaha 400 Special Author: at smtpgw Date: 7/1/97 10:22 AM How much??????? ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: FS: 1980 Yamaha 400 Special Author: "Joe Snider" at Internet Date: 7/1/97 9:25 AM 1980 Yamaha XS400SG "Special" - 12,500 miles, new rear tire, new chain, new rear brakes, new plugs. Good condition, runs well. Includes cover, and possibly saddle bags if I can be talked into it. I am selling for a variety of personal reasons, not because I want to part with the bike. The only major problem is the electric starter does not work well, but it has a kick start which has been perfectly fine for me. Supposedly it is the brushes, which Crossroads Cycles quoted me about $230 to replace. Also included in the package is the Haynes manual which shows how to do this. Joe Snider joe_snider@XXXXXX h: 703-920-6347 w: 703-873-2916 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 14:46:25 1997 From: mobacc@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 14:46:12 -0400 X-Sender: mobacc@XXXXXX X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) At 11:58 AM 7/1/97 -0400, Amit Chatterjie wrote: . . . I would take my moped (once I felt comfortable with >it) out on a dust path (or someplace with less traction than a wet road) >and try corners practicing skids, slides, somersaults (just kidding), >etc. er...proper attire is required. I practiced crashing with rolls, >slides. This built up my confidence so that when a crash occured on the >road I would not close my eyes and leave it up to fate. My personal >feeling is that 80% of injuries by accidents can be reduced or avoided >by reducing panic just prior and during an accident. Takes practice. > > Anyway, back to the subject. My reccomendation is buy a moped & >practice till you feel VERY comfortable. It shouldn't cost you much > . . . Yes. Poignant for me. As a mature urban first biker (MSF and more) this spring, am at a 3,000 mile stage where I yearn for a skill-wrenching survival workout. But don't want to put my pretty bike at risk or chance buying bandages. I remember private pilot training stalls and spins. Sports car gymkhanas (lotsa rubber lost). Windsurfing at 35+ knots. But want just the experience to be a prepared MC recreational rider, not the sporting entree. Want to be ready for, then try to avoid, then join and coopt chaos. Instantly. Wide Receiver survival. Have read about some techniques (highside roll, lowside skid, etc.) but want to be coached for and practice them. (Probably a gyrational cut above the experienced rider courses; possibly a racing or MX intro course?) Like outstanding MSF, would like a course that supplies virtually everything, close to DC, and lets me twist and gnaw at my skills and emotions (but not my skin or bike). Suggestions? Or pockmarked moped and crash gear rental anyplace {:>? ***Bill Swanson '96 EN500LTD From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 15:14:18 1997 Date: Tue, 01 Jul 1997 15:12:27 -0700 From: Bill Schmidt X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mobacc@XXXXXX CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit mobacc@XXXXXX wrote: > coopt chaos. Instantly. Wide Receiver survival. Have read about some > techniques (highside roll, lowside skid, etc.) but want to be coached for > and practice them. I don't think you want to practice the highside! One of the problems I'd guess you'd have with the moped approach and the translation of that experience to the world of big bikes is the lack of power--both go and stop--of the moped. You be better off with a trail bike, decent protective gear, and some open fields for the kind of practice you seem to be seeking. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 16:47:04 1997 Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 15:46:18 -0500 (CDT) From: "Martha E. Moore" To: Squeakers Cc: Barbelle14@XXXXXX, wist@XXXXXX, sbl@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.16.19970630223109.39cf42de@pop.erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII This is very interesting to me. After a few years as a passenger, I decided to learn to ride myself. I took a motorcycle safety class, and almost didn't pass. I had the same problem--being too short. I'd always been on low-riders and didn't dream that these "little" bikes would be too tall for me! I dropped bikes in class five times, became totally intimidated and at one point I started to cry and wanted to leave. I'm sure I would have left that day, but my boyfriend had dropped me off and I didn't have any way of getting home. I did finish and I did pass, but only barely. The only bike that was low enough for me to feel comfortable with was a 125, and by the time we took the skills test, I decided that was the only bike I could test on if I didn't want to drop my bike during the "evaluation" (which results in failing the course). So, now I'm "stuck" with only a class L license. Of course I can still take the DMV road test on a bigger bike and get a class M, but I'm faced with the problem of gaining experience on a bigger bike without having a valid license. The course did teach me a lot. I'm a better passenger when I ride with my boyfriend because I understand what he's faced with in different situations. I'm a better car driver and a better pedestrian. In my mind I know I can ride a motorcycle if I can find the right bike to start on. I agree with some of the other responses--I'm looking for a smaller bike that is in somewhat "rough" condition to start with. I don't want to freak over the first dent or scratch. All I need is practice and confidence. Luckily, I live less than a mile from the safety course and I can get that practice fairly easily. I've looked at an older Rebel 250, and I thought it might work. I also know what I want down the road--I'm totally in love with the Virago. I sat on a 750 in the showroom and it's the one bike where EVERYTHING feels like it's in the right place. It reminds me of my car, a Geo Metro, which is one of the few cars I've ever driven that seems to "fit" me perfectly. Some of the low-riders have foot pegs that make my knees feel like they're sticking up in the air, including the Rebel 250. By the way, I'm almost 5"3 but my legs are fairly short. I've learned that the 28" seat height is about as tall as I can go. I'm very fit and do weight training, so the weight of the bike is not as much of a concern as the height of the seat. One hesitation I have in buying a small bike to start with is the response I get from more seasoned bikers--they all say "if you buy a small bike you'll outgrow it in a few months, then you'll be sorry you didn't start out bigger." I'd like to hear from anyone who cares to write back about what they chose for a first bike and why, what their experiences were and how long they waited to "move up" to a bigger, more powerful bike. On Mon, 30 Jun 1997, Squeakers wrote: > > >1) I took the MSF course this weekend. I did not pass. What I got instead was > >a LOT of experience picking up a Rebel. (It's actually fairly easy, but then > >it was a 250.) Instructors said that I had good potential, and felt my > >problems were: > > a) being 4'11" and having a hard time reaching the controls > > b) no experience on a bicycle - ie I didn't have that balance thing going > > c) the Rebel is a tough bike to learn on > > > >So here's the problem. I bought a '96 Shadow 600. She's georgous. She's > >showroom. She's heavy as a water buffalo. Even with a lowering package and > >bent-back handlebars (not yet installed), is it reasonable for me to start on > >her? Or do I need to give her up and get a smaller junk bike to learn on? > >Finances will probably not allow keeping her and buying another. > > > > I personally think that if the rebel 250 was difficult to begin with, > then the Shadow 600 will be EXTREMELY difficult. I started out on a Sporty. > When I ordered the bike, I signed up for the MSF classes. They didnt have > ANY bikes for us vertically challenged folks at that time, so I had to learn > on a bike that kept me up on my toes. Luckily, I passed. 'course, then I got > on the Sporty and promptly dropped it. Then I got on it again. And dropped > it again. A heavy bike was just too much for me to learn on. You have to > remember, that since you arent used to riding ANYTHING, you not only have to > get the feel of "balance", but ALSO of using throttle thingys and clutch > thingys and the weight of a bike all at once. And "leaning" and "looking > kewl" etcetcetc.... We went looking around, and found me a used (i.e. cheap) > rebel 250 to practice on. Im only 5 feet flat, and not the most muscle bound > woman on earth, had never ridden or driven anything that wasnt equipped with > "automatic" and hadnt ridden a bicycle in... I dont care to discuss how many > years. After trying out a few different bikes, and talking to a LOT of OTHER > height challenged women, I learned that, in actuality, the Rebel 250 is the > easiest of all the bikes to learn on. Its light, very low and handles very > easily. The Savage 450 also got alot of high marks, but that was mostly for > women that were a tad over 5 feet. You really do need to be able to master > and feel comfortable on a smaller bike like the Rebel BEFORE you try riding > a bigger, heavier bike that could easily overpower you. You need to keep up > the determined attitude to accomplish everything you have a desire to do. > But with riding, we also have to balance determination with safety. An > accident on a bike can be, and unfortunately often is.... catastrophic. Take > it easy. Start slow. Work up. I figure if *I* can do it, then anyone can! :) > > I cant stress enough my opinion on this. If the bike is too big and heavy > to feel comfortable on, and you're JUST learning, then please please please > consider a smaller used bike. Life's too short to shorten it even more. > > Well. You know what they say about opinions. :) > > Squeakers > > > Martha E. Moore From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 16:55:33 1997 X-Ms-Tnef-Correlator: From: "Jordan, Michael" To: "mobacc@XXXXXX" , "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" Subject: RE: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 12:00:42 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 Encoding: 17 TEXT, 45 UUENCODE X-Ms-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 >Like outstanding MSF, would like a course that supplies virtually everything, close to DC, and lets me twist and gnaw at my skills and emotions (but not my skin or bike). Suggestions? Or pockmarked moped and crash gear rental anyplace {:>?< Bill - check out the MSF advanced course - not high speed stuff, but will put you through some interesting exercises on your own scoot. Michael Jordan '86 SRX-6 '93 GSX 1100GP AMA IBA etc. begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(A(3`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0F `0`A````1#DX,$4R M,T9&,T8Q1# Q,3DQ1C0P,# P1C8S0D-"1#8`+P"Q-1AKP!'@!P``$````Y````4D4Z($585%)%344@ M<')E<"!F;W(@;F5W8FEE,C)E!&!T:0(@!" H8GD7,"!N%G AM0.@!;%B&1;A*2X>[Q8I M4W5G5F<'D"+3/QE03P7 <.AO8VL`P'(6\!Y0!&".<"@A'C(%`&%S:"$POF4* MP0EP`C '0!XA>0M1@F,7`%Q[.CX_)-PN/ JB"H0*@$(B$2 M]1J@: 60:Q<2 M&Q$7`!?A^1J 9'8`<"IP*-$:Q"SPZR."'0!G*3!S*' H(1=0OG4!(!@0(T(# M\"S!<"-1_GD(8!L1`V FH"_!`W 7`)\+@!: "7 FX1>Q97@$D#YC! `'D0(@ M,7(%P&]WNP.@!/!O%G DP"OY30W@U1! 90,@2@6P9 !P*^0()S@V!@!26"TV M`3:U.3,@1U-8("(Q%2 P1U KY$%-LD$KY$E".640@&,U!A<6&2OJ$3$`/, ` M```#`( 0_____PL``X (( 8``````, ```````!&``````.%`````/__`P`% M@ @@!@``````P ```````$8`````$(4````````#``" "" &``````# ```` M````1@````!2A0``MPT``!X``8 (( 8``````, ```````!&`````%2%```! M````! ```#@N, `#``* "" &``````# ````````1@`````!A0````````L` M!( (( 8``````, ```````!&``````Z%`````````P`&@ @@!@``````P `` M`````$8`````$84````````#``> "" &``````# ````````1@`````8A0`` M`````!X`"( (( 8``````, ```````!&`````#:%```!`````0`````````> M``F "" &``````# ````````1@`````WA0```0````$`````````'@`*@ @@ M!@``````P ```````$8`````.(4```$````!``````````,`)@```````P`V M```````"`?D_`0```!X`````````W*= R,!"$!JTN0@`*R_A@@$````````` M+@```!X`^#\!````%0```%-YCFY1AKP!`P`--/T_```"`10T`0```! ```!4E*' *7\0&Z6'" `K*B47 M'@`]``$````%````4D4Z( `````+`"D```````L`(P```````@%_``$````^ M````/&,]55,E83U?)7 ]5FES825L/59)4T$O3D%-15))0T$O,# P-S,Y,45 8;7-M86EL9W From: Squeakers Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. Cc: Barbelle14@XXXXXX, wist@XXXXXX, sbl@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX >One hesitation I have in buying a small bike to start with is the response >I get from more seasoned bikers--they all say "if you buy a small bike >you'll outgrow it in a few months, then you'll be sorry you didn't start >out bigger." > Hi, Martha! The way I see it, the problem with the "more seasoned bikers" is that most of them arent, and never have been....short. :) Actually, in a WAY they're right. You probably WILL outgrow the smaller bike, and be ready for a bigger one soon. Maybe a few months. More likely after a year or so. How soon of course depends on how much you ride and how comfortable you get on your small bike. On the OTHER hand.... the reason that some of us might GET to the point of being ready for a bigger bike is BECAUSE of the opportunity to ride on a smaller bike. I tried to learn on a bigger bike. It ended up scaring the hell out of me, and I almost gave up. At 5 feet (alright, Im actually 4ft 11 1/2 ") I just wasnt able to handle barely being on my almost flat feet and learning to ride all at the same time. If my husband hadnt DRAGGED me to sit on the Rebel he'd seen sitting at the local pawn shop, Id still be stuck on the back. And totally.....horribly.....miserably... depressed! yes. I had quite a few shorter women that ride, (most of whom learned on either the Rebel or Savage and are now on Harleys) SWEAR to me that I COULD ride if I only got a small bike to learn on!! Even so, after seeing that I couldnt handle the Sporty, I decided I couldnt ride and was a mess. (thank God for desperate hubby's, eh?) :) The point Im taking forever to get to is... a smaller bike may be outgrown, but it gave me the opportunity to feel comfortable and CAPABLE enough to learn how to ride. And because it WASNT too big, I was MUCH safer on the streets. (Im still alive) If I had tried to force myself to continue trying to learn to ride on my Sporty, I honestly believe I would have hurt myself. Im ready for a big bike BECAUSE of my itty bitty bike. He never overpowered me. *I* controlled HIM! :) :) Squeakers From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 17:46:43 1997 To: "Martha E. Moore" Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. Date: Tue, 01 Jul 97 17:41:31 -0500 From: "Linda Tanner" X-Mailer: messageMCI v3.3 CC: "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" -- [ From: Linda J. Tanner * EMC.Ver #3.3 ] -- I don't understand your comment about your class 'L' license. What state are you in? I'm a woman 5'5" who has been riding for almost 3 years. I took the MSF class riding a 125 and don't remember having too much trouble with the seat height. After the class, I bought a Seca II (600 cc's,48 HP, ~430# dry). I had no particular reason to buy that particular bike. The price was right and I was afraid to get too small of a bike. I also wanted a 'sport' bike. Like I had a clue. I was dazzled by the colors. I dropped it a number of times - first time about 10 minutes into ownership. I blamed the problem on not paying attention, the weight of the bike and not having both feet down at the same time. I became fanatical about always putting both feet down together. I could almost flatfoot both sides. After becoming comfortable with the bike about 1.5 years into ownership, I traded it for an F3. I wanted something a little more powerful but not bigger displacement because my insurance is based on displacement. It was taller than the Seca, about the same weight, but distributed differently (600 cc's, 90HP, ~430# dry). I dropped it a few times too. I finally bought some mondo frankenstein boots that made me much taller and put me flatfoot again and a Corbin seat which lowered the seat height a little. I'm still a little nervous about dropping it during slow speed maneuvers, but things have improved alot. I've clocked 31K miles on both bikes and feel pretty confident. It's good to communicate with other women riders. There aren't as many out there as I would like. We had a guy in our MSF class who didn't know how to ride a bicycle. I can't imagine how difficult that must have been. He didn't finish the class. Good Luck LindaT. 95 F3 Purple Haze -------- REPLY, Original message follows -------- > Date: Tuesday, 01-Jul-97 03:46 PM > > From: Martha E. Moore \ Internet: (moore@XXXXXX) > To: Squeakers \ Internet: (squeaks@XXXXXX) > cc: Barbelle14@XXXXXX \ America On-Line: () > cc: wist@XXXXXX \ Internet: (wist@XXXXXX) > cc: sbl@XXXXXX \ Internet: (sbl@XXXXXX) > cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX \ Internet: (dc-cycles@XXXXXX) > > Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. > > This is very interesting to me. After a few years as a passenger, I > decided to learn to ride myself. I took a motorcycle safety class, and > almost didn't pass. I had the same problem--being too short. I'd always > been on low-riders and didn't dream that these "little" bikes would be too > tall for me! I dropped bikes in class five times, became totally > intimidated and at one point I started to cry and wanted to leave. I'm > sure I would have left that day, but my boyfriend had dropped me off and I > didn't have any way of getting home. I did finish and I did pass, but > only barely. The only bike that was low enough for me to feel comfortable > with was a 125, and by the time we took the skills test, I decided that > was the only bike I could test on if I didn't want to drop my bike during > the "evaluation" (which results in failing the course). > > So, now I'm "stuck" with only a class L license. Of course I can still > take the DMV road test on a bigger bike and get a class M, but I'm faced > with the problem of gaining experience on a bigger bike without having a > valid license. > > The course did teach me a lot. I'm a better passenger when I ride with my > boyfriend because I understand what he's faced with in different > situations. I'm a better car driver and a better pedestrian. In my mind > I know I can ride a motorcycle if I can find the right bike to start on. > > I agree with some of the other responses--I'm looking for a smaller bike > that is in somewhat "rough" condition to start with. I don't want to > freak over the first dent or scratch. All I need is practice and > confidence. Luckily, I live less than a mile from the safety course and I > can get that practice fairly easily. > > I've looked at an older Rebel 250, and I thought it might work. I also > know what I want down the road--I'm totally in love with the Virago. I > sat on a 750 in the showroom and it's the one bike where EVERYTHING feels > like it's in the right place. It reminds me of my car, a Geo Metro, which > is one of the few cars I've ever driven that seems to "fit" me perfectly. > Some of the low-riders have foot pegs that make my knees feel like they're > sticking up in the air, including the Rebel 250. > > By the way, I'm almost 5"3 but my legs are fairly short. I've learned > that the 28" seat height is about as tall as I can go. I'm very fit and > do weight training, so the weight of the bike is not as much of a concern > as the height of the seat. > > One hesitation I have in buying a small bike to start with is the response > I get from more seasoned bikers--they all say "if you buy a small bike > you'll outgrow it in a few months, then you'll be sorry you didn't start > out bigger." > > I'd like to hear from anyone who cares to write back about what they chose > for a first bike and why, what their experiences were and how long they > waited to "move up" to a bigger, more powerful bike. > > > > Martha E. Moore > > -------- REPLY, End of original message -------- From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 17:50:20 1997 From: Amit Chatterjie To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" Subject: FW: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 17:49:38 -0400 X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) > ---------- > From: Bill Schmidt[SMTP:billsch@XXXXXX] > Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 1997 6:12 PM > To: mobacc@XXXXXX > Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > Subject: Re: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) > > One of the problems I'd guess you'd have with the moped approach and > the > translation of that experience to the world of big bikes is the lack > of > power--both go and stop--of the moped. You be better off with a trail > bike, decent protective gear, and some open fields for the kind of > practice you seem to be seeking. > The reason I recommended a moped was because the person asking the question had to make some financial considerations. As far as the stop and go, the dynamics of motorcycling always holds true, therefore, they are just accentuated with larger bikes. Power is not something you want to be concerned with as a beginner. I agree trial biking is an excellent way to go (for many reasons), but MORE expensive. Amit CBR1000 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 17:58:16 1997 From: jcarver@XXXXXX Original-From: jcarver@XXXXXX Original-From: "Carver, John" To: "'suzuki-l@XXXXXX'" , "'bandit-talk@XXXXXX'" , "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" Cc: "'Meier, Chris'" Subject: TICKET!!! Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 17:56:15 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.994.63 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To all, If you remember I am the guy who was caught speeding; 85/55. Well, today I had my day in court. I decided to get a lawyer and it paid off. The lawyer "interfaced" with the prosecutor and police officer. I could not have done that. Also, the lawyer informed me of various items that I would need at my trial. DMV abstracts from NJ, (my home state at the time), and later VA my new home. All, of this and more I was unaware of. I also took a driver improvement course during the time before the trial. Because I cooperated when I was stopped and did not mouth off, the officer had a favorable impression of me. That coupled with a good driving record, (1 offense in 3 years), lead the judge to sentence me to "Improper Driving". A $100 fine waived because I paid for the driving program. ($30 in court costs) The cost for the lawyer was $1045 hard earned dollars. Not including the time I spent collecting the various items of information. I am extremely pleased with the outcome. The lawyer kept stressing had it been in Fairfax Cty or the D.C. area, I would have probably faced jail time. This is all F.Y.I. But, I would say get a lawyer!!! Getting the reckless dropped as well as the speeding saved much money and grief. --John Ride SAFE From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 18:24:17 1997 X-Ms-Tnef-Correlator: From: "Jordan, Michael" To: Bill Schmidt , "mobacc@XXXXXX" Cc: "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" Subject: RE: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 13:13:37 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 Encoding: 10 TEXT, 45 UUENCODE X-Ms-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 >One of the problems I'd guess you'd have with the moped approach and the >translation of that experience to the world of big bikes is the lack of >power--both go and stop--of the moped. You be better off with a trail >bike, decent protective gear, and some open fields for the kind of >practice you seem to be seeking. As I recall (from my dirt riding days), the falls came as part of the general activity - usually with an audience present - never thought of it as practice. begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(A84`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0F `0`A````1$4X,$4R M,T9&,T8Q1# Q,3DQ1C0P,# P1C8S0D-"1#8`.P@$``!X`"! !````90```$].14]&5$A%4%)/0DQ%35-)1$=515-3 M64]51$A!5D57251(5$A%34]0141!4%!23T%#2$%.1%1(151204Y33$%424]. M3T942$%415A015))14Y#151/5$A%5T]23$1/1D))1T(``````P`0$ $````# M`!$0`0````(!"1 !````(P(``!\"```H`P``3%I&==K*C/L#``H`=')S`'$+8'1I`B 7 M!!W0($QE>!H0"(%N8Q;P=&IO%S-W!;!L&# 7$6+T:6<@46L'D00`%S,+8!QC M:Q!M'U(FP7,QD2XQ9RXO"RZE+K-!M1?Q( EP8P= `R H`U*U&>!Y*M!I M`" TD&DUH,,5`"K087ES*2K %T+>9C31!" TP"S!800@"K%_!4 7%2P`%N = M@ ,@,.)V@QEP-8 M('5S=331YS6 )Z0#H&%U-: ?$Q90?P>0*Q(YP!;@&3 M MT@A@9_YH.",9<#>S,-4RLA8W+J0%$3$`/W ``P" $/____\+``. "" &```` M``# ````````1@`````#A0````#__P,`!8 (( 8``````, ```````!&```` M`!"%`````````P``@ @@!@``````P ```````$8`````4H4``+<-```>``& M"" &``````# ````````1@````!4A0```0````0````X+C ``P`"@ @@!@`` M````P ```````$8``````84````````+``2 "" &``````# ````````1@`` M```.A0````````,`!H (( 8``````, ```````!&`````!&%`````````P`' M@ @@!@``````P ```````$8`````&(4````````>``B "" &``````# ```` M````1@`````VA0```0````$`````````'@`)@ @@!@``````P ```````$8` M````-X4```$````!`````````!X`"H (( 8``````, ```````!&`````#B% M```!`````0`````````#`"8```````,`-@```````@'Y/P$````>```````` M`-RG0,C 0A :M+D(`"LOX8(!`````````"X````>`/@_`0```!4```!3>7-T M96T@061M:6YI Subject: Re: FW: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit No disrespect intended Amit. As I recall, the writer had a pretty good sized machine (750?) already and seemed to me to be past the "balancing on two wheels" stage hence my suggestion/observation. In my experience, the coordinated use of brakes and/or throttle is a key consideration and, as I recall my moped experience, mopeds are woefully inadequate on that front. Besides, for the best highsides you want to be able to lock that rear brake and pour on the power when the rear end comes around. Amit Chatterjie wrote: > > > One of the problems I'd guess you'd have with the moped approach and > > the > > translation of that experience to the world of big bikes is the lack > > of > > power--both go and stop--of the moped. You be better off with a trail > > bike, decent protective gear, and some open fields for the kind of > > practice you seem to be seeking. > > > The reason I recommended a moped was because the person asking the > question had to make some financial considerations. As far as the stop > and go, the dynamics of motorcycling always holds true, therefore, they > are just accentuated with larger bikes. Power is not something you want > to be concerned with as a beginner. I agree trial biking is an excellent > way to go (for many reasons), but MORE expensive. > > Amit CBR1000 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 22:39:37 1997 X-Mailer: Calypso Version 2.10.18 Date: Wed, 25 Jun 1997 22:39:02 -0400 From: "paddy" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D REPLY PARTITION= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D On 06/30/97, at 10:29 PM, Squeakers wrote: I`m almost 15, about 5'5" and am interested in motorcycling. I have been= riding bicycles since I was 5. I bought a moped 2 months ago and have put= 700 miles on it. I have a lot of questions. a. how old do you have to be to take an msf course? b. how old do you have to be to get your license in VA c. I'm looking at a couple of bikes, 1. RD/RZ 250/350 80-84 2. KE100 new or used (it's a trail bike, that is street legal, and its a 2= stroke, costs only 2000 new less used 3. Ninja 250 used 4. Rebel 250 used 5. DR 250 6. XR 250 d. any ideas on insurance costs for me? thanks From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Jul 1 23:38:36 1997 From: SackcoD@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 1 Jul 1997 23:37:23 -0400 (EDT) To: mobacc@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) In a message dated 97-07-01 14:54:55 EDT, mobacc@XXXXXX writes: << Or pockmarked moped and crash gear rental anyplace {:>? >> Y O U are the crash gear, no matter what else you might rent, and you are guarranteed until, not during, the first crash. I suggest practicing the skills that keep you from rolling high or sliding low. If worse comes to worse you scrub off a lot more energy before impact by using both brakes right into a wall than by "laying it down" and sliding across the pavement at a nice steady speed. The less energy you and your crash gear have when you finally hit the wall/cage/armco the less damage you sustain. And remember, E=mv**2; which means if you cut your speed in half you have cut your energy by 75%. Stay on the bike to stay on the brakes. I'll apply my typing brake now. Dave Sackrider From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 01:07:57 1997 From: KLThomas77@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 01:05:53 -0400 (EDT) To: vfr@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX, jolie@XXXXXX Subject: More humor-no motorcycle content Hey, y'all- Sorry--I couldn't come up with any motorcycle content. Kevin In a message dated 97-07-01 19:58:23 EDT, EptSwanson writes: << < Take me to Your Leader > > Two aliens land on earth and they happen to land next to a gas > station. So, the aliens waddle out of their ship and look around. The > first thing they see that resembles a being is the gas pump. The two > aliens approach and the first one says "Earthling, take me to your > leader!" > > Of course he gets no response... The first alien looks at his buddy > then addresses the pump again. "Earthling, I said take me to your > leader!" Of course, still no response... > > The alien then turns to his buddy and says "If this Earthling doesn't > show me some respect and at least acknowledge me, I'm going to blast >him!" > At that the second alien replies, "OK. I'm just going to stand down on > the next block." > > The first Alien looks a little puzzled, but waits for the other to > waddle > to the next block. He then addresses the pump a third time. "Earthling > take me to your leader!" Still nothing. So the alien then pulls out > his ray gun and vaporizes the pump... > > The gas station goes up in a huge explosion, blowing the alien all the > way down the block to his buddy. He gets up, dusts himself off, and >turns > to the second Alien. "If you knew that was going to happen why didn't > you warn me!?" > The second replies "Well, I didn't know exactly *what* was going to > happen. But there's no way I'm gonna' mess with a guy whose dick hangs > to the ground, wraps around his body twice, and is still long enough >to > stick in his left ear. > > -------------------------- Good bet >A little old lady entered the main branch of the Chase Manhattan bank >with a >large grocery bag in her arms. She told the teller that she wanted to open >an >account to make a substantial deposit, in excess of $200,000. Further, >she >said that since such a large sum was involved, she would deal only with >the >president of the bank to make the necessary arrangements. > >The teller looked in the bag and confirmed that it was, in fact, full of cash. >He >called upstairs and explained the situation to the bank president, who >agreed >to see the woman. The teller escorted her to the president's office, and >the >president invited her to have a seat, which she accepted. She repeated >her >request to open an account. > >The president said he would take care of it personally, but his curiosity >was >killing him. He said, "Mind if I ask how you happened to come into such a >large sum of cash?" > >"Not at all," was her reply. "I bet." "You bet?" he countered. "At the >racetrack, or on professional sports, or in casinos?" "Nothing like that," >she >said. "I just ... bet. For example, I'll bet you $50,000 that by tomorrow >morning your balls will be square." > >The president chuckled but, seeing that the lady had the funds to back up >such >a wild bet, agreed. They shook hands on it, and she promised to return at >nine >the next morning to follow up, and left. As the day wore on, the >president >found himself frequently checking to make sure that all was in order. It >was, >but just as a precaution he canceled his regular Tuesday-afternoon golf >match >and went home early. > >The next morning when he showered, he was actually quite relieved to >find >that nothing had changed drastically while he slept. He confidently >headed for >the bank, laughing all the way at the unexpected windfall that was about >to >become his. > >The little old lady showed up promptly at the appointed hour, >accompanied by >a young man. When the president asked who he was, she replied that >he was >her lawyer, who she always brought along when payoffs involving >significant >sums were involved. > >The president told her that sorry, she had lost that particular bet, so the >funds >would be outgoing rather than incoming. She insisted on examining the >evidence for herself, considering the amount at stake. He deemed it a >reasonable request under the circumstances, so he stood up, unbuckled >his >belt and dropped his pants. She proceeded to closely inspect his jewels >for >any abnormalities. > >As she did, the president noticed that her lawyer was standing in the >corner, >banging his head against the wall. He asked the lady, "What's the matter >with >him?" She paused her inspection long enough to glance at the lawyer >and >replied, "Oh, him. I bet him $150,000 that before ten a.m. today I'd have >the >president of the Chase Manhattan Bank by the balls." >> >> --------------------- Forwarded message: Subj: Fwd: CPPARENT Digest - 27 Jun 1997 to 28 Jun 1997 Date: 97-07-01 19:58:23 EDT From: EptSwanson To: KLThomas77 In a message dated 97-06-30 23:27:09 EDT, jwgg@XXXXXX (Whit Garberson) writes: << Take me to Your Leader > > Two aliens land on earth and they happen to land next to a gas > station. So, the aliens waddle out of their ship and look around. The > first thing they see that resembles a being is the gas pump. The two > aliens approach and the first one says "Earthling, take me to your > leader!" > > Of course he gets no response... The first alien looks at his buddy > then addresses the pump again. "Earthling, I said take me to your > leader!" Of course, still no response... > > The alien then turns to his buddy and says "If this Earthling doesn't > show me some respect and at least acknowledge me, I'm going to blast >him!" > At that the second alien replies, "OK. I'm just going to stand down on > the next block." > > The first Alien looks a little puzzled, but waits for the other to > waddle > to the next block. He then addresses the pump a third time. "Earthling > take me to your leader!" Still nothing. So the alien then pulls out > his ray gun and vaporizes the pump... > > The gas station goes up in a huge explosion, blowing the alien all the > way down the block to his buddy. He gets up, dusts himself off, and >turns > to the second Alien. "If you knew that was going to happen why didn't > you warn me!?" > The second replies "Well, I didn't know exactly *what* was going to > happen. But there's no way I'm gonna' mess with a guy whose dick hangs > to the ground, wraps around his body twice, and is still long enough >to > stick in his left ear. > > -------------------------- Good bet >A little old lady entered the main branch of the Chase Manhattan bank >with a >large grocery bag in her arms. She told the teller that she wanted to open >an >account to make a substantial deposit, in excess of $200,000. Further, >she >said that since such a large sum was involved, she would deal only with >the >president of the bank to make the necessary arrangements. > >The teller looked in the bag and confirmed that it was, in fact, full of cash. >He >called upstairs and explained the situation to the bank president, who >agreed >to see the woman. The teller escorted her to the president's office, and >the >president invited her to have a seat, which she accepted. She repeated >her >request to open an account. > >The president said he would take care of it personally, but his curiosity >was >killing him. He said, "Mind if I ask how you happened to come into such a >large sum of cash?" > >"Not at all," was her reply. "I bet." "You bet?" he countered. "At the >racetrack, or on professional sports, or in casinos?" "Nothing like that," >she >said. "I just ... bet. For example, I'll bet you $50,000 that by tomorrow >morning your balls will be square." > >The president chuckled but, seeing that the lady had the funds to back up >such >a wild bet, agreed. They shook hands on it, and she promised to return at >nine >the next morning to follow up, and left. As the day wore on, the >president >found himself frequently checking to make sure that all was in order. It >was, >but just as a precaution he canceled his regular Tuesday-afternoon golf >match >and went home early. > >The next morning when he showered, he was actually quite relieved to >find >that nothing had changed drastically while he slept. He confidently >headed for >the bank, laughing all the way at the unexpected windfall that was about >to >become his. > >The little old lady showed up promptly at the appointed hour, >accompanied by >a young man. When the president asked who he was, she replied that >he was >her lawyer, who she always brought along when payoffs involving >significant >sums were involved. > >The president told her that sorry, she had lost that particular bet, so the >funds >would be outgoing rather than incoming. She insisted on examining the >evidence for herself, considering the amount at stake. He deemed it a >reasonable request under the circumstances, so he stood up, unbuckled >his >belt and dropped his pants. She proceeded to closely inspect his jewels >for >any abnormalities. > >As she did, the president noticed that her lawyer was standing in the >corner, >banging his head against the wall. He asked the lady, "What's the matter >with >him?" She paused her inspection long enough to glance at the lawyer >and >replied, "Oh, him. I bet him $150,000 that before ten a.m. today I'd have >the >president of the Chase Manhattan Bank by the balls." >> --------------------- Forwarded message: From: jwgg@XXXXXX (Whit Garberson) To: EptSwanson@XXXXXX Date: 97-06-30 23:27:09 EDT Dear Eileen, Here are two stupid jokes, hopefully not too raunchy for your taste, recently forwarded me by one of my brothers. If the internet is not useful for humor, I'm not sure what it's good for. Cheers, Whit ps. Julian and I *are* doing better. thanks for mentioning it. Settling into our new apt. I think I am better in large part because I see he's better. It is going to be some time before the divorce business settles down, let alone resolves, but I have a sense of at least some forward progress in that dept. and I feel pretty good about my lawyer. Other than the fact that he costs so goddam much. > Take me to Your Leader > > Two aliens land on earth and they happen to land next to a gas > station. So, the aliens waddle out of their ship and look around. The > first thing they see that resembles a being is the gas pump. The two > aliens approach and the first one says "Earthling, take me to your > leader!" > > Of course he gets no response... The first alien looks at his buddy > then addresses the pump again. "Earthling, I said take me to your > leader!" Of course, still no response... > > The alien then turns to his buddy and says "If this Earthling doesn't > show me some respect and at least acknowledge me, I'm going to blast >him!" > At that the second alien replies, "OK. I'm just going to stand down on > the next block." > > The first Alien looks a little puzzled, but waits for the other to > waddle > to the next block. He then addresses the pump a third time. "Earthling > take me to your leader!" Still nothing. So the alien then pulls out > his ray gun and vaporizes the pump... > > The gas station goes up in a huge explosion, blowing the alien all the > way down the block to his buddy. He gets up, dusts himself off, and >turns > to the second Alien. "If you knew that was going to happen why didn't > you warn me!?" > The second replies "Well, I didn't know exactly *what* was going to > happen. But there's no way I'm gonna' mess with a guy whose dick hangs > to the ground, wraps around his body twice, and is still long enough >to > stick in his left ear. > > -------------------------- Good bet >A little old lady entered the main branch of the Chase Manhattan bank >with a >large grocery bag in her arms. She told the teller that she wanted to open >an >account to make a substantial deposit, in excess of $200,000. Further, >she >said that since such a large sum was involved, she would deal only with >the >president of the bank to make the necessary arrangements. > >The teller looked in the bag and confirmed that it was, in fact, full of cash. >He >called upstairs and explained the situation to the bank president, who >agreed >to see the woman. The teller escorted her to the president's office, and >the >president invited her to have a seat, which she accepted. She repeated >her >request to open an account. > >The president said he would take care of it personally, but his curiosity >was >killing him. He said, "Mind if I ask how you happened to come into such a >large sum of cash?" > >"Not at all," was her reply. "I bet." "You bet?" he countered. "At the >racetrack, or on professional sports, or in casinos?" "Nothing like that," >she >said. "I just ... bet. For example, I'll bet you $50,000 that by tomorrow >morning your balls will be square." > >The president chuckled but, seeing that the lady had the funds to back up >such >a wild bet, agreed. They shook hands on it, and she promised to return at >nine >the next morning to follow up, and left. As the day wore on, the >president >found himself frequently checking to make sure that all was in order. It >was, >but just as a precaution he canceled his regular Tuesday-afternoon golf >match >and went home early. > >The next morning when he showered, he was actually quite relieved to >find >that nothing had changed drastically while he slept. He confidently >headed for >the bank, laughing all the way at the unexpected windfall that was about >to >become his. > >The little old lady showed up promptly at the appointed hour, >accompanied by >a young man. When the president asked who he was, she replied that >he was >her lawyer, who she always brought along when payoffs involving >significant >sums were involved. > >The president told her that sorry, she had lost that particular bet, so the >funds >would be outgoing rather than incoming. She insisted on examining the >evidence for herself, considering the amount at stake. He deemed it a >reasonable request under the circumstances, so he stood up, unbuckled >his >belt and dropped his pants. She proceeded to closely inspect his jewels >for >any abnormalities. > >As she did, the president noticed that her lawyer was standing in the >corner, >banging his head against the wall. He asked the lady, "What's the matter >with >him?" She paused her inspection long enough to glance at the lawyer >and >replied, "Oh, him. I bet him $150,000 that before ten a.m. today I'd have >the >president of the Chase Manhattan Bank by the balls." From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 02:02:49 1997 Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 02:02:54 -0700 From: "John C. Kozyn" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: KLThomas77@XXXXXX CC: vfr@XXXXXX, DC Moto List Subject: Re: More humor-no motorcycle content Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit KLThomas77@XXXXXX wrote: > Hey, y'all- Sorry--I couldn't come up with any motorcycle content. > Kevin Yeah so am I... --> major snippage <-- > Forwarded message: > In a message dated 97-07-01 19:58:23 EDT, EptSwanson writes: > Forwarded message: > Subj: Fwd: CPPARENT Digest - 27 Jun 1997 to 28 Jun 1997 > From: jwgg@XXXXXX (Whit Garberson) > To: EptSwanson@XXXXXX --> major snippage <-- > Dear Eileen, > > Here are two stupid jokes, hopefully not too raunchy for your taste, > recently forwarded me by one of my brothers. If the internet is not useful > for humor, I'm not sure what it's good for. > > Cheers, > Whit Hey Kev and Whit(less), Get a clue, the lists you targeted are (duhhh) not for humor - they're for M-O-T-O-R-C-Y-C-L-E-S Don't get me wrong, I like silly crap like this too sometimes, but there is a place and a time.. How do you spell appropriate? > ps. Julian and I *are* doing better. thanks for mentioning it. Settling > into our new apt. I think I am better in large part because I see he's > better. It is going to be some time before the divorce business settles > down, let alone resolves, but I have a sense of at least some forward > progress in that dept. and I feel pretty good about my lawyer. Other than > the fact that he costs so goddam much. Let's not even start to talk about how much bandwidth has been wasted here either. Imagine living with someone you want to or who wants to divorce you? Sheeesh! What a crazy world. N.B. Major Mofo Hint: Use left mouse button and highlight extraneous material not germane to message. When done, press delete key - works like a charm!! JK From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 07:22:21 1997 X-Ms-Tnef-Correlator: From: "Jordan, Michael" To: "'DC-Cycles'" Subject: RE: Help! 2 questions. Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 04:20:38 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 Encoding: 22 TEXT, 43 UUENCODE X-Ms-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 >The way I see it, the problem with the "more seasoned bikers" is that >most of them arent, and never have been....short. :) Not all... 36 years of riding 29" inseam My wife has longer legs but "needs" a much shorter bike than I am comfortable with It's mostly mindset - if you expect to have problems, you will Michael Jordan '86 SRX-6 '93 GSX 1100GP (pick which foot touches or both feet "sur les points", as they say in ballet) AMA IBA etc. begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(A$+`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0F `0`A````1#A#0S U M.#-!-T8R1# Q,3DQ1C0P,# P1C8S0D-"1#8`+ `0$-@ 0``@````(` M`@`!!( !`!<```!213H@2&5L<"$@,B!Q=65S=&EO;G,N`"8'`0.0!@`D!@`` M)0````L``@`!`````P`N``````! `#D`(&BG]]F&O $>`' ``0```!<```!2 M13H@2&5L<"$@,B!Q=65S=&EO;G,N```"`7$``0```!8````!O(;9]XZ#!X ,`!Q!:`0``'@`($ $```!E````5$A% M5T%925-%14E4+%1(15!23T),14U7251(5$A%(DU/4D5314%33TY%1$))2T52 M4R))4U1(051-3U-43T942$5-05)%3E0L04Y$3D5615)(059%0D5%3E-(3U)4 M.BE.3U1!3 `````#`! 0`0````,`$1 !`````@$)$ $````V`@``,@(``/<" M``!,6D9U#Y^&`@,`"@!R8W!G,3(U=C(`] 'W( *D`^,"`&.": K (!! 'N :( GA M+A^Q`&QL'['S&R048"!Y&; 08!V"!1#* M9 N 9QLD,CD:D0" M1FP;2%J31\1AP9P0@=&)U M!4 B&? )@!J!8?\=,!.P&. ?\Q[Q&C(:T@.@ZQ=0)2 @!:!M`A `( &@QQAP M&*,A:DET)P0@'4(Z;!@':!Y"& @97APV1:2=&\?%!@U M!K%P#Z:##Q( (0(C$N("AQ!Y&?!;$&X!C1)E L M\2)S"'#3)R$$('!O"X!T&H >8?4:PF47,',7(0N &B B84<0@"" &S-!34$K MA4)[.640@&,BM18*&R01,0`!/& ```,`@!#_____"P`#@ @@!@``````P `` M`````$8``````X4`````__\#``6 "" &``````# ````````1@`````0A0`` M``````,``( (( 8``````, ```````!&`````%*%``"W#0``'@`!@ @@!@`` M````P ```````$8`````5(4```$````$````."XP``,``H (( 8``````, ` M``````!&``````&%````````"P`$@ @@!@``````P ```````$8`````#H4` M```````#``: "" &``````# ````````1@`````1A0````````,`!X (( 8` M`````, ```````!&`````!B%````````'@`(@ @@!@``````P ```````$8` M````-H4```$````!`````````!X`"8 (( 8``````, ```````!&`````#>% M```!`````0`````````>``J "" &``````# ````````1@`````XA0```0`` M``$``````````P`F```````#`#8```````(!^3\!````'@````````#`````````-RG0,C 0A :M+D(`"LO MX8(!`````````"X````>`/H_`0```!4```!3>7-T96T@061M:6YI`#T``0````4```!213H@``````L`*0`` M````"P`C```````"`7\``0```#X````\8SU54R5A/5\E<#U6:7-A)6P]5DE3 L02].04U%4DE#02\P,# W-#%#0D!M From: "Jordan, Michael" To: "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" Subject: RE: Help! 2 questions. Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 04:29:53 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 Encoding: 48 TEXT, 56 UUENCODE X-Ms-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 >a. how old do you have to be to take an msf course? I believe it's 16 with parental consent and 18 without (my kids needed it at age 17) >b. how old do you have to be to get your license in VA 16 >c. I'm looking at a couple of bikes, My personal prejudices will be displayed below > 1. RD/RZ 250/350 80-84 Generally nice bikes with enough performance and potential as adrenaline generators. > 2. KE100 new or used (it's a trail bike, that is street legal, and its a 2 stroke, costs only 2000 new less used Good choice > 3. Ninja 250 used See comment for RD/RZ, but with MUCH less adrenaline > 4. Rebel 250 used Wife had one - hated it - no guts and uncomfortable Cute, though... > 5. DR 250 See #2 > 6. XR 250 See #2 >d. any ideas on insurance costs for me? Nope - sorry Generally, a dual-purpose bike is good as a first bike as it opens up a lot of possibilities that a street oriented bike tends to exclude (of course, if you live in a city, the off-road part tends to get less use). If you tend to find dirt roads and cow paths interesting, a DP bike is the ticket. I had a couple back in the 70's and enjoyed them immensely. Michael Jordan '86 SRX-6 '93 GSX 1100GP AMA IBA etc. begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(A$+`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0F `0`A````1$5#0S U M.#-!-T8R1# Q,3DQ1C0P,# P1C8S0D-"1#8`.0`' ``0```!<```!2 M13H@2&5L<"$@,B!Q=65S=&EO;G,N```"`7$``0```!8````!O(;;0GB#!"6 ,`"@!R8W!G,3(U=C(`] 'W( *D`^,"`&.": K %0"T@OF<'0$ 0';(;T#\R,D"B_RPP0 $%H$"P!" "(#;Q`=#_ M/@4#,#.B+2 $$3ZB-4\V4GP"X!J0A$TP43/ M*E7W!F 8( 6@;0> '8$XP30$#4 08AYQ'%--54-(+T1D.FA&_S,;-$CA4F7W M&U%);RH*5P:0&" 00"1 ^P(@&" M%^$6@!^#4X X,.\EH!YP.D$=P74Y$ -P M.,%W`9$M(!K40QYP0 ,X0BZ75P!.?S,;-4CA1%(T8KM1?TL%(PY05T\S*C9( MX=Y866]:?UN/%G1D(\ `<+L>P![P93HQ`B FL7,(<#\Y`T+42_('@!G_&P%. M;\C:'RT%Q)%!U!T M< AP.9!W)I$M@D!R9T92.C)+X&G_ M$& CD6?B.C$?H63!!C$M`/\LL0D`:>$9<&>!`) M@!1 _SG@!Y% ,RS 0+4% ML B0`C ?,8)GXCFQ'P$8065X8_\*0 $`'I M41F40! &D"2#_Q1 &Z(#H"S! M&]!FL1QP+3+\9BT#8%,1"K$%0&W');+]1'8I*[%OI&W"&#)H\!W!_S P 00#50P4H% ML&0`%```!`````0`` M```````>``J "" &``````# ````````1@`````XA0```0````$````````` M`P`F```````#`#8```````(!^3\!````'@````````#`````````-RG0,C 0A :M+D(`"LOX8(!```````` M`"X````>`/H_`0```!4```!3>7-T96T@061M:6YI`#T``0````4```!213H@``````L`*0``````"P`C```` M```"`7\``0```#X````\8SU54R5A/5\E<#U6:7-A)6P]5DE302].04U%4DE# C02\P,# W-#(P0D!M X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Young Riders Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jordan, Michael wrote: > > >a. how old do you have to be to take an msf course? > I believe it's 16 with parental consent and 18 without (my kids needed it > at age 17) Correct. Also, a parent or guardian's signature must be witnessed by the instructor if you take the class in VA. > > 1. RD/RZ 250/350 80-84 > Generally nice bikes with enough performance and potential as adrenaline > generators. Note: Here in the U.S., only the RZ350 was available in 1984 and 1985. The RD series 250 was discontinued in 1975 and the RD350 was supplanted by the RD400 in 1976; the RD400 was discontinued in 1979. No RZ250 was ever sold in the U.S. There are a few 'gray market' RD350L/C's (which was offered in Canada from 1980-1983) floating around. Parts are hard to get, and most U.S. examples were imported as race bikes. > > 2. KE100 new or used > Good choice If you confine your riding to surface streets only. > > 4. Rebel 250 used > Wife had one - hated it - no guts and uncomfortable Significantly more guts than a KE100, though! > Generally, a dual-purpose bike is good as a first bike as it opens up a lot > of possibilities that a street oriented bike tends to exclude (of course, > if you live in a city, the off-road part tends to get less use). If you > tend to find dirt roads and cow paths interesting, a DP bike is the ticket. Good advice. Plus, those rural backroads allow less adrenaline inducing learning to take place in the (relative) absence of heavy traffic. -- Tim Morrow '73 Ducati 750GT '76 Honda GL1000 - RatWing #3 '91 Suzuki VX800 '92 Ducati 750SS - The Hotrod '92 Ducati 851 - The Beast E-mail respondants remove the 'X' in the address below: XMORROWS@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 08:12:53 1997 X-Sender: cnorloff@XXXXXX X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 07:57:35 -0400 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Chris Norloff Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >One hesitation I have in buying a small bike to start with is the response >I get from more seasoned bikers--they all say "if you buy a small bike >you'll outgrow it in a few months, then you'll be sorry you didn't start >out bigger." That's a hard one to answer because there are so many variables. First off, your first bike must physically fit you. You must be able to get both feet flat on the ground when you're in the saddle. Lower the bike, lower the seat, wear Doc Martens, but you must be able to get your feet flat. The bike must be light enough that you can handle it, particularly when you stop on a left-right slope and one foot goes down farther than you expect (the bike is now probably leaning past vertical, and you must be able to hold it up). The engine size is less critical, but has to do with your desired riding style. If you and/or your buddies cruise only back roads and rides are primarily social events with lots of stops, a 250 will do fine for quite a while. Figure you're probably seldom going over 55, and spending much time at 40-45 mph. Our 250 Nighthawks at the training site were a real blast to ride, and I'm used to a 750. If you want to start taking some longer trips and carrying camping gear, then maybe go up to a 400. It will probably be more comfortable on long trips. And remember that a 600 will pull a small person around as fast as a 750 or 900 will pull a large person. Generally, I recommend beginning riders pass the MSF course so they know how to handle a 250 (or 125 in some places). Then buy something in the 250-600 cc range, depending on the bike's physical size, what used bikes are available, and what your budget is. It's better to have too little bike and learn easily, than to have too much bike and learn harder, or hurt yourself. Chris Norloff From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 09:16:15 1997 Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 09:15:55 -0400 X-Sender: squeaks@XXXXXX X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: "Jordan, Michael" , "'DC-Cycles'" From: Squeakers Subject: RE: Help! 2 questions. >Not all... >36 years of riding >29" inseam > >My wife has longer legs but "needs" a much shorter bike than I am >comfortable with > >It's mostly mindset - if you expect to have problems, you will > > Michael. I wish it WAS all mindset, but it really isnt. Experience (or lack of) is the lions share of riding. There's too many factors involved. How much have you ridden a bicycle? Is the concept of hand and foot brakes foreign to you? Have you ever driven a car with a clutch and gears, so you at least have a general knowledge of how they work? How tall are you? How much do you weigh? How strong are you? (although not always, most shorter men STILL have greater strength than most shorter women) Mistakes that are easily compensated for because you have the strength and size are MUCH easier to handle, eh? And honestly, Michael, there's been many times while learning to ride that I wish I had the little more "inchage" that YOU have. :) The time I went down and damaged my bike some WOULDNT have happened if I had just had maybe 2 stupid more inches in my right leg. Just... two..... Squeakers Oh, BTW you said the Rebel has no "guts" and is uncomfortable????? I guess it depends on the size of the person riding it. My Rebel has plenty of guts. It may be a little 250, but I had no problems keeping up with the "big boys" on a long ride when our club was invited out to see the redskins at their training camp. We took the pretty route through the mountains in West Virginia ( it WAS beautiful!!!)It doesnt do 100mph, but I wouldnt even if it could. As for uncomfortable. Nonsense! I dont have to do the "butt dance" nearly as soon as most people do! From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 09:16:45 1997 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 08:54:21 -0400 From: Dave_Choat@XXXXXX (Dave Choat) Subject: Re[2]: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: cc:Mail note part Good point, the tires brake much better than the fairing does. "I had to put the bike down" to avoid something is ridiculous. Dave Choat _______________________________________________________________________________ Subject: Re: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) From: SackcoD@XXXXXX at ddn Date: 1/7/1997 11:37 PM In a message dated 97-07-01 14:54:55 EDT, mobacc@XXXXXX writes: << Or pockmarked moped and crash gear rental anyplace {:>? >> Y O U are the crash gear, no matter what else you might rent, and you are guarranteed until, not during, the first crash. I suggest practicing the skills that keep you from rolling high or sliding low. If worse comes to worse you scrub off a lot more energy before impact by using both brakes right into a wall than by "laying it down" and sliding across the pavement at a nice steady speed. The less energy you and your crash gear have when you finally hit the wall/cage/armco the less damage you sustain. And remember, E=mv**2; which means if you cut your speed in half you have cut your energy by 75%. Stay on the bike to stay on the brakes. I'll apply my typing brake now. Dave Sackrider From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 09:30:16 1997 Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 09:28:46 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clark E. Dorman" X-Sender: dorman@blackbird To: Chris Norloff Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help! 2 questions. In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19970702075735.009528a0@204.194.180.21> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Wed, 2 Jul 1997, Chris Norloff wrote: > >One hesitation I have in buying a small bike to start with is the response > >I get from more seasoned bikers--they all say "if you buy a small bike > >you'll outgrow it in a few months, then you'll be sorry you didn't start > >out bigger." [snip] > The bike must be light enough that you can handle it, particularly when you > stop on a left-right slope and one foot goes down farther than you expect > (the bike is now probably leaning past vertical, and you must be able to > hold it up). That's one of the things that I learned very quickly. The difficulties that I've had have not been while I was riding or moving the bike on decent terrain. You're guaranteed to eventually need to move the bike around on a hill with poor traction. Size the bike to be able to do that, at least at first. > The engine size is less critical, but has to do with your desired riding > style. If you and/or your buddies cruise only back roads and rides are > primarily social events with lots of stops, a 250 will do fine for quite a > while. Figure you're probably seldom going over 55, and spending much time > at 40-45 mph. Our 250 Nighthawks at the training site were a real blast to > ride, and I'm used to a 750. > > If you want to start taking some longer trips and carrying camping gear, > then maybe go up to a 400. It will probably be more comfortable on long > trips. > > And remember that a 600 will pull a small person around as fast as a 750 or > 900 will pull a large person. Being a medium size person, I started with an old, fairly beaten '83 Yamaha 650 (air cooled, two cylinder). For my size (5'8", 200#), I could not recommend a better starting bike. My advice is to make sure that your first bike is one that you are not going to mind dropping. Because you are (probably) going to drop it. If you want to learn how to do basic maintenance, then you want a simple bike that has cheap available parts. Because you are (probably) going to make mistakes, largely due to taking things apart to find out that _that_ was not what you needed to fix. If you get a cheap , used first bike, then you can learn on it, drop it, make mistakes, and then sell it for pretty close or equal to the orignal cost. Just keep in mind that it's got to be safe and will run consistently. Other than that, go cheap and ugly and sell it later. (Have no fear, since I have learned maintenance and riding, the bike is now in better condition than when I got it; and I'd never sell an un-safe bike, and it's not for sale anyway.) > Generally, I recommend beginning riders pass the MSF course so they know > how to handle a 250 (or 125 in some places). Then buy something in the > 250-600 cc range, depending on the bike's physical size, what used bikes > are available, and what your budget is. > > It's better to have too little bike and learn easily, than to have too much > bike and learn harder, or hurt yourself. It's difficult for me to imagine that a person needs much more than a 750 or 850 for street riding unless you really like to go fast. A decent condition, tuned 750 will go awfully fast. It makes more sense to learn how to get more out of the bike that you have before moving on to a bigger faster bike. Just my $0.02. -- Clark From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 09:59:52 1997 X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.00.00 Date: Wed, 02 Jul 97 09:42:14 -0800 From: "Joe Snider" To: Subject: Re[2]: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On the crashing of mopeds/scooters side of things I have an amusing tangent. I went to Key West recently with a friend from work while in Florida on business. Renting scooters to scoot around the island is the "in" thing to do, so we obliged. My friend looked rather unstable as the rental guy showed her around the parking lot. She claimed she had been to Key West and rented a scooter before, so I gave her the benefit of the doubt. We scooted off to breakfast. When we came out, I let her pull out into the street first. She made it about half way into the street then somehow hit the gas, jumped the curb, was heading straight towards a parked car, swerved and ran through a three foot stretch of bushes, fell off and left the bike in the middle of the sidewalk. After determining that she was okay, aside from a few scratches and bruises, we took a look at the bike, which became somewhat of a concern since the deposit was on my credit card. We got it started again, and nothing looked too bent or broken. The worst was the left mirror was shattered and broken, and a few scratches. A local who witnessed the incident directed us to a Honda shop down the road where we got a new mirror. They were also kind enough to buff out the scratches, and even had some purple Honda touch up paint to take care of the big ones. We then went to the drug store and got a silver paint pen to duplicate the rental company's number on the mirror. After a little dirt was rubbed on the mirror to make it look less new, we were ready to go. The rental company was none the wiser, and our bill came to $17 as opposed to what the rental company would have charged. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: RE: EXTREME prep for newbies (was RE: Help! 2 questions) Author: "Jordan Michael" at smtpgw Date: 7/1/97 1:13 PM >One of the problems I'd guess you'd have with the moped approach and the >translation of that experience to the world of big bikes is the lack of >power--both go and stop--of the moped. You be better off with a trail >bike, decent protective gear, and some open fields for the kind of >practice you seem to be seeking. As I recall (from my dirt riding days), the falls came as part of the general activity - usually with an audience present - never thought of it as practice. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 10:20:58 1997 Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 10:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Todd B Peer" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Difficult, was Re: Help! 2 questions. X-Mailer: MailRoom v2.1e Clark Wrote: It's difficult for me to imagine that a person needs much more than a 750 or 850 for street riding unless you really like to go fast. Sometimes Clark it's not about going fast (hard for some of you squids to grasp). My ST1100 does indeed go 'fast', but it is also 50 times more comfortable to ride at speed and at the speed limit than my CB750. It also looks cooler and demands more attention, something that we all need from the 'head-in-the-clouds' cagers, eh? One day, you will imagine and you will wonder why you had such difficulty. Todd From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 11:08:05 1997 From: "Dysart, Glenn B., Mr., IMCEN" To: "'DC Cycles'" Subject: Good Stuff Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 11:07:28 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 Encoding: 18 TEXT One of the highlights to our past weekend ride was of course talking about our bikes. We got onto the subject of clean and shinny engines. My bike being an 84 has a dull look to the engine from the years of use. I told one guy that I used WD-40 but hated it because it picked up every speck of dirt as I ride plus it comes out in such high pressure it get all over everything else. He said that he used the S100 Engine Brightner. I went and bought some of this stuff the other day and put it on last night. All I can say is WOW! This stuff kicks butt. You spray it on (out of an aerosol can) and then a couple seconds later just wipe lightly. It leaves a great shine, doesn't splash when it comes out and doesn't seem to be greasy or oily. I haven't rode with it on yet so I don't know how long it lasts. I recommend this stuff to anyone with an exposed engine that wants so more shine. Glenn Dysart DysarGB@XXXXXX 84 V30 Magna From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 16:16:59 1997 From: Barbelle14@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 16:15:41 -0400 (EDT) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: July 4th ride? Anybody gettin' together for a little Amurrican-highway-type fun? My bruises are red and blue, and yellow (almost white). Let's go riding!!! Sharon From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 17:22:09 1997 X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.00.00 Date: Wed, 02 Jul 97 17:12:16 -0500 From: "Brian McCoy" To: , Subject: Re: July 4th ride? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Count me in - I was planning on picking up a new bike, but looks like that's not going to happen. I can be reached at bmccoy@XXXXXX through 8pm Thursday evening, and (301)409-5911 anytime (pager w/voice mail). Ride safe... Brian McCoy ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: July 4th ride? Author: at smtplink-micros Date: 7/2/97 4:15 PM Anybody gettin' together for a little Amurrican-highway-type fun? My bruises are red and blue, and yellow (almost white). Let's go riding!!! Sharon From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 17:37:28 1997 X-Sender: gixer@XXXXXX X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 17:38:55 -0400 To: MORROWS@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Collin T. Fagan" Subject: Re: Young Riders In-Reply-To: <33BA4327.3428@postoffice.worldnet.att.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >> > 2. KE100 new or used >> Good choice > >If you confine your riding to surface streets only. > > 4. Rebel 250 used >> Wife had one - hated it - no guts and uncomfortable > >Significantly more guts than a KE100, though! > I beg to differ. I had a KE100 quite a number of years ago that was an absolute blast to ride both on and off road. It definitely didn't have the guts of either of my race bikes (KX 125 & 250) but it could easily whip out a ten footer (with a tabletop even) (a little trying on the suspension, but it did ok) & with a little tinkering, it had plenty of guts. My little brothers Yamahopper DT125 could take higher jumps with its mono-shock suspension, but its engine was no comparison for kawasaki torque and power. ps: Tim, you have far too many awsome eye-talion bikes for your own good ;^) Collin _________________________________________ Collin and Penny Fagan LTjg, U.S. Coast Guard (202) 366-0067 (work) (703) 356-4279 (home) (703) 816-7255 (pager) http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/5280/ ride.html (ride sheets) bike.html (pics of the bikes) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 19:07:57 1997 Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 18:35:42 -0400 From: Tim Morrow X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Collin T. Fagan" CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Young Riders Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Collin T. Fagan wrote: > > >> > 2. KE100 new or used > >> Good choice > > > >If you confine your riding to surface streets only. > > I beg to differ. (snip) Sorry, I should have been more specific. I meant surface streets as opposed to limited access highways, not as opposed to riding off road. -- Tim Morrow '73 Ducati 750GT '76 Honda GL1000 - RatWing #3 '91 Suzuki VX800 '92 Ducati 750SS - The Hotrod '92 Ducati 851 - The Beast E-mail respondants remove the 'X' in the address below: XMORROWS@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 19:29:20 1997 Date: Wed, 02 Jul 1997 19:25:35 -0400 From: "Thomas H. Gimer" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: August trip Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've got the month of August off this year, and am planning to take a long (1-2 week) trip. If any of you were in the same unfortuneate situation, where would you go? If any of you _are_ in the same unfortuneate situation, would you like to come along? I'll be taking the ZX-6. I enjoy camping, fishing, drinking, sleeping, etc. This is basically a request for input concerning which part of the east coast you would choose to see by motorcycle if you had the opportunity. Thanks. -- Thomas H. Gimer tgimer@XXXXXX *email address shown here (not in header) is valid* '90 XR600R '93 XR250R '94 ZX-6E AMA#549096 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Jul 2 19:58:18 1997 From: "Gilley, Lester" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: August trip Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 20:04:18 -0400 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) Content-Type: text/plain This isn't necessarily a full 2 week trip bit I've always wanted to drive down the Shannendoa (SP! I know) Parkway down to Kentucky and visit Mammoth National Park and climb around in the caves. From there you can ride (again through the mountains) to Great Smokey Mountain National Park for some good rides and nice scenery. Then back up the parkway home. Good riding and good scenery. I believe that there are also quite a few camping grounds the whole way down and back. Then again, I am the sissy that is taking the car to Maine in the end of July for 10 days. My $.02. - Lester '97 YZF1000 > -----Original Message----- > From: Thomas H. Gimer [SMTP:tgimer@?smart?.net] > Sent: Wednesday, July 02, 1997 7:26 PM > To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > Subject: August trip > > I've got the month of August off this year, and am planning to take a > long (1-2 week) trip. If any of you were in the same unfortuneate > situation, where would you go? If any of you _are_ in the same > unfortuneate situation, would you like to come along? > > I'll be taking the ZX-6. I enjoy camping, fishing, drinking, > sleeping, > etc. > > This is basically a request for input concerning which part of the > east > coast you would choose to see by motorcycle if you had the > opportunity. > > Thanks. > > -- > Thomas H. Gimer tgimer@XXXXXX > *email address shown here (not in header) is valid* > '90 XR600R '93 XR250R '94 ZX-6E AMA#549096 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Jul 3 00:59:18 1997 From: KLThomas77@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 00:58:18 -0400 (EDT) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Good Stuff --------------------- Forwarded message: Subj: Re: Good Stuff Date: 97-07-03 00:58:21 EDT From: KLThomas77 To: Dysart@XXXXXX Hey, y'all- Just want to add that when Glenn likes a cleaner, you know it's good---while out riding, he wipes the bike down with a chamois at every stop!!! Seriously!! He's got the cleanest motorcycle I've ever seen. Later Kevin From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Jul 3 01:04:16 1997 From: KLThomas77@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 01:03:34 -0400 (EDT) To: Todd.B.Peer@XXXXXX, vfr@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: More humor-no motorcycle content Sorry-- I thought my sister edited these before she sent them to me. I didn't notice all that personal stuff in there. That's from whoever sent it to her. And I don't know what's up with the 3 times each. I don't think I got them 3 times, but it happens sometimes. Later Kevin From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Jul 3 01:12:48 1997 From: KLThomas77@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 01:12:09 -0400 (EDT) To: bmccoy@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: July 4th ride? Hey, y'all- My friend saw a sign at the Frederick Co. MD fairgrounds proclaiming a motorcycle race there on the 4th. I don't know what kind of racing, but I'd bet it's flat track, probably dirt. I hope to have more details tomorrow. Watch this space! Later Kevin From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Jul 3 06:50:52 1997 From: "Dysart, Glenn B., Mr., IMCEN" To: "'Brian McCoy'" Cc: "'DC Cycles'" Subject: RE: July 4th ride? Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 06:50:35 -0400 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.995.52 Encoding: 17 TEXT Brian, I thought you were going to replace your clutch? If you guys go anywhere count me in. If you want, I could lead a nice VA ride if anyone is interested. Let me know the distance/time you want to travel and I'll decide which route(s) to take. Glenn Dysart DysarGB@XXXXXX 84 V30 Magna > >> Count me in - I was planning on picking up a new bike, but looks like >> that's not going to happen. I can be reached at bmccoy@XXXXXX >> through 8pm Thursday evening, and (301)409-5911 anytime (pager w/voice >> mail). > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Jul 3 07:52:55 1997 From: sbeck@XXXXXX X-Lotus-FromDomain: ISI To: 0003833157@XXXXXX, 103126.2533@XXXXXX, anniem@XXXXXX, askstephen@XXXXXX, B.Elwell@XXXXXX, baldwin2@XXXXXX, bdouglas@XXXXXX, bellomo@XXXXXX, Biker413@XXXXXX, bill.maggs@XXXXXX, billsch@XXXXXX, BKVA1@XXXXXX, blase.morgan@XXXXXX, bmonaco@XXXXXX, botcher@XXXXXX, botcher1@XXXXXX, BPOKRASS@XXXXXX, bsajim@XXXXXX, BWEINER@XXXXXX, C.Fagan/MSC01@XXXXXX, cfagan@XXXXXX, Chris.Kleponis@XXXXXX, cnorloff@XXXXXX, cometk@XXXXXX, conteh@XXXXXX, Cooper@XXXXXX, creativ3@XXXXXX, dale@XXXXXX, darden@XXXXXX, davenunn@XXXXXX, DavidW@XXXXXX, dorman@XXXXXX, dotis@XXXXXX, dstrout@XXXXXX, dutchd@XXXXXX, dwakef@XXXXXX, ecrosen@XXXXXX, Edward_Shea@XXXXXX, elliottm@XXXXXX, engine14@XXXXXX, eoffalcon@XXXXXX, fsupik@XXXXXX, gcraddoc@XXXXXX, GRALNGAA@XXXXXX, hacker@XXXXXX, HDWarp80@XXXXXX, herb_manell@XXXXXX, higdont@XXXXXX, hintze@XXXXXX, hmanell@XXXXXX, hugo1200@XXXXXX, jbalders@XXXXXX, JBerkin@XXXXXX, jcclaman@XXXXXX, jchi@XXXXXX, jckozyn@XXXXXX, jeffp@XXXXXX, jimb@XXXXXX, jimi@XXXXXX, jockodc@XXXXXX, John.Nelson@XXXXXX, jonesw@XXXXXX, jrduffy@XXXXXX, jschaaf@XXXXXX, jsnider@XXXXXX, jv@XXXXXX, jwfreyjr@XXXXXX, kays1@XXXXXX, kbass@XXXXXX, kbour@XXXXXX, kmlee@XXXXXX, larry_wilson@XXXXXX, larry_wilson@XXXXXX, Lgvxlh883@XXXXXX, linda.tanner@XXXXXX, louieb386@XXXXXX, louis@XXXXXX, Loupil@XXXXXX, lvarouxis@XXXXXX, mackinto@XXXXXX, mdow@XXXXXX, mducey@XXXXXX, merscht@XXXXXX, Michael_Dow@XXXXXX, mike@XXXXXX, mjhayes@XXXXXX, morris@XXXXXX, mustchz@XXXXXX, mxc11@XXXXXX, names@XXXXXX, nicholsn@XXXXXX, padoug@XXXXXX, Pcoleman@XXXXXX, pdenno@XXXXXX, penneyps@XXXXXX, philipa@XXXXXX, pwwisnes@XXXXXX, Randy.Chartier@XXXXXX, remenick@XXXXXX, rford@XXXXXX, RFRAER@XXXXXX, RichDe@XXXXXX, robertst@XXXXXX, saturnsr1@XXXXXX, sbeck@XXXXXX, scotje@XXXXXX, shadorebel@XXXXXX, slarrab@XXXXXX, smonell@XXXXXX, soukupj@XXXXXX, spak@XXXXXX, SRFox@XXXXXX, steeleg@XXXXXX, STEVE_JOHNSON@XXXXXX, steveb@XXXXXX, syswsb@XXXXXX, tbgliz@XXXXXX, terpstra@XXXXXX, thomas_meeker@XXXXXX, tobias@XXXXXX, Todd.B.Peer@XXXXXX, Tracy-Minter@XXXXXX, venture.royale@XXXXXX, vzo1@XXXXXX, VZO1@XXXXXX, wef@XXXXXX, Winger1200@XXXXXX, wjm1@XXXXXX, wrohara@XXXXXX, IMCEAMS-C3I_C3IPNT1_manteid@XXXXXX, IMCEAMS-C3I_C3ISKY1_WeinsteJ@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 15:59:04 -0400 Subject: July 4th ride Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII For all you riders that don't already have plans for the daylight portion of July 4th, and would like some excitement, please consider riding with us to the Barbara Fritchie Classic flat track race this Friday. If you've never seen this type of racing, you owe it to yourself to give it a try. Picture a dozen riders on a half mile horse race track, pitching their bikes over hard to the left at about a hundred miles per hour and turning their wheels to the right in order to stay in control around the turn, and you get an idea of how wild this kind of racing can be. Getting back in time for fireworks activities will be no problem. The races will be over no later than 6 pm, probably a good deal earlier. Sometimes they finish around 4 pm. The actual races start at 1 pm. Practice and qualifying heats usually start about 11 am. The entrance fee in the past has been 10 dollars and I assume it is still the same. They have your standard hamburgers, hot-dogs and sodas for sale. The location is at the fairgrounds in Frederick Md. It's a horse race track with a large covered grandstand that provides comfortable shade. I would like to get up their early enough to catch some of the practice and qualifying, so if we leave no later than 9 we should be able to get there by 11. We currently have about 4 people that plan to meet at the Fairfax Diner at 8 am and we intend to leave no later than 9 am. To get to the Silver diner , take 66 west past the beltway. exit 50 w. take west ox rd SOUTH exit, go through several lights and diner will be on your left.] Hope to see some of you Friday morning. Steve Beck, From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Jul 3 11:41:21 1997 From: sbeck@XXXXXX X-Lotus-FromDomain: ISI To: 0003833157@XXXXXX, 103126.2533@XXXXXX, anniem@XXXXXX, askstephen@XXXXXX, B.Elwell@XXXXXX, baldwin2@XXXXXX, bdouglas@XXXXXX, bellomo@XXXXXX, Biker413@XXXXXX, bill.maggs@XXXXXX, billsch@XXXXXX, BKVA1@XXXXXX, blase.morgan@XXXXXX, bmonaco@XXXXXX, botcher@XXXXXX, botcher1@XXXXXX, BPOKRASS@XXXXXX, bsajim@XXXXXX, BWEINER@XXXXXX, C.Fagan/MSC01@XXXXXX, cfagan@XXXXXX, Chris.Kleponis@XXXXXX, cnorloff@XXXXXX, cometk@XXXXXX, conteh@XXXXXX, Cooper@XXXXXX, creativ3@XXXXXX, dale@XXXXXX, darden@XXXXXX, davenunn@XXXXXX, DavidW@XXXXXX, dorman@XXXXXX, dotis@XXXXXX, dstrout@XXXXXX, dutchd@XXXXXX, dwakef@XXXXXX, ecrosen@XXXXXX, Edward_Shea@XXXXXX, elliottm@XXXXXX, engine14@XXXXXX, eoffalcon@XXXXXX, fsupik@XXXXXX, gcraddoc@XXXXXX, GRALNGAA@XXXXXX, hacker@XXXXXX, HDWarp80@XXXXXX, herb_manell@XXXXXX, higdont@XXXXXX, hintze@XXXXXX, hmanell@XXXXXX, hugo1200@XXXXXX, jbalders@XXXXXX, JBerkin@XXXXXX, jcclaman@XXXXXX, jchi@XXXXXX, jckozyn@XXXXXX, jeffp@XXXXXX, jimb@XXXXXX, jimi@XXXXXX, jockodc@XXXXXX, John.Nelson@XXXXXX, jonesw@XXXXXX, jrduffy@XXXXXX, jschaaf@XXXXXX, jsnider@XXXXXX, jv@XXXXXX, jwfreyjr@XXXXXX, kays1@XXXXXX, kbass@XXXXXX, kbour@XXXXXX, kmlee@XXXXXX, larry_wilson@XXXXXX, larry_wilson@XXXXXX, Lgvxlh883@XXXXXX, linda.tanner@XXXXXX, louieb386@XXXXXX, louis@XXXXXX, Loupil@XXXXXX, lvarouxis@XXXXXX, mackinto@XXXXXX, mdow@XXXXXX, mducey@XXXXXX, merscht@XXXXXX, Michael_Dow@XXXXXX, mike@XXXXXX, mjhayes@XXXXXX, morris@XXXXXX, mustchz@XXXXXX, mxc11@XXXXXX, names@XXXXXX, nicholsn@XXXXXX, padoug@XXXXXX, Pcoleman@XXXXXX, pdenno@XXXXXX, penneyps@XXXXXX, philipa@XXXXXX, pwwisnes@XXXXXX, Randy.Chartier@XXXXXX, remenick@XXXXXX, rford@XXXXXX, RFRAER@XXXXXX, RichDe@XXXXXX, robertst@XXXXXX, saturnsr1@XXXXXX, sbeck@XXXXXX, scotje@XXXXXX, shadorebel@XXXXXX, slarrab@XXXXXX, smonell@XXXXXX, soukupj@XXXXXX, spak@XXXXXX, SRFox@XXXXXX, steeleg@XXXXXX, STEVE_JOHNSON@XXXXXX, steveb@XXXXXX, syswsb@XXXXXX, tbgliz@XXXXXX, terpstra@XXXXXX, thomas_meeker@XXXXXX, tobias@XXXXXX, Todd.B.Peer@XXXXXX, Tracy-Minter@XXXXXX, venture.royale@XXXXXX, vzo1@XXXXXX, VZO1@XXXXXX, wef@XXXXXX, Winger1200@XXXXXX, wjm1@XXXXXX, wrohara@XXXXXX, IMCEAMS-C3I_C3IPNT1_manteid@XXXXXX, IMCEAMS-C3I_C3ISKY1_WeinsteJ@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 2 Jul 1997 15:59:04 -0400 Subject: July 4th ride Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII For all you riders that don't already have plans for the daylight portion of July 4th, and would like some excitement, please consider riding with us to the Barbara Fritchie Classic flat track race this Friday. If you've never seen this type of racing, you owe it to yourself to give it a try. Picture a dozen riders on a half mile horse race track, pitching their bikes over hard to the left at about a hundred miles per hour and turning their wheels to the right in order to stay in control around the turn, and you get an idea of how wild this kind of racing can be. Getting back in time for fireworks activities will be no problem. The races will be over no later than 6 pm, probably a good deal earlier. Sometimes they finish around 4 pm. The actual races start at 1 pm. Practice and qualifying heats usually start about 11 am. The entrance fee in the past has been 10 dollars and I assume it is still the same. They have your standard hamburgers, hot-dogs and sodas for sale. The location is at the fairgrounds in Frederick Md. It's a horse race track with a large covered grandstand that provides comfortable shade. I would like to get up their early enough to catch some of the practice and qualifying, so if we leave no later than 9 we should be able to get there by 11. We currently have about 4 people that plan to meet at the Fairfax Diner at 8 am and we intend to leave no later than 9 am. To get to the Silver diner , take 66 west past the beltway. exit 50 w. take west ox rd SOUTH exit, go through several lights and diner will be on your left.] Hope to see some of you Friday morning. Steve Beck, From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Jul 3 14:30:12 1997 X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.00.00 Date: Thu, 03 Jul 97 14:25:26 -0500 From: "Brian McCoy" To: Subject: Helmet laws.. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello all.. Just curious (read - sitting at work, borred), what's the helmet law for passangers in MD, VA, and DC? Required, required under 18, not required? Not that I've ever had anyone on the back of a motorcycle... and I wouldn't let anyone ride with me without the same level of protection I require for myself.. Also.. anyone out there any good at laying custom fiberglass? I'm buying a nice old bike, and would like to play with it's looks a little, but don't have the skills/place to lay fiberglass. Heck, I don't have a place to change oil.. (slanted driveway).. blah... sorry for bothering everyone, work's DEAD today. Brian McCoy 81 CB750f NEW ADDITION! 86 VF500f Scrappy nope.. no cages... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Jul 3 15:15:56 1997 From: KLThomas77@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 15:15:06 -0400 (EDT) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: K1200RS spotted in Silver Spring Hey, y'all- I saw a K1200RS on University Blvd today. Was that one of us? Later Kevin From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Jul 3 15:18:35 1997 From: jimi@XXXXXX X-Authentication-Warning: clark.net: jimi owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 3 Jul 1997 15:18:07 -0400 (EDT) To: DC Cycles Subject: 1990 HawkGT 647cc FOR SALE MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Hi, I have a 100% stock, 1990 red HawkGT for sale. The bike is absolutely perfect, not a scratch on it, ultra clean. It has about 7000 miles on it, and has a Targa Tsunami fairing on it, painted to match, but comes off easily if you want. If you have been looking, you know there are not many left in this kind shape. $3300. Feel free to email me with questions, or call 703-264-5501. jimi@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jul 4 07:25:57 1997 X-Authentication-Warning: denmark.it.earthlink.net: 1Cust56.Max3.Washington.DC.MS.UU.NET [153.34.50.56] didn't use HELO protocol Date: Fri, 04 Jul 1997 07:24:23 -0700 From: Mark Lucas Organization: to a fault X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-KIT (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DC Cycles Mailing List Subject: Re: Helmet laws.. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Flat out required for anyone on a motorcycle in MD, DC, and VA. and, IMHO, it's crazy to get on a bike without one anyway.... -- Peace, Mark Lucas http://home.earthlink.net/~mjlucas/ mjlucas@XXXXXX PGP Public Key available on request From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 00:19:49 1997 Date: Fri, 4 Jul 1997 23:57:48 +45722824 (EDT) From: "Gil M. Nissley" Subject: Re: Helmet laws.. To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In-Reply-To: <9707038679.AA867954682@smtplink.micros.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On the subject of helmets...I stopped in to that accessory place in Falls Church(can't remember the name,small shop,guy rides a Beemer with a dog kennel) the other day,and the guy said that in VA you're required to have 4 square inches of reflective material on your helmet.I've never heard of this.Can anyone tell me if this is true? Also,a quick product review.I picked up one of those hot weather scarfs that you soak in water(can't remember the product's name,boy am I doing good tonight) that he recommended.It works pretty good.You need to be in motion for it to work properly,but when you're stopped it doesn't make you any warmer,and it does a good job of keeping the back of your neck from getting sunburned.A good buy for anyone who doesn't want to spend the money on specialized hot weather gear like my CoolTech jacket. The official BuellBoy Genes model. gnissley@XXXXXX GATB#1121 HSB#38DT Buell S1 Lightning "The Petty Hate Machine" "Auto-Darwin the ignorant." D. Sorenson From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 08:42:58 1997 Date: Sat, 05 Jul 1997 08:31:30 -0400 From: Tim Morrow X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Gil M. Nissley" CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Helmet laws.. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Gil M. Nissley wrote: > > On the subject of helmets...I stopped in to that accessory place in > Falls Church(can't remember the name,small shop,guy rides a Beemer with > a dog kennel) ... Art Crow, runs Rider's Accessory Warehouse. > ... the other day,and the guy said that in VA you're required > to have 4 square inches of reflective material on your helmet.I've never > heard of this.Can anyone tell me if this is true? I can't be 100% sure, but I also have some vestigal memory of this item being true. If it is, I've never heard of it being enforced. -- Tim Morrow '73 Ducati 750GT '76 Honda GL1000 - RatWing #3 '91 Suzuki VX800 '92 Ducati 750SS - The Hotrod '92 Ducati 851 - The Beast E-mail respondants remove the 'X' in the address below: XMORROWS@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 14:36:42 1997 From: KLThomas77@XXXXXX Date: Sat, 5 Jul 1997 14:35:52 -0400 (EDT) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Al @ Level 5, please read Al- I forgot to tell you I want a Level 5 t-shirt when they are ready. Thane told me about them. Extra large, not black. thanks Kevin From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 18:26:05 1997 X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.00.00 Date: Sat, 05 Jul 97 18:18:17 -0500 From: "Brian McCoy" To: , Cc: Subject: Re[2]: Helmet laws.. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > ... the other day,and the guy said that in VA you're required > to have 4 square inches of reflective material on your helmet.I've never > heard of this.Can anyone tell me if this is true? I know it's true in MD... though noone's said a word to me about it (getting a license, MSF course, etc....) Brian McCoy 86 VF500f -with a BAD clutch From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 20:01:09 1997 X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.00.00 Date: Sat, 05 Jul 97 19:55:46 -0500 From: "Brian McCoy" To: , Subject: July 4th ride report. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Greetings again fellow crazies.. Ok, maybe I'm the only crazy one... esp. doing a 400 mile ride (ok, 390) with a sadly slipping clutch. But it was a GOOD ride - I left home at 8am yesterday to meet up with another V4 powered bike (a Very clean 84(?) V30), and some gsxr750 thing too... We headed out 66 west (BORING!!) and caught some nifty little back-roads south. We were (I think) pretty much parallel to Skyline Drive. I was supprised that there weren't many bikes out and about it was such a beautiful day. This trip was definatally much more on the leasure side of my rideing style - out of necesity mostly, $#&^%$%^ clutch. You know it's time to replace it when holding a steady throtle at 7k, slight uphill.. and loseing speed while the tach rises... *grumble*. Makes for an interesting feeling when attempting to squirt out of a corner too... feels almost as if the back end has let loose and is swinging free... weight moveing from the back tire to the front.. yuck. ANYWAY.. back to the ride report.... it was a very uneventful ride, no cops (well, one chick that gave me a NASTY stare.. she probably wanted to be out with us, and the park police on Skyline Drive). Lunch at this nice little place called Northern Lights in Charlotesville, VA (SP!). The 3 of us all decided we'd probably be in to much trouble living there... lots of cuties walking about. Dang, I digress once again. Ok, head on out to Skyline drive... easy, pictureske ride for 105 miles... hit this short little road (rt 6?) .. and I see this sign that I want in my garage. It was the ever loved squiggly line.. with a posted recomended 15mph speed limit *drool*.. now if it weren't for that clutch.... Skyline drive.. I bought the year pass, just incase I want to ride that awesome strech of road again (perhaps a nice picknick with a cute girl? any volunteers?). Once we got up there, the bike traffic started.. goldwings and hardleys galore. Thankfully not a lot of cage traffic.. beautiful views, and a very comfortable temperature. We had to make a few unscheduled stops... one for a bear crossing the road, a couple of deer.. and a skunk that didn't know which way to turn. Actually, I understand that a deer decided to make a break for it inbetween the 2nd and 3rd bike at one point in time. For all the wildlife gazing there.. the 'wildlife' was better at Front Royal (town at the 'top' of Skyline Drive).. camo shorts, more surgical steel implants than the 6billion dollar man (body pierces), bass cars, and enough shades of hair color to put a rainbow to shame. Here ended the fun of the ride... it was pretty much a shot on the superslab to get home. Well, one camakazi bird that flew into one of the tires on the bike infront of me... All in all, a long, very good day of rideing. I managed to make it home by about 9pm. An interesting side thought - if the goverentment ever needed money, they could rent out Skyline drive for a good race. 105 miles, top to bottom... ave speeds arround 100mph, and a long way down should you happen to mess up or start watching the scenery.. Sorry for the long post, but I love motorcycleing, and I love rides... anyone want to take me on another one, or join us on one of ours, let me know.. I'm more than happy to forward information about upcoming rides. They are pretty spontanious though (3 days planning.. if that). Oh, this is Valid for anyone in/arround the D.C./MD/VA area... Ride safe everyone... Brian McCoy bmccoy@XXXXXX 86 VF500f - DEAD clutch From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 21:19:39 1997 X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R8.00.00 Date: Sat, 05 Jul 97 21:16:20 -0500 From: "Brian McCoy" To: , Subject: Chain lube.. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Another one.. I forgot to mention one little thing, I receintally changed chain/sprockets and wanted to start off right with a good chain lube. Well, somewhere I heard someone praising Honda pro chain lube (in the RED can) and decided to give it a try. Putting this on my chain, letting it sit over-night and going out for this past ride... NOTHING flung off. My wheels only had dust on them. This is a first for me, and I just wanted to pass on my experiences with this... For those of you on the DC-cycles list, you'll remember the post from Glenn about the S100 engine cleaner... my god does it work. I'll shut up now... Brian From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 22:32:02 1997 Date: Sun, 6 Jul 1997 02:31:34 GMT From: leavitt@XXXXXX (Mr. Bill) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Re[2]: Helmet laws.. >> ... the other day,and the guy said that in VA you're required >> to have 4 square inches of reflective material on your helmet.I've never >> heard of this.Can anyone tell me if this is true? > I know it's true in MD... though noone's said a word to me about it > (getting a license, MSF course, etc....) And I've never heard of anybody being written up for not having it, in VA or MD. I don't know the status of DC. Has anybody ever heard of a citation (or even a written or verbal warning) being issued for this? Personally, I suspect it's a non-issue. At least until you get stopped by some SuperCop with a hair up his butt... Mr. Bill -- Bill Leavitt leavitt@XXXXXX | "Blow it out your ass, motorcycle man! 4 Hondas, 3 Kawasakis & 7 Suzukis +----+ I am THE DEVIL, do you UNDERSTAND?" AMA, ICOA, KTC, Lemans, VJMC, DoD #224 |_____--Frank Zappa, "Titties & Beer" From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 22:32:10 1997 Date: Sat, 5 Jul 1997 22:26:43 +45722824 (EDT) From: "Gil M. Nissley" Subject: Re: Helmet laws.. To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Sat, 5 Jul 1997, Tim Morrow wrote: > Gil M. Nissley wrote: > > On the subject of helmets...I stopped in to that accessory place in > > Falls Church(can't remember the name,small shop,guy rides a Beemer with > > a dog kennel) ... > Art Crow, runs Rider's Accessory Warehouse. Danke.Also,I remembered the name of the scarf.It's Thermo Cool. > > ... the other day,and the guy said that in VA you're required > > to have 4 square inches of reflective material on your helmet.I've never > > heard of this.Can anyone tell me if this is true? > I can't be 100% sure, but I also have some vestigal memory of this > item being true. If it is, I've never heard of it being enforced. I was just curious.Given the color of my helmet(blaze orange) I wasn't real worried about getting nailed. The official BuellBoy Genes model. gnissley@XXXXXX GATB#1121 HSB#38DT Buell S1 Lightning "The Petty Hate Machine" From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 22:34:28 1997 From: Barbelle14@XXXXXX Date: Sat, 5 Jul 1997 22:33:20 -0400 (EDT) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, sbl@XXXXXX Subject: Sharon's 2 answers First of all - *THANKS* so much for all of your help! I got tons of great advice and encouragement. Have no fear, I will never quit riding. :-) A funny thing happened after the class - I sat on my Shadow and everything felt *smaller* than before. I guess that's just from the familiarity I gained at the class. I'm talking engine off, in the storage facility, but she still seemed to fit me better than I remembered. I feel confident that with 6mos-1yr experience, lowering package and bent back handlebars the two of us will eat up a lot of miles together. :-) Okay, maybe move the footpegs back, too. I did find a pair of "Frankenstien" boots for my little feet that give me about an inch and a half. I'm going to ride my new bicycle as much as possible, and ditto a little junkheap motorcycle to learn on. Please don't send bike ads, tho - I'm waiting till after the move for logistic reasons. RE: The move, Jon is going to ride the Ninja down and rent a place. He'll fly back and drive the truck (loaded w/ furniture and Shadow), towing his car. I'll convoy driving my car. We plan to strap the Shadow down and build a little crate around her to protect from falling objects. Thanks again - I'll update you on my progress! Sharon From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jul 5 23:23:23 1997 Date: Sat, 05 Jul 1997 23:25:03 -0700 From: Bryndyn Weiner X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.01KIT (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: July 4th ride report. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Brian McCoy wrote: > anyone want to take me on another one, or join us on one of ours, let > me know.. Well, I'm headed out toward "your town", MD (they might be lurking here) at 6 am to serve a summons for a friend. If we don't get shot we'll probably have a nice ride afterwards. Any takers?.... Thought not. Bryndyn Weiner email: rzbean@XXXXXX "It only takes two-strokes to get me excited." RZ350, CB-1 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Jul 6 20:59:36 1997 X-Sender: ranone@XXXXXX X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 06 Jul 1997 21:02:29 -0400 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Nick & Wendy Ranone Subject: CB Radio I want to get a hand held CB radio for bike to bike communications. Midland makes one that is a 3 in 1. It is a 40 channel CB, 10 channel weather, and an FM radio. Does anyone know of a shop that sells CB radios? There is no listing in the yellow pages under CB or radio that mentions CB's. Nick Ranone 96 Ninja 250R From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Jul 6 22:40:27 1997 X-Sender: gixer@XXXXXX X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Sun, 06 Jul 1997 22:41:39 -0400 To: Nick & Wendy Ranone From: "Collin T. Fagan" Subject: Re: CB Radio Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19970707010229.00664760@pop.erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 09:02 PM 7/6/97 -0400, you wrote: >I want to get a hand held CB radio for bike to bike communications. Midland >makes one that is a 3 in 1. It is a 40 channel CB, 10 channel weather, and >an FM radio. Does anyone know of a shop that sells CB radios? There is no >listing in the yellow pages under CB or radio that mentions CB's. > >Nick Ranone >96 Ninja 250R > It's a little late tonight, but I'll look through my mail for some info I got a while back. The company that sent me the response has CB', 49MHz units, 900Mhz units, FM transcevers, etc. CB is a nice option, but handheld units will be very awkward (even the smallest ones are kind of bulky, and pain in the but to use with helmets) Chaterbox makes a nifty 49Mhz unit, and so does Maxon. The wife and I have two maxon units (49HX) They work pretty well, but the FX model is even better. The HX model we have uses a helmet speaker and boom mic. Above 50 mph the wind noise interferes quite a bit. I noticed that this also happens with the chatterboxes (based on a recent ride with friends) The 49 FX model by maxon uses an earphone mic/speaker. We used these for engine room drills while I was stationed aboard a ship. Even with 2 16 cylinder turbo charged diesels running at 100rpm (and the generators too) transmission through a steel bulkhead was still very loud and clear. With any of the 49Mhz units, the range is limited to a little less than 1/8th mile (even though they'll advertise 1/4 or more....the chatterbox's might come close) they will still be great for group rides, or bikes in pairs. The maxon's also allow a passenger to plug into the main unit. Like I said, I'll dig tomorrow for the web page and e-mail that I have. Collin _________________________________________ Collin and Penny Fagan LTjg, U.S. Coast Guard (202) 366-0067 (work) (703) 356-4279 (home) (703) 816-7255 (pager) http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/5280/ ride.html (ride sheets) bike.html (pics of the bikes) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Jul 7 01:06:11 1997 From: Dark Hacker Date: Mon, 7 Jul 1997 01:05:43 -0400 (EDT) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, mjlucas@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Helmet laws.. Cc: hacker@XXXXXX From: Mark Lucas Subject: Re: Helmet laws.. Flat out required for anyone on a motorcycle in MD, DC, and VA. and, IMHO, it's crazy to get on a bike without one anyway.... A full face helmet with a chin g