From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 1 07:43:41 2005 Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 04:43:34 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Ray Subject: MC Trailer To: DC Cycles FYI - A friend sent me a link to another trailer that's now on the market. Looks like a pretty good design. http://www.portachopper.com/default.htm Of course, I may be biased, since it's pretty darn close to what I built last year. http://share.shutterfly.com/osi.jsp?i=EeCN2LRs5aNWFK I only wish I was getting royalties. Oh well. Brian From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 1 09:03:13 2005 From: To: Subject: Re: MC Trailer Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 9:03:05 -0500 > > From: Brian Ray > Date: 2005/02/01 Tue AM 07:43:34 EST > To: DC Cycles > Subject: MC Trailer > > FYI - > > A friend sent me a link to another trailer that's now > on the market. Looks like a pretty good design. > > http://www.portachopper.com/default.htm eek! $1,200 and fenders are an *option*?? That's even more than the bloated overpriced "Trailer in a Bag". > > Of course, I may be biased, since it's pretty darn > close to what I built last year. > > http://share.shutterfly.com/osi.jsp?i=EeCN2LRs5aNWFK > ..personally, I think your trailer looks *much* sturdier than the Portachopper or the Trailer in a Bag setups and I'm willing to bet you didn't spend HALF that amount. Your's isn't a breakdown type though is it? -aki From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 1 09:12:55 2005 Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 06:12:48 -0800 (PST) From: Ryan Santoso Subject: Re: MC Trailer To: adamme1@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX I just bought a (5x8) utility trailer from Northern Tools for $500. I've used it to load to bikes without any issues. Ryan __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do? http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 1 13:08:23 2005 From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:07:51 EST Subject: Re: MC Trailer To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I just bought one of those MotoTote thingies. Haven't opened the box yet but, I'll give a review once I have. Scooter. In a message dated 2/1/2005 9:13:14 AM Eastern Standard Time, santosor2001@XXXXXX writes: I just bought a (5x8) utility trailer from Northern Tools for $500. I've used it to load to bikes without any issues. Ryan From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 1 15:48:07 2005 Subject: Where my bike and I have been Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 15:48:02 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: See, I have had my boxers in a twist over all the salt on the road and waiting to maybe get 3M paint protection on my bike from an outfit in Sterling called RoadBlock. So as each morning has passed, I stick my head out the door and decide it is too wet; too salty; and too cold to take my new bike out. Before the word poser comes to my mind, I am and will ride my bike all time, but it is my wish to keep it running smooth and as shiny as can be because I like taking care of something that takes care of me and a clean, shiny bike makes me happy. It has been sitting in a garage at about 54 miles on the odometer. I broke today....starting and riding my bike around the garage is not enough. Ducking out of work in a flash of red and black, I made a beeline to my bike. Checked tire pressures...a little low. Started the bike. WHOA....there was this angry, bass rumbling from the engine....use me or lose me. Took a nice 30 mile jaunt up and around Arlington to Fairlington and back. It is hard to vary the RPM range on the 66 and 395 without grabbing the clutch. The engine seemed to smooth out. I get to the Sunoco on Quaker Lane and realize I forgot my dollars so no gas or air for my bike. By the time I snuck it back, the engine was running hot at 199 (F) degrees. I cut the engine, but then mindful of y'alls council about putting a horse away wet...decided to let the engine idle. This was a bad idea as the temp shot up to 225 (F) in no time. So I shut it down and headed for the office. Happy and giddy to be on two wheels once again, I forgot to mention one ominoius metallic ker-klunk when shifting gears from fourth to fifth. As it only happened once, maybe the clutch was not fully engaged. I am riding the bike every day from here on in, and if I don't make it to the paint protection shop and they can't fit me in then I suppose that is how it is going to be. My fingers are still cold but I am a happy man. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 1 15:48:52 2005 Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 12:48:45 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Ray Subject: Re: MC Trailer To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Actually, it's pretty scary how close that design is to what I started with. Yeah, mine is a take-down setup, but takes more tools. Probably is a bit sturdier as a result. You'll always get a bit more play when you have pins vs. bolts. It *is* a bit more expensive than the trailer-in-a-bag (TIAB) setup, but IMHO it's a better design. The torsion axle of the portachopper (and mine) is a huge improvement over the unsuspended TIAB design. Yeah, $1200 is steep, but pretty close to being in-line for whats on the market these days. I probably have $400 in materials in mine, plus 30 hours of labor between my friend and me. Yeah, there's much cheaper trailers that do a good job. Still, the torsion axle leads to a much lower loading height, and a related much easier loading process. I also like the idea of being able to take mine apart and put it inside my grand cherokee if I ever need to. YMMV Brian --- adamme1@XXXXXX wrote: > > > > From: Brian Ray > > Date: 2005/02/01 Tue AM 07:43:34 EST > > To: DC Cycles > > Subject: MC Trailer > > > > FYI - > > > > A friend sent me a link to another trailer that's > now > > on the market. Looks like a pretty good design. > > > > http://www.portachopper.com/default.htm > > eek! $1,200 and fenders are an *option*?? > > That's even more than the bloated overpriced > "Trailer > in a Bag". > > > > > > Of course, I may be biased, since it's pretty darn > > close to what I built last year. > > > > > http://share.shutterfly.com/osi.jsp?i=EeCN2LRs5aNWFK > > > > > ..personally, I think your trailer looks *much* > sturdier > than the Portachopper or the Trailer in a Bag setups > and > I'm willing to bet you didn't spend HALF that > amount. > Your's isn't a breakdown type though is it? > > -aki > > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 1 16:18:44 2005 Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 13:18:36 -0800 (PST) From: "James O'Connor" Subject: Re: Where my bike and I have been To: Julian Halton , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Congrats on breaking the habit of not riding the bike because of.....something.....the weather is doing. I have been without my bike since last Thursday, as I just moved to a new place (behind the clock tower in Herndon) and I haven't had the opportunity to bring it home. But, today I wore my riding boots on the bus, because I'm riding her home tonight, cold weather be darned ;) . And I'm gonna stay on it come everything but icy roads. A few days of figuring out a new bus/metro system is more than I want to deal with right now - I need my bike back...........if you see a green ZRX on the 267, that'd be me :) - Jimmy --- Julian Halton wrote: > See, I have had my boxers in a twist over all the salt on the road > and > waiting to maybe get 3M paint protection on my bike from an outfit > in > Sterling called RoadBlock. So as each morning has passed, I stick > my > head out the door and decide it is too wet; too salty; > and too cold to take my new bike out. Before the word poser comes > to my > mind, I am and will ride my bike all time, but it is my wish to > keep it > running smooth and as shiny as can be because I like taking care of > something that takes care of me and a clean, shiny bike makes me > happy. > It has been sitting in a garage at about 54 miles on the odometer. > > I broke today....starting and riding my bike around the garage is > not > enough. Ducking out of work in a flash of red and black, I made a > beeline to my bike. Checked tire pressures...a little low. Started > the > bike. WHOA....there was this angry, bass rumbling from the > engine....use me or lose me. Took a nice 30 mile jaunt up and > around > Arlington to Fairlington and back. It is hard to vary the RPM range > on > the 66 and 395 without grabbing the clutch. The engine seemed to > smooth > out. I get to the Sunoco on Quaker Lane and realize I forgot my > dollars > so no gas or air for my bike. By the time I snuck it back, the > engine > was running hot at 199 (F) degrees. I cut the engine, but then > mindful > of y'alls council about putting a horse away wet...decided to let > the > engine idle. This was a bad idea as the temp shot up to 225 (F) in > no > time. > > So I shut it down and headed for the office. Happy and giddy to be > on > two wheels once again, I forgot to mention one ominoius metallic > ker-klunk when shifting gears from fourth to fifth. As it only > happened > once, maybe the clutch was not fully engaged. > > I am riding the bike every day from here on in, and if I don't make > it > to the paint protection shop and they can't fit me in then I > suppose > that is how it is going to be. My fingers are still cold but I am a > happy man. > > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 1 16:53:16 2005 Subject: RE: Where my bike and I have been Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2005 16:53:08 -0500 From: "Jonathan W. Kalmes" To: >I am riding the bike every day from here on in, and if I don't >make it to the paint protection shop and they can't fit me in >then I suppose that is how it is going to be. My fingers are >still cold but I am a happy man. Cool... Glad someone's able to ride. Mine is in pieces in the garage waiting for me to finish wiring up a bunch of accessories. Of course, I've been sick as a dog for the last couple of weeks, so I haven't gotten anywhere close to done. :( I'd say that *EVERY* day is a bit high on the expectation chart... The weathermen are still arguing about it, but it looks like Thursday and Friday could be another coating of sleet and snow. :( Hopefully they're over-reacting and I can get my scoot up and running by then. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 08:29:28 2005 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 08:29:00 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: evil cell chatters To: DCCycles http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6895319/ Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 08:57:55 2005 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 05:57:46 -0800 (PST) From: Isaac Blanck Subject: New Harley Sportster To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I'm thinking about getting the 2005 Sportster, the 1200 Custom. It lists for just under $10k. At the moment I have a 2002 Suzuki Marauder with 22,600 miles on it. I live and work in the city, so on one hand I like having a bike that's nimble enough for city riding. However, I also go on longer trips; it's not uncommon for me to ride 1500 miles on a 3 day weekend in the summer. So I want a bike that's a 'tweener; not great for city riding or touring, but decent at both. The Marauder is OK at this. However, the new Sportster is rubber mounted and has a 4.5 gallon tank, and got a pretty good review in the last issue of the AMA magazine. Anyone have this bike that can give me a first hand report on how it rides, or anyone have any additional info on the bike? Also, the closest dealership to me would be the one in Fort Washington, MD, but I guess Patriot Harley wouldn't be that much farther. Any recommendations on where to get it, if I decide to go ahead? Obviously price and quality of service would be factors, but another would be how I get from the dealership to the city when I drop the bike off for service. At the moment I go to Coleman Power Sports in Falls Church, and I can take a $6 cab ride from dealership to the metro which is reasonably convenient. Thanks for any thoughts. jib __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 09:25:39 2005 From: "W.S." To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: RE: Where my bike and I have been Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 09:25:14 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" . . . snip as shiny as can be because I like taking care of something that takes care of me and a clean, shiny bike makes me happy. . . . snip -------------- For temporary surface shielding, try clear shelf paper on vulnerable areas. Been using it for years after a tip off this list, replacing every year or so, though should have converted to some kind of a permanent coating. Bill S. / DC (on digest) '99 VN750 > Wildly veer to avoid dings. Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 10:29:46 2005 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 10:29:38 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC Cycles Subject: Coolant Got a couple of "winterish" question for everyone... My FJR says that if the coolant level is low I should "add coolant" (real helpful manual). Every bottle of anti-freeze I have says to use a 50/50 mix of anti-freeze and water. So... Should I add a 50/50 mix to my bike, or just straight anti-freeze? Any problems with mixing the types of anti-freeze? I have no idea what the dealer used. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 11:31:28 2005 Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2005 11:22:02 -0500 From: skip To: you@XXXXXX CC: DC Cycles Subject: Re: Coolant in my experience: just top it off with some straight coolant. coolant/anti-freeze is at it's peak of cooling/not freezing at a 50/50 mix. using a slightly different mix will nto drastically affect the desired properties, nor will it introduce undisired properties. throw a little straight coolant in. it'll be fine. what I wouldn't do is throw in straight water. if it doesn't get mixed, it will freeze. that's bad. AMHIK http://tinyurl.com/52suk smthng else wrote: > > Got a couple of "winterish" question for everyone... My FJR says that > if the coolant level is low I should "add coolant" (real helpful > manual). Every bottle of anti-freeze I have says to use a 50/50 mix > of anti-freeze and water. So... > > Should I add a 50/50 mix to my bike, or just straight anti-freeze? > > Any problems with mixing the types of anti-freeze? I have no idea > what the dealer used. > > --smthng > http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 11:43:49 2005 Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2005 11:42:01 -0500 Subject: Re: Coolant To: you@XXXXXX Cc: DC Cycles From: "garcia oliver" you@XXXXXX writes: >Got a couple of "winterish" question for everyone... My FJR says that >if the coolant level is low I should "add coolant" (real helpful >manual). Every bottle of anti-freeze I have says to use a 50/50 mix >of anti-freeze and water. So... > >Should I add a 50/50 mix to my bike, or just straight anti-freeze? 50/50 > > >Any problems with mixing the types of anti-freeze? I have no idea >what the dealer used. I haven't heard of problems with mixing. Honda water pumps prefer abrasive/silicate-free antifreeze. There is also non-toxic propylene glycol antifreeze that costs about $1 more per gallon than the common ethylene glycol version. --garcia )B“How is it that the American government was 100 percent certain that Saddam had weapons of mass destruction, but zero percent able to find them?)B” ---Hans Blix, UN chief weapons inspector > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 12:34:58 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: you@XXXXXX, DC Cycles Subject: Re: Coolant Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 12:46:16 -0500 Always 50/50 should be added to the bike. If it's not 50/50 then you are expected to cut it with water yourself. I like 50/50 cause it's more convient. Rob On Wed, 2 Feb 2005 10:29:38 -0500, smthng else wrote > Got a couple of "winterish" question for everyone... My FJR says > that if the coolant level is low I should "add coolant" (real > helpful manual). Every bottle of anti-freeze I have says to use a > 50/50 mix of anti-freeze and water. So... > > Should I add a 50/50 mix to my bike, or just straight anti-freeze? > > Any problems with mixing the types of anti-freeze? I have no idea > what the dealer used. > > --smthng > http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 12:40:49 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: DC Cycles Subject: GPS and maps Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 12:52:09 -0500 I was riding around arlington and DC the other night and my GPS was completely useless. I have a Garmin GPS V with CitySelect maps that are probably a few years old. Anyhow the GPS was telling me exits that didn't exist and was having trouble keep locked on the roads. I figured there has been so many changes over the past few year it's just no accurate anymore. Has anyone else encountered this ? I am thinkging I might need some new maps for DC since being from the Burbs I depend on the GPS to guide me around in the District. It happens in PA on RT 15 too since they have done a lot of changes on it too. Rob -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 14:07:43 2005 From: "Perry Coleman" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: GPS and maps Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2005 14:04:51 -0500 I also have the GPS V and Mapsource/City Select. The last "upgrade" was in mid-2003. Since then, there have been patches, but no updates to the database. So, any changes in the last two years or so won't be reflected. And yes, I run into the same problem with different areas that are undergoing (or have recently underwent) construction. You've just got to know when to believe the GPS and when to believe the signage... ;^) Perry >From: "Rob Sharp" >To: DC Cycles >Subject: GPS and maps >Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 12:52:09 -0500 > >I was riding around arlington and DC the other night and my GPS was >completely >useless. I have a Garmin GPS V with CitySelect maps that are probably a >few >years old. Anyhow the GPS was telling me exits that didn't exist and was >having trouble keep locked on the roads. I figured there has been so many >changes over the past few year it's just no accurate anymore. Has anyone >else >encountered this ? I am thinkging I might need some new maps for DC since >being from the Burbs I depend on the GPS to guide me around in the >District. >It happens in PA on RT 15 too since they have done a lot of changes on it >too. > >Rob > >-- >Rob Sharp >rob@XXXXXX > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 15:16:46 2005 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 15:16:42 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Perry Coleman Subject: Re: GPS and maps Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > I also have the GPS V and Mapsource/City Select. The last "upgrade" was in > mid-2003. Since then, there have been patches, but no updates to the > database. The only updates on the Garmin website are for the base program - map database updates are always for ca$h. I believe that City Select is up to version 6 or 7 now. Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 2 15:44:03 2005 Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 15:43:55 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC Cycles Subject: Helmet? Hey all, Just putting this out there because it was sent to me... It seems that the helmet law for VA is being put up to a vote again sometime real soon (not sure exactly when)... http://leg1.state.va.us/cgi-bin/legp504.exe?051+ful+HB1828 Thought you all might be interested. If I can find out any more details about when it's being voted on, I'll let ya know. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 02:20:50 2005 Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 19:35:04 -0500 Subject: Easy Rider??? From: Bob McKeithen To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new-20040701 (2.0) at filter02.roc.ny.frontiernet.net It is on right now and I cannot for the life of me see why we consider this mess a classic. My summary--Drug dealer makes a big sale and heads East a t speeds approaching 30 MPH while uttering deeply significant observations and winds up getting beat up and shot dead by locals. WFT Bob From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 03:02:09 2005 Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 03:02:31 -0500 To: Bob McKeithen , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Easy Rider??? At 07:35 PM 2/3/05 -0500, Bob McKeithen wrote: >It is on right now and I cannot for the life of me see why we consider >this mess a classic. My summary--Drug dealer makes a big sale and heads >East a t speeds approaching 30 MPH while uttering deeply significant >observations and winds up getting beat up and shot dead by locals. WFT Alternate description: A pair of non-conformist entrepreneurs complete a big deal successfully, and take a vacation on bikes, using the free time made possible by their success to explore life's options, have some good times, and relax. Conformist society, primarily motivated by prejudice and fear of those who would exercise real freedom rather than the illusion of it sanctioned by that society, resorts to violence and kills one of the partners, ending the vacation, and the dreams of freedom it represented. Yes, if you totally miss all the symbolism, and ignore the culture at the time it was made, it's just a drug dealer and his buddy put-putting around until killed. Enough people didn't miss the symbolism and the cultural setting though to make it a classic and a fair description of the attitude and problems of the times. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 07:20:39 2005 Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 07:20:31 -0500 From: "De Boeser, Tom" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Easy Rider??? Bob McKeithen wrote: > It is on right now and I cannot for the life of me see why we > consider this mess a classic. My summary--Drug dealer makes a big sale > and heads East a t speeds approaching 30 MPH while uttering deeply > significant observations and winds up getting beat up and shot dead by > locals. WFT > I believe its considered a classic due to the writing and the filmmakers talent. IMOH, its ok, little strange. Its definitely no _On Any Given Sunday_ or _Faster_. Tom de - '03 ST1300 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 09:50:40 2005 From: bernescut@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Easy Rider??? Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:49:56 -0500 I wonder if years from now they'll look back on the Starboyz video with the same nostalgia now held for Easy Riders. Cedric Bernescut 2000 CBR600F4 Annandale, VA -----Original Message----- From: De Boeser, Tom [mailto:tdeboeser@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Easy Rider??? Bob McKeithen wrote: > It is on right now and I cannot for the life of me see why we > consider this mess a classic. My summary--Drug dealer makes a big sale > and heads East a t speeds approaching 30 MPH while uttering deeply > significant observations and winds up getting beat up and shot dead by > locals. WFT > I believe its considered a classic due to the writing and the filmmakers talent. IMOH, its ok, little strange. Its definitely no _On Any Given Sunday_ or _Faster_. Tom de - '03 ST1300 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 10:07:53 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:07:38 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Bob McKeithen Subject: Re: Easy Rider??? Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX On Thu, 3 Feb 2005 19:35:04 -0500, Bob McKeithen wrote: > It is on right now and I cannot for the life of me see why we consider > this mess a classic. My summary--Drug dealer makes a big sale and heads > East a t speeds approaching 30 MPH while uttering deeply significant > observations and winds up getting beat up and shot dead by locals. WFT > > Bob I think I'm with Bob on this one. One of the primary attractions seems to be all the folklore and spirit of the times surrounding the picture, not the picture itself, which as Bob points out, is barely watchable. The fact that all the principals spent a good portion of the production time high as a kite prolly has something to do with that. Furthermore, I have little use for all that "outlaw biker" crap, not to mention garishly appointed and virtually unrideable "chopper" motorcycles. "Easy Rider" stoked that all that silliness. It continues on with the things like the high profile of the Orange County Blowhards and what passes for "biker" culture in the popular imagination. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 10:09:05 2005 X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.81) by wfilter.us4.outblaze.com; 4 Feb 2005 15:08:54 -0000 From: "David Blumgart" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 10:08:52 -0500 Subject: RE: Easy Rider >> It is on right now and I cannot for the life of me see >> why we consider this mess a classic.... I'm with you. It's a trainwreck. Bad script, bad acting (Nicholson excepted, of course)dumb ideas. It's one of those movies that I thought was far out when I saw it in 1969, and should never, ever have watched again, remaining content with the memories. But to answer your implied question, its reputation stems from its innovation: it was the first time a credible version of the emerging alternative life-style (freaks, hippies, whatever) was portrayed on the screen. And choppers too. It might be their first screen appearance, and I believe heralded a whole bunch of really, really crappy biker movies in the 70's, many with Peter Fonda, if I recall correctly. In fact, I think we've Easy Rider to thank for that whole OC chopper deal, which is another excellent reason to hate the movie. And the Nicholson characters's death and the ending murders prefigures the whole tone of the polarized and paranoid early 70's. Lordy, that decade sucked. -- ___________________________________________________________ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 10:49:15 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 10:49:06 -0500 From: Robert To: Bob McKeithen Subject: Re: Easy Rider??? Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Unfortunately I saw it at the tender age of six years of age (not sure why my dad thought this was "family entertainment"), and the shooting scene gave me nightmares for years... I wonder if that's why I always give pickups trucks such a leery eye when they pull alkongside? ;-) Robert On Thu, 3 Feb 2005 19:35:04 -0500, Bob McKeithen wrote: > It is on right now and I cannot for the life of me see why we consider > this mess a classic. My summary--Drug dealer makes a big sale and heads > East a t speeds approaching 30 MPH while uttering deeply significant > observations and winds up getting beat up and shot dead by locals. WFT > > Bob > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 11:18:58 2005 Subject: Not so easy Easy Rider Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:18:56 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "David Blumgart" , http://media.skoopy.com/vids/vid_00438.wmv From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 12:12:44 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "Julian Halton" , "David Blumgart" , Subject: Re: Not so easy Easy Rider Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 12:24:25 -0500 They need a speed camera at the corner. :-p On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 11:18:56 -0500, Julian Halton wrote > http://media.skoopy.com/vids/vid_00438.wmv -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 12:21:53 2005 X-OB-Received: from unknown (205.158.62.81) by wfilter.us4.outblaze.com; 4 Feb 2005 17:21:46 -0000 From: "David Blumgart" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Cc: julian@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 12:21:46 -0500 Subject: Not so Easy Rider That's a corner I plan to avoid. I do admire a couple of those drivers. In the second group, the guy in the white car does some nice defensive moves, albeit aided by a lack of oncoming traffic. The driver of the little yellow (Fiat?) pulls it out nicely, too. OTOH, the guy on the bike was hosed before he even gets to the turn. MSF for him -- ___________________________________________________________ Sign-up for Ads Free at Mail.com http://promo.mail.com/adsfreejump.htm From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 12:33:43 2005 Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 12:34:10 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Not so easy Easy Rider At 11:18 AM 2/4/05 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: > > http://media.skoopy.com/vids/vid_00438.wmv Looks like the bike rider went down early. The guy in the second cut, in the white car, did a fantastic job of avoiding the collision. Damn good driving there. Wonder if he'd been around that corner before? ;-) -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 12:36:28 2005 Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 12:36:56 -0500 To: "David Blumgart" , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Not so Easy Rider Cc: julian@XXXXXX At 12:21 PM 2/4/05 -0500, David Blumgart wrote: >aided by a lack of oncoming traffic. The driver of the little yellow (Fiat?) Looked a bit like a Citroen 2CV. It looks like it's raining, but given how easily some of those vehicles lost traction, I'm wondering if there isn't some ice involved? Maybe that building shades that spot or something. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 12:56:20 2005 From: "Kathleen Loerich" To: Subject: Request for Input Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 12:53:50 -0500 A presenter for the upcoming SHA/FHA Traffic Safety Conference on February 9th and 10th asked for input for his presentation. Instead of relying solely on my opinon, I thought I'd extend the request to dc-cycles. --------------------------------------- The Request --------------------------------------- The original "working title" is "What Really Pisses Bikers Off About Highway Issues", but since most of the participants would not see the humor it will be called, "Behind The Handlebars: A Biker's Perspective On Highway Issues". The idea is to address some of the other topics presented at the conference as they concern riders. I will cover topics such as: the inattentive driver, intelligent transportation, highway maintenance (repaving), roadside barriers as well as rider responsibility issues. Any information you have on these issues, or others, that I can incorporate into my presentation would be helpful. ---------------------------- So.... Are there any comments? Kathleen Loerich From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 12:57:13 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:56:49 -0800 (PST) From: "James O'Connor" Subject: Re: Not so Easy Rider To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX There has to be ice there. Some of those cars were going mighty slow to have lost traction like they did......and to keep sliding. Poor sap towards the end that clipped the other car must've been knocked out because they weren't making any attempt to control it. > It looks like it's raining, but given how easily some of those > vehicles > lost traction, I'm wondering if there isn't some ice involved? > Maybe that > building shades that spot or something. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 13:19:15 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 13:19:07 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Not so Easy Rider On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 09:56:49 -0800 (PST), James O'Connor wrote: > There has to be ice there. I'm not certain that all of them had ice. Some of the incidents happened in May. (The others: Oct., Nov, Jan., Feb.) In some it ice may be a contributing factor, but it appears to be primarily some sort of basic road surface issue/flaw that's exacerbated in the rain. Some of those cars were going mighty slow > to have lost traction like they did......and to keep sliding. It does point out the rather obvious advantages to having four wheels instead of two planted on Mother Earth. None of the cagers went through the curve on their butts. :-/ -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 13:23:11 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 13:23:03 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: Request for Input To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >The original "working title" is "What Really Pisses Bikers >Off About Highway Issues", but since most of the >participants would not see the humor it will >be called, "Behind The Handlebars: A Biker's Perspective On >Highway Issues". [Dave] How about "A 2 wheeled perspective". "Biker" conjures up stereotypical images to politicians. "Motorcyclist's" would be an improvement as well. The idea is to address some of the other topics presented at the conference as they concern riders. I will cover topics such as: the inattentive driver, [Dave] Recent studies show cell yakking is dangerous, we've known that for quite some time. Hands free doesn't matter in the studies, and since I don't like yakking while I drive, I'll reserve judgment on whether or not that's true. I do know that statistically, 8 of 10 drivers that cut over on me without a decent gap, or, are poking along in front of me, are yakking on a phone. Get some prop bumper stickers that say SHUT UP AND DRIVE! Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 13:51:58 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 13:51:45 EST Subject: Re: Not so Easy Rider To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/4/2005 1:26:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, dcmcrider@XXXXXX writes: > but it appears to be primarily some sort > of basic road surface issue/flaw that's exacerbated in the rain. I tried to load the video several times with no luck (dial up) so I have not seen it. But _that_ statement reminded me of a road near where I first began riding. The surface on that damn stretch of road was fine when dry. But wet? Holy shit!!!! Cars, and bikes (including me) constantly slid through intersections with no apparent slowing at all. Used to avoid that road like the plague if it was damp at all. Used to say it was "like driving on ice" Now that I have driven/ridden on ice I can safely say that I was right. They came in and re-paved at the intersections to help with accidents but if you had to apply the brakes in the straightaways between you were still F&*%ed. Also I lived in Vegas for 3 years, there was _never_ enough rain to clean the crap off of the roads. When we did get a little rain all it did was bring all the shit to the surface. That was like riding on ice also... John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC 1999, Honda ST1100X Pan European 1983, BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles 1976, Honda CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 15:13:10 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 12:13:02 -0800 (PST) From: Carl Custer Subject: ST1100 for sale To: DCCycles Cc: teblum@XXXXXX From SabMag list: My 93 ST1100 is for sale. I have decided to keep the V65 Sabre for long trips and the SV650 for short trips and curves. [Carl]: Contact him: not me. After 2000 miles through Baja California on a DR 350, Tom decided he "don't need no steenkin' luxury barge". He's even older than me :^). The bike is the rare (but faded) Candy Glory Red. He lives twixt Tampa and Orlando so you could take a bus, pick up the bike, drive over to T&T week in Daytona, and return in the balmy latter days of March. Tom also does his own wrenching so you won't have any "surprises" that older bikes "fixed" by dealers sometimes offer. Price $2800. 75K miles Needs tires. Has Helibars and Driving Lights and Tank Bra. Paint weathered on the bags. Some Buffing scratches on the front fender. Tom Carl (back from Baja) in Bethesda __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? All your favorites on one personal page )B– Try My Yahoo! http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 15:16:13 2005 Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 15:13:44 -0500 To: "Kathleen Loerich" , From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input At 12:53 PM 2/4/05 -0500, Kathleen Loerich wrote: >as they concern riders. I will cover topics such as: the inattentive >driver, intelligent transportation, highway maintenance (repaving), roadside >barriers as well as rider responsibility issues. There are lots of possibilities, but the one that comes to mind first as being mildly dangerous (especially to new riders), fairly annoying, and probably not obvious to non-riders is that grooved stuff left behind when they grind off the top layer of a couple of miles of road surface. The paving crews seem to think this mess is as good as a regular road surface, as they open the road to normal traffic again and then often leave it that way for weeks before they get around to re-paving. With cars and trucks they are basically right, but with bikes and their tiny contact patches, the grooves can try to steer the bike for you, and if you tense up or panic at the strange motions you get, could pose a serious safety hazard. I've found that a loose grip, and not trying to fight the shimmy lets me ride on the stuff well enough, but there's still some concern about how it will affect swerves, stops and other emergency maneuvers should they become necessary. Sometimes the grooves aren't too bad, other times they can require a lot of attention to negotiate safely...attention that is no longer available for other required tasks. Those responsible for road maintenance should at least be aware of these issues, and try to limit the potential harm by limiting duration, not doing it to all lanes at once on a given stretch of roadway, or even by limiting the depth of the grooves and standardizing the characteristics a bit better. I'm sure they are already aware of things like potholes, crown roads and the reverse banking they create at curves, traffic light sensors that don't detect bikes, roads that run directly into the rising or setting sun (no real sun visors on bikes...and what we have requires aiming the head down to use), etc., but those are all worth mentioning too. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 17:21:48 2005 From: Daniel To: "Kathleen Loerich" Cc: Subject: Re: Request for Input Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 17:21:24 -0500 You probably already have it covered, but if not, standard metal gaurd rails can be fatal or mutilating to a sliding motorcyclist. If you can, you might want to see if you can get any statistics on the Harry S Truman exit from central avenue. A guy who used to work at clinton cycles lost his legs there. On Fri, 4 Feb 2005 12:53:50 -0500, "Kathleen Loerich" wrote: >A presenter for the upcoming SHA/FHA Traffic Safety Conference on February >9th and 10th asked for input for his presentation. > >Instead of relying solely on my opinon, I thought I'd extend the request to >dc-cycles. > >--------------------------------------- >The Request >--------------------------------------- >The original "working title" is "What Really Pisses Bikers Off About Highway >Issues", but since most of the participants would not see the humor it will >be called, "Behind The Handlebars: A Biker's Perspective On Highway Issues". > >The idea is to address some of the other topics presented at the conference >as they concern riders. I will cover topics such as: the inattentive >driver, intelligent transportation, highway maintenance (repaving), roadside >barriers as well as rider responsibility issues. > >Any information you have on these issues, or others, that I can incorporate >into my presentation would be helpful. >---------------------------- > >So.... Are there any comments? > >Kathleen Loerich > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 17:26:06 2005 From: Daniel To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: rubbernecking Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 17:25:31 -0500 I was on the beltway a few days ago, there was an accident on the other side... traffic on my side was slow just because of people gawking. It occured to me if the median were a foot or two higher, most of the cagers wouldn't be able ot see what's going on that side, and woulnd't slow down to be nosey. not only would it speed up traffic but it would prevent some collisions on the non crash side from people running into the back of others or hitting someone else while looking at the accident. If anyone writes to Dr gridlock, throw that in will ya. thanks Anyone wanna guess in how many years it will take them to raise the wall height or never? From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 17:33:12 2005 From: "Rob Keiser" To: kathleenloerich@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Request for Input Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 17:31:34 -0500 One of my pet peeves...cigarette butts flicked out car/truck windows bouncing off me or my bike. Rob '98 VFR800 From: "Kathleen Loerich" To: Subject: Request for Input Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 12:53:50 -0500 A presenter for the upcoming SHA/FHA Traffic Safety Conference on February 9th and 10th asked for input for his presentation. Instead of relying solely on my opinon, I thought I'd extend the request to dc-cycles. --------------------------------------- The Request --------------------------------------- The original "working title" is "What Really Pisses Bikers Off About Highway Issues", but since most of the participants would not see the humor it will be called, "Behind The Handlebars: A Biker's Perspective On Highway Issues". The idea is to address some of the other topics presented at the conference as they concern riders. I will cover topics such as: the inattentive driver, intelligent transportation, highway maintenance (repaving), roadside barriers as well as rider responsibility issues. Any information you have on these issues, or others, that I can incorporate into my presentation would be helpful. ---------------------------- So.... Are there any comments? Kathleen Loerich From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 17:43:37 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "Rob Keiser" , kathleenloerich@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Request for Input Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:55:22 -0500 Or it hits my car. I bet if you forced smokers to keep the smoke/ash and butts in their car they might think twice before continuing their habit. Rob On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 17:31:34 -0500, Rob Keiser wrote > One of my pet peeves...cigarette butts flicked out car/truck windows > bouncing off me or my bike. > > Rob > '98 VFR800 > > From: "Kathleen Loerich" > Reply-To: "Kathleen Loerich" > To: > Subject: Request for Input > Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 12:53:50 -0500 > > A presenter for the upcoming SHA/FHA Traffic Safety Conference on > February 9th and 10th asked for input for his presentation. > > Instead of relying solely on my opinon, I thought I'd extend the > request to dc-cycles. > > --------------------------------------- > The Request > --------------------------------------- > The original "working title" is "What Really Pisses Bikers Off About > Highway Issues", but since most of the participants would not see > the humor it will be called, "Behind The Handlebars: A Biker's > Perspective On Highway Issues". > > The idea is to address some of the other topics presented at the > conference as they concern riders. I will cover topics such as: the > inattentive driver, intelligent transportation, highway maintenance > (repaving), roadside barriers as well as rider responsibility issues. > > Any information you have on these issues, or others, that I can > incorporate into my presentation would be helpful. > ---------------------------- > > So.... Are there any comments? > > Kathleen Loerich -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 17:46:22 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 17:46:14 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Rob Keiser Subject: Re: Request for Input Cc: kathleenloerich@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX My list of pet peeves, in no particular order. 1) Left lane turtles. Note to Hwy. Administrators: if it's the law from slower traffic to move right, let's have lots of signs to that effect. And how about some enforcement. 2) Traffic circles: more of 'em. Traffic lights: fewer of them. 3) Those damned in-pavement loops that don't detect bikes. 4) Milled pavement to not be left from more than 3 calendar days. Put this in the specifications for re-paving contracts. Require contractors to mark edge traps in bright orange paint when milling. 5) Since this concerns Maryland, how about a crackdown on HOV cheaters on 270? My on-bike surveys indicate rampant cheating. 6) Terminate the silly publicity stunt called Operation Road Rocket, if it hasn't happened already. 7) Higher penalties for careless/inattentive driving that results in death or injury. On Fri, 04 Feb 2005 17:31:34 -0500, Rob Keiser wrote: > One of my pet peeves...cigarette butts flicked out car/truck windows > bouncing off me or my bike. > > Rob > '98 VFR800 > -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 17:51:08 2005 From: "rich hall" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Request for Input Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2005 17:50:53 -0500 Legalize lane-splitting aka lane-sharring aka filtering. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 22:10:27 2005 From: "W.S." To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: Re: Request for Input Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 22:10:03 -0500 How about measures leaning on the positives motorcycles bring to traffic/parking? Lane splitting/filtering (as mentioned), multiple bikes to a space, special high density parking areas, selective sidewalk parking, and other possible benefits to the urban choke problem. Also have all public garages (gates, insurance) made mc-friendly. Adding to construction nits - steel plates turn slick. Both more pronounced/advanced notification and roughening are needed. And uneven pavement is all too often uncautioned. While we're at it -- how about 270deg.-visible front turn signals, particularly on all trucks? Catch me again in 6 mos. Bill S. / DC (on digest) '99 VN750 > Ban cages. Area roads sans autos are great. Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 22:57:15 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 22:57:07 -0500 From: smthng else To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: rubbernecking > Anyone wanna guess in how many years it will take them to raise the > wall height or never? It's already been raised in most places... that's what the little green slot things are all along the dividing wall. The problem is that there are hills and dips. A car coming down towards a dip can see all the way up the other side and it would take a 30 foot wall to block it. Do I think that the two foot green things are enough? No. Would a bigger wall help? Probably. Couldn't people just freaking pay attention and DRIVE? That would be nice. :S --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 23:09:04 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 23:08:57 -0500 From: smthng else To: Kathleen Loerich Subject: Re: Request for Input Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Gravel. Not only cleaning it up off the roadways where it gathers, but how about making VDOT secure it to the road when using it for repairs, instead of just spraying buckets of the stuff on blobs of tar (very similar to the kitty-litter -on-oil-leaks trick - has about the same effect too). On a separate note, simply enforcing standard laws would be a good thing. Prime example... a semi did a U-turn yesterday at a stop light on Braddock where it was clearly posted "No U-Turns". A Ffx Cty cop pulled up and flipped on his lights in order to stop traffic. The semi had to do a 5-point turn and held up traffic through three full cycles of the light. The semi then drove away and the cop went the other way. If I had done that on a bike, you can guarantee I would have been tagged. That's just a personal peeve though... I see people violating basic road rules every day on the way to work and the cops don't care. One of us doesn't spot a speed limit sign and you can bet they'll be there. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 23:09:09 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 23:11:50 -0500 Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 02/04/05 From: Bob McKeithen To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new-20040701 (2.0) at filter02.roc.ny.frontiernet.net > > Yes, if you totally miss all the symbolism, and ignore the culture at > the > time it was made, it's just a drug dealer and his buddy put-putting > around > until killed. Enough people didn't miss the symbolism and the cultural > setting though to make it a classic and a fair description of the > attitude > and problems of the times. I didn't miss the symbolism--thought it was inane and about what a bunch of junior high school playwrights would come up with. Especially the scene early on where the two riders are changing a tire in the background while a couple of ranchers are shoeing a horse in the foreground. ( groan ) Some of the photography was nice though. Bob From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 4 23:47:41 2005 Date: Fri, 4 Feb 2005 20:47:04 -0800 (PST) From: John Kozyn Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 02/04/05 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "rich hall" "Legalize lane-splitting aka lane-sharring aka filtering." Thank you. That about sums up my priorities. The rest I can deal with. Sitting in traffic is f'n ridiculous. Happily Rich, there is this truism: "As goes California, so goes the nation." Hope we get to see it happen. JK 1999 900SS 1995 VFR750F __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? All your favorites on one personal page )B– Try My Yahoo! http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 08:44:58 2005 Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 09:02:04 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: Biker hit from behind http://www.farson.com/images/bikestop.gif Watch your backs! -- Wayne - http://www.blueblackbusa.org/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 09:02:03 2005 Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 06:01:55 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Withrow Subject: Re: Request for Input To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- "Mike B." wrote: > roads that run directly into the > rising or setting sun (no > real sun visors on bikes...and what we have requires > aiming the head down > to use), etc., but those are all worth mentioning > too. So you want to ban East/West roads? ===== AIM: Inf DS http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow ----------------------------------------------------------- Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to childproof the world. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 09:21:21 2005 Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 09:21:15 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Wayne Edelen Subject: Re: Biker hit from behind Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > http://www.farson.com/images/bikestop.gif > > Watch your backs! Ouch! I don't know how much good my blinking Hyperlites do, but they definitely can't hurt. It was amazing that it took the person in the pickup as long as it did to react to the stopped bike (based on when their brake lights came on). Maybe rig up a ultrasonic rangefinder from an old Polaroid camera to fire a rearward facing paintball gun when a certain distance/velocity parameter has been met? Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 09:27:57 2005 Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2005 09:27:55 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: David Blumgart Subject: Re: Biker hit from behind At 09:21 AM 2/5/2005 -0500, you wrote: > > http://www.farson.com/images/bikestop.gif > > > > Watch your backs! > >Ouch! I don't know how much good my blinking Hyperlites do, but they >definitely can't hurt. > >It was amazing that it took the person in the pickup as long as it did >to react to the stopped bike (based on when their brake lights came >on). I'm guessing he was rubbernecking the cop whose camera provided that riveting footage. Idiot. >Maybe rig up a ultrasonic rangefinder from an old Polaroid camera to >fire a rearward facing paintball gun when a certain distance/velocity >parameter has been met? Yeah, that's a good idea From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 09:54:04 2005 From: "Dave Yates" To: Subject: RE: Request for Input Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 09:52:00 -0500 X-ELNK-Trace: 956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec79c79e83d990ee9d393ef49bfdfd495284350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c A Ffx Cty cop pulled up and flipped on his lights in order to stop traffic. The semi had to do a 5-point turn and held up traffic through three full cycles of the light. The semi then drove away and the cop went the other way. If I had done that on a bike, you can guarantee I would have been tagged. That's just a personal peeve though... I see people violating basic road rules every day on the way to work and the cops don't care. One of us doesn't spot a speed limit sign and you can bet they'll be there. [Dave] The trucker above may have contacted the officer in advance, from what you describe, the officer probably sanctioned the turn, as (s)he is empowered to do. May have been inconvenient, but it beats a collision... Re: road rules. Take the money out of speeding tickets and you'll see that stop. Not overnight, but it will stop not because they're cracking down, because the governments won't be able to afford to... Well, Fairfax will, but they're a lost cause. Fines don't deter us ! Nor high gas prices as we've seen over the past 2 years... I haven't seen a single solitary gas guzzling SUV for cheap during this high gas price boom. Now, if you've got to bail a day of work to work along the road side picking up trash, the state probably isn't going to make any money off it. In fact, it will be a drain on the tax payers. Soon, from on high, the police decision makers will be told to find other busy work during their shifts, or face budget cuts! From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 09:54:15 2005 From: "Gary Foreman" To: Subject: RE: Biker hit from behind Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 09:55:29 -0500 It's amazing how many accidents are caused by rubbernecking at the cops. Case in point. I was traveling west on Rt. 7 past Purceville Wed. A state trooper decided he needed to turn around in the emergency crossover in the median. He turned his lights on, and crossed over. About 8 cars in front of me got heavy on the brakes. I had about 6-7 car lengths in front of me so when I saw the chain reaction, I slowed down...heavy, but not standing on the brakes. Two seconds later, I'm plowed in the rear in my 2001 Tundra with on 18k miles on it. Launched the back of my truck off the ground. I laid on the horn so the cop would look over and see what happened. He came back an worked the accident. The guy that hit me took the brunt of it. His hood was almost in his windshield. The bumper is toast on my truck, and it kissed the right corner lightly. I haven't found any other damage yet. My passenger's back is a little sore, and my right shoulder is sore (probably from bracing against the steering wheel) but I'll be fine. Not trying to rake the insurance company or anything. At first I was mad I didn't take my old '91 Accord that day...then I was thinking that I might not be here typing this if I had. Had I been on my bike? Forget it! Guess I'm getting old. After about 10 seconds of being pissed, I started feeling bad for the guy who hit me. He won't be driving home, though physically he was okay. I've been on both sides of this situation. All because the trooper had to turn around in rush hour traffic. He wasn't on an emergency call (since he turned his lights off as soon as the turned around. Of course I'm speculating here. I have no idea why he turned. Of course I won't be complaining since the accident wasn't my fault. But the other guy sure was upset about what caused it. Gary Foreman (happy to be here) -----Original Message----- From: Wayne Edelen [mailto:wayne@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Biker hit from behind http://www.farson.com/images/bikestop.gif Watch your backs! -- Wayne - http://www.blueblackbusa.org/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 10:25:41 2005 Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 10:25:33 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: rich hall Subject: Re: Request for Input Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > Legalize lane-splitting aka lane-sharring aka filtering. Different animals - Lane Splitting and Sharing are usually done with all vehicles moving. Filtering is done at stoplights as a bike filters past stopped cars. Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 10:31:22 2005 Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 10:31:19 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Gary Foreman Subject: Re: Biker hit from behind Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > All because the trooper had to turn around in rush hour traffic. He wasn't > on an emergency call (since he turned his lights off as soon as the turned > around. Of course I'm speculating here. I have no idea why he turned. The ironic part of this whole thing is that he turned his lights on as a safety measure. Ya gotta love it. Glad that you're OK Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 13:07:38 2005 Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2005 13:01:53 -0500 To: Todd Withrow , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input At 06:01 AM 2/5/05 -0800, Todd Withrow wrote: > >--- "Mike B." wrote: >> roads that run directly into the >> rising or setting sun (no >> real sun visors on bikes...and what we have requires >> aiming the head down >> to use), etc., but those are all worth mentioning >> too. > >So you want to ban East/West roads? No, just the sort I described. Most roads don't run directly into the areas the sun rises into or sets from...they are at least a few degrees off (even allowing for changes in where the sun rises and sets throughout the year). Those that need to head that way often wind a bit, so the places where you are blinded are minimized, and many of those have conveniently placed trees, buildings, walls or hills to limit the line of sight to the thermonuclear furnace glow, so you have a chance of seeing other vehicles, lane markers and other things that improve safety. Unfortunately, not all roads are like that, and some are dangerous to ride at particular times of the day as a result. It also adds to traffic congestion, as even cage drivers have problems with the glare and tend to slow way down...or not and then the resulting accidents tie things up. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 13:07:41 2005 Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2005 13:08:05 -0500 To: Michael Jordan , Wayne Edelen From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Biker hit from behind Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX At 09:21 AM 2/5/05 -0500, Michael Jordan wrote: >> http://www.farson.com/images/bikestop.gif >Maybe rig up a ultrasonic rangefinder from an old Polaroid camera to >fire a rearward facing paintball gun when a certain distance/velocity >parameter has been met? The solution was invented many years ago (not sure of the exact date, but I'm fairly sure it was prior to 1990), but has never been implemented. It's a radar (or ultrasonic) range finder on the front of all vehicles that's tied to the brake system. When there's an obstacle too close for the current speed, the brakes are applied. This not only should prevent rear-enders, it will also prevent tailgating...if it was mandatory in all cars the way brake lights, horns, and other safety equipment is. A test I saw on TV had the inventor standing in a parking lot while his son drove at him in the family station wagon. The car stopped with about 6' to spare from 40 mph, with no braking action from the son. That sure demonstrated confidence in the idea! He was going to try to sell it to car makers, but apparently they weren't interested. Perhaps some lobbying would get the DOT to mandate such systems? They shouldn't cost more than the parking sensors some cars now come with for those who can't learn to park... -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 13:22:52 2005 Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 13:40:00 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: Re: Biker hit from behind On Sat, 5 Feb 2005, Mike B. wrote: > He was going to try to sell it to car makers, but apparently they weren't > interested. Perhaps some lobbying would get the DOT to mandate such > systems? They shouldn't cost more than the parking sensors some cars now > come with for those who can't learn to park... Mercedes has Distronic, Infiniti has lane control software built into their cars (it sounds an alarm if you're wandering, I'm sure others have intelligent cruise control (like the MB Distronic). I think the issue is litigation. If your car is equipped with a system to avoid collisions and you get in an accident, people will sue the manufacturers. -- Wayne - http://www.blueblackbusa.org/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 13:53:10 2005 From: "Dave Yates" To: Subject: RE: Biker hit from behind Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 13:51:07 -0500 X-ELNK-Trace: 956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec793c9ff732bd6da2b7fcb2af84e571252a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c It's amazing how many accidents are caused by rubbernecking at the cops. Case in point. I was traveling west on Rt. 7 past Purceville Wed. A state trooper decided he needed to turn around in the emergency crossover in the median. He turned his lights on, and crossed over. About 8 cars in front of me got heavy on the brakes. [Dave] It doesn't even take that.... Of all days... I'm headed to the shooting range one Friday night. West on 66, maybe 1.25 miles from 28N. I'm in the Lightning, traffic is very, very heavy. I decided to not be in a hurry, and had about 3 or 4 cage lengths in front of me. Traffic took off at stop & go pace, I let off the brake, and next thing I know, my truck & I are being shoved forward... I go full brakes, no diff. Traffic ahead slows and stops, and my 3-4 cage lengths is eaten away almost entirely before we stop. A beverage truck behind me did the shoving. The F150 goes close to 5,000, and that guy shoved me like we weren't even there. It wasn't a fast hit, and of all the luck, his substantial bumper hit only the plastic trim on my bumper, leaving nary a mark. U.F.B. Not knowing if there was any other damage, I hit up the VSP, who came, saw & went on his way. I asked the other drive what happened, he said he just mixed up the pedals... yeah. Glad that wasn't in the wife's Escort... Dave From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 14:42:58 2005 From: "Jim McGonigle" To: "'Mike B.'" , "'Michael Jordan'" , "'Wayne Edelen'" Cc: Subject: RE: Biker hit from behind Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 14:42:43 -0500 X-PMX-Version: 4.6.0.99824, Antispam-Core: 4.6.1.104326, Antispam-Data: 2005.2.5.4 X-PerlMx-Spam: Gauge=IIIIIII, Probability=7%, Report='__TO_MALFORMED_2 0, __MIME_VERSION 0, __CTYPE_CHARSET_QUOTED 0, __CT_TEXT_PLAIN 0, __CT 0, __CTE 0, __HAS_X_MAILER 0, __IN_REP_TO 0, __UNUSABLE_MSGID 0, SIGNATURE_SHORT_SPARSE 0, __MIME_TEXT_ONLY 0, RELAY_IN_SORBS 0, IN_REP_TO 0' Sounds great until you add in rain, snow, ice, bad roads, gravel, etc... -----Original Message----- From: Mike B. [mailto:omni@XXXXXX] To: Michael Jordan; Wayne Edelen Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Biker hit from behind At 09:21 AM 2/5/05 -0500, Michael Jordan wrote: >> http://www.farson.com/images/bikestop.gif >Maybe rig up a ultrasonic rangefinder from an old Polaroid camera to >fire a rearward facing paintball gun when a certain distance/velocity >parameter has been met? The solution was invented many years ago (not sure of the exact date, but I'm fairly sure it was prior to 1990), but has never been implemented. It's a radar (or ultrasonic) range finder on the front of all vehicles that's tied to the brake system. When there's an obstacle too close for the current speed, the brakes are applied. This not only should prevent rear-enders, it will also prevent tailgating...if it was mandatory in all cars the way brake lights, horns, and other safety equipment is. A test I saw on TV had the inventor standing in a parking lot while his son drove at him in the family station wagon. The car stopped with about 6' to spare from 40 mph, with no braking action from the son. That sure demonstrated confidence in the idea! He was going to try to sell it to car makers, but apparently they weren't interested. Perhaps some lobbying would get the DOT to mandate such systems? They shouldn't cost more than the parking sensors some cars now come with for those who can't learn to park... -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 5 22:26:03 2005 Date: Sat, 5 Feb 2005 19:25:55 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: Request for Input To: Kathleen Loerich , dc-cycles@XXXXXX jk hit it right on the head. my #1 gripe around here is why can't m/cs filter or, when the circumstances permit it, lane split/share. --- Kathleen Loerich wrote: > A presenter for the upcoming SHA/FHA Traffic Safety > Conference on February > 9th and 10th asked for input for his presentation. > > Instead of relying solely on my opinon, I thought I'd > extend the request to > dc-cycles. > > --------------------------------------- > The Request > --------------------------------------- > The original "working title" is "What Really Pisses > Bikers Off About Highway > Issues", but since most of the participants would not see > the humor it will > be called, "Behind The Handlebars: A Biker's Perspective > On Highway Issues". > > The idea is to address some of the other topics presented > at the conference > as they concern riders. I will cover topics such as: the > inattentive > driver, intelligent transportation, highway maintenance > (repaving), roadside > barriers as well as rider responsibility issues. > > Any information you have on these issues, or others, that > I can incorporate > into my presentation would be helpful. > ---------------------------- > > So.... Are there any comments? > > Kathleen Loerich > > > ===== Tom Gimer - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 00:04:35 2005 From: Daniel To: "Mike B." Cc: Todd Withrow , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Request for Input Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 00:04:17 -0500 95 south from baltimore... man that really can take a sunset and make traffic crawl! You can barely see in front of you. Maybe it's only on certain days.. but those days, the sun is huge and brilliant and blinding.. anyone else recall this? On Sat, 05 Feb 2005 13:01:53 -0500, "Mike B." wrote: >At 06:01 AM 2/5/05 -0800, Todd Withrow wrote: >> >>--- "Mike B." wrote: >>> roads that run directly into the >>> rising or setting sun (no >>> real sun visors on bikes...and what we have requires >>> aiming the head down >>> to use), etc., but those are all worth mentioning >>> too. >> >>So you want to ban East/West roads? > >No, just the sort I described. > >Most roads don't run directly into the areas the sun rises into or sets >from...they are at least a few degrees off (even allowing for changes in >where the sun rises and sets throughout the year). Those that need to head >that way often wind a bit, so the places where you are blinded are >minimized, and many of those have conveniently placed trees, buildings, >walls or hills to limit the line of sight to the thermonuclear furnace >glow, so you have a chance of seeing other vehicles, lane markers and other >things that improve safety. Unfortunately, not all roads are like that, >and some are dangerous to ride at particular times of the day as a result. >It also adds to traffic congestion, as even cage drivers have problems with >the glare and tend to slow way down...or not and then the resulting >accidents tie things up. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 00:44:45 2005 Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 00:50:40 -0500 Subject: Re: Request for Input To: "Kathleen Loerich" Cc: From: "garcia oliver" Hi, Katherine. Thanks for doing this. My suggestions (without much in the way of evidence or argument, and in no special order): (1) impaired drivers: mandatory one day jail time for first offenders. Even one day is no fun at all. [As an aside, erratic driving behavior is a better criterion than is blood alcohol content.] (2) Ban driver)B’s cell phone use while vehicle’s in motion. (“Shut up and drive.)B”) (3) End the use of police radar (i.e., )B“revenue enhancement”) and get these cops on the road looking for actual dangerous driving. (4) Ok filtering thru stopped traffic. It works fine in California. Calling it )B“reckless driving” is absurd and offensive. (5) Get the slugs out of the left lane, for all the obvious reasons. Post signs ()B“Slower traffic stay right” or some such). Give it a month for this difficult concept to sink in. Then ticket the morons. (6) Require zipper merges when construction or accident closes lane(s). Signs would help with this, too. (7) Ok sidewalk parking where it doesn)B’t impede pedestrian traffic. See San Francisco. (8) Have proof of ability to pay a judgment the size of minimum liability insurance as an alternative to buying such insurance. There are plenty of other things, but I think even the above list would go a long way toward making life more pleasant for everyone on the road, not just bikers. You may also want to talk with bicycle groups. I suspect there are areas of common concern and interest. --garcia )B“I wonder how they reconcile their “Choose Life!” slogans and their support for a president who is responsible for the deaths of 1300 American soldiers and some 100,000 Iraqi civilians.)B” From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 00:51:24 2005 Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 00:57:20 -0500 Subject: Re: Request for Input To: "Kathleen Loerich" Cc: From: "garcia oliver" I will write "Kathleen" 100 times. "garcia oliver" writes: >Hi, Katherine. Thanks for doing this. My suggestions (without much in >the way of evidence or argument, and in no special order): [snip] From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 01:03:55 2005 Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 01:04:17 -0500 To: "garcia oliver" , "Kathleen Loerich" From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input Cc: At 12:50 AM 2/6/05 -0500, garcia oliver wrote: >(5) Get the slugs out of the left lane, for all the obvious reasons. Post >signs ()B“Slower traffic stay right” or some such). Give it a month for >this difficult concept to sink in. Then ticket the morons. Traffic slower than the speed limit has to move right in all local states. Traffic slower than ambient doesn't have to in Maryland, so long as it's at the speed limit. >(8) Have proof of ability to pay a judgment the size of minimum liability >insurance as an alternative to buying such insurance. Don't know if they've changed it, but when I first moved to Maryland you could post a $20,000 bond in lieu of insurance if you wanted to. The insurance is cheaper. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 08:28:06 2005 From: "Kathleen Loerich" To: Subject: Re: Request for Input - The Results Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2005 08:25:37 -0500 Thanks to everyone who contributed. I consolidated the comments into one list. In some cases the original contributor will notice blatant plagiarism and others will notice some embellishments. I hope I accurately reflected each contributor's intent. If not, let me know and I'll make any needed corrections. I realize that there are probably a gazillion (my father told me a billion times not to exaggerate) other topics that we didn't include. For example, I know the presenter is going go address the issue of DRLs/Modulated Lights and some other topics. Also, there were a few late breaking comments that I didn't include in the list. I will forward them to the presenter separately. I won't be able to attend the conference myself, but there will be representatives from the motorcycling community in attendance. If anyone on the list is interested, you can get information and register at http://www.ence.umd.edu/mdt2center/. Look for the Traffic Safety Conference link. The dates are Feb 8-9, 2005. If you go, let me know what you thought about it. Kathleen Loerich ------------------------- Safety Conference Input ------------------------- Distracted Drivers Cell-phone yakking is dangerous. Actually any activity inside a vehicle that draws a driver's attention away from the road will ultimately compromise the driver's ability to conduct the task at hand - driving. For cell phones, hands-free doesn't matter. It's the conversation that causes the distraction the phone just amplifies the problem. Flying Debris Anything that flies out of or off of a vehicle has potentially lethal consequences for motorcycle riders. A particular peeve is cigarette butts flicked out car/truck windows bouncing off me or my bike. These can become lodged in a riders clothing or helmet and at a minimum cause mild distress or contribute to a rider's loss of control of the motorcycle. There are a surprising number of things that fall from traveling vehicles. They include but are not limited to cigarettes, paper, plastic bags, toys, clothing, shoes, car parts, tools, ladders, manure (I'm not making this up), suitcases (I'm still not making this up), and rail-road ties (I'm really, really, really not making this up). If it can be carried in or on a vehicle, it can come loose. Dodging these things is a chore and can require frequent underwear changes. Road Debris The corollary to the "what is in a vehicle may come out" axiom is "when it comes out it will be on the road". Milled Pavement One item that can be mildly dangerous (especially to new riders), fairly annoying, and probably not obvious to non-riders is that grooved stuff left behind when they grind off the top layer of a couple of miles of road surface. The paving crews seem to think this mess is as good as a regular road surface, as they open the road to normal traffic again and then often leave it that way for weeks before they get around to re-paving. With cars and trucks they are basically right, but with bikes and their tiny contact patches, the grooves can try to steer the bike for you, and if you tense up or panic at the strange motions you get, could pose a serious safety hazard. Some riders use a loose grip on the handlebars, and try not to fight the shimmy to let them ride on the stuff well enough, but there's still some concern about how it will affect swerves, stops and other emergency maneuvers should they become necessary. Sometimes the grooves aren't too bad, other times they can require a lot of attention to negotiate safely...attention that is no longer available for other required tasks. Those responsible for road maintenance should at least be aware of these issues, and try to limit the potential harm by limiting duration, not doing it to all lanes at once on a given stretch of roadway, or even by limiting the depth of the grooves and standardizing the characteristics a bit better. Uneven Pavement Require contractors to mark edge traps in bright orange paint when milling. Uneven pavement that is not clearly marked can be especially dangerous for motorcycles. Traveling in the dark can make uneven pavement nearly impossible to detect until it is too late to react. Markings that are visible at night and signs warning of the condition would make the roads safer for everyone including car drivers. Road Conditions and Construction Other more obvious issues include potholes, crown roads and the reverse banking they create at curves. The rumble strips carved into the shoulder of nearly every major highway create a hazard for riders who find it necessary to make an emergency stop on the shoulder of the road. If a rider is already experiencing mechanical difficulty or even worse a flat tire, these gashes in the side of the road make pulling off of the road even more precarious than the primary reason for the stop. Steel construction plates may be a necessary evil, but that is exactly what they are to motorcycles - evil. When the weather is dry, they present a hazard, but when steel plates are wet they are slippery and dangerous. The same goes for roadway markings like giant arrows that are made with plastic or rubber. The markings may be more durable, but they are 'slippery when wet'. And then there is gravel. When using it at construction sites it would be helpful to clean it up off the roadway where it gathers as soon as possible. Traffic Light Sensors Traffic light sensors that don't detect bikes can force a situation where the rider has no choice, but to disobey the signal. Guardrails Standard metal guardrails can be fatal or mutilating to a sliding motorcyclist. Left Lane 'Turtles' If it's the law for slower traffic to move right, make sure there are lots of signs to that effect. Enforcement of the 'slower traffic move right' edict could improve traffic flow. Traffic Circles Many motorcycle riders prefer traffic circles to stop signs and signals because the motorcycle rider can usually control the motorcycle's speed sufficiently to eliminate the need to come to a complete stop. The fewer times you have to put your feet on the ground the better. HOV Cheaters How about a crackdown on HOV cheaters? Many of them dart back and forth from the HOV lane and the normal lane to avoid detection. The panicked driver trying to get out of the HOV lane is prone to making lane change errors. Emphasize the Positive Aspects to Motorcycles Motorcycles are fuel and space efficient vehicles. Take advantage of these characteristics when designing parking and analyzing traffic flow patterns. Examine whether lane sharing and lane filtering are viable to reduce congestion and grid-lock. Parking Permitting multiple motorcycles in a single space is a step in the right direction, but planning for special high density parking areas, selective sidewalk parking, and using areas in parking lots and garages that are inaccessible to cars for motorcycles could relieve some of the urban choke problems. The big parking peeve is the fact that when you arrive at your destination and can't find street parking, nearly every parking garage in Maryland has a sign on the gate that says no motorcycles. Most operators of garages don't aggressively enforce this ban, but motorcyclists are vulnerable to the whims of the garage operator when parking their vehicles in these facilities. Inconsistent Enforcement On a separate note, simply enforcing standard laws consistently for all vehicles would be a good thing. It may be subjective perception, but many motorcycle riders feel invisible to car drivers, but feel that they are wearing a beacon that says pull me over while riding a motorcycle. Transportation Policy Essentially, if public roadways are designed with motorcycles in mind, then it is highly likely that they are safer for all vehicles. If the most vulnerable vehicles are considered during initial construction and design of all transportation initiatives, then the resulting product is likely to more safely accommodate other vehicles as well. When, as frequently happens, motorcycles are not considered or are an after thought, safety for other vehicles may be compromised as well. Increased Penalties for Moving Violations that Cause Injury or Death (This is an excerpt from the AMA web site 'Justice for All' campaign'. It says everything I could and more regarding increased penalties for accidents in particular those that violate the right-of-way of another vehicle.) What is a reasonable penalty for a car driver who kills or seriously injures a motorcyclist, bicyclist, pedestrian, or even another car driver? We know what's not reasonable: The $70 fine imposed on an Iowa driver for crossing the center line of a highway and killing three motorcyclists. The sentence handed down to an Oklahoma woman, putting her on probation for 30 months and ordering her to perform unspecified "acts of kindness and generosity" after she pleaded guilty to negligent homicide for killing a motorcyclist who was slowing to make a right turn. The 10-day suspended sentence and three-month driver's-license suspension for an Ohio driver convicted of vehicular homicide after backing out of a driveway into the path of an oncoming motorcyclist, who was killed. None of those penalties comes close to addressing the consequences of those crashes. But what is reasonable? That's the complex question we've tried to deal with in developing the AMA's Justice for All legislation. One of the key issues is whether a particular crash should be treated as a traffic matter, which could result in charges like failure to yield right of way, or whether it rises to the level of criminal offenses, like vehicular manslaughter. In many states, the distinction is based on words like "reckless disregard for the safety of others." If a prosecutor determines that a driver's actions fit that definition, then criminal charges could be filed. In writing model legislation that we hope to get introduced in all 50 states, the AMA has tried to address both categories. We have written one bill directed at traffic violations, like failure to yield right of way, and another aimed at felony offenses arising from traffic crashes. The right-of-way legislation seeks to impose fines on drivers who commit traffic offenses that injure or kill others. But the main thrust is on driver's-license suspensions designed to get dangerous drivers off the road-at least for a period of time. For those cases that involve felonies like vehicular manslaughter, we've written a separate bill that seeks fines, license suspensions and incarceration. That bill would, for instance, seek to impose a minimum one-year prison sentence on anyone convicted of a felony after killing someone in a traffic crash. There are two important things to remember about these bills: First, they're not designed to turn someone who makes a simple mistake while driving into a criminal. Only drivers convicted of a felony would face jail time. Second, these penalties don't just apply to crashes in which motorcyclists are the victims. If a car driver acts with "reckless disregard for the safety of others" and kills another car driver, the same penalty would apply. In fact, they could apply to a speeding motorcyclist who runs down a pedestrian or bicyclist, too. The idea is to recognize that driving (and riding) is a serious responsibility. The consequences of mistakes can be high for victims, and they should be high for offenders, too. There is one more part of the Justice for All legislation that does single out motorcyclists. It's a separate bill that we'd like to get passed to include motorcyclist-awareness instruction in each state's driver-education program. This information, developed by the Motorcycle Safety Foundation, is vital to getting car drivers to watch for motorcycles on the road. Together, those three bills form the basis for the AMA Justice for All campaign. Working with motorcyclists in all states over the coming years, we hope to get all three introduced-and passed-in every state. )B© 2004, American Motorcyclist Association Mandatory Motorcycle Helmet Use Many non-riders believe that motorcycle safety begins and ends with the helmet. It is obvious from the laundry list of issues previously mentioned that it is one small factor in a much larger picture. I can't count the number of times a non-rider has said to me after learning that I ride, 'but you wear a helmet, right?' The helmet might help if I fall down, but the larger goal is to stay on two wheels. The old adage is that you should keep the shiny side up and the rubber side down. There are times when a helmet will help a rider and times when it will harm a rider. Laws mandating helmet use are draconian and specious especially when helmet advocates refuse to acknowledge that there may be negative consequences to helmet use. The unanswered questions that helmet advocates either cannot answer or will not examine include, what are the injury trade-offs associated with motorcycle helmets; and what happens to a helmet during an accident? There is some evidence that suggests a higher potential for neck injuries with a helmet. This is a serious question that deserves an answer. There is an 'off button' for air bags because under certain circumstances they cause harm. There is no 'off button' for helmets other than the rider's discretion. So, let's get a real answer to a real question. As for what happens to a helmet during an accident, it would be extremely useful to know if the helmet is even there to protect the rider. There is a Maryland study that does not address the question directly, but sheds some light on the problem in the appendix. The appendix contains numerous comments about what happened to the helmet in an accident. In about 30% of the comments, the helmet either came off or was dislodged. So, what happened to the helmet? Where did it go? Did it harm the rider when it came off? These are real questions that also deserve an answer. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 08:39:57 2005 From: "Kathleen Loerich" To: Subject: Fw: ABATEMD: Alert - Maryland Motorcycle Helmet Law Modification - Hearing Scheduled Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2005 08:37:33 -0500 FYI: ----- Original Message ----- From: "ABATE of Maryland, Inc. - Legislative Alert" To: <@erols.com;> Subject: ABATEMD: Alert - Maryland Motorcycle Helmet Law Modification - Hearing Scheduled > Maryland General Assembly Session 2005 > Motorcycle Helmet Bill > Hearing Scheduled (February 15, 2005) > > The motorcycle helmet law modification bill was filed, assigned a bill > number. The bill number is HB 450. Bill details can be located at > http://mlis.state.md.us/2005rs/billfile/hb0450.htm. There are 52 > co-sponsors. > > The hearing for this bill will be in the House of Delegates Environmental > Matters Committee on February 15, 2005 at 1 pm in Annapolis. We encourage > everybody who is able to be there for the hearing to attend. Information > about locating the hearing room will be provided in a subsequent > legislative > alert. > > The motorcycle helmet bill will eliminate mandatory motorcycle helmet use > by > adult riders. The 2004 bill includes some language that is similar to the > recently enacted Pennsylvania helmet bill. These provisions are that a > rider must be over 21 and must have either two years of riding experience > or > must have taken a motorcycle safety course. It also includes provisions > for > passengers and three-wheeled vehicles. > > The primary sponsor for HB 450 is delegate Norman Conway. Co-sponsors > include Delegates Cluster, Aumann, Bartlett, Bromwell, Boschert, Costa, > Hogan, Impallaria, Haddaway, Frank, Glassman, Gilleland, Edwards, Eckardt, > Dwyer, Minnick, McConkey, Kelly, McKee, Murray, O'Donnell, Shank, Sossi, > Stull, Weir, Weldon, Stocksdale, Bates, Bohanan, Boteler, Bozman, Cadden, > Cane, C. Davis, Elmore, Goodwin, Harrison, Haynes, Heller, Jameson, > Jennings, Kach, King, Kirk, Myers, Oaks, Parker, Ramirez, Shewell, > Smigiel, > and Wood. > > The first milestone that we must pass is to achieve a positive committee > vote. House of Delegates Environmental Matters Committee members are > listed > below. When contacting a sponsor of the bill, please be sure to thank > them > for their support. When contacting those who have not yet stated a > position > ask them to vote for HB 450. Many delegates will vote for our bill, but > prefer not to be listed as a sponsor. Be polite and respectful when > making > your request. If you live in the Delegates district, make sure to mention > that in your letter or e-mail. > > Maggie L.McIntosh, Chair (410) 841-3990, (301) 858-3990, > e-mail: maggie_mcintosh@XXXXXX (Baltimore City) > > James E. Malone, Jr., Vice-Chair (410) 841-3378, (301) 858-3378, > e-mail: james_malone@XXXXXX (Baltimore & Howard) > > Rudolph C. Cane (Sponsor), (410) 841-3427, (301) 858-3427, > e-mail: rudolph_cane@XXXXXX (Dorchester & Wicomico) > > John W. E. Cluster, Jr. (Sponsor), (410) 841-3365, (301) 848-3365, > e-mail: john_cluster@XXXXXX (Baltimore) > > Barry Glassman (Sponsor), (410) 841-3289, (301) 858-3289, > e-mail: barry_glassman@XXXXXX (Harford) > > Patrick N. Hogan (Sponsor), (410) 841-3240, (301) 858-3240, > e-mail: patrick_n_hogan@XXXXXX (Frederick) > > J. B. Jennings (Sponsor), (410) 841-3334, (301) 858-3334, > e-mail: jb_jennings@XXXXXX (Baltimore & Harford) > > Tony McConkey (Sponsor), (410) 841-3223, (301) 858-3223, > e-mail: tony_mcconkey@XXXXXX (Anne Arundel) > > Rosetta C. Parker (Sponsor), (410) 841-3326, (301) 858-3326, > e-mail: rosetta_parker@XXXXXX (Prince George's) > > Richard A. Sossi (Sponsor), (410) 841-3543, (301) 858-3543, > e-mail: richard_sossi@XXXXXX (Caroline, Cecil, Kent, & Queen > Anne > 's) > > Paul S. Stull (Sponsor), (410) 841-3107, (301) 858-3107, > e-mail: paul_stull@XXXXXX (Frederick) > > Michael H. Weir, Jr. (Sponsor), (410) 841-3328, (301) 858-3328, > e-mail: michael_weir@XXXXXX (Baltimore) > > John S. Arnick, (410) 841-3458, (301) 858-3458, > e-mail: john_arnick@XXXXXX (Baltimore) > > Kumar P. Barve, (410) 841-3464, (301) 858-3464, > e-mail: kumar_barve@XXXXXX (Montgomery) > > Elizabeth Bobo, (410) 841-3205, (301) 858-3205, > e-mail: elizabeth_bobo@XXXXXX (Howard) > > Virginia P. Clagett, (410) 841-3211, (301) 858-3211, > e-mail: virginia_clagett@XXXXXX (Anne Arundel) > > Barbara A. Frush, (410) 841-3114, (301) 858-3114, > e-mail: barbara_frush@XXXXXX (Anne Arundel & Prince George's) > > Tony E. Fulton, (410) 841-3030, (301) 858-3030, > e-mail: unavailable (Baltimore City) > > Marvin E. Holmes, Jr., (410) 841-3098, (301) 858-3098, > e-mail: marvin_holmes@XXXXXX (Prince George's) > > Karen S. Montgomery, (410) 841-3380, (301) 858-3380, > e-mail: karen_montgomery@XXXXXX (Montgomery) > > Joan F. Stern, (410) 841-3045, (301) 858-3045, > e-mail: joan_stern@XXXXXX (Montgomery) > > Contact your Delegates today and ask them to vote for HB 450. If your > Delegate is one of the listed sponsors, contact them and thank them for > supporting the bill. > > Address letters to: > Lowe House Office Building > 84 College Ave. > Annapolis, MD 21401 > > If you receive a response from any of the delegates who are not yet > sponsors, please send any information you can to mdabate@XXXXXX. > > Bill details can be located at: > http://mlis.state.md.us/2005rs/billfile/hb0450.htm > > Obtain information about members of the House of Delegates via this link: > http://www.mdarchives.state.md.us/msa/mdmanual/06hse/html/hse.html > > Locate your legislators via this link: > http://mdelect.net/ > > Contact your legislators via this link: > http://www.mlis.state.md.us/cgi-win/mail32.exe > > ABATE of Maryland, Inc. > http://www.abate-of-maryland.org > mdabate@XXXXXX > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 12:07:17 2005 From: "rich hall" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Request for Input Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 12:04:03 -0500 Yesterday I was at Potomac Mills Mall on the bike. I rode up to the front of the parking lot, there was a 3' wide strip in front of the last car that was boxed off w/ white diagonal lines painted through it. There were tons of cars looking for spots, so I decided not to take one from them and use this area in front of the row. As I'm exiting the mall I see a PW Co police car. I'm never sure about parking in spots like that, so I wonder if I've gotten a ticket. I hadn't gotten one. But the police officer informed me if she beat me to the bike I would've gotten a ticket. I understand it's a "no parking" zone. But really, I'm not parked in the drive way. I also realize she's only enforcing the rules, but at some point you have to ask if it makes sense. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 16:30:41 2005 Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2005 13:30:23 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: Request for Input To: "Mike B." , Todd Withrow , dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- "Mike B." wrote: > At 06:01 AM 2/5/05 -0800, Todd Withrow wrote: > > > >--- "Mike B." wrote: > >> roads that run directly into the > >> rising or setting sun (no > >> real sun visors on bikes...and what we have requires > >> aiming the head down > >> to use), etc., but those are all worth mentioning > >> too. > > > >So you want to ban East/West roads? > > No, just the sort I described. i think what mike really wants is for the sun to be shut off occasionally. -- tg ===== Tom Gimer - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? All your favorites on one personal page )B– Try My Yahoo! http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 18:36:43 2005 From: "Kathleen Loerich" To: Subject: Re: Request for Input Date: Sun, 6 Feb 2005 18:34:18 -0500 > > i think what mike really wants is for the sun to be shut > off occasionally. > I'll be in Annapolis tomorrow. Would you like for me to see if someone will draft a bill for that? Kathleen =8^) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 6 23:13:14 2005 From: Daniel To: "rich hall" Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Request for Input Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2005 23:12:58 -0500 It's funny because some places will let you park there.. or on the sidewalk.. I for one can appreciate when an officer yeilds to common sense over the rules. On Sun, 06 Feb 2005 12:04:03 -0500, "rich hall" wrote: >Yesterday I was at Potomac Mills Mall on the bike. I rode up to the front >of the parking lot, there was a 3' wide strip in front of the last car that >was boxed off w/ white diagonal lines painted through it. There were tons >of cars looking for spots, so I decided not to take one from them and use >this area in front of the row. As I'm exiting the mall I see a PW Co police >car. I'm never sure about parking in spots like that, so I wonder if I've >gotten a ticket. I hadn't gotten one. But the police officer informed me >if she beat me to the bike I would've gotten a ticket. I understand it's a >"no parking" zone. But really, I'm not parked in the drive way. I also >realize she's only enforcing the rules, but at some point you have to ask if >it makes sense. > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 00:19:37 2005 Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 00:19:44 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input At 01:30 PM 2/6/05 -0800, Tom Gimer wrote: >--- "Mike B." wrote: >> At 06:01 AM 2/5/05 -0800, Todd Withrow wrote: >> >So you want to ban East/West roads? >> >> No, just the sort I described. > >i think what mike really wants is for the sun to be shut >off occasionally. Only if you are solar powered... -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 01:05:25 2005 Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 01:11:22 -0500 Subject: Re: Request for Input Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "garcia oliver" Speaking of sun in the eyes: I put duct tape around the lower edge of my helmet face shield (which I normally keep open/up except in the rain). By lowering the shield a bit, I have an adjustable sun visor. --garcia )B“The human eye is a wondrous device. With a little effort, it can fail to see even the most glaring injustice.)B” From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 03:35:51 2005 Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 03:32:44 -0500 From: skip CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: rubbernecking smthng else wrote: > > > Anyone wanna guess in how many years it will take them to raise the > > wall height or never? > > It's already been raised in most places... that's what the little > green slot things are all along the dividing wall. The problem is > that there are hills and dips. A car coming down towards a dip can > see all the way up the other side and it would take a 30 foot wall to > block it. > > Do I think that the two foot green things are enough? No. Would a > bigger wall help? Probably. > > Couldn't people just freaking pay attention and DRIVE? That would be nice. :S if I'm sitting in stop and go traffic for more than 5 minutes, I want to see dead, burnt bodies, and mangled cars... then I feel like it was time well spent. but I'm a sick f*cker... --skip From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 07:23:26 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 04:23:03 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: rubbernecking To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I've been saying that for years. Make the walls about 8' tall. Works on I-64 where the tree line keeps people from Rubbernecking. Glenn --- Daniel wrote: > I was on the beltway a few days ago, there was an > accident on the > other side... traffic on my side was slow just > because of people > gawking. It occured to me if the median were a foot > or two higher, > most of the cagers wouldn't be able ot see what's > going on that side, > and woulnd't slow down to be nosey. not only > would it speed up > traffic but it would prevent some collisions on the > non crash side > from people running into the back of others or > hitting someone else > while looking at the accident. If anyone writes to > Dr gridlock, throw > that in will ya. thanks > > Anyone wanna guess in how many years it will take > them to raise the > wall height or never? > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 13:54:26 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 13:54:10 EST Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/6/2005 12:45:00 AM Eastern Standard Time, garicao@XXXXXX writes: > (6) Require zipper merges when construction or accident closes lane(s). > Signs would help with this, too. "Zippering" would be fine, _IF_ what happened even vaguely resembled a zipper, but it does not. Also, "Zippering" is the primary cause of the "slugs in the left lane" mentioned previously. The first problem is that there are _two_ distinct areas where people are expected to zipper, one legitimate, one pure bullshit. Legitimate: When two lanes come from different sources (some on ramps; Duke/Little river onto N395 for instance.) There is no opportunity to merge prior to a lane ending and there is no distinct lane ending, the lanes simply merge together evenly. Another area where I can accept it _sometimes_ is the accident/construction mentioned in your post but _only_ where it cannot be determined just which lane is blocked until the last moment. BULLSHIT: When everyone knows that the lane is going to end up ahead, when the signs are clear and posted miles ahead "_Left lane ends" for instance. What that means is _ merge_into_the_thru_lane _at_the_first_opportunity. It does not mean drive until you lane ends and then force your way into the thru lane. It does not mean drive like you lane continues, without even looking to see if there is anyone next to you. You do not have the right to force your way into traffic when your lane ends. Traffic in the through lane is under _no_ obligation to let you in. And here is what _really_ happens. Person in ending lane slips into the through lane pretty much as they should. Then someone forces their way in front of _them,_ _then_ someone forces their way in front of the driver who let the first car in. And gets pissed off if they do not let them in, even though they have let someone in, in fact _two_ some ones in. Now the ratio of cars moving in the ending lane against the cars moving in the through lane is THREE TO ONE!! No wonder that the through lane, the lane that should move freely in fact is always the slowest lane and the ending lane, the one that should be moving slowest, is the one moving fastest. It is no wonder that people move into the far left lane to avoid the hassles and danger of people pushing their way in front of them. And do not even get me started on the butt f*#@ing SOBs that move from the through lane into the ending lane just so they can force their way in front of a couple of extra cars. _They_ should burn in hell starting today. If people around here would learn what "merge" and "yield" mean, and obey the vast majority of the traffic problems around here would disappear overnight. But I am not bitter.... John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC 1999, Honda ST1100X Pan European 1983, BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles 1976, Honda CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 14:11:56 2005 Subject: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:11:54 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: So you have been single for a long while and apart from the occasional bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and nonsense like that are very happy about it...then you happen to meet someone you find interesting and start spending time with them. Next thing you know the occasional gripe; barb or attempt to make you feel guilty about riding your bike worms into your conversations. For those experienced ( married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the best way of letting someone know the following: A) it is your bike B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular playing hours like a weekly cricket match D) Don't talk about the bike and don't ever say "I think you should go and ride your bike now" which really means that you are some kind of de-prioritized and backwards unfeeling SOB if you actually get on your bike and ride. Obviously, one solution is to just "keep on movin" but recent events make me wonder what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort of thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. A sincere thank you to any repliers.... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 14:17:43 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:17:30 EST Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/7/2005 2:12:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, julian@XXXXXX writes: > but recent events > make me wonder what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort of > thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. _Always_ make the first date a ride, _Always_! A few will "get away", but you do not want them anyway. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 14:21:40 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:21:15 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX LongJohn says: >"Zippering" would be fine, _IF_ what happened even vaguely >resembled a zipper, but it does not. Also, "Zippering" is >the primary cause of the "slugs in the left lane" mentioned >previously. [Dave] John, I don't know of an area around here where we can get an accurate read on that. By that, I mean that the roads are so overcrowded now that traffic is slowed below the limit anyway, regardless of the right hand zippering. I submit that the slugs going left do not adversely affect _That_ traffic. However, I agree with you that in a traffic Utopia, your description is correct, it would slow down left lane traffic... ...It does not mean drive until you lane ends and then force your way into the thru lane. [Dave] John, this idea is far to radical, and a 'fringe' concept at best. ;-) It does not mean drive like you lane continues, without even looking to see if there is anyone next to you. [Dave] I agree... does that mean accelerate ? ;-) And here is what _really_ happens. Person in ending lane slips into the through lane pretty much as they should. Then someone forces their way in front of _them,_ _then_ someone forces their way in front of the driver who let the first car in. And gets pissed off if they do not let them in, even though they have let someone in, in fact _two_ some ones in. [Dave] OOOOOOOOH no they don't. The victor in the above disagreement shall be the vehicle operator with: 1-the bigger 'I don't give a $h!t, me 1st' attitude. 2-the vehicle which is the least worthy piece of $h!t. 2 trumps 1 when the attempted 'forcer' is driving a 'prized' vehicle, meaning 1 which they don't want to screw up. I see this acted out every day. I've seen the signs - in other areas - asking motorists to 'zipper merge'. I wonder if they would have an effect around here? Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 14:22:42 2005 Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:22:40 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: , That's something I make a habit of...since I have had a bike everytime I have had a "encounter of the opposite kind"..I always pull up on my bike. -----Original Message----- From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX [mailto:PenguinBiker@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman In a message dated 2/7/2005 2:12:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, julian@XXXXXX writes: > but recent events > make me wonder what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort > of thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. _Always_ make the first date a ride, _Always_! A few will "get away", but you do not want them anyway. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 14:25:31 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 11:25:23 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Seems pretty simple to me. If you ever get in this situation, dump the bitch. Seriously, no need to have to explain your hobby to an SO. If she don't get it, then she don't get it. Glenn --- Julian Halton wrote: > So you have been single for a long while and apart > from the occasional > bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and > nonsense like that make me wonder what would ever happen if I found > myself in some sort of > thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with > this issue. > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 14:27:00 2005 From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:26:53 -0500 I agree or make sure that they ride or come from a family of riders. -----Original Message----- From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX [mailto:PenguinBiker@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman In a message dated 2/7/2005 2:12:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, julian@XXXXXX writes: > but recent events > make me wonder what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort of > thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. _Always_ make the first date a ride, _Always_! A few will "get away", but you do not want them anyway. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 14:39:30 2005 From: "Anne S" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 14:37:28 -0500 I think you have to know what is non negotiable. I always ask potential dates how they feel about goats. So they know the scoop -- they don't like the goat, no date. My suggestion if you really like this girl is to have her take the intro to motorcycle class - get her into it. Might be a way of gently introducing her to something that is very important in your life. If she's not willing, are you willing to be controlled by her? Anne PS I'm single >From: "Julian Halton" >To: >Subject: Of bikes and a woman >Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:11:54 -0500 > > >So you have been single for a long while and apart from the occasional >bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and nonsense like that >are very happy about it...then you happen to meet someone you find >interesting and start spending time with them. Next thing you know the >occasional gripe; barb or attempt to make you feel guilty about riding >your bike worms into your conversations. For those experienced ( >married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the best way of letting >someone know the following: >A) it is your bike >B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it >C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular playing hours like >a weekly cricket match >D) Don't talk about the bike and don't ever say "I think you should go >and ride your bike now" which really means that you are some kind of >de-prioritized and backwards unfeeling SOB if you actually get on your >bike and ride. > > > >Obviously, one solution is to just "keep on movin" but recent events >make me wonder what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort of >thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. > >A sincere thank you to any repliers.... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 14:41:02 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:40:54 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >So you have been single for a long while and apart from the occasional bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and nonsense like that are very happy about it...then you happen to meet someone you find interesting and start spending time with them. Next thing you know the occasional gripe; barb or attempt to make you feel guilty about riding your bike worms into your conversations. [Dave] err... Double ewe tee eff ? It's a lifestyle choice. You are, or are not a motorcyclist. If you allow her to browbeat you into submission over the issue of motorcycling, the chances are very likely this trait will resurface later on, at a much higher degree of manifestation. There must at least be tolerance, but not necessarily exuberance. For those experienced ( married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the best way of letting someone know the following: >A) it is your bike [Dave] Remember, I'm married, 9 years now. YMMV "It's my bike, my hobby. You knew I was a motorcyclist, and speed enthusiast when you met me. This is non negotiable and something which brings me great joy, and I think it is unfair of you to even think about me giving even a small part of this up. I offer to include you in my riding, but you choose not to. I choose to ride anyway. You're still welcome to come with me, but if you don't, I'm riding anyway" >B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it [Dave] Many, many, many moons ago, TOWMBO made me commit to a Saturday BBQ at one of her friends' house. Said day came and ( of f888ing course ) it was BE A U Tiful no, scratch that - Perfect riding weather. me: Hey, I'm going for a ride, be back in a couple hours. TOWMBO: You said we could go to Cathy's bbq today. me: It's beautfil, I'll be back... TOWMBO: It's a 1 o'clock. me: Who the F*** starts their bbq at 1 F***ing o'clock and why do we have to be there right AT one... TOWMBO: I asked you about this months ago and YOU said ok me: ~!@#$%^&*()_~!@#$%^&*()~!@#$%^&*() ..."I will never commit to an event you want to go to ever again, as long as I live, until the day of the event"... That was 8 years ago. I kept my word; on the stupid BBQ, and not committing. C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular playing hours like a weekly cricket match [Dave] But it *CAN* be if you want to do that too... that's part of the great thing about bikes, you can have planned and organized rides, or, go when you wish. 'tis up to you. >D) Don't talk about the bike and don't ever say "I think you should go and ride your bike now" which really means that you are some kind of de-prioritized and backwards unfeeling SOB if you actually get on your bike and ride. [Dave] Kind of like "you don't need to get me anything for Valentine's day". riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight... ...what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort of thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. [Dave] you either need, or will need to have a serious heart to heart. An agreement might not be reached, and you have to be willing to accept that. You can't change who you are. Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 14:52:48 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 11:52:41 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Oh no, do you realize the can of worms you are opening with that statement? Glenn --- Anne S wrote: > Anne > > PS I'm single __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 15:00:27 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 15:00:15 -0500 From: smthng else To: Anne S Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > PS I'm single If I get another bike soon, I could be. :P --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 15:06:05 2005 Subject: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 15:06:03 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: , "Anne S" Cc: Took it out for a spin yesterday...am racking up miles and will be ready for my first oil change by the end of the week. Rock Creek on this thing was amazing. The new R6 does not like traffic and I frequently find the cooling fan kicking in as the temp jumps to 227 degrees farenheit which worries me a bit. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 16:26:18 2005 From: "Perry Coleman" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 16:25:00 -0500 Julian, Only you can make the choice and set your priorities. For me, that sort of thing would be a "walk away" situation. For what it's worth, my wife of 17 years first date with me was a ride on my bike. I would not have given up the bike for her. Oh, by the way, she has her own bike now. Of course, all relationships require a certain amount of give and take - on both sides! Good luck! Perry >From: "Julian Halton" >To: >Subject: Of bikes and a woman >Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:11:54 -0500 > > >So you have been single for a long while and apart from the occasional >bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and nonsense like that >are very happy about it...then you happen to meet someone you find >interesting and start spending time with them. Next thing you know the >occasional gripe; barb or attempt to make you feel guilty about riding >your bike worms into your conversations. For those experienced ( >married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the best way of letting >someone know the following: >A) it is your bike >B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it >C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular playing hours like >a weekly cricket match >D) Don't talk about the bike and don't ever say "I think you should go >and ride your bike now" which really means that you are some kind of >de-prioritized and backwards unfeeling SOB if you actually get on your >bike and ride. > > > >Obviously, one solution is to just "keep on movin" but recent events >make me wonder what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort of >thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. > >A sincere thank you to any repliers.... > > > > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 16:29:25 2005 From: "Perry Coleman" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 16:28:39 -0500 Hell! I'm still trying to work out the goat reference... ;^) >From: Glenn Dysart >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman >Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 11:52:41 -0800 (PST) > >Oh no, do you realize the can of worms you are opening >with that statement? > >Glenn > >--- Anne S wrote: > > > > Anne > > > > PS I'm single > > > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. >http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 16:30:48 2005 From: To: Subject: Re: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 16:30:37 -0500 > > From: "Anne S" > Date: 2005/02/07 Mon PM 02:37:28 EST > To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman > > I think you have to know what is non negotiable. I always ask potential > dates how they feel about goats. So they know the scoop -- they don't like > the goat, no date. > > My suggestion if you really like this girl is to have her take the intro to > motorcycle class - get her into it. Might be a way of gently introducing > her to something that is very important in your life. If she's not willing, > are you willing to be controlled by her? > > Anne > > PS I'm single > When I first met my (then future) wife, Jennifer, she had never rode a bike in her life. Expecting the obvious questions of "Why do you ride something that dangerous?", and "I hope you don't plan on keeping that bike after we're married", I was SHOCKED to find out that she quietly signed up for an MSF class and bought a used 500 Shadow without ever saying a word to me. What a surprise it was when I pulled up to her place one day on my V65 to find her suiting up and firing up her OWN bike. When I asked her why she decided to get a bike, she simply said, "I know how much you love motorcycles, and overcoming my fear of them, I decided the only fair thing to do was sign up for a class and see what it's all about." "I did that, and then *I got it*...so I bought this bike and here I am..now are you just going to stand there with your mouth open or we going to go find some twisties?" Gawd I love that woman... -aki From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 16:32:05 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 13:31:32 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman To: Glenn Dysart , dc-cycles@XXXXXX glenn, what about the types that decide mid-marriage that bikes suck and those who ride them are assholes? hypothetical question, of course! ;) --- Glenn Dysart wrote: > Seems pretty simple to me. If you ever get in this > situation, dump the bitch. Seriously, no need to have > to explain your hobby to an SO. If she don't get it, > then she don't get it. > > Glenn > > --- Julian Halton wrote: > > > > So you have been single for a long while and apart > > from the occasional > > bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and > > nonsense like that > make me wonder what would ever happen if I > found > > myself in some sort of > > thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with > > this issue. ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 16:34:02 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 13:33:40 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman To: Julian Halton , you@XXXXXX, Anne S Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX why does it worry you? because it doesn't come on until 227? or because your bike gets to 227 in the middle of winter? --- Julian Halton wrote: > > > > Took it out for a spin yesterday...am racking up miles > and will be ready > for my first oil change by the end of the week. Rock > Creek on this > thing was amazing. The new R6 does not like traffic and > I frequently > find the cooling fan kicking in as the temp jumps to 227 > degrees > farenheit which worries me a bit. > > ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 16:41:52 2005 Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 16:38:12 -0500 To: "Julian Halton" , From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman At 02:11 PM 2/7/05 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: > >married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the best way of letting >someone know the following: >A) it is your bike >B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it >C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular playing hours like >a weekly cricket match >D) Don't talk about the bike and don't ever say "I think you should go >and ride your bike now" which really means that you are some kind of >de-prioritized and backwards unfeeling SOB if you actually get on your >bike and ride. First off, if you feel as you do, and your SO feels in ways that require any of the above, then you aren't compatible, and finding someone else would probably be best for both of you. A woman with a bike would be a good candidate. That said, saying something like, "This is me. This is the way I am. You picked me the way I am, for what I am, not so you could change me into something else...right?" If the answer to that isn't "right", see above... You might just get one of those T-shirts that says, "My wife said, 'Either that bike goes, or I go.' I'm gonna miss her..." and leave it at that... ;-) -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 17:13:29 2005 From: "Anne S" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 17:10:39 -0500 Love me, love my goat. (he's a 200 or so pound Alpine with large horns who is very intimidating but quite nice once you get past the posturing). He has quite a few pals, too ... anyhow, the point is just lifestyle. I don't yet have my own bike -- just enjoying your stories vicariously -- but I DO have a farm and whereas I could still conceivably date someone who doesn't ride (although he'd better not tell me he doesn't want me to ride!), I couldn't date someone who has a problem with horned and hooved beasts. :) That's all. Therefore for those of you who ride regularly, it seems it would be quite impossible to date or marry someone who can't get with the program. :) Loved the story about the wife who took the safety class on the sly! Anne >From: "Perry Coleman" >Hell! I'm still trying to work out the goat reference... ;^) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 17:22:33 2005 Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 17:22:40 -0500 To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) At 01:54 PM 2/7/05 EST, PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: >It does not mean drive like you lane continues, without even looking to see if >there is anyone next to you. You do not have the right to force your way into >traffic when your lane ends. Traffic in the through lane is under _no_ >obligation to let you in. Agree 100% with your sentiments, and with most of what you say too. *Slight* disagreement about the stress on the last tiny bit though. Traffic in the through lane is under the same obligation to avoid collisions if at all possible that all traffic is under. If jackass-merger just comes over like he has right of way (which he does not, as you point out), and you *don't* act to let him in (move over, brake, or whatever), and the two of you hit each other, then you have failed to prevent an avoidable collision and you'd be in violation. Of course, jackass-merger is going to get the bulk of the blame, as the one who changed lanes/merged improperly, failed to yield right of way, exercise due caution, etc., and probably the only one that would get ticketed if anyone does, but the law says you are both at some fault last I looked so there is *some* obligation to let him in, should he act illegally like that. >And here is what _really_ happens. Person in ending lane slips into the >through lane pretty much as they should. Then someone forces their way in front of >_them,_ _then_ someone forces their way in front of the driver who let the >first car in. And gets pissed off if they do not let them in, even though they >have let someone in, in fact _two_ some ones in. >Now the ratio of cars moving in the ending lane against the cars moving in >the through lane is THREE TO ONE!! At which point the really and truly born-again-assholes start moving from the thru lane into the ending lane farther back, running up to the end, and forcing their way in, thus helping to maintain the conditions that have them pissed off to start with...and generating road rage in everyone around them who would like nothing better than run over their selfish, brainless, totally useless carcasses. Repeatedly. >And do not even get me started on the butt f*#@ing SOBs that move >from the through lane into the ending lane just so they can force their way in >front of a couple of extra cars. _They_ should burn in hell starting today. I think you're going too light on them. I think it should be retroactive to their first such offense, and eternal sentences for each event should run consecutively. >If people around here would learn what "merge" and "yield" mean, and obey the >vast majority of the traffic problems around here would disappear overnight. Not to mention "Stop", "No U-Turn", "Right turn on red AFTER STOP", and a few other basic concepts. Unfortunately, the motto for driving in the D.C. area, that covers all situations that might arise, is: "ME FIRST!!!!" >But I am not bitter.... Me neither. I've almost reached the "amused" state at the mind boggling stupidity of it all. If it really bothered me, I'd move to somewhere else that has a different motto. Here are some I've discovered in my travels over the years: Boston, MA: "Banzai!!!" (not really an improvement...) Los Angeles, CA: "Step on it! You're only doing 75!" Huntsville, AL: "No, after you, I insist!" Minneapolis, MN: "Step on it! It's only four inches deep!" Austin, TX: "Wow! Look, tall buildings!" New York, NY: "Hey! I'm *drivin'* hea'!!" Ohio: "Wake me when we get near a city." New Jersey: "Left..no...right! No!...left!...ahhh...STOP!" Ft. Meyer, FL: "Look! A pelican!" Anybody got others? -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 17:54:44 2005 From: "Sean Steele" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 17:54:32 -0500 Subject: Deep metric socket question I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to torgue this nut off this bolt: http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, even online. Any ideas? Thanks, -Sean '92 Seca II From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 18:03:30 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 15:02:57 -0800 (PST) From: Leon Begeman Subject: Re: Deep metric socket question To: Sean Steele , dc-cycles@XXXXXX > I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to > torgue this nut off > this bolt: > http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg > > Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, > even online. > > Any ideas? Things that come to mind. 1) crowfoot wrench 2) offset box end wrench 3) shorter socket with a hex head on it (similar to a spark plug socket) so another wrench could be applied to the socket. or 4) weld a handle to an old metric socket that you don't use much anymore. I'm sure there are other methods. I just can't think of any right now. Leon. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 18:10:44 2005 From: "Rob Keiser" To: sean@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Deep metric socket question Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 18:09:31 -0500 Are you sure a standard set won't work? One might be close enough. I ask because I have some deep standard sockets that might help. Any idea what size that is? I'll measure the depth of my set..and if they'll work, you're welcome to try. Rob '98 VFR800 From: "Sean Steele" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Deep metric socket question Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 17:54:32 -0500 I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to torgue this nut off this bolt: http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, even online. Any ideas? Thanks, -Sean '92 Seca II From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 18:39:04 2005 Subject: Re: Deep metric socket question From: lister lynch To: Sean Steele , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 18:46:08 -0500 The shaft seems to have a flat on it. Is it possible to hold the nut in place and turn the shaft? Mike On Mon, 2005-02-07 at 18:02, Leon Begeman wrote: > > I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to > > torgue this nut off > > this bolt: > > http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg > > > > Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, > > even online. > > > > Any ideas? > > Things that come to mind. > > 1) crowfoot wrench > 2) offset box end wrench > 3) shorter socket with a hex head on it (similar to a > spark plug socket) so another wrench could be applied > to the socket. > or > 4) weld a handle to an old metric socket that you > don't use much anymore. > > I'm sure there are other methods. I just can't think > of any right now. > > Leon. > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 19:12:49 2005 From: "Lisa Goddard" To: "DC Cycles" Subject: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 19:12:31 -0500 When Jay starts complaining about all of the motorcycle maintinance and repairs he has to do, especially after I crash, again. I tell him that the entire situation could be a whole lot worse. There are worse things in the world than your wife crashing motorcycles on the track! For the record, I got him in to riding and I bought a bike before he did. Lisa Goddard '97 GSXR 600, track only '95 VFR Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 16:38:12 -0500 To: "Julian Halton" , From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman At 02:11 PM 2/7/05 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: > >married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the best way of letting >someone know the following: >A) it is your bike >B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it >C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular playing hours like >a weekly cricket match That said, saying something like, "This is me. This is the way I am. You picked me the way I am, for what I am, not so you could change me into something else...right?" If the answer to that isn't "right", see above... You might just get one of those T-shirts that says, "My wife said, 'Either that bike goes, or I go.' I'm gonna miss her..." and leave it at that... ;-) - Mike B. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 19:42:24 2005 X-SpaceNet-Authentification: SMTP AUTH verified Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 19:42:15 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Chris Chubb Subject: Re: Deep metric socket question X-Spam-Level: 1/2 inch drive impact socket and a small pipe wrench? The shaft will stick up through the top of the socket and you grab the socket with some vice grips or a pipe wrench. It does look like you have already been bungling on it with an open ended wrench. Chris At 07:00 PM 2/7/2005, you wrote: >From: "Sean Steele" >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Deep metric socket question >Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 17:54:32 -0500 > >I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to torgue this nut off >this bolt: http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg > >Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, even online. > >Any ideas? From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 20:15:48 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 20:15:29 -0500 Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Randy Moran There is only one proper place to merge when a lane is ending; that is at the point where the lane ends. People who merge early are simpletons, as are the people who let them in. In heavy traffic, I never let anyone in until I get to the proper merge point and I always use all of the lane ending, using proper signals and yielding, of course, to those who don't know how to drive. It's quite simple; merge at the merge point. Many states, Pennsylvania for one, have signs that say this very thing. RPM From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 20:58:31 2005 From: "W.S." To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: Re: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 20:58:09 -0500 From: . . . snip "I did that, and then *I got it*...so I bought this bike and here I am..now are you just going to stand there with your mouth open or we going to go find some twisties?" Gawd I love that woman... . . . snip ---------- Aki's great tale needs wider Valentine's Day exposure for due recognition. Another current fine one is the Triumph ad on the back cover of the March "Motorcyclist": Lovely lady, (from a Swedish linens ad?) with just the right look of smouldering disdain - "If it was another woman, at least I could compete." Smaller musings: ". . .. And when he finally comes home, all he can talk about is her. Her smooth powerband . . . and worst of all, how she makes him feel inside. "I wouldn't mind if he was up that early cleaning the garage, but he's out there having fun with her. "A little too much fun." [Find this on a 'stand -- also details the new HD VSRCR] Bill S. / DC (on digest) '99 VN750 > Dunno. Would feel guilty pulling you away from her. Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 21:13:35 2005 From: "W.S." To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes) Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 21:13:22 -0500 From: "garcia oliver" Speaking of sun in the eyes: I put duct tape around the lower edge of my helmet face shield (which I normally keep open/up except in the rain). By lowering the shield a bit, I have an adjustable sun visor. . . .snip --------- For me, it's electrical tape on the top third. Cuts out that annoying low sun Nov-Feb. Bill S. / DC (on digest) '99 VN750 > Definitely beats a parasol. Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 22:00:44 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 22:21:17 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman On Mon, 7 Feb 2005, Perry Coleman wrote: > Of course, all relationships require a certain amount of give and take - on > both sides! The best advice so far. It's all about respecting each other. Honestly, if someone you're dating is already hassling you about your lifestyle, it doesn't seem like that person respects you. Dave's example illustrates what I'm saying... lack of respect on both sides. I was in a similiar situation recently - scheduled event on a really nice winter riding day. Told the wife I was riding, she agreed that it was too nice to not ride. I got in a good 1.5-2hrs ride, we arrived at the event fashionably late and we were both happy. -- Wayne - http://www.blueblackbusa.org/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 22:09:19 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 22:29:56 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: Re: Deep metric socket question On Mon, 7 Feb 2005, Sean Steele wrote: > I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to torgue this nut off > this bolt: http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg > > Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, even online. > > Any ideas? Can't tell from the pic, but can you get to the backside? The suggestion of a crow's foot wrench is a good one, as is an offset box wrench. -- Wayne From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 22:23:35 2005 Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 22:23:28 -0500 To: From: Aki Damme Subject: Re: Deep metric socket question At 10:29 PM 2/7/2005, Wayne Edelen wrote: >On Mon, 7 Feb 2005, Sean Steele wrote: > > > I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to > torgue this nut off > > this bolt: http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg > > > > Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, even > online. > > > > Any ideas? > >Can't tell from the pic, but can you get to the >backside? The suggestion >of a crow's foot wrench is a good one, as is an offset box >wrench. > >-- Wayne Sears sells closed end ratchet wrenches with hinged ends. I got a set there about a year ago on sale for about $30. SAE and Metric sets. -aki From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 22:30:28 2005 From: Daniel To: "Julian Halton" Cc: Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 22:30:11 -0500 Personality flaw... nagging... and controlling.. dump her. You will find another to replace her. She has an anti social personality. She cannot communicate effectively. Dump her and get a more normal replacement. Explain my ass. You were born free and you have no obligation to yeild your freedoms to someone elses whim. If she will dump you for enjoying your freedom she's not worth keeping. Let her worry about you.. it's better than you having to worry about her. Yield to nagging as least as possible.. because when you yeild to it, it reinforces the behavior by rewarding the behavior by satisfying the request.. nagged about this now... she'll nag harder about more later. You have to be the dominate one in the relationship... she'll respect you more. Women want a strong man. If you let her wear the pants, a strong man will come along and take her from you. Tell her you're riding, and she is free to leave. Just ride when you want to ride... if s/he doesn't like it, they are free to leave and move on. Never try to keep someone around, let them follow their heart, because they will anyway, but if you try to keep someone around, they will just follow their heart in secret, until you find out.. and then it's your fault as much as theirs for pressuring someone to stay with you, when they really don't want to. when she puts on a hissy fit, ignore it. Ride when you want to ride. Any time she gets annoying, leave. Either she'll dump you, or she'll yeild. Either way you're done listening to the BS and drama. Better to replace someone sooner than later. Woman want a Man.. not a robot or slave who will do whatever they want. Only engage in civilized debate.. when it gets retarded.. leave teh environment.. and don't come back apologizing. Feel free to forget about it.. but never yeild to nagging and nonesense. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 22:52:35 2005 From: Daniel To: "Anne S" Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 22:52:23 -0500 I am on the other side of the fence... I never encourage anyone to get into motorcycling. It's deadly.. and if a person seriously loves it on their own accord, they will take it seriously... If they aren't into riding, then they will be scared and not using their full faculties and have an even higher chance of getting hurt. I don't want to be responsible for motivationg someone to ride, when they didn't have the motivation on their own, and then they end up getting mutilated or killed. Kind of the like bartenders not handing patrons drinks. Let people choose their own poison. Even when my son becomes old enough to get into motorcycling, sure it would be cool to have father and son riding and having all the fun and joys related to riding, but if he doesn't come to me saying he wants to do it, I won't suggest it to him. It kind of sucks that something that can give so much joy can also take so much away. On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 14:37:28 -0500, "Anne S" wrote: >I think you have to know what is non negotiable. I always ask potential >dates how they feel about goats. So they know the scoop -- they don't like >the goat, no date. > >My suggestion if you really like this girl is to have her take the intro to >motorcycle class - get her into it. Might be a way of gently introducing >her to something that is very important in your life. If she's not willing, >are you willing to be controlled by her? > >Anne > >PS I'm single > >>From: "Julian Halton" >>To: >>Subject: Of bikes and a woman >>Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 14:11:54 -0500 >> >> >>So you have been single for a long while and apart from the occasional >>bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and nonsense like that >>are very happy about it...then you happen to meet someone you find >>interesting and start spending time with them. Next thing you know the >>occasional gripe; barb or attempt to make you feel guilty about riding >>your bike worms into your conversations. For those experienced ( >>married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the best way of letting >>someone know the following: >>A) it is your bike >>B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it >>C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular playing hours like >>a weekly cricket match >>D) Don't talk about the bike and don't ever say "I think you should go >>and ride your bike now" which really means that you are some kind of >>de-prioritized and backwards unfeeling SOB if you actually get on your >>bike and ride. >> >> >> >>Obviously, one solution is to just "keep on movin" but recent events >>make me wonder what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort of >>thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. >> >>A sincere thank you to any repliers.... > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 22:55:24 2005 From: Daniel To: "Sean Steele" Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Deep metric socket question Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 22:55:07 -0500 can you take it to a machine shop? On Mon, 07 Feb 2005 17:54:32 -0500, "Sean Steele" wrote: >I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to torgue this nut off >this bolt: http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg > >Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, even online. > >Any ideas? > >Thanks, > >-Sean >'92 Seca II From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 23:03:13 2005 From: Daniel To: Randy Moran Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2005 23:03:00 -0500 I agree. I learned my lesson after a few times going from 395 north, to penn. ave to 295 north. I would get in the left lane and wait.. for 3 or 4 traffic lights until it was my turn... only ot have people going by in the outer lane mergeing over at the last minute and making the light... then sitting in a lot of left lane construction and the right lane closes.. and i get over way to early... So i learned my lesson if you can't beat them join them... zipper in.. if the people in the left lane merged horizontally instead of vertically, we could just zipper in and not be so backed up. I mean until it becomes an enforced law, might as well go to the front and merge like everyone else. Until society and law changes, I urge everyone to go ahead and ride the left lane out and merger at the last moment if traffic is backed up. If you can't beat them, join them. On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 20:15:29 -0500, Randy Moran wrote: >There is only one proper place to merge when a lane is ending; that is >at the point where the lane ends. People who merge early are >simpletons, as are the people who let them in. In heavy traffic, I >never let anyone in until I get to the proper merge point and I always >use all of the lane ending, using proper signals and yielding, of >course, to those who don't know how to drive. > >It's quite simple; merge at the merge point. Many states, Pennsylvania >for one, have signs that say this very thing. > >RPM From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 23:05:15 2005 From: "Dave Yates" To: Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:03:14 -0500 X-ELNK-Trace: 956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec7928d7f485a94c261f3dac1fec2e0e6219350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c I am on the other side of the fence... I never encourage anyone to get into motorcycling. It's deadly.. [Dave] Reality check: Life - it's 100% fatal. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 23:08:21 2005 Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:28:58 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman On Mon, 7 Feb 2005, Dave Yates wrote: > > I am on the other side of the fence... I never encourage anyone > to get into motorcycling. It's deadly.. > > [Dave] Reality check: Life - it's 100% fatal. I agree. What's that saying? "I refuse to tiptoe through life, only to arrive safely at death." -- Wayne From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 23:15:27 2005 From: "Dave Yates" To: Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:13:23 -0500 X-ELNK-Trace: 956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec798fe03de5fa329a7b4d22fa77d73c8af1350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Danny said: Personality flaw... nagging... and controlling.. dump her. You will find another to replace her. She has an anti social personality. She cannot communicate effectively. Dump her and get a more normal replacement. [Dave] Seems she's communicated pretty effectively so far... Explain my ass. [Dave] Male & female donkeys got together and produced it? You were born free and you have no obligation to yeild your freedoms to someone elses whim. If she will dump you for enjoying your freedom she's not worth keeping. Let her worry about you.. it's better than you having to worry about her. [Dave] I'm in no position to speak for the wimmen-folk on the list. Still, I haven't met any o' them thar wimmen-folk who appreciate this approach... Maybe I just haven't hung out in the right places... Yield to nagging as least as possible.. because when you yeild to it, it reinforces the behavior by rewarding the behavior by satisfying the request.. nagged about this now... she'll nag harder about more later. [Dave] Here, we are in agreement. I'm certainly not the example to follow on diplomatic relations, but if you do nothing about it, or if you tolerate being shamed into not riding, it's a move away from goodness. You have to be the dominate one in the relationship... she'll respect you more. Women want a strong man. If you let her wear the pants, a strong man will come along and take her from you. Tell her you're riding, and she is free to leave. [Dave] This presumes that I let my wife out of the closet, and unleash her at times other than feeding, which is false. My GOD man... free to leave... That's a good one... ... ;-) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 7 23:41:31 2005 From: "LindaT." To: "Dc-Cycles" Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:39:17 -0500 He must be mighty young to spout nonsense like this. Wake up and smell the exhaust fumes. Give AND take. That's what relationships require. Men do not have to be dominant all the time or even most of the time. Compromise. On everything except riding. LindaT. www.CustomTankBags.com Hollywood, FL IBA,BMWBMW,AMA '99 R1100RT Mr Buzzy '95 F3 Purple Haze '00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing Danny said: You have to be the dominate one in the relationship... she'll respect you more. Women want a strong man. If you let her wear the pants, a strong man will come along and take her from you. Tell her you're riding, and she is free to leave. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 00:04:51 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 00:10:41 -0500 Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "garcia oliver" You are exactly right (except for saying that )B‘ "Zippering" is the primary cause of the "slugs in the left lane" )B‘ It’s not. They’re sit in the left lane because either they don)B’t know any better (signs may help), or they)B’re self-centered assholes (tickets might get their attention)). But you ignore your own good observations. Zipper merge is *especially* valuable in your )B“BULLSHIT” scenario. Consider: The current situation has responsible, honest, upstanding citizens---such as ourselves---moving early into the thru lane and being taken advantage of by the my-time-is-more-important-than-yours crowd. Now, if zipper merge were the norm, both lanes would be backed up about equally, so these jerks couldn)B’t butt to the head of the line and squeeze in. Everyone gets through in more-or-less the order they arrived, justice triumphs, and road rage decreases. (There)B’s a minor secondary advantage in that fewer vehicles will be caught at a traffic light in the thru lane since some of them would be in the other lane past the light if they could count on zipper merge. (Don)B’t try to diagram that sentence.)) Everyone merging early into the thru lane might be better, but it)B’s not gonna happen, because it)B’s structured for the line busters to benefit. Zipper merge is structured so they can)B’t. --garcia )B“A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government.)B” Edward Abbey PenguinBiker@XXXXXX writes: >"Zippering" would be fine, _IF_ what happened even vaguely resembled a >zipper, but it does not. Also, "Zippering" is the primary cause of the >"slugs in the >left lane" mentioned previously. > >The first problem is that there are _two_ distinct areas where people are >expected to zipper, one legitimate, one pure bullshit. >Legitimate: When two lanes come from different sources (some on ramps; >Duke/Little river onto N395 for instance.) There is no opportunity to >merge prior to >a lane ending and there is no distinct lane ending, the lanes simply >merge >together evenly. Another area where I can accept it _sometimes_ is the >accident/construction mentioned in your post but _only_ where it cannot >be determined >just which lane is blocked until the last moment. > >BULLSHIT: When everyone knows that the lane is going to end up ahead, >when >the signs are clear and posted miles ahead "_Left lane ends" for >instance. What >that means is _ merge_into_the_thru_lane _at_the_first_opportunity. It >does >not mean drive until you lane ends and then force your way into the thru >lane. >It does not mean drive like you lane continues, without even looking to >see if >there is anyone next to you. You do not have the right to force your way >into >traffic when your lane ends. Traffic in the through lane is under _no_ >obligation to let you in. > >And here is what _really_ happens. Person in ending lane slips into the >through lane pretty much as they should. Then someone forces their way in >front of >_them,_ _then_ someone forces their way in front of the driver who let >the >first car in. And gets pissed off if they do not let them in, even though >they >have let someone in, in fact _two_ some ones in. >Now the ratio of cars moving in the ending lane against the cars moving >in >the through lane is THREE TO ONE!! >No wonder that the through lane, the lane that should move freely in fact >is >always the slowest lane and the ending lane, the one that should be >moving >slowest, is the one moving fastest. It is no wonder that people move into >the far >left lane to avoid the hassles and danger of people pushing their way in >front of them. And do not even get me started on the butt f*#@ing SOBs >that move >from the through lane into the ending lane just so they can force their >way in >front of a couple of extra cars. _They_ should burn in hell starting >today. > >If people around here would learn what "merge" and "yield" mean, and obey >the >vast majority of the traffic problems around here would disappear >overnight. > >But I am not bitter.... > > >John Walters (Long John) >PenguinBiker@XXXXXX >Up near DC From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 00:59:44 2005 From: Daniel To: "LindaT." Cc: "Dc-Cycles" Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 00:59:32 -0500 I guess I'm young. I'm 31. But i'm not pulling this out of thin air.. This is what young women say. Young meaning 25 y/o. There are different generations... There's good old fashioned folx... which I wish had never changed... but now there's a whole new culture out there. Women who take for granted a man who will cater to her, but cry and fight over a big time loser. GO figure? These women dont' appreciate poetry or love letters... they don't want romance... they want the bad boys who make them feel safe from others, hard core sex, and guys who don't treat them all that great. I'm old fashioned myself, but i've always been one to keep my ears open and adapt.. So i play the role and it works... it beats being lonley. I know that it's better to be without the relationship label/ties than in it. Always let the other person feel comfortable with walking away.. and that your'e comfortable with it too... because then you know they are there because they want to be there, not because they feel trapped. Or they wont' take the relationship for granted thinking "oh he or she isn't going anywhere no matter what i do.. i could cheat and they'd still be there" and they will. But if they feel like you're a catch adn they're still working on locking you down, they wont' take you for granted and be ready to throw your relationship away. THey wont' get tired or bored of it... they'll be too worried some other person will come snatch thier gold mine, vs not realizing what they have and trying for some one better... or entertain someone who seems better, who is trying to get their attention. I always would tell a woman, if someone better comes along, go for it. Just let me know, they can have you, if you're willing to go, because if you can be taken away, i dont' want you. Woman went men who are hard to get, not the men who are at their feet... it's backwards as hell but that's how it is now adays. personally, i wouldn't bet a dollar on any relationship lasting the distance where the participants are in their 20's. On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:39:17 -0500, "LindaT." wrote: >He must be mighty young to spout nonsense like this. > >Wake up and smell the exhaust fumes. Give AND take. That's what >relationships require. Men do not have to be dominant all the time or even >most of the time. Compromise. > >On everything except riding. > > LindaT. >www.CustomTankBags.com >Hollywood, FL >IBA,BMWBMW,AMA >'99 R1100RT Mr Buzzy >'95 F3 Purple Haze >'00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing > >Danny said: >You have to be the dominate one in the relationship... she'll respect >you more. Women want a strong man. If you let her wear the pants, a >strong man will come along and take her from you. Tell her you're >riding, and she is free to leave. > > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:01:16 2005 From: Daniel To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 01:01:06 -0500 On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:03:14 -0500, "Dave Yates" wrote: > >I am on the other side of the fence... I never encourage anyone >to get into motorcycling. It's deadly.. > >[Dave] Reality check: Life - it's 100% fatal. If that's how you feel, push your wife in front of a bus, and tell me it woudln't bother you Better yet push my wife LOL please From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:06:11 2005 From: Daniel To: "Dave Yates" Cc: Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 01:05:55 -0500 On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:13:23 -0500, "Dave Yates" wrote: >Danny said: > >Personality flaw... nagging... and controlling.. dump her. You will >find another to replace her. She has an anti social personality. >She cannot communicate effectively. Dump her and get a more normal >replacement. > >[Dave] Seems she's communicated pretty effectively so far... No wonder she whines and bitches to him, she's been communicating with you! >Explain my ass. > >[Dave] Male & female donkeys got together and produced it? LOL > You were born free and you have no obligation >to yeild your freedoms to someone elses whim. If she will dump you >for enjoying your freedom she's not worth keeping. Let her worry >about you.. it's better than you having to worry about her. > >[Dave] I'm in no position to speak for the wimmen-folk on the list. Still, >I haven't met any o' them thar wimmen-folk who appreciate this approach... >Maybe I just haven't hung out in the right places... It's a new generation out there. Maybe there are some 50/50 relationships amoung young folks, but if a person is trying to go over that 50% then she's selfish.. and selfish people will leave the giving with a broken heart. > Yield to nagging as least as possible.. because when you yeild to >it, it reinforces the behavior by rewarding the behavior by >satisfying the request.. nagged about this now... she'll nag >harder about more later. > >[Dave] Here, we are in agreement. I'm certainly not the example to follow >on diplomatic relations, but if you do nothing about it, or if you tolerate >being shamed into not riding, it's a move away from goodness. quote ben franklin: those who trade freedom for security deserve neither. >You have to be the dominate one in the relationship... she'll respect >you more. Women want a strong man. If you let her wear the pants, a >strong man will come along and take her from you. Tell her you're >riding, and she is free to leave. > > >[Dave] This presumes that I let my wife out of the closet, and unleash her >at times other than feeding, which is false. My GOD man... free to leave... >That's a good one... Any chance you could do that to my wife? You don't even have to feed her. ... > >;-) > touche :) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:07:07 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 01:06:55 EST Subject: Re: Deep metric socket question To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/7/2005 5:55:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, sean@XXXXXX writes: > I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to torgue this nut off > this bolt: http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg 1/2inch drive deep well socket that will slide _over_ the threaded rod (with the threads going all the way through the socket and out the square drive hole) then use vise grips to turn the socket? John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC 1999, Honda ST1100X Pan European 1983, BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles 1976, Honda CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:15:43 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 01:15:32 EST Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/7/2005 8:16:03 PM Eastern Standard Time, rjmoran@XXXXXX writes: > It's quite simple; merge at the merge point. Many states, Pennsylvania > for one, have signs that say this very thing. > A mile or so from the end of the lane. When the sign says "lane ends merge" it means merge at the first safe opportunity. It is a simple lane change and should have no more effect on traffic then any other lane change. One need only notice that traffic speeds up _after_ the merge area even though there are fewer lanes in order to see that it is the merge itself that is the problem. The problem is _entirely_ created by people who refuse to merge properly. I have lived in many places across the US and this is the only place where the leftmost lane is nearly always the slowest lane. Pure bullshit. John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC 1999, Honda ST1100X Pan European 1983, BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles 1976, Honda CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:22:12 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 01:22:02 EST Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/7/2005 10:53:01 PM Eastern Standard Time, daniel.dc@XXXXXX writes: > and if a person seriously > loves it on their own accord, they will take it seriously... If they > aren't into riding, then they will be scared and not using their full > faculties and have an even higher chance of getting hurt. I always hated to have a wife in an MSF class whos husband was making them take the class. They usually did not want to be there and had an _awful_ time of it. The worst case I am aware of was a guy whos wife failed the class _three_ times, so he put a sidecar on her bike. John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC 1999, Honda ST1100X Pan European 1983, BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles 1976, Honda CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:26:18 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 01:26:07 EST Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/7/2005 11:04:06 PM Eastern Standard Time, daniel.dc@XXXXXX writes: > Until society and law changes, I urge everyone to go ahead and > ride the left lane out and merger at the last moment if traffic is > backed up. If you can't beat them, join them. > Wish I could blame you. But I do not. I understand. The end problem is education , licensing (it should be a bitch to get a license), and enforcement. The state (general term) is at fault. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:29:13 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 01:29:04 EST Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/7/2005 11:08:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, wayne@XXXXXX writes: > > [Dave] Reality check: Life - it's 100% fatal. > > I agree. What's that saying? > > "I refuse to tiptoe through life, only to arrive safely at death." > I want to know when and how we got into the idea that quantity of life should take precedence over quality. It clearly was not always that way. Sometime feels like we live in a world of cowards. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:40:53 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 01:40:39 EST Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/8/2005 12:05:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, garicao@XXXXXX writes: > You are exactly right (except for saying that ` "Zippering" is the primary > cause of the "slugs in the left lane" ` It's not. They're sit in the left > lane because either they don't know any better Timid drivers move to the leftmost lane to avoid all the traffic interaction in the right lanes. Once there they poke along as might be expected. That does not change the point that they are there because they are afraid of the morons in the merge lanes and the havoc they create. > or they're self-centered assholes Very likely. > But you ignore your own good observations. Zipper merge is *especially* > valuable in your "BULLSHIT" scenario. What I said was that zippering was not what was happening. I agree that if it was there would be no problem. > (Don't try to diagram that sentence.)) There is absolutely NO danger of my ever diagramming a sentence. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:43:05 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 01:41:53 -0500 To: "DC-Cycles" From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes) At 09:13 PM 2/7/05 -0500, W.S. wrote: >From: "garcia oliver" > >Speaking of sun in the eyes: I put duct tape around the lower edge of my >helmet face shield (which I normally keep open/up except in the rain). By >lowering the shield a bit, I have an adjustable sun visor. > >--------- >For me, it's electrical tape on the top third. Cuts out that annoying low >sun Nov-Feb. I have one of those inch-wide green plastic things on mine...sold as a sun reducer, and it works...if you can get it between your eyes and the sun, and if it isn't directly in your line of sight. There are times, and roads, were to do that would require looking far enough down that I wouldn't be able to see where I was going properly. West on Key West Ave, just past Great Seneca for instance, at the wrong time of the afternoon. Looking in the direction of travel means looking directly into the sun. This is poor road design. It can be corrected to some extent with proper timing though. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:47:38 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 01:47:25 EST Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/7/2005 2:21:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, Dave@XXXXXX writes: > [Dave] John, I don't know of an area around here where we > can get an accurate read on that. You can get a read on it anywhere there is a merge around here. You can do it from the saddle _or_ you can pull off and park. Observe _any_ two cages in the through lane before the merge area and see just how many cars wind up between them before the merge area ends. I _guarantee_ that the average will be about 3. Or you can just think about how the through lane can be moving slower then the ending lane unless more cars are getting through from the ending lane then the through lane. Its simple really. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 01:54:02 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 01:48:00 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman At 11:28 PM 2/7/05 -0500, Wayne Edelen wrote: >On Mon, 7 Feb 2005, Dave Yates wrote: >> [Dave] Reality check: Life - it's 100% fatal. The question here is: "when?" >I agree. What's that saying? > >"I refuse to tiptoe through life, only to arrive safely at death." I like this one: "...Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in one pretty and well preserved piece, but to slide across the finish line broadside, thoroughly used up, worn out, leaking oil, and shouting "WOW--What a ride!"" -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 02:32:50 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 02:33:22 -0500 To: Randy Moran From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX At 08:15 PM 2/7/05 -0500, Randy Moran wrote: >There is only one proper place to merge when a lane is ending; that is >at the point where the lane ends. People who merge early are >simpletons, as are the people who let them in. In heavy traffic, I >never let anyone in until I get to the proper merge point and I always >use all of the lane ending, using proper signals and yielding, of >course, to those who don't know how to drive. I think you forgot either a smiley or a "" tag on that... >It's quite simple; merge at the merge point. Many states, Pennsylvania >for one, have signs that say this very thing. And these signs say what, exactly? I've driven in many states, including Pennsylvania, and I've yet to see one. All the ones I've seen in various states (Maryland and Virginia to name two) say things like, "Lane Ends - Merge Right" (or Left)...indicating that the lane is ending, get over as soon as you can do so safely. In some places, where I-95 meets the beltway near College Park for instance, they actually paint huge arrows on the road indicating which way to go, and when (and they aren't at the point where the lane runs out...). Only a total lackwit, or selfish bastard, would wait until the lane actually ends to get into a lane that's continuing, and I really doubt there are any states that suggest this. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 07:27:08 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:27:00 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX You knew this before marriage! ;-) Glenn --- Tom Gimer wrote: > glenn, what about the types that decide mid-marriage > that > bikes suck and those who ride them are assholes? > hypothetical question, of course! ;) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - now with 250MB free storage. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 07:45:56 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 04:45:48 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Hard to top that story. Glenn --- Lisa Goddard wrote: > > > For the record, I got him in to riding and I bought > a bike before he did. > > Lisa Goddard > '97 GSXR 600, track only > '95 VFR __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do? http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 08:02:26 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 05:01:59 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Ray Subject: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes) To: DC-Cycles Mike B spouted: > Looking in the direction of travel means looking > directly into the sun. > This is poor road design. It can be corrected to > some extent with proper > timing though. Ok, I've tried to ignore this, but I can't. Mike, have you ever studied roadway design? Since you're an expert in everything else, I'm guessing you have. Did you simply fail the course? Consider that the sun does not rise and set in the same place each day. In fact, I think it varies as much as 25* between summer & winter solstace. Having a road that did not go directly into the sun at some time of the year would mean that no roads could go in a direction from east to east/southeast, or west to west/southwest. Umm, yeah, right. Ok, then as you pontificated, that people could build buildings in stratgic locations. Ummm, no. That would mean that you could have *no* reasonable straight roads, because they'd have to be kinked like you're mother. As a rider, I think this would be great, but it would *seriously* reduce the capacity of the roadway. Straight roads move traffic better. Also, given the fact that changing road alignment would requiring reconstruction of these roads, condemnation of private property for the new right-of-way, and the changing of historic roads that may have been there for many years, it ain't gonna happen. There's also a little thing of topography. Roads need to be designed around it, to ensure proper alignment. Little thinks like maximum slopes. Smooth transitions (horizontal and vertical) at changes in direction. Frankly, the government has an awful time maintaining the roads we have. Unless you're going to add to their coffers, I don't think we're getting any changes anytime soon, simply to make sure people don't get sun in their eyes a couple days a year. (See moving sun above - each road only has a problem a couple days a year.) Get over it, and spout off on things you know something about. Oh, that's nothing, so you couldn't talk. Darn. Brian From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 08:02:59 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:02:55 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX "Dave Yates" >wrote: > >> >>[Dave] Reality check: Life - it's 100% fatal. > >If that's how you feel, push your wife in front of a bus, >and tell me it woudln't bother you Better yet push my >wife LOL > >please [Dave] While I don't doubt that the insurance settlement would be tempting, that option is not on the table for me. Probably because if mom or dad busted me typing something along those lines, they'd hop in the Escalade, pop on over to my crib, and scrub my hands with wire brushes. Shortly thereafter washing my mouth out with soap. Sounds bogus, but it's probably a good contributing factor that I'm not a burden on society. YMMV. Nevertheless, you can't live another person's life for them. Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 08:32:59 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 08:32:51 -0500 From: Larry Meyer To: Dc-Cycles Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman Danny, That's nothing new - it's been true forever. The good ones will grow up and realize they don't have to piss off their parents any more or they'll marry one of the bad guys, learn from their mistake, get a divorce, and start looking at nice guys differently. The ones who don't do one of those are more trouble than they're worth (or they're still married to the bad guy). I used the MC first date technique with my wife. She went from petrified to 'can we go faster???' in about 2 hours. Larry Daniel wrote: > I guess I'm young. I'm 31. But i'm not pulling this out of thin air.. > This is what young women say. Young meaning 25 y/o. There are > different generations... There's good old fashioned folx... which I > wish had never changed... but now there's a whole new culture out > there. Women who take for granted a man who will cater to her, > but cry and fight over a big time loser. GO figure? > > These women dont' appreciate poetry or love letters... they don't > want romance... they want the bad boys who make them feel safe from > others, hard core sex, and guys who don't treat them all that great. > I'm old fashioned myself, but i've always been one to keep my ears > open and adapt.. So i play the role and it works... it beats being > lonley. > > I know that it's better to be without the relationship label/ties than > in it. Always let the other person feel comfortable with walking > away.. and that your'e comfortable with it too... because then you > know they are there because they want to be there, not because > they feel trapped. Or they wont' take the relationship for granted > thinking "oh he or she isn't going anywhere no matter what i do.. > i could cheat and they'd still be there" and they will. But if they > feel like you're a catch adn they're still working on locking you > down, they wont' take you for granted and be ready to throw your > relationship away. THey wont' get tired or bored of it... they'll be > too worried some other person will come snatch thier gold mine, > vs not realizing what they have and trying for some one better... > or entertain someone who seems better, who is trying to get their > attention. I always would tell a woman, if someone better comes > along, go for it. Just let me know, they can have you, if you're > willing to go, because if you can be taken away, i dont' want you. > Woman went men who are hard to get, not the men who > are at their feet... it's backwards as hell but that's how it is > now adays. > > personally, i wouldn't bet a dollar on any relationship lasting the > distance where the participants are in their 20's. > > > > On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 23:39:17 -0500, "LindaT." > wrote: > > >>He must be mighty young to spout nonsense like this. >> >>Wake up and smell the exhaust fumes. Give AND take. That's what >>relationships require. Men do not have to be dominant all the time or even >>most of the time. Compromise. >> >>On everything except riding. >> >>LindaT. >>www.CustomTankBags.com >>Hollywood, FL >>IBA,BMWBMW,AMA >>'99 R1100RT Mr Buzzy >>'95 F3 Purple Haze >>'00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing >> >>Danny said: >>You have to be the dominate one in the relationship... she'll respect >>you more. Women want a strong man. If you let her wear the pants, a >>strong man will come along and take her from you. Tell her you're >>riding, and she is free to leave. >> >> >> > > > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 08:40:44 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:40:23 -0500 Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX To: "Mike B." From: Randy Moran "Lane Ends - Merge Right" does not anywhere within its explicit or implied text tell you or anyone else when to merge. This is from a quick web search: "For example, if traffic is heavy, the system will instruct motorists to use both lanes and take turns once they've reached the defined merge point just before the lane closure." This strategy often referred to as the "zipper" improves traffic flow, reduces conflicts and hopefully will decrease the number of crashes when traffic demand exceeds the capacity of a single lane closure. "Basically, we want drivers to know that under normal traffic speeds, they should try to merge early to avoid unsafe merging maneuvers; however, when traffic is congested, drivers should use both lanes all the way to the definite merge point," said Servatius. http://www.dot.state.mn.us/newsrels/03/10/29merge.html And this is my point. Around here, at least where I drive, there is almost never what the above quote refers to as "normal traffic speeds." Traffic is almost always backed up well behind the end of the closing lane, and there is always some jackass trying to get in a mile before the lane ends, or some fuckwit "straddling" the lanes to prevent anyone from using the closing lane (This is when I love being on a bike). It is exactly this asinine insistence on early merging in this instance that leads to pissed off people and long delays. It's really quite simple: Wait until the FUCKING LANE ENDS TO MERGE! Then, everyone knows that they're not getting screwed, and we can all take our turn and use all of the fucking asphalt that has been provided. RPM From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 08:46:07 2005 From: To: Subject: Re: Re: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 8:45:59 -0500 > > From: Daniel > Date: 2005/02/08 Tue AM 12:59:32 EST > To: "LindaT." > CC: "Dc-Cycles" > Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman > > I guess I'm young. I'm 31. But i'm not pulling this out of thin air.. > This is what young women say. Young meaning 25 y/o. There are > different generations... There's good old fashioned folx... which I > wish had never changed... but now there's a whole new culture out > there. Women who take for granted a man who will cater to her, > but cry and fight over a big time loser. GO figure? > > These women dont' appreciate poetry or love letters... they don't > want romance... they want the bad boys who make them feel safe from > others, hard core sex, and guys who don't treat them all that great. > I'm old fashioned myself, but i've always been one to keep my ears > open and adapt.. So i play the role and it works... it beats being > lonley. funny, just about *every* divorcee I know tells me that she married just the "bad boy" imeage you mentioned and couldn't WAIT to get out of that relationship. The reality of it is, that many women, IMHO, like the Bad Boy image, but when it comes to finding a father and a husband, they look for a completely different profile. Being married means sharing..both the good and bad..and tons of compromises..that's what it's all about. -aki From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 08:46:57 2005 From: Daniel To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 08:46:45 -0500 If this is some kind of peer pressure trick to get my wife to juggle flaming chain saws..... I think I like it. Otherwise I believe in letting a person make their own choices from their own motivations. It's just not fun losing someone close... and i think it would suck a whole lot more if it's from something you wanted them to do and they didnt' want to do. I'm not saying don't live life to it's fullest.. i'm just saying a person should do it because they want to, not because you want them to. :) On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 01:29:04 EST, PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: >In a message dated 2/7/2005 11:08:29 PM Eastern Standard Time, >wayne@XXXXXX writes: > >> > [Dave] Reality check: Life - it's 100% fatal. >> >> I agree. What's that saying? >> >> "I refuse to tiptoe through life, only to arrive safely at death." >> > >I want to know when and how we got into the idea that quantity of life should >take precedence over quality. It clearly was not always that way. >Sometime feels like we live in a world of cowards. > >John. >PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 08:51:27 2005 From: Daniel To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: tear off shield - was Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes) Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 08:51:16 -0500 That reminds me.. I have a new helmet which doesn't have tear off shield posts... and a tear off shield from an old helmet.. anyone ever made the posts before? I'm thinking a couple of rivits woudl work but look tacky... hmm maybe small wooden dowels glued on? I dont know. Any ideas? From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 09:04:44 2005 Subject: RE: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:04:41 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "Tom Gimer" , , "Anne S" Cc: Every time I am done a ride I typically park at about 197 fahrenheit. A few weeks ago there was mention of putting horses away wet. Well, if I just tuen the bike off, the temperature will shoot up to some unknown height and if I understand correctly, overheating is a bad idea..so I stand there with the lights on and wait for the fan to kick in at 210. five minutes later the bike cools down to a temperature that does not engage the fan. This is when I turn the bike off. -----Original Message----- From: Tom Gimer [mailto:t_gimer@XXXXXX] To: Julian Halton; you@XXXXXX; Anne S Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman why does it worry you? because it doesn't come on until 227? or because your bike gets to 227 in the middle of winter? --- Julian Halton wrote: > > > > Took it out for a spin yesterday...am racking up miles and will be > ready for my first oil change by the end of the week. Rock Creek on > this thing was amazing. The new R6 does not like traffic and I > frequently find the cooling fan kicking in as the temp jumps to 227 > degrees farenheit which worries me a bit. > > ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 09:05:27 2005 From: Daniel To: Brian Ray Cc: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes) Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 09:05:17 -0500 One day paved roadways will be obsolete... and humanity will fly around in computer navigated vehicles.. then we can find new things to bicker about, while we lay back and play on our laptops while we travel. :) looking forward it's like we are in the transistioning phase of history.. sure we have our technologies which we think make our life great, probably like those who had the first cars, in house bathrooms and tv's,.. but there is apotential for so much more, and things so much more efficient that our way of life is slow in comparison.. our cars today, will be comparable to colonian times with horse and wagon compared to vehicles of the future. In a way our technology is cool.. in other ways (long term thinking) it sucks. sure we have google and palmtops and such..but in the future they'll have a computer at the tip of thier lips like star trek.. "computer.. tell me the history of this george washington fort we are visiting" "the fort was built in XXXX, it served as ...., today it is maintained by.... , some of it's featers are.... " to get back on topic.. I wonder what motorcycles will be like then.. I guess they won't be called motorcycles any more.. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 09:10:33 2005 From: Daniel To: Dave Yates Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 09:10:22 -0500 exactly, pushing someone into somethign dangerous is trying to live their life for them.. if they like it, fine encourage them then... but if they never expressed an interest to do something dangerous.. I would never try to motivate them to do it as a condition of being with me. I'm not going to discourage my son from doing dangerous things either.. i'm just not going to try to motivate him to do things because i selfishly want him to. I have a friend who was saying how awesome it was to motorcycle around with his brother.. unfortunately his brother had an accident and died... there's such a big void there now. I'm not saying family shouldn't ride together, i'm saying they should, IF each participant is doing it because they love doign it. On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:02:55 -0500, Dave Yates wrote: >"Dave Yates" >>wrote: >> >>> >>>[Dave] Reality check: Life - it's 100% fatal. >> >>If that's how you feel, push your wife in front of a bus, >>and tell me it woudln't bother you Better yet push my >>wife LOL >> >>please > >[Dave] While I don't doubt that the insurance settlement >would be tempting, that option is not on the table for me. > >Probably because if mom or dad busted me typing something >along those lines, they'd hop in the Escalade, pop on over to >my crib, and scrub my hands with wire brushes. Shortly >thereafter washing my mouth out with soap. Sounds bogus, but >it's probably a good contributing factor that I'm not a >burden on society. YMMV. > >Nevertheless, you can't live another person's life for them. >Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 09:17:37 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:17:28 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Julian Halton Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:04:41 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: > Every time I am done a ride I typically park at about 197 fahrenheit. A > few weeks ago there was mention of putting horses away wet. Well, if I > just tuen the bike off, the temperature will shoot up to some unknown > height and if I understand correctly, overheating is a bad idea..so I > stand there with the lights on and wait for the fan to kick in at 210. > five minutes later the bike cools down to a temperature that does not > engage the fan. This is when I turn the bike off. > Oh, thank goodness for the old-fashioned analog gauges on my bikes. :) I have no idea what temperature the things run at. Julian, for the "fan to kick on" that means the engine temperatures are rising. Why not shut it off when the temperature's lower and not go through the whole "fan kick on" routine. Am I missing something? IMHO, you're just wasting time and fuel. BTW, real honest to goodness "overheating" means coolant puking out into the overflow reservoir when the pressure cap opens. Don't pay too much attention to what those digital gauges are saying. The only time my gauges have told me anything worthwhile was when the fan switch crapped out on the VFR, on a 95-degree day. Then I wondered why I was inching toward the red and took corrective measures. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 09:21:37 2005 From: "Sean Steele" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 09:21:24 -0500 Subject: Re: Deep metric socket question Mike, Nope, there are a number of bits "behind" the bolt that keep it from freely rotating... look upper left (#10 is the offending nut): http://parts.yamaha-motor.com/partimage.gifx?d=30781,5,0 -Sean lister lynch wrote: > The shaft seems to have a flat on it. Is it possible to hold the nut in > place and turn the shaft? > > Mike > > On Mon, 2005-02-07 at 18:02, Leon Begeman wrote: > >>>I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to >>>torgue this nut off >>>this bolt: >>>http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg >>> >>>Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, >>>even online. >>> >>>Any ideas? >> >>Things that come to mind. >> >>1) crowfoot wrench >>2) offset box end wrench >>3) shorter socket with a hex head on it (similar to a >>spark plug socket) so another wrench could be applied >>to the socket. >>or >>4) weld a handle to an old metric socket that you >>don't use much anymore. >> >>I'm sure there are other methods. I just can't think >>of any right now. >> >>Leon. >> > > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 09:36:39 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:36:30 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Randy Moran Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) Cc: "Mike B." , dc-cycles@XXXXXX On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:40:23 -0500, Randy Moran wrote: > "Lane Ends - Merge Right" does not anywhere within its explicit or > implied text tell you or anyone else when to merge. > .... It > is exactly this asinine insistence on early merging in this instance > that leads to pissed off people and long delays. It's really quite > simple: Wait until the FUCKING LANE ENDS TO MERGE! Then, everyone knows > that they're not getting screwed, and we can all take our turn and use > all of the fucking asphalt that has been provided. > > RPM > I'm with Randy. It's really pretty simple, folks. Is there's a dashed white line between you and the next lane where you want to go, merging is fair game. If there's a solid line, no. If people are offended by this "rule" too bad; they're idiots. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 09:36:59 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 06:36:52 -0800 (PST) From: "James O'Connor" Subject: Re: Deep metric socket question To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I'd try what a previous poster already suggested - take a socket of appropriate size and fit over the nut, allowing bolt to slip through open end of socket. use vice grips to turn the socket. spraying PB Blaster or similar ahead of time will make the task easier. Another suggestion, if it is worth it to you to "ruin" a wrench - take box end wrench of appropriate size and bend into L shape (heat may be required). you won't be left with much leverage, but you should be able to get vice-grips or similar on the wrench to help. Another.....use a dremel to cut nut off. Another.....if bolt is to be replaced, cut bolt shorter and use the socket(s) you already have. Good luck! - Jimmy --- Sean Steele wrote: > Mike, > > Nope, there are a number of bits "behind" the bolt that keep it > from > freely rotating... look upper left (#10 is the offending nut): > http://parts.yamaha-motor.com/partimage.gifx?d=30781,5,0 > > -Sean > > lister lynch wrote: > > > The shaft seems to have a flat on it. Is it possible to hold the > nut in > > place and turn the shaft? > > > > Mike > > > > On Mon, 2005-02-07 at 18:02, Leon Begeman wrote: > > > >>>I believe I need at least a 3" deep metric socket to > >>>torgue this nut off > >>>this bolt: > >>>http://www.gaweeka.com/blog/pics/bike/01.jpg > >>> > >>>Thing is, I can't seem to find anything that deep, > >>>even online. > >>> > >>>Any ideas? > >> > >>Things that come to mind. > >> > >>1) crowfoot wrench > >>2) offset box end wrench > >>3) shorter socket with a hex head on it (similar to a > >>spark plug socket) so another wrench could be applied > >>to the socket. > >>or > >>4) weld a handle to an old metric socket that you > >>don't use much anymore. > >> > >>I'm sure there are other methods. I just can't think > >>of any right now. > >> > >>Leon. > >> > > > > > > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today! http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 09:47:49 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 09:47:41 -0500 From: "De Boeser, Tom" To: DC-CYCLES Subject: pretty nice for us poor guys http://maps.google.com/ i did search on washington dc... pretty detailed so far.... tom de '03 ST1300 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 10:07:01 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:06:53 -0500 From: smthng else To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:04:41 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: > Every time I am done a ride I typically park at about 197 fahrenheit. A > few weeks ago there was mention of putting horses away wet. Well, if I > just tuen the bike off, the temperature will shoot up to some unknown > height and if I understand correctly, overheating is a bad idea..so I > stand there with the lights on and wait for the fan to kick in at 210. > five minutes later the bike cools down to a temperature that does not > engage the fan. This is when I turn the bike off. You were reading that a bit too literally, Julian. If the fan is on when you stop, wait for it to kick off by itself before killing the engine (since it IS cooling down the system). If it's not on, just kill the engine without worrying about it. Just so you know, the fan on most Yama's kicks on at just over halfway through the full range of normal operating temperature. I'd imagine that you could run up to about 270 or so with no problems, so don't worry about the 10-20 degrees that you're seeing. The only time you NEED to worry about the temperatures on your bike is if the fan never comes on (fan be broke) or if it stays on (cooling system be broke). Everything else is pretty much normal. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 10:18:22 2005 Subject: Cool Moto Links Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:18:20 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: I was in Barnes and Noble and came across a magazine referencing the international motorcycle design show that takes place once a year in Paris. They had some really, really cool pictures of project sport bikes. The article referenced a designer whose name escapes me. In a search to track him down I came across some interesting links: http://blogs.motorbiker.org/blogs.nsf/dx/10062003144930MIKH32.htm http://www.guggenheim.org/exhibitions/past_exhibitions/motorcycle/motorc ycle.html From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 10:20:22 2005 From: "Perry Coleman" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 10:19:56 -0500 Interesting setup on the Yami... The fan on the Concours comes on without the ignition being switched on. It is not that unusual that after a commute or ride in hot weather, that I will park the bike in the garage, turn off the key and the fan will kick in. It will run for a few minutes and then cut off. Seems to be operating normally. Perry >From: smthng else >Reply-To: you@XXXXXX >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman >Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:06:53 -0500 > >On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:04:41 -0500, Julian Halton >wrote: > > Every time I am done a ride I typically park at about 197 fahrenheit. A > > few weeks ago there was mention of putting horses away wet. Well, if I > > just tuen the bike off, the temperature will shoot up to some unknown > > height and if I understand correctly, overheating is a bad idea..so I > > stand there with the lights on and wait for the fan to kick in at 210. > > five minutes later the bike cools down to a temperature that does not > > engage the fan. This is when I turn the bike off. > >You were reading that a bit too literally, Julian. If the fan is on >when you stop, wait for it to kick off by itself before killing the >engine (since it IS cooling down the system). If it's not on, just >kill the engine without worrying about it. > >Just so you know, the fan on most Yama's kicks on at just over halfway >through the full range of normal operating temperature. I'd imagine >that you could run up to about 270 or so with no problems, so don't >worry about the 10-20 degrees that you're seeing. The only time you >NEED to worry about the temperatures on your bike is if the fan never >comes on (fan be broke) or if it stays on (cooling system be broke). >Everything else is pretty much normal. > >--smthng >http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 10:34:12 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 10:34:05 -0500 From: smthng else To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 10:19:56 -0500, Perry Coleman wrote: > It is not that unusual that after a commute or ride in hot weather, that I > will park the bike in the garage, turn off the key and the fan will kick in. > It will run for a few minutes and then cut off. Seems to be operating > normally. I think the most of the Yama's will continue to run the fan without the key, but it has to be REAL hot for it to do so. I know my FZ1 has continued the fan after cut-off once or twice, but the FJR hasn't done it yet (I haven't had it long enough to make it through a summer ride yet). Makes sense to me, since it's not circulating water without the engine running anyway. I imagine it just clears out some of the hot air under there so you don't end up cooking electronics. My old Venture behaved more like your concours... Fan ran when the bike turned on and turned off about 3 minutes after you switched off the engine. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 11:21:40 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 10:51:38 -0500 To: Brian Ray , DC-Cycles From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes) At 05:01 AM 2/8/05 -0800, Brian Ray wrote: >Mike B spouted: > >> Looking in the direction of travel means looking >> directly into the sun. >> This is poor road design. It can be corrected to >> some extent with proper >> timing though. > >Consider that the sun does not rise and set in the >same place each day. In fact, I think it varies as >much as 25* between summer & winter solstace. Having >a road that did not go directly into the sun at some >time of the year would mean that no roads could go in >a direction from east to east/southeast, or west to >west/southwest. You apparently missed all the earlier comments, or you just have a really short memory, or considering all that was said would prevent you from feeling superior or something. Or are you a road designer responsible for a road that has this problem and so you see this as a personal attack? At no point did I suggest that you couldn't have a road that went in a direction that the sun sets (or rises) in at some time of the year (and yes, I did comment earlier that the location of these events does shift with season). Road design includes more than road direction. As I said (I think it might have been my first message on this subject) things like buildings, trees, walls and curves are big factors that can limit the problems caused by road direction and sun location. Lots of roads manage to go in the required direction without major impact from rising and setting suns, and without Gimer's suggestion of turning the sun off. How do they do this? They consider the sun factor in their design and include or take advantage of some of the factors that can limit the harm. The sun is only a large problem when it's near the horizon. It doesn't take a very tall obstruction to block it at times like this. You only have problems when you run a flat road directly into it for a long distance. This isn't done much that I've seen...at least not around here...and local roads that do this are just poor designs. >Ok, then as you pontificated, that people could build >buildings in stratgic locations. Ummm, no. That >would mean that you could have *no* reasonable >straight roads, because they'd have to be kinked like >you're mother. As a rider, I think this would be >great, but it would *seriously* reduce the capacity of >the roadway. Straight roads move traffic better. Your pontifications are faulty here. You can have plenty of straight roads without running them into the sun with no obstructions. You just can't run them in particular directions (which vary with latitude). The "zig zag" needed doesn't have to be on a scale of meters as you seem to be assuming. >Also, given the fact that changing road alignment >would requiring reconstruction of these roads, >condemnation of private property for the new >right-of-way, and the changing of historic roads that >may have been there for many years, it ain't gonna >happen. You are introducing the idea of changing existing roads...I didn't mention that at all. I just said that roads that had particular characteristics were poorly designed. Fixing that is a separate discussion...which, since it isn't about bikes, isn't really on topic here (any more than this one really). >Get over it, and spout off on things you know >something about. Oh, that's nothing, so you couldn't >talk. Darn. Why don't you try to discuss things without the personal attacks? Are you unable to do that? -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 11:29:48 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:27:10 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman At 10:06 AM 2/8/2005, smthng else wrote: >You were reading that a bit too literally, Julian. If the fan is on >when you stop, wait for it to kick off by itself before killing the >engine (since it IS cooling down the system). If it's not on, just >kill the engine without worrying about it. That doesn't make any sense to me. If you are sitting with the engine running, the bike is bound to heat up. Why keep it running for the fan to counter act your heating by keeping it running? If I am incoherent and this is obvious, I am slowly recovering from a week of flu and back on the bike for the first time today since it snowed. ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr 1997 Honda VFR 750 AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 11:31:31 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:24:06 -0500 To: Randy Moran From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX At 08:40 AM 2/8/05 -0500, Randy Moran wrote: >"Lane Ends - Merge Right" does not anywhere within its explicit or >implied text tell you or anyone else when to merge. Explicit I'll agree with. For anyone with any sense at all there is certainly an implied imperative there. Just for those few who are too dense to pick it up on their own, they generally mention something about it in driving school. >This is from a quick web search: > >"For example, if traffic is heavy, the system will instruct motorists >to use both lanes and take turns once they've reached the defined merge >point just before the lane closure." This strategy often referred to as >the "zipper" improves traffic flow, reduces conflicts and hopefully >will decrease the number of crashes when traffic demand exceeds the >capacity of a single lane closure. What you are quoting from is from an article about an experimental program that is trying to see whether early or late merges at *construction sites* are better for reducing backup distances and improving safety at the construction site and whether traffic density matters in this. It has nothing to do with permanent merges and trying to keep traffic flowing. It assumes that the available road is inadequate to carry the normal traffic load due to one or more closed lanes, and it isn't conclusive about which method is better...though it does say that early merges are better for normal traffic loads since they prevent the last minute lane change that waiting requires and are thus safer. Their system involved a lot of equipment that isn't normally installed on roadways (alert messages, Doppler radar sensors, etc.) to keep all drivers on the same page about what to do under current conditions. In no way does that article support your claim that waiting until the lane runs out to merge is the way to do it under all driving conditions. >And this is my point. Around here, at least where I drive, there is >almost never what the above quote refers to as "normal traffic speeds." Where are you driving? Where is "around here"? I've been driving in the D.C. area (Maryland and Virginia mostly, with some in D.C.) since 1980. There are times, usually rush "hour", and places, where it's stop and go on a regular basis, and I've driven in such times and places a lot...the "zipper merge" is the way to go in those cases for sure, and I try to drive that way in such situations, but those situations are not the norm at all, even around here. They are limited to specific times of day, or just while construction happens. Saying that normal speeds are an "almost never" situation is hyperbole. On the contrary, higher than legal speeds are common in most places, most of the time. >Traffic is almost always backed up well behind the end of the closing >lane, and there is always some jackass trying to get in a mile before >the lane ends, Getting over as soon as you can is the way to do it, but sitting and blocking the ending lane while you wait for a hole is stupid. If you get a hole, take it...that's one less vehicle to have to merge at the end, and since there was a hole, you haven't slowed the through lane at all. Holes happen when someone is slow starting up when the traffic moves ahead a few car lengths. Most jackasses don't do this of course...they bypass multiple opportunities to merge early without disruption so they can get in front of all those other cars. Most of them probably got out of the through lane to do that in the first place... >or some fuckwit "straddling" the lanes to prevent anyone >from using the closing lane (This is when I love being on a bike). It This may not be optimal, but it is understandable. After watching dozens of selfish fuckwits pull into the disappearing lane to zip past and add to the merge problems up ahead, thus helping to create the problem, those drivers are motivated to do anything to reduce the attractiveness of that lane and convince them to stay where they were to start with. One poor behavior results in the other. >is exactly this asinine insistence on early merging in this instance >that leads to pissed off people and long delays. It's really quite >simple: Wait until the FUCKING LANE ENDS TO MERGE! If you can't move over early without disrupting flow, sure...WHEN TRAFFIC IS CRAWLING. You didn't limit your instructions to that situation though...and doing what you suggest is dangerous, stupid, annoying and demonstrates a lack of driving ability when done in other situations. I see it all the time as some halfwit drives to the end of the merge with no attempt to change early, despite there being plenty of opportunity, and then comes over like they have right of way, causing vehicles already in the through lane to brake heavily or swerve to avoid a collision. When changing lanes you don't have right of way...and if there's a collision, it's going to be your fault (according to a police officer who was taking reports at an accident I witnessed once upon a time). Doesn't alter the behavior of these "wait to the end" halfwits though. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 11:35:14 2005 Subject: RE: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:35:12 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "Troutman" , Sounds incoherent I know but my reasoning is that I shut the bike off immediately then the engine continues to heat up and the fan will not kick in so the engine actually gets hotter than if I waited for the fan to kick in...this was my initial question -----Original Message----- From: Troutman [mailto:mike@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman At 10:06 AM 2/8/2005, smthng else wrote: >You were reading that a bit too literally, Julian. If the fan is on >when you stop, wait for it to kick off by itself before killing the >engine (since it IS cooling down the system). If it's not on, just >kill the engine without worrying about it. That doesn't make any sense to me. If you are sitting with the engine running, the bike is bound to heat up. Why keep it running for the fan to counter act your heating by keeping it running? If I am incoherent and this is obvious, I am slowly recovering from a week of flu and back on the bike for the first time today since it snowed. ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr 1997 Honda VFR 750 AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 11:43:26 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:43:18 -0500 From: Sean Jordan To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:35:12 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: > Sounds incoherent I know but my reasoning is that I shut the bike off > immediately then the engine continues to heat up I'm with Troutman. My knowledge of thermodynamics (albeit limited) would seem to preclude the motorcycle from getting hotter after the ignition has been killed. (Assuming the ambient air temperature is less than that of the motor - Julian is not posting froma burn ward.) Maybe the reading is just something wonky that the guage does on shutoff? - Sean Jordan From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 11:47:41 2005 Subject: RE: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:47:39 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "Julian Halton" , "Troutman" , Let me further clarify ..lack of caffeine.. I do not let the engine run..I shut the engine off but leave the key in the on position so that as the engine heats up (even off) the fan will kick in once the engine temp hits 210 which happens every time. Hope this helps unconfuse everyone. -----Original Message----- From: Julian Halton [mailto:julian@XXXXXX] To: Troutman; dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Sounds incoherent I know but my reasoning is that I shut the bike off immediately then the engine continues to heat up and the fan will not kick in so the engine actually gets hotter than if I waited for the fan to kick in...this was my initial question -----Original Message----- From: Troutman [mailto:mike@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman At 10:06 AM 2/8/2005, smthng else wrote: >You were reading that a bit too literally, Julian. If the fan is on >when you stop, wait for it to kick off by itself before killing the >engine (since it IS cooling down the system). If it's not on, just >kill the engine without worrying about it. That doesn't make any sense to me. If you are sitting with the engine running, the bike is bound to heat up. Why keep it running for the fan to counter act your heating by keeping it running? If I am incoherent and this is obvious, I am slowly recovering from a week of flu and back on the bike for the first time today since it snowed. ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr 1997 Honda VFR 750 AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 11:49:52 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:49:50 -0500 From: Robert To: Paul Wilson Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) Cc: Randy Moran , dc-cycles@XXXXXX And I'm just as firmly not in agreement with Randy. The actual situation in this case is that one or another of the merging lanes, usually the one that is coming to an end (no more asphalt to use), comes to a grinding halt and three or four vehicles behind the first one immediately attempt to "power merge." Sure, in an ideal world, if the vehicle in the disappearing lane merged smoothly with the travel lane at the merge intersection, traffic flow would be expedited. However, given varying levels of driver skill and confidence levels, the easiest and safest way to merge and still maintain speed is by matching speed and signaling (funny how no one's mentioned that...) to merge before the lane ends. Way before the lane ends. As soon as practical after the "lane ending" sign appears. I was also taught that if the lane I am in is a merge lane, I must yield to the flow of traffic to move into the travel lane. Not behave as though I have a perfect right to join the travel lane at any time I wish, with no signal whatsoever. If someone comes flying down the merge lane, especially when I've seen them pull into it from the travel lane behind me, they can pass me on the shoulder for all I care, I'm ignoring them. If I have someone pull alongside, match speed, and signal, I ease off and leave them room to move in safely. I've driven the Outer Loop near Alexandria a few times, and never fail to spot some aggressive driver use the Rt. 1 (I think that's the exit) on-ramp merge lane to get a jump on a few cars in the 495 travel lanes. Who is getting screwed in that scenario? Or should all vehicles move out to occupy all available asphalt at all times? Good grief. Robert Verde On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 09:36:30 -0500, Paul Wilson wrote: > On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 08:40:23 -0500, Randy Moran wrote: > > "Lane Ends - Merge Right" does not anywhere within its explicit or > > implied text tell you or anyone else when to merge. > > > .... It > > is exactly this asinine insistence on early merging in this instance > > that leads to pissed off people and long delays. It's really quite > > simple: Wait until the FUCKING LANE ENDS TO MERGE! Then, everyone knows > > that they're not getting screwed, and we can all take our turn and use > > all of the fucking asphalt that has been provided. > > > > RPM > > > I'm with Randy. It's really pretty simple, folks. Is there's a > dashed white line between you and the next lane where you want to go, > merging is fair game. If there's a solid line, no. If people are > offended by this "rule" too bad; they're idiots. > > -- > Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org > 95 VFR - 90 KLR > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 11:53:00 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:52:53 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Julian Halton Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Cc: Troutman , dc-cycles@XXXXXX On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:35:12 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: > Sounds incoherent I know but my reasoning is that I shut the bike off > immediately then the engine continues to heat up and the fan will not > kick in so the engine actually gets hotter than if I waited for the fan > to kick in...this was my initial question Officer, pull that man over and give him a ticket for breaking the Second Law of Thermodynamics. If the engine's "off" (i.e. no piston-thingies going up and down - no work, no fuel burning) how does the engine continue to heat up? Now, the *coolant* in the engine's water jacket might get hotter, as the heat flows from the cylinders and the head and there's no water pump circulating the coolant, but surely not the "engine" as a whole. Not trying to be a smart-ass, but it seems obvious to me. I learned just enough physics to be dangerous. :) -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 11:54:01 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:53:35 -0500 To: "dc Cycles" From: Troutman Subject: RE: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Your actions make sense with the clarification, but I don't know why the bike continues to heat up once it is off, unless you have something wrong with the cooling system. I don't see that behavior with the VFR or BIL's F4i. I can imagine the fan is doing a lot of cooling, but not 40 degrees worth. At 11:47 AM 2/8/2005, you wrote: >Let me further clarify ..lack of caffeine.. I do not let the engine >run..I shut the engine off but leave the key in the on position so that >as the engine heats up (even off) the fan will kick in once the engine >temp hits 210 which happens every time. Hope this helps unconfuse >everyone. ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr 1997 Honda VFR 750 AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 12:01:11 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 12:01:24 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: RE: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman At 11:35 AM 2/8/05 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: >Sounds incoherent I know but my reasoning is that I shut the bike off >immediately then the engine continues to heat up and the fan will not >kick in so the engine actually gets hotter than if I waited for the fan >to kick in...this was my initial question Why would the bike continue to heat up once you stop burning gas in it? Yes, it's possible the temp sensor will get hotter for a bit as coolant circulation stops and heat migrates from hotter to cooler locations in the engine, but total heat content of the engine will go down, not up, once you shut down (unless you park in liquid lava or something ;-). The bike should have been designed to handle this redistribution of heat with no problems, and continuing to run the engine when stopped is going to make any problems that do exist worse as you have removed the cooling airflow of motion...which the fan is trying to simulate. You always need to know how the data you are being shown is created before you will know what it means, and can decide what to do about it. This goes for temp gauges as much as for politics. The temp gauge isn't showing you engine temp, it's showing you engine temp sensor temp, more or less. ;-) -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 12:16:37 2005 From: "Rob Keiser" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 12:14:54 -0500 Just be careful not to drain your battery while you wait. Voice of experience. Rob '98 VFR800 (gets a bit hot now and then) From: Troutman To: "dc Cycles" Subject: RE: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 11:53:35 -0500 Your actions make sense with the clarification, but I don't know why the bike continues to heat up once it is off, unless you have something wrong with the cooling system. I don't see that behavior with the VFR or BIL's F4i. I can imagine the fan is doing a lot of cooling, but not 40 degrees worth. At 11:47 AM 2/8/2005, you wrote: >Let me further clarify ..lack of caffeine.. I do not let the engine >run..I shut the engine off but leave the key in the on position so that >as the engine heats up (even off) the fan will kick in once the engine >temp hits 210 which happens every time. Hope this helps unconfuse >everyone. ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr 1997 Honda VFR 750 AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 12:39:21 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:59:52 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Sean Jordan wrote: > I'm with Troutman. My knowledge of thermodynamics (albeit limited) > would seem to preclude the motorcycle from getting hotter after the > ignition has been killed. (Assuming the ambient air temperature is > less than that of the motor - Julian is not posting froma burn ward.) The engine temp will continue to rise once you've turned off the ignition. I assume it's because the waterpump is no longer circulating coolant through the rad, which is dissipating the heat of the motor (along with the oil flowing through the oil cooler, if so equipped). In our racecars, we employ electric waterpumps along with our electric cooling fans. In the pits/staging lanes, we'll run the pumps/fans to cool the car. Julian, don't let your bike sit and idle. If you have a problem with your cooling system, get it checked out. If it's a problem with the design, adding a 2nd fan with a manual switch can sometimes aid in cooling. Good luck! -- Wayne From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 12:46:10 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 12:46:03 -0500 From: "De Boeser, Tom" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Julian Halton wrote: >Sounds incoherent I know but my reasoning is that I shut the bike off >immediately then the engine continues to heat up and the fan will not >kick in so the engine actually gets hotter than if I waited for the fan >to kick in...this was my initial question > > First from all the posts it sounds like your coolant level is low. Now a possible explaination for heat up after shut-off, no coolant flowing. If the coolant level is low and the motor is shut-off the coolant can't help the heat dissipate leaving the motor to cook itself. kinda like eggs or pasta tend to keep cooking after taken off the heat. just a possiblity. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 12:48:26 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 12:48:21 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Paul Wilson Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Cc: Julian Halton , Troutman , dc-cycles@XXXXXX > Officer, pull that man over and give him a ticket for breaking the > Second Law of Thermodynamics. If the engine's "off" (i.e. no > piston-thingies going up and down - no work, no fuel burning) how does > the engine continue to heat up? Now, the *coolant* in the engine's > water jacket might get hotter, as the heat flows from the cylinders > and the head and there's no water pump circulating the coolant, but > surely not the "engine" as a whole. > > Not trying to be a smart-ass, but it seems obvious to me. I learned > just enough physics to be dangerous. :) Give that man a cee-gar! The ONLY engines that need a cooldown period after a run are turbocharged engines. Cutting off the oil supply to a turbo spinning merrily away at 30K+ RPMs is not a good thing. Ride it home. put it on the stand and turn the engine off. Michael J. Or Turn the engine off and then put it on the stand - sequence is irrelevant - what it doesn't need is a cool down run, unless it's turbocharged. Superchargers don't need the cooldown, as they stop with the rngine. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 13:06:23 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 13:26:56 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Michael Jordan wrote: > Or Turn the engine off and then put it on the stand - sequence is > irrelevant - what it doesn't need is a cool down run, unless it's > turbocharged. Superchargers don't need the cooldown, as they stop with > the rngine. Somewhat true. The reason you want to run your turbocharged engine after driving is to let the oil drain out of the turbo, so it doesn't cook in there. That's the purpose of products like a turbo timer, which allows your motor to run after you remove the key. The same is true for some superchargers, since many are lubricated with the engine's own oil supply. I have a centrifugal supercharger on one of my cars. The headunit is oiled from the engine. There is a feed line near the oil filter, on the pressure side of the oil system and a drain that I tapped into the front of the oil pan. -- Wayne From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 14:15:46 2005 From: rjmoran@XXXXXX To: "Mike B." Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 19:15:35 +0000 X-Authenticated-Sender: cmptb3JhbkBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA== > At 08:40 AM 2/8/05 -0500, Randy Moran wrote: > >"Lane Ends - Merge Right" does not anywhere within its explicit or > >implied text tell you or anyone else when to merge. > > Explicit I'll agree with. For anyone with any sense at all there is > certainly an implied imperative there. Just for those few who are too > dense to pick it up on their own, they generally mention something about it > in driving school. "Now" or "quickly" is not in any way implied in the text of that sign. Your own impatience and lack of driving skill cause you to infer something that simply isn't there. Also, I missed the part in driving school where they said "Lane Ends - Merge Right" means "get over well before the lane ends" or "get over before the proper merge point." I'm pretty sure that's because they never said that. > > >This is from a quick web search: > > > >"For example, if traffic is heavy, the system will instruct motorists > >to use both lanes and take turns once they've reached the defined merge > >point just before the lane closure." This strategy often referred to as > >the "zipper" improves traffic flow, reduces conflicts and hopefully > >will decrease the number of crashes when traffic demand exceeds the > >capacity of a single lane closure. > > What you are quoting from is from an article about an experimental program > that is trying to see whether early or late merges at *construction sites* > are better for reducing backup distances and improving safety at the > construction site and whether traffic density matters in this. It has > nothing to do with permanent merges and trying to keep traffic flowing. It > assumes that the available road is inadequate to carry the normal traffic > load due to one or more closed lanes, and it isn't conclusive about which > method is better...though it does say that early merges are better for > normal traffic loads since they prevent the last minute lane change that > waiting requires and are thus safer. Their system involved a lot of > equipment that isn't normally installed on roadways (alert messages, > Doppler radar sensors, etc.) to keep all drivers on the same page about > what to do under current conditions. > > In no way does that article support your claim that waiting until the lane > runs out to merge is the way to do it under all driving conditions. In fact the article says that in heavy traffic, which is what we generally have around here, my method (the end of the lane zipper merge) is better. > Where are you driving? Where is "around here"? Route 66 in rush hour. Route 50 (in VA) during rush hour. If we're not talking about rush hour or construction traffic, then what difference does it make how you merge? Just get over when you can. No one in his right mind cares how you merge while traffic is flowing nicely, as long as you don't drive into them and you use your turn signal. The problems come in traffic, which is what I deal with every day; construction, on ramps, lanes ending, etc. > I've been driving in the D.C. area (Maryland and Virginia mostly, with some > in D.C.) since 1980. There are times, usually rush "hour", and places, > where it's stop and go on a regular basis, and I've driven in such times > and places a lot...the "zipper merge" is the way to go in those cases for > sure, and I try to drive that way in such situations, but those situations > are not the norm at all, even around here. They are limited to specific > times of day, or just while construction happens. Saying that normal > speeds are an "almost never" situation is hyperbole. On the contrary, > higher than legal speeds are common in most places, most of the time. > > >Traffic is almost always backed up well behind the end of the closing > >lane, and there is always some jackass trying to get in a mile before > >the lane ends, > > Getting over as soon as you can is the way to do it, but sitting and > blocking the ending lane while you wait for a hole is stupid. If you get a > hole, take it...that's one less vehicle to have to merge at the end, and > since there was a hole, you haven't slowed the through lane at all. Holes > happen when someone is slow starting up when the traffic moves ahead a few > car lengths. Most jackasses don't do this of course...they bypass multiple > opportunities to merge early without disruption so they can get in front of > all those other cars. Most of them probably got out of the through lane to > do that in the first place... > > >or some fuckwit "straddling" the lanes to prevent anyone > >from using the closing lane (This is when I love being on a bike). It > > This may not be optimal, but it is understandable. After watching dozens > of selfish fuckwits pull into the disappearing lane to zip past and add to > the merge problems up ahead, thus helping to create the problem, those > drivers are motivated to do anything to reduce the attractiveness of that > lane and convince them to stay where they were to start with. One poor > behavior results in the other. I have not said that it's OK to pull from the open lane into the lane that's closing for the purpose of cutting in line. That IS bullshit and those people should be killed. However, there is only a space in the closing lane into which your aforementioned fuckwits can pull because some other fuckwit has pulled the profoundly stupid and supremely annoying "early merge." MERGERS: STAY IN YOUR LANE UNTIL IT ENDS. OPEN LANERS: DO NOT LET ANYONE IN UNTIL YOU REACH THE PROPER MERGE POINT. The "Lane Sherriff Straddle" may be understandable but it is not proper, safe, or at all helpful. Those who do it should also be executed on the spot, their car firebombed and pushed to the side. > >is exactly this asinine insistence on early merging in this instance > >that leads to pissed off people and long delays. It's really quite > >simple: Wait until the FUCKING LANE ENDS TO MERGE! > > If you can't move over early without disrupting flow, sure...WHEN TRAFFIC > IS CRAWLING. You didn't limit your instructions to that situation > though...and doing what you suggest is dangerous, stupid, annoying and > demonstrates a lack of driving ability when done in other situations. I > see it all the time as some halfwit drives to the end of the merge with no > attempt to change early, despite there being plenty of opportunity, and > then comes over like they have right of way, causing vehicles already in > the through lane to brake heavily or swerve to avoid a collision. When > changing lanes you don't have right of way...and if there's a collision, > it's going to be your fault (according to a police officer who was taking > reports at an accident I witnessed once upon a time). Doesn't alter the > behavior of these "wait to the end" halfwits though. > Whatever. I will continue to do it correctly, and go around you if you pull the "early merge." I will use my lane until it ends, turn on my signal when I'm ready to merge, and come over when there is room. If someone wants to be a dick and not let me in, so be it. More drivers than not know how to handle a merge properly, and let those of us performing a proper merge at the end of a closing lane in without any hystrionics. RPM From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 14:42:29 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 14:42:22 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC Cycles Subject: Fwd: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Accidentally sent this to Mike only - reposting (this reply/reply to all stuff is kind of irritating - no other list I know of does this - ah well). On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 12:01:24 -0500, Mike B. wrote: > At 11:35 AM 2/8/05 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: > >Sounds incoherent I know but my reasoning is that I shut the bike off > >immediately then the engine continues to heat up and the fan will not > >kick in so the engine actually gets hotter than if I waited for the fan > >to kick in...this was my initial question Here's what I understand from my past three Yama's that either had some kind of temp guage or a fan that I could hear kicking on or off... Turning off the engine does indeed stop heat generation. However, a bike with a fairing will continue to SHOW a rise in heat because the air is no longer moving and the remaining heat builds up under the fairing. Also, the coolant stops flowing, but continue to "spread" the heat through the system via conduction (or is it convection, I get those two confused). Having the fan run AFTER the engine is off allows the radiator to cool a bit more, which in turn reduces the heat that is building up under the fairing. The fan also pushes the hot air out from under the fairing, reducing the heat build up even further. So, the ENGINE is cooling as soon as it's turned off (or at least within 20 seconds or so of cut-off), but the temp sensor is still increasing because the general heat under the fairing is not being exhausted. The fan reduces the general temperature of the engine compartment, thereby saving you a bit from cooking electrics and wires and such. Julian, I like your method of cutting the engine, but leaving the ignition on to run the fan. I didn't realize that's what you were initially doing (I thought you were running the engine until the fan went through a full cycle). I'll probably start doing the same on the FJR if I notice a heat buildup after cut-off. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 14:49:58 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 11:49:51 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- Wayne Edelen wrote: > On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Michael Jordan wrote: > > > Or Turn the engine off and then put it on the > stand - sequence is > > irrelevant - what it doesn't need is a cool down > run, unless it's > > turbocharged. Superchargers don't need the > cooldown, as they stop with > > the rngine. > > Somewhat true. The reason you want to run your > turbocharged engine after > driving is to let the oil drain out of the turbo, so > it doesn't cook in > there. That's the purpose of products like a turbo > timer, which allows > your motor to run after you remove the key. > And this is NOT true. The reason you keep a turbo vehicle running is not to let the oil drain but to keep the oil flowing through the turbo so the turbo and the bearings have time cool down (without boost). Of course if you use synthetic this is a non issue. Glenn __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 15:54:32 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:15:03 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Glenn Dysart wrote: > > Somewhat true. The reason you want to run your > > turbocharged engine after > > driving is to let the oil drain out of the turbo, so > > it doesn't cook in > > there. That's the purpose of products like a turbo > > timer, which allows > > your motor to run after you remove the key. > > And this is NOT true. The reason you keep a turbo > vehicle running is not to let the oil drain but to > keep the oil flowing through the turbo so the turbo > and the bearings have time cool down (without boost). > Of course if you use synthetic this is a non issue. Thanks for the clarification, Glenn. I love to be blown, but don't have any turbos in the stable ATM. I hope to remedy that with a trip to Cleveland with my Hayabusa. :-) -- Wayne 'how fast is too fast?' From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 16:05:25 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 16:05:11 -0500 To: rjmoran@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX At 07:15 PM 2/8/05 +0000, rjmoran@XXXXXX wrote: >> At 08:40 AM 2/8/05 -0500, Randy Moran wrote: >> >"Lane Ends - Merge Right" does not anywhere within its explicit or >> >implied text tell you or anyone else when to merge. >> >> Explicit I'll agree with. For anyone with any sense at all there is >> certainly an implied imperative there. Just for those few who are too >> dense to pick it up on their own, they generally mention something about it >> in driving school. > >"Now" or "quickly" is not in any way implied in the text of that sign. Your >own impatience and lack of driving skill cause you to infer something that >simply isn't there. You need to go back to reading school I think...and you might want to check into a logic class or two as well. Oh, and driver's ed while you are there. 1) As I pointed out, driver's ed usually explains that "merge" commands like that mean to merge over as soon as you can do so safely. Some of the state handbooks I've read in the past say the same thing. Those signs are warnings that the lane you are in is about to end. If you don't merge soon enough, you will be driving on the shoulder. If there's a shoulder. If you wait until the very end, and then find there's a vehicle next to you, you'll need that shoulder...or you'll stop, and have to merge over from a standing start...there's a safe practice! (NOT!). 2) You have no idea about my level of driving skill, so why are you basing your argument on that? Seems pretty weak to me. Just FYI though, I've been driving since 1973 or thereabouts, and I've had one really minor fender-bender in that time on 4 wheels, and one even more minor one on two. Both were based on assuming that other drivers would do something they didn't (not her fault in one case, was her fault in the other)...I don't make that mistake anymore. I've paid exactly one ticket for a moving violation in that time (speeding), and only been issued two (one was dismissed in court). If driving so that I don't hit things, even in bad weather (snow storms, hurricanes, floods, etc. included) and don't get written up by traffic cops means anything, I'd say my driving skills are just fine for the sort of driving I do (typical commuting and travel stuff). >Also, I missed the part in driving school where they said "Lane Ends - Merge >Right" means "get over well before the lane ends" or "get over before the >proper merge point." I'm pretty sure that's because they never said that. Go find a good school then. Or listen more closely. The "proper merge point" is "as soon as you can do so safely, but not later than where the lane ends...except in an emergency (and only if there's something there to drive on)". >> In no way does that article support your claim that waiting until the lane >> runs out to merge is the way to do it under all driving conditions. > >In fact the article says that in heavy traffic, which is what we generally >have around here, my method (the end of the lane zipper merge) is better. An if your reading skills were up to par, you'd have noted that I agreed with you about that part...look again and see if you can spot it. While you are at it, note that even you saw that that method was best only in creeping high density traffic. At other times the "early merge" is better...particularly with respect to safety. Since you claimed that late merge was always better (you made an absolute statement with no qualifications about traffic conditions), the article doesn't support your position at all well. >> Where are you driving? Where is "around here"? > >Route 66 in rush hour. Route 50 (in VA) during rush hour. If we're not talking >about rush hour or construction traffic, then what difference does it make how >you merge? We aren't talking about just rush hour...that's only part of the discussion, since people merge all the time, not just during rush hour. How they do it matters for safety reasons...as I pointed out in detail. That reading thing again? >I have not said that it's OK to pull from the open lane into the lane that's >losing for the purpose of cutting in line. That IS bullshit and those people >hould be killed. So we agree on something at least. >However, there is only a space in the closing lane into which your >aforementioned fuckwits can pull because some other fuckwit has pulled the >profoundly stupid and supremely annoying "early merge." Wrong. There are places, even at rush hour, where there is a mostly open lane merging into a full one. There is no need for anyone to merge early to create a space for a fuckwit to pull over into to jump the line. For instance, the inner loop between Rt 197 and the GW parkway. Really long on-ramp that is also the off ramp for GW parkway toward D.C.. Traffic on the through lanes is often backed up all the way across the bridge. Since there's an exit at the end, that most don't want to take, the lane stays pretty clear...except at the end where the late mergers are backing everything up trying to force their way in at the last possible place. People are constantly leaving the through lanes there, getting into the exit lane, then trying to jump back into the through lanes at the last meter...or even past it. They can't stay on the shoulder though, they have to merge...the underpass tends to get in the way. A similar thing happens at the next on-ramp from the GW parkway...the on-ramp lane extends across the bridge and becomes the exit ramp for the Cabin John Parkway. >MERGERS: STAY IN YOUR LANE UNTIL IT ENDS. OPEN LANERS: DO NOT LET ANYONE IN >UNTIL YOU REACH THE PROPER MERGE POINT. If traffic is inching along, and it's a closed-end merge, fine....though how you are going to prevent someone coming over without failing to avoid a collision I'm not quite sure. Yes, intimidation with a large and beat up vehicle works pretty well, but if it doesn't, or you aren't driving such a vehicle, are you going to ram them or something? Or let them ram you when you could avoid it? Both are illegal, so I wouldn't recommend either. >Whatever. I will continue to do it correctly, and go around you if you pull >the "early merge." You mean you will be one of the selfish fuckwits that pulls out of the travel lane into the merging lane?!? And you call that "correctly"??? You really do need to go back to school...maybe a judge will send you there sometime soon. We can only hope. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 16:09:38 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:29:53 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Mike B. wrote: > You need to go back to reading school I think...and you might want to check > into a logic class or two as well. Oh, and driver's ed while you are there. Quoting... "Why don't you try to discuss things without the personal attacks? Are you unable to do that?" BTW, WTF is 'reading school'? :-) -- Wayne - http://www.blueblackbusa.org/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 16:14:03 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:13:52 EST Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/8/2005 8:41:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, rjmoran@XXXXXX writes: > Then, everyone knows > that they're not getting screwed, and we can all take our turn and use > all of the fucking asphalt that has been provided. > The number of vehicles that can travel on a road is limited by the _minimum_ number of lanes available. A 20 lane road that merges into 2 lanes can handle the maximum traffic of 2 lanes, period. The rest is wasted parking space. If no one used the wasted lanes at all then traffic would flow faster and be safer. The only time "extra" lanes have any use is to serve as a sort of capacitor, storing extra traffic flow in situation were traffic has a regular rhythm. An example would be a traffic light that dumps lots of traffic onto a ramp when green but then shuts it off when red. In this case extra lanes would allow more traffic to flow through the green light while "metering" it onto the main road. "Extra" lanes around here just allow the Butt F*%ks to push their way in front of others. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 16:26:01 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:25:48 EST Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/8/2005 9:05:00 AM Eastern Standard Time, julian@XXXXXX writes: > if I > just tuen the bike off, the temperature will shoot up to some unknown > height and if I understand correctly, overheating is a bad idea..so I > stand there with the lights on and wait for the fan to kick in at 210. > five minutes later the bike cools down to a temperature that does not > engage the fan. This is when I turn the bike off. Interesting idea, but flawed. The _bike_ does not gain heat after it is shut off (where would the heat come from?) What happens is that the hear remaining in the engine block where thing are very hot, has time to heat the coolant in the area where the fan switch is. _The engine itself _is_ cooling_ All you are doing in leaving the key on is running your battery down, and cooling fluid. There is _no_ benefit to the engine. (If there was then the manufacturers would simply leave the fan circuit (electrically) hot all the time. Kawasaki in fact does just that but no one else seems to think it necessary. (And I do not like the fact that Kawasaki does it, it can and does sometimes cause problems itself.) John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC 1999, Honda ST1100X Pan European 1983, BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles 1976, Honda CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 16:30:11 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:29:57 EST Subject: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/8/2005 9:05:41 AM Eastern Standard Time, daniel.dc@XXXXXX writes: > to get back on topic.. I wonder what motorcycles will be like then.. > I guess they won't be called motorcycles any more.. At the rate things are going they will be called illegal. BTW In a _very_ real sense a cell phone with a hands free is nothing less then prosthetic telepathy. The future is here. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 16:33:07 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 16:32:34 -0500 To: Wayne Edelen , From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Request for Input (Long bitch session) At 04:29 PM 2/8/05 -0500, Wayne Edelen wrote: >On Tue, 8 Feb 2005, Mike B. wrote: > >> You need to go back to reading school I think...and you might want to check >> into a logic class or two as well. Oh, and driver's ed while you are there. > >Quoting... > >"Why don't you try to discuss things without the personal attacks? Are >you unable to do that?" Yep, touche. How about if I quote something else for this situation then? "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." ...which has as it's corollary if you give them credit and assume the other person follows the Golden Rule too: "Treat others the way they are treating you." >BTW, WTF is 'reading school'? > >:-) Apparently something that doesn't exist anymore, if the Internet is a valid source of data. Used to be the classes that taught how to read for understanding, not just how to mouth the words on the page (screen) or selectively pull out just the bits that support your preconceptions and desires and ignore the rest. So, how fast will your bike be when you get the turbocharger on it? What other mods are needed to do that sort of thing? Remapping EFI seems obvious, but what else? Larger oil capacity? Changes in coolant? Changes in fairing to redirect air flow? Asbestos leggings? ;-) -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 16:45:32 2005 From: Daniel To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes) Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 16:45:20 -0500 prosthetic telepathy... pretty cool idea On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 16:29:57 EST, PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: >In a message dated 2/8/2005 9:05:41 AM Eastern Standard Time, >daniel.dc@XXXXXX writes: > >> to get back on topic.. I wonder what motorcycles will be like then.. >> I guess they won't be called motorcycles any more.. > >At the rate things are going they will be called illegal. > >BTW In a _very_ real sense a cell phone with a hands free is nothing less >then prosthetic telepathy. The future is here. > > >John. >PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 17:16:53 2005 From: Daniel To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: overheating bike Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 17:16:37 -0500 Let's make this simple.. check your coolant level. If it's fine. Good. If low add. THe manufacturers knew what they were doing when they designed your bike. It's designed to be ridden and turned off. If your fan is kicking on at 220 degrees and cooling your bike off, it's working properly and not over heating. I think mine comes on at 220 or 230. You can let your bike idle at 230... the fan will come on, the bike temp will be lower.. the fan will cut off... the bike will go back up. repeat as necc. Tha'ts how the bike is supposed to work, and that is fine. The fan is just a suplimentary air flow system for when your bike isnt' moving. You can turn your bike off at those temperatures without a problem. If you have a mechanical water pump and not an electric water pump, then having your key on/ engine off is just wasting your time and battery power, as you're cooling the radiator but the water/coolant isnt' circulating. If you want to be really conscientious Turn your bike off when your close enough to coast home... you'll save gas, pollution and get free air flow... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 18:27:00 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 15:26:52 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: noise canceling (sp?) headphones To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX after years of bombarding my eardrums, i am considering the etymotic 4P headphones. does anyone have any experience with these? if so, do they fit comfortably in your helmet without modifications to the inner shell? are they worth the bump in price from the etymotic 6? thanks in advance for any feedback. ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 18:31:23 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 15:31:16 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes) To: "Mike B." , DC-Cycles --- "Mike B." wrote: > At 05:01 AM 2/8/05 -0800, Brian Ray wrote: > >Mike B spouted: > > > >> Looking in the direction of travel means looking > >> directly into the sun. > >> This is poor road design. It can be corrected to > >> some extent with proper > >> timing though. > > > > > >Consider that the sun does not rise and set in the > >same place each day. In fact, I think it varies as > >much as 25* between summer & winter solstace. Having > >a road that did not go directly into the sun at some > >time of the year would mean that no roads could go in > >a direction from east to east/southeast, or west to > >west/southwest. > > You apparently missed all the earlier comments, or you > just have a really > short memory, or considering all that was said would > prevent you from > feeling superior or something. Or are you a road > designer responsible for > a road that has this problem and so you see this as a > personal attack? if you just admitted that you shouldn't have hit the "send" button, you would have come out looking better. but that's not your nature, is it? ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - now with 250MB free storage. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 20:53:31 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 20:13:43 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Cell phones vs. passengers. (was: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes)) At 04:29 PM 2/8/05 EST, PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: >BTW In a _very_ real sense a cell phone with a hands free is nothing less >then prosthetic telepathy. The future is here. There's a lot of ire at cell phone yakkers these days, but nobody seems to have a problem with drivers talking with passengers. With hands-free for the cell phone the only interference with driving is the distraction of a conversation...and this is present when chatting with a passenger too. Why no ire at drivers chatting with passengers? Other than the fact that there's, maybe, an extra pair of eyes watching for problems, it seems identical to the cell phone situation to me...unless the driver does the Emily Post thing and insists on looking at the person they are speaking to, in which case the cell phone might be safer. If not, why not? Anybody noticed the same pattern of cages with passengers being hazards that many claim with cell-phone users? Just curious. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 22:05:11 2005 Date: Tue, 8 Feb 2005 19:04:51 -0800 (PST) From: Corbett B Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman? Really? To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Holy Cow Julian! Why are you bothering all these nice folks for their sage advice? I think all that riding on your new R6 must have injured your "PIMP HAND." (please note motorcycle content) OR ..if you can't handle the smackdown, I guess you're just going to have to COMMUNICATE your feelings on this issue (There's no GOOD WAY to do this, SEE NIKE ads), ASSESS the situation and determine if can be resolved or is terminal, and COMPROMISE if the lady is worth the trouble.. THEN....after all the talking is done... ..show her your Pimp Hand, the door,...and go date her girlfriends...better yet, offer them all rides on the scooter. -Corbett (No actual persons were injured during the provision of this advice. Similarities to situations or persons either living or dead is purely coincidental. Women who ride bikes of their own, rock.) --- Julian Halton wrote: > > So you have been single for a long while and apart > from the occasional > bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and > nonsense like that > are very happy about it...then you happen to meet > someone you find > interesting and start spending time with them. Next > thing you know the > occasional gripe; barb or attempt to make you feel > guilty about riding > your bike worms into your conversations. For those > experienced ( > married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the > best way of letting > someone know the following: > A) it is your bike > B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it > C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular > playing hours like > a weekly cricket match > D) Don't talk about the bike and don't ever say "I > think you should go > and ride your bike now" which really means that you > are some kind of > de-prioritized and backwards unfeeling SOB if you > actually get on your > bike and ride. > > > > Obviously, one solution is to just "keep on movin" > but recent events > make me wonder what would ever happen if I found > myself in some sort of > thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with > this issue. > > A sincere thank you to any repliers.... > > > > > > ===== -Corbett '99 BMW K1200RS '04 KTM 625 SMC Supermoto '82 Honda XL250R AMA Member BMW Motorcycle Owners Association Member __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 8 23:40:52 2005 Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 23:46:47 -0500 Subject: Towing wanted To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "garcia oliver" Hi)B…I occasionally get calls from people looking for moto towing. Any of you interested in having your phone number given to such callers? You make your own $ arrangements with them, I just pass on the phone number. If you want to be on this year)B’s list, send me your name, contact info, times/days it)B’s ok to call you, when and where you will/won’t tow, and whether you use a trailer or load onto a truck. If you have a per mile or per hour fee, please include that. Thanks. --garcia "A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always count on the support of Paul." From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 07:16:27 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 04:16:19 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I've a couple videos of turbo busa's and they are extremely fast, and that's putting it mildly. One up against a heavily modded Toyota Supra pushing like 700 hp. The busa just leaves it in the dust and this was while rolling, not from a stop. Anyone that wants a copy of these hit me up off list. Glenn --- Wayne Edelen wrote: > > Thanks for the clarification, Glenn. I love to be > blown, but don't have > any turbos in the stable ATM. I hope to remedy that > with a trip to > Cleveland with my Hayabusa. > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 08:29:44 2005 Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman? Really? Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:29:41 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "Corbett B" , Rest assured Corbett I have been busy keeping my promise of riding every single day. Recent events made me wonder what it would be like if I ever faced that whole settling down, kids type of thing so I thought I would ask my favorite advisory panel and I got some great responses. Riding, going to the gym, great reads and my Sunday crossword are non negotiable items. -----Original Message----- From: Corbett B [mailto:corbettk1200rs@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman? Really? Holy Cow Julian! Why are you bothering all these nice folks for their sage advice? I think all that riding on your new R6 must have injured your "PIMP HAND." (please note motorcycle content) OR ..if you can't handle the smackdown, I guess you're just going to have to COMMUNICATE your feelings on this issue (There's no GOOD WAY to do this, SEE NIKE ads), ASSESS the situation and determine if can be resolved or is terminal, and COMPROMISE if the lady is worth the trouble.. THEN....after all the talking is done... ..show her your Pimp Hand, the door,...and go date her girlfriends...better yet, offer them all rides on the scooter. -Corbett (No actual persons were injured during the provision of this advice. Similarities to situations or persons either living or dead is purely coincidental. Women who ride bikes of their own, rock.) --- Julian Halton wrote: > > So you have been single for a long while and apart from the occasional > bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and nonsense like > that are very happy about it...then you happen to meet someone you > find interesting and start spending time with them. Next thing you > know the occasional gripe; barb or attempt to make you feel guilty > about riding your bike worms into your conversations. For those > experienced ( married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the best > way of letting someone know the following: > A) it is your bike > B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it > C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular playing hours > like a weekly cricket match > D) Don't talk about the bike and don't ever say "I think you should go > and ride your bike now" which really means that you are some kind of > de-prioritized and backwards unfeeling SOB if you actually get on your > bike and ride. > > > > Obviously, one solution is to just "keep on movin" > but recent events > make me wonder what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort > of thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. > > A sincere thank you to any repliers.... > > > > > > ===== -Corbett '99 BMW K1200RS '04 KTM 625 SMC Supermoto '82 Honda XL250R AMA Member BMW Motorcycle Owners Association Member __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 08:36:43 2005 Subject: Yet more advice (please) pertainig to other matters Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:36:40 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: While I was riding my new R6 at lunch Monday (moto content). My mother was involved in a car accident. A car crossed four empty lanes on the 270 and slammed into my mom's car. The air bag deployed and she had her seatbelt on . She said the only choice she had was to swerve into the side of the road where there was a barrier. Cops, fire, ambulance showed up. Ambulance left. Mom sat in tow truck. Ambulance was called back. After a 3 hour wait in Shady Grove ( that place ...sux) my mom got pissed and went home. Saw her, insisted ER room, she balked. Finally got her to ER: two broked ribs, chipped knee, various contusions and a concussion. Maryland cop gave little information except for phone number to station. My mother does not recall a ticket being issued to the other party I have advised her to seek legal counsel in this matter just like I might if I had been on my moto. Anyone recommend someone good at this? From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 08:43:04 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 09:03:29 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman On Wed, 9 Feb 2005, Glenn Dysart wrote: > I've a couple videos of turbo busa's and they are > extremely fast, and that's putting it mildly. One up > against a heavily modded Toyota Supra pushing like 700 > hp. The busa just leaves it in the dust and this was > while rolling, not from a stop. Anyone that wants a > copy of these hit me up off list. > > Glenn The latest round of car vs. bike racing was a 1300hp Supra with a TH400 vs. a full Carbon 'Busa w/around 240rwhp. They were dead even up to the car's gearing limit of 160mph. A TH400 is a 3spd auto tranny with a 1:1 3rd gear. The guy that runs the Suzukihayabusa.org message board has a shop in Ohio. He's turned out some 550+rwhp bikes. Pretty insane stuff. -- Wayne From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 08:45:38 2005 Subject: RE: Of bikes and a woman? Really? Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:45:36 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "Corbett B" , Corbett, You need to ride up to Canada with me...if the BMW or KTM can take it... In Quebec you will see so many women in bikes you will not believe it..the majority are cruiser types. If only the winter wasn't so bitter and long. -----Original Message----- From: Corbett B [mailto:corbettk1200rs@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Of bikes and a woman? Really? Holy Cow Julian! Why are you bothering all these nice folks for their sage advice? I think all that riding on your new R6 must have injured your "PIMP HAND." (please note motorcycle content) OR ..if you can't handle the smackdown, I guess you're just going to have to COMMUNICATE your feelings on this issue (There's no GOOD WAY to do this, SEE NIKE ads), ASSESS the situation and determine if can be resolved or is terminal, and COMPROMISE if the lady is worth the trouble.. THEN....after all the talking is done... ..show her your Pimp Hand, the door,...and go date her girlfriends...better yet, offer them all rides on the scooter. -Corbett (No actual persons were injured during the provision of this advice. Similarities to situations or persons either living or dead is purely coincidental. Women who ride bikes of their own, rock.) --- Julian Halton wrote: > > So you have been single for a long while and apart from the occasional > bout of wish I had someone to go get coffee with and nonsense like > that are very happy about it...then you happen to meet someone you > find interesting and start spending time with them. Next thing you > know the occasional gripe; barb or attempt to make you feel guilty > about riding your bike worms into your conversations. For those > experienced ( married, LTR type ) folks out there....what is the best > way of letting someone know the following: > A) it is your bike > B) you ride it when you FEEL and WANT to ride it > C) Bike riding is not a scheduled event with regular playing hours > like a weekly cricket match > D) Don't talk about the bike and don't ever say "I think you should go > and ride your bike now" which really means that you are some kind of > de-prioritized and backwards unfeeling SOB if you actually get on your > bike and ride. > > > > Obviously, one solution is to just "keep on movin" > but recent events > make me wonder what would ever happen if I found myself in some sort > of thing with some sort of girl and I had to deal with this issue. > > A sincere thank you to any repliers.... > > > > > > ===== -Corbett '99 BMW K1200RS '04 KTM 625 SMC Supermoto '82 Honda XL250R AMA Member BMW Motorcycle Owners Association Member __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 08:56:23 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 08:56:20 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: Yet more advice (please) pertainig to other matters To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX J, I'm glad you mom is ok. Find out if the errant driver has been charged and if a report has been filed. If the driver gets away without being 'charged' it's going to be much more difficult to get insurance to cover anything. Not sure about MD - NMA has traffic lawyer referrals though - www.motorists.org . you might want to check there... Gimer might be able to chime in here... Maryland cop gave little information except for >phone number to station. My mother does not recall a ticket being >issued to the other party > >I have advised her to seek legal counsel in this matter just like I >might if I had been on my moto. Anyone recommend someone good at this? > > > Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 09:37:13 2005 From: "Jon Strang" To: Subject: Re: Cell phones vs. passengers. (was: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes)) Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 09:37:10 -0500 Cellphones, whether hands-free or not, impair the driver worse than DUI. "Comparison of the Cell Phone Driver and the Drunk Driver", Strayer, Drews and Crouch (AEI - Brookings Institute) available at http://ssrn.com/abstract=570222. Other studies have shown that talking to a passenger impairs the driver very little. Theories include that the passenger subconsciously cues off of the driver and surroundings, halting conversation at appropriate times. I don't recall if the study ref. above addresses that issue. --jon ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike B." To: Subject: Cell phones vs. passengers. (was: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes)) > At 04:29 PM 2/8/05 EST, PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: > >>BTW In a _very_ real sense a cell phone with a hands free is nothing less >>then prosthetic telepathy. The future is here. > > There's a lot of ire at cell phone yakkers these days, but nobody seems to > have a problem with drivers talking with passengers. With hands-free for > the cell phone the only interference with driving is the distraction of a > conversation...and this is present when chatting with a passenger too. > Why > no ire at drivers chatting with passengers? Other than the fact that > there's, maybe, an extra pair of eyes watching for problems, it seems > identical to the cell phone situation to me...unless the driver does the > Emily Post thing and insists on looking at the person they are speaking > to, > in which case the cell phone might be safer. If not, why not? > > Anybody noticed the same pattern of cages with passengers being hazards > that many claim with cell-phone users? Just curious. > > > > > > -- > -- Mike B. > > '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley > folks) > > Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's > mistakes > is better. > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 09:42:36 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 06:42:29 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: Yet more advice (please) pertainig to other matters To: Julian Halton , dc-cycles@XXXXXX kevin goldberg 301 589-2999 x102 if she calls, have her mention my name --- Julian Halton wrote: > > > While I was riding my new R6 at lunch Monday (moto > content). My mother > was involved in a car accident. A car crossed four empty > lanes on the > 270 and slammed into my mom's car. The air bag deployed > and she had her > seatbelt on . She said the only choice she had was to > swerve into the > side of the road where there was a barrier. Cops, fire, > ambulance > showed up. Ambulance left. Mom sat in tow truck. > Ambulance was called > back. After a 3 hour wait in Shady Grove ( that place > ...sux) my mom > got pissed and went home. Saw her, insisted ER room, she > balked. > Finally got her to ER: two broked ribs, chipped knee, > various contusions > and a concussion. Maryland cop gave little information > except for > phone number to station. My mother does not recall a > ticket being > issued to the other party > > I have advised her to seek legal counsel in this matter > just like I > might if I had been on my moto. Anyone recommend someone > good at this? > > > > ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 10:00:58 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 10:00:47 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: DC-Cycles Subject: WaPo: Shut up and drive What Call Is Worth a Life? It's time to admit that hands-free is not a solution. It's time to ban phone driving. By Dan Carney Wednesday, February 9, 2005; Page A23 Phone driving is the drunken driving of the new millennium. Seemingly everyone does it, and all of them seem to believe that they are skilled in a way that prevents their powers of perception from being clouded by the fog of isolation that envelops drivers who talk on the phone. Everyone who isn't on the phone while driving sees evidence of it every day, as drivers weave and stutter drunkenly through traffic while negotiating peace in the Middle East over the phone, or their kid's allowance, or some other question that, while too important to wait, doesn't merit pulling over to the side and parking for a few minutes to make the call. Those who are on the phone not only don't see others weaving in their lanes, they don't realize that they themselves are doing it. Whole thing here: From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 10:01:02 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 10:00:51 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Cell phones vs. passengers. (was: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes)) > Other studies have shown that talking to a passenger impairs the driver very > little. Theories include that the passenger subconsciously cues off of the > driver and surroundings, halting conversation at appropriate times. I > don't recall if the study ref. above addresses that issue. I read an article in Mobile PC magazine (of all places) that referenced the same kind of study. Basically a passenger is aware of the environment and "tips off" the driver to things around them, whether they know they are doing it or not. While some studies have shown that a driver and passenger having a heated discussion about something are not quite as competant as a single driver paying attention, they are generally significantly less of a danger than a cell phoner. In a totally non-scientific study, I've rarely noticed a problem caused by a passenger-driver conversation or actions, unless it was an entire car full of people. Generally, if I am near a car full of teens, I endeavor to change my location as quickly as possible. :S --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 10:37:53 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 10:38:11 -0500 To: DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Cell phones vs. passengers. (was: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes)) At 09:37 AM 2/9/05 -0500, Jon Strang wrote: >Cellphones, whether hands-free or not, impair the driver worse than DUI. I heard of another that says that a teen or 20-something on a cell phone drives about as well as the average 74 year old (accident rates I believe was the item used to make the claim). >Other studies have shown that talking to a passenger impairs the driver very >little. Theories include that the passenger subconsciously cues off of the >driver and surroundings, halting conversation at appropriate times. That would make sense. Thanks! -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 11:27:41 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 11:27:22 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Cc: DC-Cycles No hablo Pablo whimsically asked: >What Call Is Worth a Life? >It's time to admit that hands-free is not a solution. It's >time to ban phone driving. [Dave] Done for my part. I won't accept any work related calls in transit, period. I put it to my boss this way - is any customer going to die if I don't pick up the phone to answer their computer question? ok then. The wife and most close friends know I won't even reach for the damn phone if it rings while I'm piloting a 4-5k pound weapon. If I'm a passenger... ok, for short periods. I think cell yakking in general is rude, personally. particularly in restaurants while you're eating, or other venues where one reasonably should expect people to behave well... > >By Dan Carney >Wednesday, February 9, 2005; Page A23 > >Phone driving is the drunken driving of the new millennium. >Seemingly everyone does it, and all of them seem to believe >that they are skilled in a way that prevents their powers of >perception from being clouded by the fog of isolation that >envelops drivers who talk on the phone. Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 11:53:39 2005 From: rjmoran@XXXXXX To: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 16:53:27 +0000 X-Authenticated-Sender: cmptb3JhbkBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA== I use my cell phone (not hands free) in the car all the time. I don't weave, I don't slow down, I don't tailgate, make sudden stops or lane changes, or forget to use my signals. RPM From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 12:10:31 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 12:10:28 -0500 To: DC-Cycles From: Troutman Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive The point of the article is that you wouldn't know if you were a bad distracted driver. My company's owner says the same thing, and he is the worst driver I know. Our collective fear is that we will all lose our jobs when he kills someone and gets sued into bankruptcy. So I email him articles like this one anonymously in the hope that he will quit it. It isn't just cell phones, he has a laptop mount in the SUV and a CDPD modem card. He reads his email while driving. I won't ride with him anymore. At 11:53 AM 2/9/2005, rjmoran@XXXXXX wrote: >I use my cell phone (not hands free) in the car all the time. I don't >weave, I don't slow down, I don't tailgate, make sudden stops or lane >changes, or forget to use my signals. > >RPM ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr 1997 Honda VFR 750 AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 12:15:14 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 12:08:25 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive >I use my cell phone (not hands free) in the car all the time. >I don't weave, I don't slow down, I don't tailgate, make >sudden stops or lane changes, or forget to use my signals. When I'm on the bike and see your exemplary use of a cell phone while driving, I'll still think you're an ass who needs to hang up and drive and I'll do my best to get as far away from you as possible before you forget your incredible driving and talking abilities and try to kill me. I'm sorry that the 90% of the other cell phone using idiots are giving you a bad reputation. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 12:31:24 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 12:31:11 EST Subject: Re: Cell phones vs. passengers. (was: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes)) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/8/2005 8:53:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, omni@XXXXXX writes: > ...unless the driver does the > Emily Post thing and insists on looking at the person they are speaking to, Knew a guy who did that. And he had no right eye... > Other than the fact that > there's, maybe, an extra pair of eyes watching for problems, it seems > identical to the cell phone situation to me That seems reasonable but I find that even with a hands free the cell takes more focus away from driving. Do not know why, just know that is the way it is for me. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 12:40:48 2005 From: rjmoran@XXXXXX To: Troutman , DC-Cycles Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 17:40:27 +0000 X-Authenticated-Sender: cmptb3JhbkBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA== Mike T. writes: > The point of the article is that you wouldn't know if you were a bad > distracted driver. > > My company's owner says the same thing, and he is the worst driver I > know. Our collective fear is that we will all lose our jobs when he kills > someone and gets sued into bankruptcy. So I email him articles like this > one anonymously in the hope that he will quit it. It isn't just cell > phones, he has a laptop mount in the SUV and a CDPD modem card. He reads > his email while driving. I won't ride with him anymore. Yeah, I get the point of the column, I just don't think it's true in my case. I think I would know if I was distracted. I'd notice things like my car weaving or not maintaining constant speed, etc. I'd like to participate in one of the studies, though. RPM From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 12:48:58 2005 From: "LindaT." To: "Dc-Cycles" Subject: RE: WaPo: Shut up and drive Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 12:46:39 -0500 But isn't that the definition of 'being distracted'?? LindaT. www.CustomTankBags.com Hollywood, FL IBA,BMWBMW,AMA '99 R1100RT Mr Buzzy '95 F3 Purple Haze '00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing rjmoran@XXXXXX said: Yeah, I get the point of the column, I just don't think it's true in my case. I think I would know if I was distracted. I'd notice things like my car weaving or not maintaining constant speed, etc. I'd like to participate in one of the studies, though. RPM From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 12:54:59 2005 From: rjmoran@XXXXXX To: smthngelse@XXXXXX Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 17:54:49 +0000 X-Authenticated-Sender: cmptb3JhbkBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA== > >I use my cell phone (not hands free) in the car all the time. > >I don't weave, I don't slow down, I don't tailgate, make > >sudden stops or lane changes, or forget to use my signals. > > When I'm on the bike and see your exemplary use of a cell phone while > driving, I'll still think you're an ass who needs to hang up and drive > and I'll do my best to get as far away from you as possible before you > forget your incredible driving and talking abilities and try to kill > me. I'm sorry that the 90% of the other cell phone using idiots are > giving you a bad reputation. > > --smthng > http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng Thanks, I *do* have both incredible driving and talking abilities, and I'll do my best not to "forget them and try to kill" you. Or something. Even though you callled me an ass. Is your GPS distracting to you while driving? RPM From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 12:56:41 2005 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Content-ID: <12643.1107971800.1@XXXXXX> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 12:56:40 -0500 From: harry@XXXXXX >... I just don't think it's true in my case. Well, there's no point is us disputing each other superpowers, we each have them (mine is the ability to get cash from a drive-thru ATM in less time than normal human capabilities allow). But I will note that when a car driver drives over a motorcyclist, the first words out of their mouth are always "I didn't see him!" The problem, of course, is that you don't notice what you don't notice. -harry From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 13:00:38 2005 From: rjmoran@XXXXXX To: "LindaT." , "Dc-Cycles" Subject: RE: WaPo: Shut up and drive Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 18:00:30 +0000 X-Authenticated-Sender: cmptb3JhbkBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldA== I figure I'd notice something, Linda. I mean I don't think I go into an oblivious stupor from the second I connect to whomever I'm calling to the second I hang up (or, really, at any time during the call). Randy Linda T asked: > But isn't that the definition of 'being distracted'?? > > LindaT. > www.CustomTankBags.com > Hollywood, FL > IBA,BMWBMW,AMA > '99 R1100RT Mr Buzzy > '95 F3 Purple Haze > '00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing > > rjmoran@XXXXXX said: > Yeah, I get the point of the column, I just don't think it's true in my > case. I think I would know if I was distracted. I'd notice things like my > car weaving or not maintaining constant speed, etc. I'd like to participate > in one of the studies, though. > > RPM > But isn't that the definition of 'being distracted'?? > > LindaT. > www.CustomTankBags.com > Hollywood, FL > IBA,BMWBMW,AMA > '99 R1100RT Mr Buzzy > '95 F3 Purple Haze > '00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing > > rjmoran@XXXXXX said: > Yeah, I get the point of the column, I just don't think it's true in my > case. I think I would know if I was distracted. I'd notice things like my > car weaving or not maintaining constant speed, etc. I'd like to participate > in one of the studies, though. > > RPM > > > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 13:17:45 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 10:17:22 -0800 (PST) From: "James O'Connor" Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive To: DC-Cycles I, to the point of sounding big headed, consider myself a very skilled driver. I've considered all sorts of "driving" careers. It is a passion of mine. With this said, I notice a distinct difference in my driving alertness/awareness when talking on the cell phone. I still feel I pay......better?......attention to the road and my surroundings than half the other nitwits out there, who aren't on their phones. But regardless, I find myself thinking more intently about things other than driving when on the cell. This has resulted in driving behavior that I scoff others for. I have stopped holding conversations on my cell while driving. If it rings, I'll pick it up, but I won't hold a conversation. Still bad, yes....but, it is a step. I have a hard time believing anyone can talk on their cell and still maintain the level of alertness/awareness while driving that they'd have if they weren't on the cell. Hands-free is a good stop-gap between no phone and no restriction, but I also believe hands-free to be distracting. FWIW - I find having a passenger to be of no effect to my driving, other than a potential instigator. When on the bike - as I scan for indicators such as: hand on turn signal driver head turning vehicle land position slowing/speeding up of vehicle etc........all indicators that I may have to react quickly, I also look for cell phone use and will avoid riding near someone on their phone. Riding 267 during the commuting hours gives plenty of opportunity to scan for indicators :( . This turned into a longer post than I meant. - Jimmy __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - now with 250MB free storage. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 13:23:11 2005 From: "Anne S" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 13:22:11 -0500 I think cell phones are a sign that the end of civilization is near. People talking into little metal boxes and totally ignoring others around them... Beeps interrupting lectures, movies, meetings... Boss able to track you down any place, any time... But seriously, they are damned dangerous on the road. I just wonder how much more dangerous they are than listening to the radio. I listen to books on tape. Sometimes I'm so engrossed that I don't even know how I got home. I'm not a very good driver anyhow (I used to be - DC has done this to me, I swear!) so I have to wonder. I got a ticket just a few weeks ago all because of a Gretchen Wilson song. But I digress. DC is right to ban use of cellphones on the road. Do motorcyclists listen to the radio? I guess it would be hard to do a book on tape while on a bike. You'd have to turn it up pretty loud and changing tapes would be an acrobatic feat. Anne From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 13:25:58 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:19:10 -0500 From: smthng else To: "rjmoran@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > Thanks, I *do* have both incredible driving and talking abilities, and I'll do my best not to "forget them and try to kill" you. Or something. Even though you callled me an ass. Nothing personal. I just think it's safer for me to consider all cell phone drivers as a threat. When all of them drive as well as you claim to, I'll change my opinion. The only drivers I consider to be a higher threat to me are drunks and taxi cabs. > Is your GPS distracting to you while driving? Nope. It gets less attention than my side mirrors. I only eff with it when stopped if I'm lost. Otherwise, it's just nice to know it's there if I need it. Much like a cell phone... but I pull over to use either one. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 13:26:51 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:26:41 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 18:00:30 +0000, rjmoran@XXXXXX wrote: > I figure I'd notice something, Linda. I mean I don't think I go into an oblivious stupor from the second I connect to whomever I'm calling to the second I hang up (or, really, at any time during the call). > > Randy > > Linda T asked: > > > But isn't that the definition of 'being distracted'?? > > On the other hand, have you ever noticed (putting on my best crotchety old fart Andy Rooney voice) that you can tell when the person you're conversing with is in the car, driving? It's blazingly obvious they're not totally focused on the conversation, and consequently, probably not focused on the road either. Lots of "huhs" and repetition. If it's more than a "I'm be home at 8" I'll ask the person (90% of the time it's the wife) to call back while parked. Perhaps there are people who can handle it, but I know I'm not one of them. On those rare occasions I'm driving a cage, I leave the phone on, but I never answer it on the fly. At the next stop light, I'll glance at the display and see who called. If there's an inkling that it's important, I'll pull over and return the call. It helps that the wife knows I'm unreachable on the bike, until I get to my destination, or a gas stop. Those are the grounds: she has no expectations of reaching me on the fly. We made it through the first 5,000 years or so of recording human history being out of touch for long periods. I figure a few more decades is just fine. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 13:46:24 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 10:46:21 -0800 (PST) From: Joe Sanjour Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Not if you use an Ipod or some other MP3 player... Joe --- Anne S wrote: > I guess it > would be hard to do a book > on tape while on a bike. You'd have to turn it up > pretty loud and changing > tapes would be an acrobatic feat. > > Anne > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 13:53:23 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 13:53:06 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive To: DC-Cycles PW: >We made it through the first 5,000 years or so of recording >human history being out of touch for long periods. I figure >a few more decades is just fine. [Dave] Can I get an AMEN Brother?! There is precious little private time anymore... time when I can enjoy the hum... or scream... of a good motor, some decent tunes... and not be bugged by some computer idiot, relative, or friend calling me with pearls of wisdome such as "DUDE!? "'SUP?!" and "HEY WADDAYADOIN?" After all, it's not like these are precious free cell minutes, lost and gone forever, that I can never recover... Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 14:04:32 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:04:23 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Anne of you'd better love my goat fame posted: >I think cell phones are a sign that the end of civilization >is near. [Dave] Didn't Jordan post 'the end is nigh' a short while back? Sh!t, I'd better get that gas tank repaired lickety split so I can get some riding in before said apocolypse... > People talking into little metal boxes and totally >ignoring others around them... > I'm not a very good driver anyhow (I used to be >- DC has done this to me, I swear!) so I have to wonder. I >got a ticket just a few weeks ago all because of a Gretchen >Wilson song. But I digress. [Dave] :-) EGADS woman! The Chirac loving, wine sipping, cheese eating contingent will SCOFF at you! ;-) I've periodically lost my perception of speed to some classic Stevie Ray Vaughn... among others.... >Do motorcyclists listen to the radio? I guess it would be >hard to do a book on tape while on a bike. You'd have to >turn it up pretty loud and changing tapes would be an >acrobatic feat. [Dave] I had speakers in the helmet a few seasons back... I kind of prefer the muffled hum of the motor unless I'm superslabbing somewhere... Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 14:24:45 2005 From: To: Subject: Re: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:24:36 -0500 > > From: Wayne Edelen > Date: 2005/02/09 Wed AM 09:03:29 EST > To: > Subject: Re: New bike was : RE: Of bikes and a woman > > On Wed, 9 Feb 2005, Glenn Dysart wrote: > > > I've a couple videos of turbo busa's and they are > > extremely fast, and that's putting it mildly. One up > > against a heavily modded Toyota Supra pushing like 700 > > hp. The busa just leaves it in the dust and this was > > while rolling, not from a stop. Anyone that wants a > > copy of these hit me up off list. > > > > Glenn > > The latest round of car vs. bike racing was a 1300hp Supra with a TH400 > vs. a full Carbon 'Busa w/around 240rwhp. They were dead even up to the > car's gearing limit of 160mph. A TH400 is a 3spd auto tranny with a 1:1 > 3rd gear. > > The guy that runs the Suzukihayabusa.org message board has a shop in Ohio. > He's turned out some 550+rwhp bikes. Pretty insane stuff. > > -- Wayne > > what's insane is a 1300hp Supra. -aki From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 14:26:03 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 14:26:30 -0500 To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Cell phones vs. passengers. (was: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes)) At 12:31 PM 2/9/05 EST, PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: >In a message dated 2/8/2005 8:53:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, >omni@XXXXXX writes: >> Other than the fact that >> there's, maybe, an extra pair of eyes watching for problems, it seems >> identical to the cell phone situation to me > >That seems reasonable but I find that even with a hands free the cell takes >more focus away from driving. Do not know why, just know that is the way it is >for me. I think a lot depends on how much attention you put into the call. If a person is fighting with their SO I doubt they could *walk* safely during the call, let alone drive. That sort of emotional call eats all your attention. On the other hand, if you are concentrating on driving first, and cell phone second, and it's a very simple matter-of-fact call (i.e. "I'm on the way...be there in 10 minutes or so, are you ready?") that only lasts a minute or less, I doubt there's a major problem in most cases, unless traffic is hairy or conditions are poor. Even so, making such calls (or returning them) when you stop at a traffic light works pretty well. If you can't cover it during a light cycle, it's probably too involved to get into while driving...park it. Works for me anyway. On the other hand, listening to the radio while riding is something I'm not sure I want to get into. Riding takes more attention than driving, and I'm not sure I want any distractions at all while I'm doing it. Highway miles on a longer trip might be ok, but for local riding and playing around the back roads I'd rather have nothing to distract at all. I know some folks who have XM radios on their bikes, and who listen to them with speakers or headphones all the time while riding, but I'm not sure that's a good idea. No statistics for this, just a gut feeling. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 14:34:35 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "Mike B." , DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Cell phones vs. passengers. (was: Re: Request for Input (sun in the eyes)) Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:47:21 -0500 Does that mean I can get the insurance rate of a 74 YO ?? That would rock. Rob On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 10:38:11 -0500, Mike B. wrote > I heard of another that says that a teen or 20-something on a cell phone > drives about as well as the average 74 year old (accident rates I believe > was the item used to make the claim). > -- Mike B. > > '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non- > Harley folks) > > Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes > is better. -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 14:36:40 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:36:33 -0500 From: smthng else To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: re: Radios (was cellphones and sun) > On the other hand, listening to the radio while riding is something I'm not > sure I want to get into. Riding takes more attention than driving, and I'm > not sure I want any distractions at all while I'm doing it. Highway miles > on a longer trip might be ok, but for local riding and playing around the > back roads I'd rather have nothing to distract at all. I won't call this an official study or anything, but some of the more serious long distance riders have suggested a radio or book-on-tape or something similar when you have to do a lot of superslab miles. The general thought behind it is that doing multiple miles on interstates starts to cause many riders to kind of "zone out". The added stimulus of music, a story, or whatever else you choose to listen to is just enough of a constantly changing "distraction" to keep you thinking and more alert, whether or not you're actually paying attention to what you're listening to. Personally, I doubt I'd consider a radio on anything shorter than a two or three hours straight on interstates. In the local stuff or on a nice twisty or country road, the engine is all the music I want. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 14:44:38 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 14:36:27 -0500 To: harry@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive At 12:56 PM 2/9/05 -0500, harry@XXXXXX wrote: >The problem, of course, is that you don't notice what you don't notice. It's also worth noting another study that found that competent people tend to underestimate their abilities, while incompetent people overestimate them. It doesn't matter what activity or ability you are interested in apparently. The theory is that competent people notice where they are lacking and so see lots of room for improvement, while incompetent people's very incompetence keeps them from seeing their lack of ability...thus leading to the different perspectives on their own performance. Summary articles about the studies: http://www.math.wisc.edu/~miller/old/incomp.txt http://www.lingsoft.fi/~reriksso/competence.html If you want the full study paper (and are willing to pay for it): http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/bpl/cdir/2003/00000012/00000003/art00004 -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 14:44:39 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 14:45:10 -0500 To: "Anne S" , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive At 01:22 PM 2/9/05 -0500, Anne S wrote: >Do motorcyclists listen to the radio? Some do, most don't from what I've seen. Most tour bikes seem to come with them these days (Road King Ultras and Gold Wings for instance). >I guess it would be hard to do a book >on tape while on a bike. You'd have to turn it up pretty loud and changing >tapes would be an acrobatic feat. Record the tape and save as MP3 on a multi-gig player...no more flipping tapes! Heck, my Palm Zire 71 has 4 full albums on one of its SD cards, along with a few miscellaneous tracks. Plenty of room for a "books on tape" session before having to change SD cards...and both my bike and my bladder have less continuous running capacity than that! ;-) Though as I said in another post a minute ago, I don't listen to anything but the bike and the world while riding. The stuff on the Zire is for waiting in doctor's offices, while eating in restaurants (so I don't have to listen to the conversations around me), and for sharing with curious friends, etc.. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 14:58:52 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 14:59:25 -0500 To: you@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: re: Radios (was cellphones and sun) At 02:36 PM 2/9/05 -0500, smthng else wrote: >I won't call this an official study or anything, but some of the more >serious long distance riders have suggested a radio or book-on-tape or >something similar when you have to do a lot of superslab miles. I agree for cage trips for sure. On the bike I think I'd rather just ride with a group instead. The extra attention it takes to ride with others is enough to keep the "interest level" up and avoid the zone-out situation. The ride down to Va. Beach last June (eastern shore route) took a bunch of hours, but was never boring, as I ended up with a group of three other bikes and maintaining position, staying with them on passes, checking on them to make sure everyone was still together, and pointing out road hazards as I saw them or had them pointed out to me, etc. was enough variety to keep the miles from blending together into a blur. Of course, when we got to the Bay-Bridge toll plaza and it started raining, there was no need for variety anymore. A 17 mile bridge crossing in the rain was enough "fun" to keep everyone on their toes. Should semis be required to keep their spray to themselves when they pass or are passed? ;-) -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 14:58:52 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 14:48:51 -0500 To: you@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX At 01:19 PM 2/9/05 -0500, smthng else wrote: >> Is your GPS distracting to you while driving? > >Nope. It gets less attention than my side mirrors. I only eff with >it when stopped if I'm lost. Otherwise, it's just nice to know it's >there if I need it. Much like a cell phone... but I pull over to use >either one. On the bike I generally set it to the speedo display. It's mounted higher up than the bike's speedo, so I don't have to look down as far to see it. With a full-face helmet the chin bar covers the bike speedo for me, so the GPS eliminates a head motion to do a speed check. A half-helmet doesn't create the problem in the first place of course...but I don't think the helmet flame wars are scheduled until late spring, so we'll just ignore that for now. ;-) -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 15:23:47 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 15:23:36 -0500 From: Aaron Maurer To: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: noise canceling (sp?) headphones Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I have them both -- they're fantastic. The differences between the model 4p/s and 6 are: -- the 4 has a slightly better driver (not noticeable to me); -- the 4 has a very slightly bigger driver (noticeable to me); -- the 4 has better/stronger wires between the jack and headphones; and -- the 4 comes with two different types of surrounds that go in your ear (one is rubber (usually pictured on the web) and the other is squishy foam, like the yellow earplug material.) The 6 only comes with a rubber surround. Overall, my advice would be that there is no reason to get the 4 over the 6 for m/c use. On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 15:26:52 -0800 (PST), Tom Gimer wrote: > after years of bombarding my eardrums, i am considering the > etymotic 4P headphones. does anyone have any experience > with these? if so, do they fit comfortably in your helmet > without modifications to the inner shell? are they worth > the bump in price from the etymotic 6? > > thanks in advance for any feedback. > > > ===== > Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) > - http://www.murphygimer.com > - http://www.mgtitlellc.com > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 15:30:09 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 12:30:00 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: re: Radios (was cellphones and sun) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX i listen to music when i ride and have no problem paying attention to the road. it is a rhythm thing and not a distraction..... to me --- smthng else wrote: > > On the other hand, listening to the radio while riding > is something I'm not > > sure I want to get into. Riding takes more attention > than driving, and I'm > > not sure I want any distractions at all while I'm doing > it. Highway miles > > on a longer trip might be ok, but for local riding and > playing around the > > back roads I'd rather have nothing to distract at all. > > I won't call this an official study or anything, but some > of the more > serious long distance riders have suggested a radio or > book-on-tape or > something similar when you have to do a lot of superslab > miles. The > general thought behind it is that doing multiple miles on > interstates > starts to cause many riders to kind of "zone out". The > added stimulus > of music, a story, or whatever else you choose to listen > to is just > enough of a constantly changing "distraction" to keep you > thinking and > more alert, whether or not you're actually paying > attention to what > you're listening to. > > Personally, I doubt I'd consider a radio on anything > shorter than a > two or three hours straight on interstates. In the local > stuff or on > a nice twisty or country road, the engine is all the > music I want. > > --smthng > http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ > > ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 15:38:22 2005 From: "rich hall" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: re: Radios (was cellphones and sun) Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 15:36:33 -0500 Talk radio for every commute trip and music most other times. If I'm in a group I usually don't have music on. >From: Tom Gimer >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: re: Radios (was cellphones and sun) >Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 12:30:00 -0800 (PST) > >i listen to music when i ride and have no problem paying >attention to the road. it is a rhythm thing and not a >distraction..... to me > > >--- smthng else wrote: > > > > On the other hand, listening to the radio while riding > > is something I'm not > > > sure I want to get into. Riding takes more attention > > than driving, and I'm > > > not sure I want any distractions at all while I'm doing > > it. Highway miles > > > on a longer trip might be ok, but for local riding and > > playing around the > > > back roads I'd rather have nothing to distract at all. > > > > I won't call this an official study or anything, but some > > of the more > > serious long distance riders have suggested a radio or > > book-on-tape or > > something similar when you have to do a lot of superslab > > miles. The > > general thought behind it is that doing multiple miles on > > interstates > > starts to cause many riders to kind of "zone out". The > > added stimulus > > of music, a story, or whatever else you choose to listen > > to is just > > enough of a constantly changing "distraction" to keep you > > thinking and > > more alert, whether or not you're actually paying > > attention to what > > you're listening to. > > > > Personally, I doubt I'd consider a radio on anything > > shorter than a > > two or three hours straight on interstates. In the local > > stuff or on > > a nice twisty or country road, the engine is all the > > music I want. > > > > --smthng > > http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ > > > > > > >===== >Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) > - http://www.murphygimer.com > - http://www.mgtitlellc.com > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! >http://my.yahoo.com > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 15:54:14 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 12:54:04 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: noise canceling (sp?) headphones To: Aaron Maurer Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX you just saved me $200. whoever said that this list ain't worth a shit and harry is a tyrant is an idiot. --- Aaron Maurer wrote: > I have them both -- they're fantastic. The differences > between the > model 4p/s and 6 are: > > -- the 4 has a slightly better driver (not noticeable to > me); > > -- the 4 has a very slightly bigger driver (noticeable > to me); > > -- the 4 has better/stronger wires between the jack and > headphones; and > > -- the 4 comes with two different types of surrounds that > go in your > ear (one is rubber (usually pictured on the web) and the > other is > squishy foam, like the yellow earplug material.) The 6 > only comes > with a rubber surround. > > Overall, my advice would be that there is no reason to > get the 4 over > the 6 for m/c use. > > On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 15:26:52 -0800 (PST), Tom Gimer > wrote: > > after years of bombarding my eardrums, i am considering > the > > etymotic 4P headphones. does anyone have any > experience > > with these? if so, do they fit comfortably in your > helmet > > without modifications to the inner shell? are they > worth > > the bump in price from the etymotic 6? > > > > thanks in advance for any feedback. > > > > > > ===== > > Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) > > - http://www.murphygimer.com > > - http://www.mgtitlellc.com > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > protection around > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 16:13:27 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 16:13:34 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: dc-cycles.com (non moto, but effects us all) My company Wheat International is going out of business. I was let go today after 10 years, along with all but 5 skeleton staff to auction off the carcass. My personal server troutman.org also hosts dccycles.com and my parent's company (plus my personal email and theirs). Wheat was great, as they allowed me to operate my personal server on the network for free along with the DNS hosting. Now I need to find a new place to stick my box and start paying for services that were always free. If anyone works for or has direct experience with an ISP that would let me stick a low bandwidth box on their network for a decent rate, please let me know. My temporary solution will be to move the server to my home DSL network and use dyndns; but I only have 12KB upstream and 50KB downstream, so it won't be a good solution. Chris and Harry - please contact me directly. Feel free to contact me directly, I don't want to make a list thread out of it. FYI - if something drastic happens immediately, email me at mtroutma@XXXXXX or 703-392-1066. And of course, if anyone is looking for a linux/cisco/network engineer/sysadmin type guy, feel free to drop me a line. My CV is http://www.troutman.org/troutman-resume.pdf _____________________________________ Mike Troutman mike@XXXXXX http://www.troutman.org/vfr '97 Honda VFR 750 AMA - http://www.amadirectlink.com/ NMA - http://www.motorists.org "I'd rather die while I'm living, then live while I'm dead." - Jimmy Buffett From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 16:36:15 2005 From: Daniel To: rjmoran@XXXXXX Cc: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 16:35:55 -0500 have you ever missed a turn or went the wrong way while being on the cell phone? I have On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 16:53:27 +0000, rjmoran@XXXXXX wrote: >I use my cell phone (not hands free) in the car all the time. I don't weave, I don't slow down, I don't tailgate, make sudden stops or lane changes, or forget to use my signals. > >RPM > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 16:40:51 2005 From: Daniel To: rjmoran@XXXXXX Cc: smthngelse@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 16:40:39 -0500 I find the gps distracting.. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 19:34:39 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 19:34:16 -0500 Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Cc: DC-Cycles To: Daniel From: Randy Moran On Wednesday, February 9, 2005, at 04:35 PM, Daniel wrote: > have you ever missed a turn or went the wrong way while being on the > cell phone? > > I have No, I haven't. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 19:47:07 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 19:46:57 -0500 Subject: Re: Cell phones vs. passengers From: "John M. Stafford" To: Personally, after riding for nearly 20 years, and paying very close attention to cagers, I think bad and inattentive driving happens constantly with some people and rarely with others. And no amount of nitpicking laws will stop that. With some people if it isn't a cell phone it's the kids in the backseat or their radio or the make-up they're applying or the food they're eating or something else, and they'll drive distracted no matter what. On a side note, I have a Jabra headset for my cell phone that works perfectly under my helmet, at low speeds. I can hear clearly to about 40 mph, and speak clearly up to about 20mph. Enjoy, John M. Stafford ---------- From: smthng else >> Other studies have shown that talking to a passenger impairs the driver very >> little. Theories include that the passenger subconsciously cues off of the >> driver and surroundings, halting conversation at appropriate times. I >> don't recall if the study ref. above addresses that issue. > > I read an article in Mobile PC magazine (of all places) that > referenced the same kind of study. Basically a passenger is aware of > the environment and "tips off" the driver to things around them, > whether they know they are doing it or not. While some studies have > shown that a driver and passenger having a heated discussion about > something are not quite as competant as a single driver paying > attention, they are generally significantly less of a danger than a > cell phoner. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 21:33:09 2005 From: "Rob Keiser" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Towing wanted Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 21:32:03 -0500 I've only had one experience getting a bike towed (after my wreck last April) but the guy at Independent MC Transport did right by me. Can't remember his name and he's probably not the cheapest, but he took great care of my bike and got her home safe. YMMV 301-946-5412 Rob '98 VFR800 From: "garcia oliver" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Towing wanted Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 23:46:47 -0500 Hi)B…I occasionally get calls from people looking for moto towing. Any of you interested in having your phone number given to such callers? You make your own $ arrangements with them, I just pass on the phone number. If you want to be on this year)B’s list, send me your name, contact info, times/days it)B’s ok to call you, when and where you will/won’t tow, and whether you use a trailer or load onto a truck. If you have a per mile or per hour fee, please include that. Thanks. --garcia "A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always count on the support of Paul." From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 22:41:57 2005 Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 19:41:49 -0800 (PST) From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: noise canceling (sp?) headphones To: Tom Gimer , Aaron Maurer Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Now how about the 6 vs. the 6i for moto use? The 6i is supposed to have slightly elevated bass emphasis. -- Larry --- Tom Gimer wrote: > you just saved me $200. whoever said that this list ain't > worth a shit and harry is a tyrant is an idiot. > > > > > --- Aaron Maurer wrote: > > > I have them both -- they're fantastic. The differences > > between the > > model 4p/s and 6 are: > > > > -- the 4 has a slightly better driver (not noticeable to > > me); > > > > -- the 4 has a very slightly bigger driver (noticeable > > to me); > > > > -- the 4 has better/stronger wires between the jack and > > headphones; and > > > > -- the 4 comes with two different types of surrounds that > > go in your > > ear (one is rubber (usually pictured on the web) and the > > other is > > squishy foam, like the yellow earplug material.) The 6 > > only comes > > with a rubber surround. > > > > Overall, my advice would be that there is no reason to > > get the 4 over > > the 6 for m/c use. > > > > On Tue, 8 Feb 2005 15:26:52 -0800 (PST), Tom Gimer > > wrote: > > > after years of bombarding my eardrums, i am considering > > the > > > etymotic 4P headphones. does anyone have any > > experience > > > with these? if so, do they fit comfortably in your > > helmet > > > without modifications to the inner shell? are they > > worth > > > the bump in price from the etymotic 6? > > > > > > thanks in advance for any feedback. > > > > > > > > > ===== > > > Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) > > > - http://www.murphygimer.com > > > - http://www.mgtitlellc.com > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam > > protection around > > > http://mail.yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > ===== > Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) > - http://www.murphygimer.com > - http://www.mgtitlellc.com > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 9 23:32:24 2005 Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 23:32:18 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: dccycles.com update There might be some confusion on the list vs. website issue. The list is maintained by Harry on his own separate servers. It is not in jeopardy. The dccycles.com site is maintained by Chris Weaver and hosted on my web server. The web site is user created and supported separately from the list itself. The archives are produced automatically by receiving each email as a list member, stripping out information and dumping to a file that is indexed nightly. Harry has a separate archive on his list server which is theoretically identical to mine (I initially used Harry's archives to create the base a couple of years ago). The DNS was hosted in Reston, California and Hawaii (now just Reston) and will have to be moved somewhere else all together. Even if my server doesn't find a home, several people have offered to host the site. I think I can find a commercial solution at a reasonable price, and my two commercially hosted sites will offset the cost of keeping dccycles.com and troutman.org alive. In theory. Thanks to the list, I have several good leads on job opportunities and always welcome more. I appreciate the support. _____________________________________ Mike Troutman mike@XXXXXX http://www.troutman.org/vfr '97 Honda VFR 750 AMA - http://www.amadirectlink.com/ NMA - http://www.motorists.org "I'd rather die while I'm living, then live while I'm dead." - Jimmy Buffett From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 05:18:28 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 05:15:09 -0500 From: skip CC: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive James O'Connor wrote: > > I, to the point of sounding big headed, consider myself a very > skilled driver. have you ever noticed that everyone thinks they're above average drivers? half of them are wrong. --skip From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 05:20:38 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 05:17:24 -0500 From: skip CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: WaPo: Shut up and drive Anne S wrote: > > I think cell phones are a sign that the end of civilization is near. People > talking into little metal boxes and totally ignoring others around them... > Beeps interrupting lectures, movies, meetings... Boss able to track you > down any place, any time... But seriously, they are damned dangerous on the > road. I just wonder how much more dangerous they are than listening to the > radio. I listen to books on tape. Sometimes I'm so engrossed that I don't > even know how I got home. I'm not a very good driver anyhow (I used to be > - DC has done this to me, I swear!) so I have to wonder. I got a ticket > just a few weeks ago all because of a Gretchen Wilson song. But I digress. > DC is right to ban use of cellphones on the road. > > Do motorcyclists listen to the radio? I guess it would be hard to do a book > on tape while on a bike. You'd have to turn it up pretty loud and changing > tapes would be an acrobatic feat. > > Anne I completely agree with you regarding the book on tape. I'm either listening to the book, or I'm paying attention to the road. I cannot do both at the same time. I no longer listen to books on tape in the car. --skip From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 07:03:00 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 04:02:52 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: re: Radios (was cellphones and sun) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I would agree, I started doing it last year for longer (300 - 500 mile) days and its fine. Glenn --- Tom Gimer wrote: > i listen to music when i ride and have no problem > paying attention to the road. it is a rhythm thing and not a distraction..... to me > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 07:53:57 2005 From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Towing wanted Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 07:53:49 -0500 I've used Independent Mc Transport before also and I highly recommend his services. -----Original Message----- From: Rob Keiser [mailto:robkeiser@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Towing wanted I've only had one experience getting a bike towed (after my wreck last April) but the guy at Independent MC Transport did right by me. Can't remember his name and he's probably not the cheapest, but he took great care of my bike and got her home safe. YMMV 301-946-5412 Rob '98 VFR800 From: "garcia oliver" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Towing wanted Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2005 23:46:47 -0500 Hi...I occasionally get calls from people looking for moto towing. Any of you interested in having your phone number given to such callers? You make your own $ arrangements with them, I just pass on the phone number. If you want to be on this year's list, send me your name, contact info, times/days it's ok to call you, when and where you will/won't tow, and whether you use a trailer or load onto a truck. If you have a per mile or per hour fee, please include that. Thanks. --garcia "A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always count on the support of Paul." From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 07:56:19 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 07:56:15 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: garcia oliver Subject: Re: Towing wanted Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > Hi)B…I occasionally get calls from people looking for moto towing. Any of > you interested in having your phone number given to such callers? My younger son, Thomas, works for a towing company and carries all of the motorcycle-specific bits on his truck. He's on the list, should you want to contact him for phone numbers. Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 08:19:26 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 08:19:17 -0500 From: "De Boeser, Tom" To: DC-CYCLES Subject: Electronics stores Hi, My local radio shack leaves a lot to be desired. I need a good electronic parts place. The type of place you could find transistors, audio/video connectors for soldering, etc. with a good selection. Well, better than most radio shacks. I know there are many online but I'm working on a "farkle" (i'm a beginner) and I'm not sure of the sizes of connectors, etc. Having hands on would be best. Thanks, Tom de '03 ST From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 08:21:43 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 05:21:35 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Electronics stores To: DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX http://www.arcade-electronics.com/ --- "De Boeser, Tom" wrote: > Hi, > My local radio shack leaves a lot to be desired. > I need a good > electronic parts place. The type of place you could > find transistors, > audio/video connectors for soldering, etc. with a > good selection. Well, > better than most radio shacks. I know there are > many online but I'm > working on a "farkle" (i'm a beginner) and I'm not > sure of the sizes of > connectors, etc. Having hands on would be best. > > Thanks, > Tom de '03 ST > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do? http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 08:41:20 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:01:37 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: Subject: re: Radios (was cellphones and sun) On Wed, 9 Feb 2005, Tom Gimer wrote: > i listen to music when i ride and have no problem paying > attention to the road. it is a rhythm thing and not a > distraction..... to me I also listen to music when I ride and don't find it a distraction. -- Wayne From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 08:52:52 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 08:44:34 -0500 From: skip To: "De Boeser, Tom" CC: DC-CYCLES Subject: Re: Electronics stores www.digikey.com http://dkc1.digikey.com/us/pdf/Current.html "De Boeser, Tom" wrote: > > Hi, > My local radio shack leaves a lot to be desired. I need a good > electronic parts place. The type of place you could find transistors, > audio/video connectors for soldering, etc. with a good selection. Well, > better than most radio shacks. I know there are many online but I'm > working on a "farkle" (i'm a beginner) and I'm not sure of the sizes of > connectors, etc. Having hands on would be best. > > Thanks, > Tom de '03 ST From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 09:06:47 2005 From: "LindaT." To: "Dc-Cycles" Subject: RE: Electronics stores Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:04:29 -0500 Arlington Electronics in (surprise!!) Arlington. LindaT. www.CustomTankBags.com Hollywood, FL IBA,BMWBMW,AMA '99 R1100RT Mr Buzzy '95 F3 Purple Haze '00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing -----Original Message----- From: De Boeser, Tom [mailto:tdeboeser@XXXXXX] To: DC-CYCLES Subject: Electronics stores Hi, My local radio shack leaves a lot to be desired. I need a good electronic parts place. The type of place you could find transistors, audio/video connectors for soldering, etc. with a good selection. Well, better than most radio shacks. I know there are many online but I'm working on a "farkle" (i'm a beginner) and I'm not sure of the sizes of connectors, etc. Having hands on would be best. Thanks, Tom de '03 ST From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 09:19:27 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 06:19:19 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: RE: Electronics stores To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Hey Linda does it still exist? I tried about a year ago and the phone number didn't work. Glenn --- "LindaT." wrote: > Arlington Electronics in (surprise!!) Arlington. > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do? http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 09:23:53 2005 From: "LindaT." To: "Dc-Cycles" Subject: RE: Electronics stores Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 09:21:48 -0500 Gee, I don't know. I haven't been there is a while. I suppose they could be gone. What a shame. They always had the coolest stuff. Drat. LindaT. www.CustomTankBags.com Hollywood, FL IBA,BMWBMW,AMA '99 R1100RT Mr Buzzy '95 F3 Purple Haze '00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing -----Original Message----- From: Glenn Dysart [mailto:glenn_dysart@XXXXXX] To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Electronics stores Hey Linda does it still exist? I tried about a year ago and the phone number didn't work. Glenn --- "LindaT." wrote: > Arlington Electronics in (surprise!!) Arlington. > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do? http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 09:57:14 2005 From: To: DC-CYCLES Subject: Re: Re: Electronics stores Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 9:57:07 -0500 > > From: skip > Date: 2005/02/10 Thu AM 08:44:34 EST > To: "De Boeser, Tom" > CC: DC-CYCLES > Subject: Re: Electronics stores > > www.digikey.com > > http://dkc1.digikey.com/us/pdf/Current.html > > > > "De Boeser, Tom" wrote: > > > > Hi, > > My local radio shack leaves a lot to be desired. I need a good > > electronic parts place. The type of place you could find transistors, > > audio/video connectors for soldering, etc. with a good selection. Well, > > better than most radio shacks. I know there are many online but I'm > > working on a "farkle" (i'm a beginner) and I'm not sure of the sizes of > > connectors, etc. Having hands on would be best. > > > > Thanks, > > Tom de '03 ST > > I believe Arlington Electronics is well known in the area for their vast array of electronical "stuff", with a knowledgable, yet usually less than friendly staff but you just can't beat their inventory...makes RS look like a electronics 7/11. Haven't been there in years and I hope they're still in business. -aki From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 12:12:37 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 12:12:24 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: "adamme1@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: Re: Electronics stores Cc: DC-CYCLES On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 07:03:11 -0800 (PST), adamme1@XXXXXX wrote: > > > I believe Arlington Electronics is well known in the area for their vast array of electronical "stuff", with a knowledgable, yet usually less than friendly staff but you just can't beat their inventory...makes RS look like a electronics 7/11. > > Haven't been there in years and I hope they're still in business. > > -aki > Still there about six months ago. http://www.dashinet.com/computer/northernvirginia/arlingtonelectronics.html 3636 Lee Hwy. 703-524-2412 There's also a big ole cat that likes to sleep on the counters. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 13:21:39 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:21:05 -0800 (PST) From: Carl Custer Subject: WaPo: Shut up and drive To: DCCycles Great thoughtful opinions and erudite observations. Now rather let these jewels of wisdom get stale before we, the assembled choir members, how about sharing them with your State legislators, especially the Maryland General Assembly that is currently in session (& rejected banning cell phones last year). Click on )B“Contact or find a Legislator” Carl in Bethesda (Loves cabrito) )B“I think cell phones are a sign that the end of civilization is near. People talking into little metal boxes and totally ignoring others around them... )B“ (Anne the Goat Woman) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 13:29:40 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:29:33 -0500 From: "De Boeser, Tom" To: DC-CYCLES Subject: Re: Electronics stores Thanks for the posts, there are two that seem to be convenient for me. Tom de '03 ST1300 De Boeser, Tom wrote: > Hi, > My local radio shack leaves a lot to be desired. I need a good > electronic parts place. The type of place you could find transistors, > audio/video connectors for soldering, etc. with a good selection. > Well, better than most radio shacks. I know there are many online but > I'm working on a "farkle" (i'm a beginner) and I'm not sure of the > sizes of connectors, etc. Having hands on would be best. > > Thanks, > Tom de '03 ST > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 13:47:37 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:47:30 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Electronics stores To: DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX You know its tough getting old. ;-) I'm guessing your six months is more like a couple years. The building they used to be in was torn down probably 1.5 years ago and a new building is there now. Did they end up moving? Try dialing the two numbers from that site, they don't work. Glenn --- Paul Wilson wrote: > > > Still there about six months ago. > > http://www.dashinet.com/computer/northernvirginia/arlingtonelectronics.html > > 3636 Lee Hwy. > 703-524-2412 > > There's also a big ole cat that likes to sleep on > the counters. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 13:58:43 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 13:58:27 EST Subject: Re: Electronics stores To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/10/2005 1:47:54 PM Eastern Standard Time, glenn_dysart@XXXXXX writes: > You know its tough getting old. ;-) I'm guessing your > six months is more like a couple years. I find that everything I remember occurred either "a couple a weeks ago" this extends in real time to about 3 or 4 years. Or "a couple a years ago" Well; this just goes back to the invention of dirt. I think it is subconscious, if I can remember things that happened 40 years ago (OK 50) I must be older then 40. NO WAY!!! "The mind is a terrible thing" John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 14:20:53 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:20:43 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: "LindaT." Subject: Re: Electronics stores Cc: Dc-Cycles > Arlington Electronics in (surprise!!) Arlington. Long gone, Dear Heart - The last I saw, their location was a large hole in the ground. Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 14:37:48 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 14:37:32 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Electronics stores Cc: DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX On Thu, 10 Feb 2005 10:47:30 -0800 (PST), Glenn Dysart wrote: > You know its tough getting old. ;-) I'm guessing your > six months is more like a couple years. Yep, busted for a senior moment I guess. I was just thinking that I needed to swing by there to pick up some connectors and whatzits for the KLR. I guess I'm stuck with Radio Shack, "you've got questions, we've got a cash register," for stuff like that. I don't like shopping on-line for little electrical items, and you get shafted for shipping. Oftentimes a brick'n'mortar retailer will have just the right thing, or you discover an item you didn't even know existed, or think up interesting ways of adapting things while in the store. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 14:44:12 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 11:44:04 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Electronics stores To: DC-CYCLES@XXXXXX Hit Arcade Electronics which is the first link I sent out earlier today. They are on General Washington Drive in Alexandria which is near the intersection of I-395 and Edsall Road. Glenn --- Paul Wilson wrote: > > Yep, busted for a senior moment I guess. I was just > thinking that I > needed to swing by there to pick up some connectors > and whatzits for > the KLR. I guess I'm stuck with Radio Shack, > "you've got questions, __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 10 20:45:28 2005 Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 20:42:28 -0500 From: smthng else Subject: Gmail? Hey all... I'm not sure why, but I have 50 gmail invites today. Anyone need one? It's great for managing mail-list threads if you happen to subscribe to a number of cycle lists. Please reply OFF-LIST if you want one!!! --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 04:02:51 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 03:59:25 -0500 From: skip To: DC Cycles Subject: Brewpub Beerfest Out here in the wilds of Loudoun County, Virginia lies the Old Dominion Brewery. You've likely seen their product in supermarkets and other fine establishments. They have a BrewPub where you can sample their wide varitey of product, from light pilsners to the delicously lethal Millenium. Every year they have the Dominon BeerFest. 3 days of mild debauchery, with bands and other forms of entertainment. If you haven't been, you should go, it's a good time. Microbrewers from around the mid-atlantic show up, and you get to sample their products as well. This year, it's running from June 24-26. I'm pretty local to it, so if you need a place to crash, let me know and I'm sure I can accomodate you. --skip From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 07:41:09 2005 From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 07:40:54 EST Subject: Re: Gmail? To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I think this was meant for the whole list. Not sure why but lately I seem to be the main recipient listed in peoples e-mails to the DC Cycles list. Harry? Scooter In a message dated 2/10/2005 8:46:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, smthngelse@XXXXXX writes: Hey all... I'm not sure why, but I have 50 gmail invites today. Anyone need one? It's great for managing mail-list threads if you happen to subscribe to a number of cycle lists. Please reply OFF-LIST if you want one!!! --smthng _http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/_ (http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 08:20:58 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 08:20:50 -0500 From: Aaron Maurer To: "ScooterFZR@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: Gmail? Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 04:41:54 -0800 (PST), ScooterFZR@XXXXXX wrote: > I think this was meant for the whole list. Not sure why but lately I seem > to be the main recipient listed in peoples e-mails to the DC Cycles list. > Harry? > > Scooter > Nope, we all got it. BTW, I have 50 invites as well. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 10:10:02 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 07:09:54 -0800 (PST) From: Carl Custer Subject: Electronics stores To: DCCycles For we Merry landers, there)B’s: Mark Electronic Supply 1215 Old Baltimore Pike )B• Beltsville, MD 20705 Phone: Wash. Area (301) 595-5040 )B• Balt. Area (410) 792-0072 Toll Free (800) 446-2228 )B• Fax (301) 937-0491 Email salesdept@XXXXXX While they are a professional supply store, they are open on Saturday)B’s. North of Powder Mill Road in an old industrial park. Lotsa shrink tubing in many colors and sizes. Contact cleaners (vewy important for your semiannual touch ups). All kinds of connectors, switches and stuff. And tools, Ohhh tools; yeah they have tools, meters, and gizmos. Plus they)B’re just a couple of miles from the Dirt Shop (Jerry WRMT editor)B’s first MC store), Heyser’s Cycle, and a jaunt from Bob)B’s BMW (Go take a free test ride.) Carl (Have gun, will solder) in Bethesda __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 10:47:24 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 10:47:08 -0500 From: harry@XXXXXX To: this-is-meaningless-i-can-put-anything-i-want-here@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Gmail? -------- >I think this was meant for the whole list. Not sure why but lately I seem >to be the main recipient listed in peoples e-mails to the DC Cycles list. >Harry? What you see in the "To:" field when you receive a message doesn't necessarily reflect who the message was sent to. In this case, the original message was composed by the original poster without a "To:" field (this might sounds illogical, but the "To:" field that you see in a message you receive is mostly window dressing). If you saw a "To:" field on that message at all, it was added by mail software on the receiving end. -harry From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 11:03:25 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 11:01:36 -0500 To: Carl Custer , DCCycles From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Electronics stores At 07:09 AM 2/11/05 -0800, Carl Custer wrote: >For we Merry landers, there)B’s: >Mark Electronic Supply >1215 Old Baltimore Pike )B• Beltsville, MD 20705 >Phone: Wash. Area (301) 595-5040 )B• Balt. Area (410) >792-0072 >Toll Free (800) 446-2228 )B• Fax (301) 937-0491 >Email salesdept@XXXXXX And the web page is at: http://www.markelectronics.com/ Thanks for the reference! I'm not a big time electronics buff, but I've managed to build simple circuits like a deadman timer for an old PC running a BBS so it would reboot when locked up (used a 510 chip...if memory doesn't need a refresh. 2 555 timers on a single chip). Those Forest Mims books that RS sells are really good for teaching to that level at least! ;-) -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 12:50:05 2005 From: bernescut@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Motorcycles are safe, it's bicycles that'll get you. Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 12:49:28 -0500 Roger Hayden in a bicycle accident, but he's OK. http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2005/Feb/050210m.htm Cedric Bernescut 2000 CBR600F4 Annandale, VA http://tinyurl.com/zbgs From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 13:26:55 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:26:53 -0500 From: Sean Jordan To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Motorcycles are safe, it's bicycles that'll get you. Longtime professonal motorcycle racer loses large amounts of skin whilst riding a bicycle . . . . . . . is that ironic, just plain shit-luck, or both? - Sean Jordan From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 13:38:04 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:37:57 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Motorcycles are safe, it's bicycles that'll get you. On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 13:26:53 -0500, Sean Jordan wrote: > Longtime professonal motorcycle racer loses large amounts of skin > whilst riding a bicycle . . . > > . . . . is that ironic, just plain shit-luck, or both? > > - Sean Jordan The friction coefficient of bare skin against asphalt does not favor human flesh. Before taking up motorcycles, I was a semi-fast recreational bicyclist and tried my hand at racing a couple of times. Used to go barreling down mountainous grades near Charlottesville at 40-45 mph, in lycra shorts, helmet, fingerless gloves, jersey and helmet. Obviously, an oopsie in those conditions would not have been pretty. As it is, I've had road rash raspberried knees, hips, ankles and elbows from less dramatic get-offs on human-powered two-wheelers. Needless to say when I got the motorbikes I needed no convincing on the subject of wearing full protective gear. I still ride the bicycle, but the first few miles takes some getting used to, feeling extremely exposed and vulnerable, having becomed accustomed to motorcycle gear. Plus there's no throttle. :) -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 14:11:11 2005 From: "Jon Strang" To: Subject: Re: Motorcycles are safe, it's bicycles that'll get you. Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 14:10:34 -0500 Not only do I feel naked on a bicycle, but it takes a quick second to remember that the front brake is on the wrong side. --jon CBR 954RR Fuji Roubaix Pro ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Wilson" > I still ride the bicycle, but the first few > miles takes some getting used to, feeling extremely exposed and > vulnerable, having becomed accustomed to motorcycle gear. Plus > there's no throttle. :) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 15:00:50 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 15:00:47 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Paul Wilson Subject: Re: Motorcycles are safe, it's bicycles that'll get you. Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > The friction coefficient of bare skin against asphalt does not favor > human flesh. That's one reason why a lot of bicicle racers shave their bodies - that much less crap to clean out of the abrasions :-( Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 15:26:42 2005 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 15:26:34 EST Subject: Re: Motorcycles are safe, it's bicycles that'll get you. To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/11/2005 2:11:19 PM Eastern Standard Time, jmstrang@XXXXXX writes: > Not only do I feel naked on a bicycle, but it takes a quick second to > remember that the front brake is on the wrong side. I was using a bicycle for exercise for a while and one of the first things I did was reverse (correct) the brake positions. Woulda killed myself if I had not as I was riding up and down some _steep_ hills #8-0 John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 16:03:48 2005 Subject: RE: Motorcycles are safe, it's bicycles that'll get you. Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 16:03:44 -0500 From: "Jonathan W. Kalmes" To: An even better shot of the results... http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2005/Feb/050210n.htm --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng >-----Original Message----- >From: bernescut@XXXXXX [mailto:bernescut@XXXXXX] >Sent: Friday, February 11, 2005 12:49 PM >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Motorcycles are safe, it's bicycles that'll get you. > >Roger Hayden in a bicycle accident, but he's OK. >http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2005/Feb/050210m.htm > >Cedric Bernescut >2000 CBR600F4 >Annandale, VA >http://tinyurl.com/zbgs > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 20:28:50 2005 From: Daniel To: garicao@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: re: towing wanted Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 20:28:35 -0500 Hey Garcia, please place me on this years list: Danny 240-353-9175 ( leave a detailed msg if no answer ) 24 hour towing by a fellow rider/dcc lister using an open trailer with drop down wide ramp + winch if neccessary $90 + $2 per mile $25 extra chemical cleanup fee if the bike leaks oil or coolant larger than a 6" puddle... Reciepts given for insurance company reimbursment - Danny From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 21:40:17 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 18:39:55 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: re: towing wanted To: Daniel , garicao@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- Daniel wrote: > Hey Garcia, please place me on this years list: > > Danny > 240-353-9175 > ( leave a detailed msg if no answer ) > > 24 hour towing by a fellow rider/dcc lister > using an open trailer with drop down wide ramp + winch > if neccessary > > $90 + $2 per mile > > $25 extra chemical cleanup fee > if the bike leaks oil or coolant larger than > a 6" puddle... will there be an extra charge for ky jelly? or is it byol? ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 11 22:41:54 2005 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2005 22:41:34 -0500 Subject: Re: Gmail? From: "John M. Stafford" To: A decent POP program is also good for managing list threads, and it doesn't leave your mail in a permanent public location where big brother can search your mail on a permanent basis. Enjoy, John M. Stafford --------- From: smthng else > Hey all... I'm not sure why, but I have 50 gmail invites today. > Anyone need one? It's great for managing mail-list threads if you > happen to subscribe to a number of cycle lists. Please reply OFF-LIST > if you want one!!! > > --smthng > http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 08:08:09 2005 From: Daniel To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: towing wanted Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 08:07:41 -0500 On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 18:39:55 -0800 (PST), Tom Gimer wrote: >--- Daniel wrote: > >> Hey Garcia, please place me on this years list: >> >> Danny >> 240-353-9175 >> ( leave a detailed msg if no answer ) >> >> 24 hour towing by a fellow rider/dcc lister >> using an open trailer with drop down wide ramp + winch >> if neccessary >> >> $90 + $2 per mile >> >> $25 extra chemical cleanup fee >> if the bike leaks oil or coolant larger than >> a 6" puddle... > >will there be an extra charge for ky jelly? or is it byol? > >===== >Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) > - http://www.murphygimer.com > - http://www.mgtitlellc.com > BYOL .. by all means! but that will cost you extra. If you are available to tow cheaper by all means by my guest. 1. motorcycling is an expensive hobby 2. towing is usually expensive 3. other professions charge rates we dont like - so in the end we all must charge rates we dont' like 4. maintenance, gas and insurance are expensive 5. my time and labor are valuable just like anyone elses 6. If it's an accident scene someone's insurance will pay the bill anyway so who cares what the charge is, and it's better to have a fellow rider / experienced tower loading your bike than just having it dragged on a tow truck, especially if you're on the way to the hospital and can't stop the tow truck driver from being an idiot, at least if you called me, you'd know a fellow rider would load your bike with as minimal damage as possible . Especially if you're interested in buying the bike back/fixing it out of pocket. 7. inflation sucks, not my fault. 8. If i'm going to spend at least an hour or what have you (travel time there, time loading, travel time transporting, time unloading, and travel time back) plus use my own equiptment and it's related costs, plus do the work, I really don't think the rate is too bad. 9. I dont' really do any jobs that require what you request, but i spose i could put my disgust aside for say twenty large. 10. If my towing service is worth it, it's worth it. If a well off person doesn't mind paying my rates, we're both happy. If an accident victim knows insurance will pay for my towing, and prefers towing by motorcycle specific towing, then we're both satisfied too. Thanks for asking! :) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 08:47:22 2005 Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 08:47:14 -0500 From: Thomas Jordan To: Daniel Subject: Re: towing wanted aka Daniels Motorcycle Transport, LLC. Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Yes, but what kind of insurance do you have for this? I seriously doubt you have any, and if any at all, I doubt you have the correct insurance. The insurance I carry for towing motorcycles costs an EXTRA $3,000 a year, over and above my 'standard' policy. And my rates are significantly less than yours. And I'm a towing professional, using (on average) $80k worth of equipment to move your $2k-$10k bike. And I have thousands of dollars of overhead to cover each month. And yet, my rates are still lower that yours. Oh yeah, I'm also a fellow rider/dcc lister. On Sat, 12 Feb 2005 08:07:41 -0500, Daniel wrote: > > > >> 24 hour towing by a fellow rider/dcc lister > >> using an open trailer with drop down wide ramp + winch > >> if neccessary > >> > >> $90 + $2 per mile > >> > >> $25 extra chemical cleanup fee > >> if the bike leaks oil or coolant larger than > >> a 6" puddle... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 09:26:51 2005 Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 09:26:46 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Thomas Jordan Subject: Re: towing wanted aka Daniels Motorcycle Transport, LLC. Cc: Daniel , dc-cycles@XXXXXX > rates are still lower that yours. Oh yeah, I'm also a fellow rider/dcc lister. And almost a member of the Loudoun Nine (of course, it would have been the Loudoun 10 then...) Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 09:31:07 2005 Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 09:31:05 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: "John M. Stafford" Subject: Re: Gmail? Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > A decent POP program is also good for managing list threads, Perhaps, but I haven't seen ANYTHING that tracks this stuff like GMail > and it doesn't leave your mail in a permanent public location where > big brother can search your mail on a permanent basis. Are you absolutely sure about that? It may not be in your inbox any longer, but it's dollars to donuts that it still resides on your ISP's servers or backups. Michael J. I just realized that the phrase "dollars to donuts" is rapidly approaching the parity point. It made sense when donuts were a nickle each, but with their price approching the buck mark... Gawd! I'm showing my age!! From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 10:17:36 2005 From: Daniel To: Thomas Jordan Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: answers to thomas jordan's thread Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 10:17:15 -0500 if you're the best deal around and you're available, I encourage people to use you. However if they call you and you're all booked up, and they need immediate service, then they may want to call and see if i'm available. As far as my rates being reasonable. Some obviously do think they are, (since they use my services) some don't. I'm not worried about that. I have other things I can do, and they can find other ways to attend to their problem, and I can use my time to do what I need to do in my daily life to solve my own problems. All the vehicles are insured and if there were some problem, the insurance companies would handle who's at fault and who pays and persuing collection of such. So there's no hassle for the bike owner. Although I'm qualified and I have a lot of experience towing locally and long distance (used to work at a bike shop) this is only offered as a side job for me. You must know you're being bamboozled if you have to pay an extra 3 grand to tow a motorcycle, because it should require the same insurance towing a car, as monitary value is all the same. Why would you have to pay more insurance to tow a smaller vehicle than what you already tow, and the vehicle isn't any more valuable than a car? . I guess you're forced to, either by law or by your insurance company to carry this insurance. Too bad. Personally i'd rather the money go into your pocket. Does anyone really need 80 grand in machinery to tow a motorcycle no. I have the same set up that the average american has who tows his own motorcycle just fine. It's good enough, and i'm experienced enough, and available. My services must be reasonable as people use them. Your rates are supposed to be signifigantly less than mine. you do this for a living. for me it's an occassional side job that I do well. You should be happy your rates are cheaper than mine. I'm not trying to take the food out of anyone's mouth and undercut your business, nor compete. By all means, prosper. And if there is any work left over, and individuals in need that you can't fulfill, I am here. I'm just trying to be useful and earn some side money and fill a need for emergency bike towing and being available when others bike specific towing is not. It's better that a fellow rider / lister prospers than your towing compettitors who may undercut or fight for your business later. Sometimes paying a little more,( if it's the only thing available for what you want), is better than not having it when you need it. How much signifacantly lower are your rates? what are your rates and what is your phone number? I'd like to keep your # on hand. I can send you some business, as there are times people want me to tow, but i'm not available, and they of course would need motorcycle specific towing. I'm sure the list would like to keep your number handy as well. ( and if they're wise they'd keep mine, and MC transport, as a back up). Thanks for your interests, - Danny the higher priced but worth it usually available side job tow guy LOL On Sat, 12 Feb 2005 08:47:14 -0500, Thomas Jordan wrote: >Yes, but what kind of insurance do you have for this? I seriously >doubt you have any, and if any at all, I doubt you have the correct >insurance. The insurance I carry for towing motorcycles costs an EXTRA >$3,000 a year, over and above my 'standard' policy. And my rates are >significantly less than yours. And I'm a towing professional, using >(on average) $80k worth of equipment to move your $2k-$10k bike. And I >have thousands of dollars of overhead to cover each month. And yet, my >rates are still lower that yours. Oh yeah, I'm also a fellow rider/dcc >lister. > > >On Sat, 12 Feb 2005 08:07:41 -0500, Daniel wrote: >> >> >> >> 24 hour towing by a fellow rider/dcc lister >> >> using an open trailer with drop down wide ramp + winch >> >> if neccessary >> >> >> >> $90 + $2 per mile >> >> >> >> $25 extra chemical cleanup fee >> >> if the bike leaks oil or coolant larger than >> >> a 6" puddle... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 14:57:44 2005 Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 14:57:32 -0500 Subject: Re: Gmail? From: "John M. Stafford" To: I use Microsoft Entourage to read my email, and at the selection of a menu item it will instantly thread my messages. Entourage is also integrated with my contacts, tasks, and calendars, so that messages are linked to individual contacts, vendors, and meetings. And all of my mailing lists (like DC-Cycles) are set to go into specified folders so I can read about a dozen lists using individual messages while not interfering with normal personal and work correspondence. The problem with Gmail is that your mail sits on Google's servers an indefinite period. With a typical mail server your mail sits on the server for a period you specify (most mail programs default to zero days aka delete as you download messages, I keep mine on server for 15 days as a back-up in case I have a system failure and haven't been able to restore my computer from a back-up). Indefinite storage poses the following problems: - Security: a hacker could access years worth of your emails without access to your computer. - Privacy (1): Google reads your emails in order to serve ads. For example by placing the words "Honda" and "Harley Davidson" in this message Gmail users are now likely to see ads related to those marques sitting on the right side of your screen. I know I don't want some company reading my email. - Privacy (2): I'm a law-abiding citizen, but also a staunch libertarian. While the standard email service (even other webmail services such as Hotmail and Yahoo Mail) can legitimately claim to be merely transport services, Gmail cannot. With other services that email is deleted or downloaded it is gone from their servers. Gmail keeps your email forever. Imagine going through a divorce and having your spouse's attorney subpoena your Gmail records. - Privacy (3): It's not just your Gmail account. It's every Gmail address your send to. Imagine the FBI or Homeland Security going through someone else's Gmail account and finding a suspicious or off-color email from you. Imagine your spouse's divorce attorney subpoenaing the Gmail account of someone they suspect you of having a fling with. I don't like SENDING messages to Gmail users because I'm not thrilled with having my personal notes no matter how innocuous scanning and then sitting on a public server forever. A great article that neatly summarizes the privacy issues with Gmail can be found here: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/06/15/gmail_spook_heaven/ Enjoy, John M. Stafford ---------- From: Michael Jordan >> A decent POP program is also good for managing list threads, > > Perhaps, but I haven't seen ANYTHING that tracks this stuff like GMail > >> and it doesn't leave your mail in a permanent public location where >> big brother can search your mail on a permanent basis. > > Are you absolutely sure about that? It may not be in your inbox any > longer, but it's dollars to donuts that it still resides on your ISP's > servers or backups. > > Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 15:32:01 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "John M. Stafford" , Subject: Re: Gmail? Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 15:45:21 -0500 Having run mail servers for ISPs for about 5 years. I can tell you that at the VERY most your email that is backed up for maybe 6 months. And if you purge your mail from the servers when you download we got none of it, except the messages in your box when the backup occurs which is usually late at night. After 6 month the tapes are destroyed by our offsite storage vendor. If you work for a company that does email archiving well then it's gonna be stored for like 7 years or something. You gmail and other online service that keep mail on the server have it all. And believe me if they get a supoena or even sometimes less than that your email can be released. Rob On Sat, 12 Feb 2005 14:57:32 -0500, John M. Stafford wrote > I use Microsoft Entourage to read my email, and at the selection of > a menu item it will instantly thread my messages. Entourage is also > integrated with my contacts, tasks, and calendars, so that messages > are linked to individual contacts, vendors, and meetings. > > And all of my mailing lists (like DC-Cycles) are set to go into specified > folders so I can read about a dozen lists using individual messages while > not interfering with normal personal and work correspondence. > > The problem with Gmail is that your mail sits on Google's servers an > indefinite period. With a typical mail server your mail sits on the server > for a period you specify (most mail programs default to zero days > aka delete as you download messages, I keep mine on server for 15 > days as a back-up in case I have a system failure and haven't been > able to restore my computer from a back-up). > > Indefinite storage poses the following problems: > - Security: a hacker could access years worth of your emails without > access to your computer. - Privacy (1): Google reads your emails in > order to serve ads. For example by placing the words "Honda" and > "Harley Davidson" in this message Gmail users are now likely to see > ads related to those marques sitting on the right side of your > screen. I know I don't want some company reading my email. - > Privacy (2): I'm a law-abiding citizen, but also a staunch libertarian. > While the standard email service (even other webmail services such > as Hotmail and Yahoo Mail) can legitimately claim to be merely transport > services, Gmail cannot. With other services that email is deleted > or downloaded it is gone from their servers. Gmail keeps your email > forever. Imagine going through a divorce and having your spouse's > attorney subpoena your Gmail records. - Privacy (3): It's not just > your Gmail account. It's every Gmail address your send to. Imagine > the FBI or Homeland Security going through someone else's Gmail > account and finding a suspicious or off-color email from you. > Imagine your spouse's divorce attorney subpoenaing the Gmail account > of someone they suspect you of having a fling with. I don't like SENDING > messages to Gmail users because I'm not thrilled with having my personal > notes no matter how innocuous scanning and then sitting on a > public server forever. > > A great article that neatly summarizes the privacy issues with Gmail > can be found here: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/06/15/gmail_spook_heaven/ > > Enjoy, > John M. Stafford > > ---------- > From: Michael Jordan > >> A decent POP program is also good for managing list threads, > > > > Perhaps, but I haven't seen ANYTHING that tracks this stuff like GMail > > > >> and it doesn't leave your mail in a permanent public location where > >> big brother can search your mail on a permanent basis. > > > > Are you absolutely sure about that? It may not be in your inbox any > > longer, but it's dollars to donuts that it still resides on your ISP's > > servers or backups. > > > > Michael J. -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 18:51:42 2005 Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 18:51:34 -0500 From: Thomas Jordan To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: towing thread/GMail thread For whatever the reason, towing insurance covers 4-wheeled vehicles. Anything else you put on or hang from the truck, be it a motorcycle or a 20' sea container, is considered cargo. If you have regular auto insurance, and you are at fault in an accident, your insurance company is not responsible for paying for cargo, unless your trailer is insured and also carries cargo insurance. I'm apparently not charging enough. My towing rates, as of right now, have been raised. $0.50/mile to scene (from my office in Chantilly, VA), $90 hookup, $2 per loaded mile, But here's the kicker: I don't charge for puddles smaller than 50" in perimeter measure (due to the odd shape of most spills.) Serving the Continental US (And yes, I have the required USDOT registration to tow across state lines and in and out of the District, which others may not.) Also, I have a limited number (50) gmail accounts, available to any DCC member, currently selling for $25 each; on sale through President's Day for $20. Limit 5 per customer. As an aside, I will give one free to anyone who uses my (properly insured) towing service. Thomas Jordan, Manager Hunter's Woods Towing/Recovery 703-860-5590 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 19:04:46 2005 Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 19:04:39 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC Cycles Subject: Re: Gmail? > > > Are you absolutely sure about that? It may not be in your inbox any > > > longer, but it's dollars to donuts that it still resides on your ISP's > > > servers or backups. I am currently the mail admin (among other things) for my company. We host other companies as well. Trust me... no matter what YOU as a user do, using ANY mail system, if the company/host wants to keep it, they will. There is no command, no utility and no magic chant that can force server to delete your message, regardless of your mail client or anything else. These days, half of the time the owner/admin of the mail server can't even REALLY get rid of stuff, even if/she/they delete the account entirely. Unless you happen to control your own server (or your company's), in which case "anything goes". And.... just to make you even MORE paranoid, there are laws currently on the books that require most ISPs to keep all messages for 7 years (if anyone really wants to argue this point, I could probably hunt a couple of them down, but I couldn't be bothered any time soon). Not all of them do this, but as "the feds" decide to excersize warrants and companies are getting fined for not being able to produce, you can bet that it'll be standard practice real soon. Yes, clever and smart people who really are looking out for thier customer's best interests might be willing to take the risk and effort to make sure your stuff is REALLY gone, but seriously... how many ISP's do you know that could be described as "clever and smart people who really are looking out for thier customer's best interests"? You want to make sure your mail doesn't get tracked back to you and/or your friends and associates? It's up to YOU to make it that way, and you can guarantee that it's a never ending battle and that it doesn't involve using your ISPs servers. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 23:30:31 2005 Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 23:30:28 -0500 From: Sean Jordan To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: towing thread/GMail thread And a heaping dollop of sarcasm in every bite! - Sean Jordan On Sat, 12 Feb 2005 18:51:34 -0500, Thomas Jordan wrote: > For whatever the reason [. . .] uses my (properly insured) > towing service. > > Thomas Jordan, Manager > Hunter's Woods Towing/Recovery > 703-860-5590 > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 12 23:41:15 2005 Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2005 23:42:40 -0500 From: Laura Roach To: Sean Jordan CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: towing thread/GMail thread Sean Jordan wrote: >And a heaping dollop of sarcasm in every bite! > >- Sean Jordan > > > > From a Jordan?!? NO WAY! ;) LAR www.speedwerks.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 13 08:30:50 2005 From: Daniel To: you@XXXXXX Cc: DC Cycles Subject: Re: Gmail? Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 08:30:23 -0500 I spose one could always get an overseas email address in a country who doesn't work with the US.. but even then it's only a chance.. that they may or may not comply with a request for the info. Me personally, I assume all email is compramised, consider it public speaking, and thus keep "damaging info" to a minimum. So I really had no problem with Gmail. Once gmail starts spamming me, I'll can the spam and stop using them. I use probably at least 3 different email accounts. 1 gmail, and 2 pop 3 accounts with forte Agent (although i may try the MS product now). I use filters/folders to manage my email lists in forte. Works pretty good. I use one email address for personal correspondance, one for business, and one for lists. That way i know exactly where to go to look for a certain type of email. - Danny From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 13 09:35:06 2005 Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 09:35:02 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Laura Roach Subject: Re: towing thread/GMail thread Cc: Sean Jordan , dc-cycles@XXXXXX > >And a heaping dollop of sarcasm in every bite! > >- Sean Jordan > > From a Jordan?!? NO WAY! ;) > LAR I, too, am shocked! Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 13 11:10:03 2005 Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 11:09:55 -0500 From: Thomas Jordan To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: towing thread/GMail thread Today only: Free GMail account for everyone shocked by the sarcasm of a Jordan. Please send a self addressed stamped envelope. On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 09:35:02 -0500, Michael Jordan wrote: > > >And a heaping dollop of sarcasm in every bite! > > >- Sean Jordan > > > > From a Jordan?!? NO WAY! ;) > > LAR > > I, too, am shocked! > > Michael J. > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 13 21:09:21 2005 Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2005 21:09:13 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC Cycles Subject: Gear under gear This may have been hashed up before, but I'm tackling it again. I made the mistake of going to Dick's sporting goods store (formerly Galyans) today. I swear that UnderArmor is laced with crack, cause I'm addicted (to the tune of $150 today - the wife hasn't found out yet!). But... What do you suit junkies wear under lowers (pants)? Underarmor is kick@ss stuff, but I couldn't find any pants that didn't make me look a reject from a ballet tryout. I can deal with the skin-tight shirts (thanks to shedding 40 lbs last year), but the pants are not suitable for public consumption, at least not when being worn by me. I usually wear Fieldsheer or Firstgear textile lowers, both armored, which means they're "snug" when on (don't want that armor sliding around if I ever need to use it). Jeans under there suck, as they bunch up and the folds tend to dig in. I'd like something comfortable, but not skin tight that I would allow me to safely walk around in public when I decide to shed to lowers. I'm okay if I know I'm not going to take the lowers off, but I haven't found anything I like for long trips when I know I'm eventually going to stop at a decent restaurant or something. I'm looking for both summer and winter ideas, as a change of season doesn't stop me, it just means that I'm switching between the lowers I have. Any thoughts? --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 14 16:56:06 2005 From: Daniel To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: slow list today? Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 16:55:45 -0500 or do i need to rejoin LOL - Danny From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 14 17:24:09 2005 From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 17:23:49 EST Subject: Re: Gear under gear To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Nope. I too am addicted to Under Armour to the tune of $250+. I even now prefer their BoxerBriefs to regular undies now. :-) I normally wear jeans over the pants when I am going somewhere that I will be walking around in public. If I'm out for just a ride, under the leathers. Have never had an instance where I needed to shed the bottoms. Sorry. Scooter In a message dated 2/13/2005 9:09:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, smthngelse@XXXXXX writes: This may have been hashed up before, but I'm tackling it again. I made the mistake of going to Dick's sporting goods store (formerly Galyans) today. I swear that UnderArmor is laced with crack, cause I'm addicted (to the tune of $150 today - the wife hasn't found out yet!). But... What do you suit junkies wear under lowers (pants)? Underarmor is kick@ss stuff, but I couldn't find any pants that didn't make me look a reject from a ballet tryout. I can deal with the skin-tight shirts (thanks to shedding 40 lbs last year), but the pants are not suitable for public consumption, at least not when being worn by me. I usually wear Fieldsheer or Firstgear textile lowers, both armored, which means they're "snug" when on (don't want that armor sliding around if I ever need to use it). Jeans under there suck, as they bunch up and the folds tend to dig in. I'd like something comfortable, but not skin tight that I would allow me to safely walk around in public when I decide to shed to lowers. I'm okay if I know I'm not going to take the lowers off, but I haven't found anything I like for long trips when I know I'm eventually going to stop at a decent restaurant or something. I'm looking for both summer and winter ideas, as a change of season doesn't stop me, it just means that I'm switching between the lowers I have. Any thoughts? --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 14 21:01:49 2005 From: "W.S." To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: Re: Gear under gear Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 21:01:21 -0500 My configuration differs ('Stich), but try these. In various combinations, I've used slick full length bicycle lycra pants, dancers' leg warmers (for the really cold or with crampable legs after workout), slick warmup pants, lycra full body dive suit, and of course trousers and Levis. (Not all at once.) That UnderArmour has been tempting. Bill S. / DC (on digest) '99 VN750 > Mounting gets clunky when you're bulky. Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From: smthng else This may have been hashed up before, but I'm tackling it again. I made the mistake of going to Dick's sporting goods store (formerly Galyans) today. . . .snip From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 14 21:44:30 2005 Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 21:44:22 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: "W.S." Subject: Re: Gear under gear Cc: DC-Cycles On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 21:01:21 -0500, W.S. wrote: > My configuration differs ('Stich), but try these. In various combinations, > I've used slick full length bicycle lycra pants, dancers' leg warmers (for > the really cold or with crampable legs after workout), slick warmup pants, > lycra full body dive suit, and of course trousers and Levis. (Not all at > once.) > > That UnderArmour has been tempting. > > Bill S. / DC (on digest) > '99 VN750 > Mounting gets clunky when you're bulky. > Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. > > From: smthng else > > This may have been hashed up before, but I'm tackling it again. I made the > mistake of going to Dick's sporting goods store (formerly > Galyans) today. . . .snip Yep, what Bill said. I'm partial to the bicycle stuff. The shorts are just the ticket for those long days in the saddle. The padded and "wicking" layers wick off that moisture in the nether regions to ward off the dreaded "monkey butt" in the summer heat. I've got regular length shorts, bib shorts and knickers. Much better than "tightey whities." No seams, for one thing, lightweight and they give (no bunching). I think I've revealed enough about Paul's Preferences in Undergarments! :) I've never had monkey butt, to tell the truth. I had to read this month's expose in Motorcycle Consumer News to find out what all the fuss was about. In cold weather I have bicycle lycra tights, in several different weights, that I wear. When I have to look "presentable" at my destination I like *loose* fitting cotton pants, or camping shorts with those zip-off legs. Those are OK for rides in the three-four hour range and make a versatile thing to pack for trip where space is at a premium. I hardly ever wear jeans under riding gear. The fabric is too heavy, and it bunches up uncomfortably. And, they take a lot of scarce room in the luggage. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 14 21:47:21 2005 X-UNTD-OriginStamp: fTLSAcSSZ0OO+O1u10jMXNeYUto3esq33gtZZIL4i62sWT4t08lH4g== To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 21:39:45 -0500 Subject: Aluminum Jacks Very Cheap at Sam's X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-1,8-9 From: Tom Fitzpatrick X-ContentStamp: 3:4:3497003528 Just came from Sam's. Sam's has a very nice "Crew Line" brand automotive aluminum jack and ATV/Motorcycle (wider, with two bars) aluminum jack, both of which originally sold for close to $150 marked down to about $77. They have an anodized aluminum mechanics creeper marked down from $39 to $24. They must be closing them out, I would think. There was still some supply at the Woodbridge store tonight. Much nicer than the stuff I have seen for the same or more money at Harbor Freight or anyplace else. Tom From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 14 23:56:42 2005 Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 23:56:39 -0500 From: Sean Jordan To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: slow list today? No need to rejoin - leaving permanently would be just fine! LOL. - Sean Jordan On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 16:55:45 -0500, Daniel wrote: > or do i need to rejoin LOL From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 15 12:36:06 2005 From: Daniel To: Sean Jordan Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: slow list today? Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:35:45 -0500 How dare you taunt me on valentines day! I declare shinanigans! you womp! On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 23:56:39 -0500, Sean Jordan wrote: >No need to rejoin - leaving permanently would be just fine! > >LOL. > >- Sean Jordan > > >On Mon, 14 Feb 2005 16:55:45 -0500, Daniel wrote: >> or do i need to rejoin LOL From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 15 12:37:41 2005 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:37:39 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Daniel Subject: Re: slow list today? Cc: Sean Jordan , dc-cycles@XXXXXX My upgraded Valentine 1 came in yesterday - talk about timing ;-) Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 15 15:14:26 2005 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 15:14:12 -0500 From: corey To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: a blatant message to bike thieves... X-PopBeforeSMTPSenders: egoinc,work@XXXXXX X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - victory.vs4dns.net X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - dc-cycles.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - egoinc.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Suspected motorcycle thieves burned alive Two suspected motorcycle taxi thieves were burned alive and killed on Tuesday in a busy section of the Burundian capital, witnesses said. The two men, who had allegedly recently stolen a motorbike in Bujumbura, were chased down by dozens of enraged motorcycle taxi drivers. The drivers then "necklaced" the men by placing gasoline-filled tires around their necks and setting them ablaze, the witnesses said. Full Article: http://www.mg.co.za/articlepage.aspx?area=/breaking_news/breaking_news__africa/&articleid=197581 ___________________________________________ corey [journal] www.egoinc.org [portfolio] www.blanksky.com [forum] www.dcstreet.com If you think there is good in everybody then you obviously haven't met everybody. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 15 15:37:22 2005 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 12:37:15 -0800 (PST) From: Nick Thompson Subject: Re: a blatant message to bike thieves... To: corey , dc-cycles@XXXXXX That's what I'm talking about!! I had a car stolen 4 yrs ago and PG County and DC did not a damn thing after it was recovered...Not that it would happen here, but if it did, thieves would think twice before lifting someone's ride! Nick --- corey wrote: > Suspected motorcycle thieves burned alive > > Two suspected motorcycle taxi thieves were burned > alive > and killed on Tuesday in a busy section of the > Burundian > capital, witnesses said. > > The two men, who had allegedly recently stolen a > motorbike > in Bujumbura, were chased down by dozens of enraged > motorcycle > taxi drivers. > > The drivers then "necklaced" the men by placing > gasoline-filled > tires around their necks and setting them ablaze, > the witnesses said. > > Full Article: > http://www.mg.co.za/articlepage.aspx?area=/breaking_news/breaking_news__africa/&articleid=197581 > > > ___________________________________________ > corey > [journal] www.egoinc.org > [portfolio] www.blanksky.com > [forum] www.dcstreet.com > > If you think there is good in everybody then you > obviously haven't met everybody. > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Helps protect you from nasty viruses. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 15 15:55:18 2005 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 15:55:53 -0500 To: Nick Thompson , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: a blatant message to bike thieves... I sympathize with the feeling...my dad had a car stolen in Alexandria by a guy with *nine* prior *convictions* for GTA, who had served no time for any of them...and wouldn't have gotten any time for stealing my dad's car either, except that a gun was found in the car and he was on probation, so he got 2 years for that. He was caught, BTW, because he pulled up at a traffic light next to a cop who had arrested him previously for GTA, and who knew the guy couldn't have afforded the 280-Z he was driving...a car which was totalled in the ensuing chase. On the other hand, the word used was "allegedly"...do *you* want some bozo to point you out as a bike thief and get lynched like that? Or would you prefer a trial first? Our system is seriously broken, but I'd rather fix it than scrap it. -- Mike B. At 12:37 PM 2/15/05 -0800, Nick Thompson wrote: >That's what I'm talking about!! I had a car stolen 4 >yrs ago and PG County and DC did not a damn thing >after it was recovered...Not that it would happen >here, but if it did, thieves would think twice before >lifting someone's ride! >--- corey wrote: > >> Suspected motorcycle thieves burned alive -- A: Maybe because some people are too annoyed by top-posting. Q: Why do I not get an answer to my question(s)? A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 15 16:04:50 2005 Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2005 16:04:47 -0500 From: "Chris Norloff" To: "List-dc cycles" Subject: MC parking in SW DC ? Anybody parking motorcycles in SW DC lately? The last I knew, there was parking on C St., behind the FAA, and on Virginia Ave. next to the railroad tracks. thanks, Chris From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 09:48:35 2005 Subject: Choosing Your T Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:48:31 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A27464-2005Feb15.html?nav= hcmodule My visceral reaction is "leave me alone". Why are you so worried abourt funding? Divert some of the money from your automated traffic enforcement programs to carry the weight. I am not comfortable with the idea that every time I ride on a road I like, I will be getting billed. A substantial part of my enjoyment of riding comes from the fact that it is unstructured. Can you imagine having to gaze at some sort of fee chart based on time of day\volume of traffic to compute today's additional fees for your riding pleasure You want to reduce traffic? Make it affordable for people to live near where they work. Give an incentive to car pool, or rideshare in the form of a tax credit. The last thing I need is yet another automated government controlled system that automatically lightens my pocketbook. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 10:22:56 2005 Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 07:22:13 -0800 (PST) From: Nick Thompson Subject: Re: Choosing Your T To: Julian Halton , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Not only that, but think about the "rural" roads that most of us enjoy riding on. Those not wanting to pay tolls will find ways around the tolls by using the roads most of us enjoy. I guess I'll have to start going two hours west to ride... Nick --- Julian Halton wrote: > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A27464-2005Feb15.html?nav= > hcmodule > > > My visceral reaction is "leave me alone". Why are > you so worried abourt > funding? Divert some of the money from your > automated traffic > enforcement programs to carry the weight. I am not > comfortable with the > idea that every time I ride on a road I like, I will > be getting billed. > > A substantial part of my enjoyment of riding comes > from the fact that it > is unstructured. Can you imagine having to gaze at > some sort of fee > chart based on time of day\volume of traffic to > compute today's > additional fees for your riding pleasure > > You want to reduce traffic? Make it affordable for > people to live near > where they work. Give an incentive to car pool, or > rideshare in the > form of a tax credit. The last thing I need is yet > another automated > government controlled system that automatically > lightens my pocketbook. > > > > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 10:25:54 2005 Subject: RE: Choosing Your T Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 10:25:52 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "Nick Thompson" , Great point Nick! I don't mind paying for the roads but my understanding is that this is why we pay municipal, state and federal taxes. In part this revenue pays for and maintains our roads. Have you driven down 14th street lately? For the capital of the world's most powerful nation, the roads and the road system here are a disgrace. If I am going to be paying tolls then my tax rate should be lowered to reflect the fact that highway maintenance is now being paid for by tolls instead of tax. In essence, I am concerned I am going to be double-billed for the same poor service. -----Original Message----- From: Nick Thompson [mailto:sfdaytona@XXXXXX] To: Julian Halton; dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Choosing Your T Not only that, but think about the "rural" roads that most of us enjoy riding on. Those not wanting to pay tolls will find ways around the tolls by using the roads most of us enjoy. I guess I'll have to start going two hours west to ride... Nick --- Julian Halton wrote: > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A27464-2005Feb15.html?nav= > hcmodule > > > My visceral reaction is "leave me alone". Why are you so worried > abourt funding? Divert some of the money from your automated traffic > enforcement programs to carry the weight. I am not comfortable with > the idea that every time I ride on a road I like, I will be getting > billed. > > A substantial part of my enjoyment of riding comes from the fact that > it is unstructured. Can you imagine having to gaze at some sort of > fee chart based on time of day\volume of traffic to compute today's > additional fees for your riding pleasure > > You want to reduce traffic? Make it affordable for > people to live near > where they work. Give an incentive to car pool, or rideshare in the > form of a tax credit. The last thing I need is yet another automated > government controlled system that automatically lightens my > pocketbook. > > > > > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 10:29:43 2005 Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 10:29:35 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Julian Halton Subject: Re: Choosing Your T Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX On Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:48:31 -0500, Julian Halton wrote: > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A27464-2005Feb15.html?nav= > hcmodule > > My visceral reaction is "leave me alone". Why are you so worried abourt > funding? Divert some of the money from your automated traffic > enforcement programs to carry the weight. I am not comfortable with the > idea that every time I ride on a road I like, I will be getting billed. > > A substantial part of my enjoyment of riding comes from the fact that it > is unstructured. Can you imagine having to gaze at some sort of fee > chart based on time of day\volume of traffic to compute today's > additional fees for your riding pleasure > > You want to reduce traffic? Make it affordable for people to live near > where they work. Give an incentive to car pool, or rideshare in the > form of a tax credit. The last thing I need is yet another automated > government controlled system that automatically lightens my pocketbook. > > As far as I call tell, the proposals described in the WaPo are for old-fashioned toll roads. There's a related story out of California, about something more insidious, a GPS-enabled "tax-by-the-mile" on all your peregrinations, not just a system of high-density toll roads. File this under the Law of Unintended Consequences. Despite all the Sturm und Drang about "gas-guzzling" SUVs, our transportation bureaucracy is (apparently) deeply worried that increased fuel economy is going to take a big bite out of fuel tax receipts and, consequently, "their" money. Seems they've figured out a so-called hybrid getting (allegedly) 60 mpg takes up just as much room on the highway as the Family Truckster that gets 12 mpg. Only the FT is paying five times the fuel tax for the asphalt space in my hypothetical situation. This is the very same point I made in a post about hybrids in the Virginia HOV lanes and the DC Council's headlong rush to dole out favors to hybrid owners. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 12:33:22 2005 Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 09:33:14 -0800 (PST) From: Carl Custer Subject: Thinking of Summer? To: DCCycles Here' a URL posted on SabMag showing bits of the Cherohala Skyway and Willville Campground on the BRP: Should start you thinking of "what to do this summer?" Plus a host of URLs taken by Geezers in Baja last month: Synopsis: Pete "Pedro" Springer loaned out five motorcycles (1983-85 1100 cc V-4 Hondas & one DR350) to east coast geezers (ME, NJ, MD & FL -- three of us had been born in Nov & Dec of 1940!). Some left coast locals joined us. We started in Oceanside, CA (north of San Diego); did a shakedown camp at Ocotillo Wells (By the Salton Sea); chilled out at Coyote Cal)B’s hostel in Erenderia; camped in a gully in Catavi)Bña, watched whales in Guererro Negro; camped on the beach south of Mulege)B’, and after several side trips, we returned. A great 10 days but then we did some more mountains in east San Diego County (who knew?) Our narratives are long -- but -- we also took pictures. They)B’re not as good as Michael Jordan’s Alpine Adventures but these are fresh. Pete's first: < http://community.webshots.com/photo/266694719/266696089DYvjXY> Pete's second: http://community.webshots.com/photo/266718312/266719378LjwOmD Jim's; Tom's: < http://mysite.verizon.net/res8j4jm/Quick%20page%20on%20Baja%20trip.htm > Rogers:: Norm)B’s: (Alas, no captions) Ye's: Mine: Carl in Bethesda __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Read only the mail you want - Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 12:55:23 2005 Subject: Arlington Riding Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 12:55:21 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "DCCycles" So there I was heading Northbound towards checking up on mom enjoying my ride while making the not so smart mental move of considering my place in the cosmos and why would I need to live in a city anyhow (see article on tolls to understand). I am in the right lane cruising at about six above the posted speed limit of 35. Rounding a bend I see the familiar silhouette of a blue and white Harley and the even more familiar silhouette of lets call him stone dedicated skinny Nick. Flashbacks to Jan 04, I casually roll of the throttle and glide on by. Worried that he may follow me I have my eyes in the rear when KA-blang I hit a "dent" in the road hard enough to jar the anatomy into the tank. Visions of dented rims in my head, I sourly and slightly sorely make my way to my parent's home in DC. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 13:32:31 2005 Subject: RE: Arlington Riding Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:32:24 -0500 From: "Jonathan W. Kalmes" To: "Julian Halton" , "DCCycles" >when KA-blang I hit a "dent" >in the road hard enough to jar the anatomy into the tank. >Visions of dented rims in my head, I sourly and slightly >sorely make my way to my parent's home in DC. Julian, that's probably not the best way of addressing your relationship questions earlier. :P --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 13:58:21 2005 Subject: RE: Arlington Riding Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 13:58:18 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "Jonathan W. Kalmes" , "DCCycles" Oh yeah...my point was...all you NOVA riders...heavy LEO presence around North Glebe from Fairfax Drive to Chain Bridge. -----Original Message----- From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 16:36:30 2005 From: "Gary Foreman" To: "'DCCycles'" Subject: OT: 3M Paint Protectant Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 16:37:49 -0500 Has anyone here ever applied, or had installed the 3M Paint Protectant on the front of their cage? My Brother-in-law had it on his Porsche, and it really seemed to do a good job of protecting it, and was almost invisible unless you were right on top of it. http://www.clearmask.com/ I'd really like someone who knows what they are doing install it on my new Accord. Thanks Gary Foreman PS, to get On-Topic I noticed that Loudoun Motorsports has THREE track days at Summit this year! 6/30 8/8 10/10 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 16 23:37:59 2005 Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2005 23:37:56 -0500 From: Sean Jordan To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, Thomas Jordan , Papa work Subject: This could be fun . . . http://www.motocross.com/story_2244.htm - Sean Jordan From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 12:26:19 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:40:40 -0500 Not really but there are MC officers popping people for going to fast through the smart tag lanes at the main toll plaza. I saw 4 MC offices with 4 people pulled over. I am not even sure how fast your supposed to go through them. I usaully slow down to about 45mph. -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 12:32:31 2005 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:32:23 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Rob Sharp Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Cc: DC-Cycles On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:40:40 -0500, Rob Sharp wrote: > Not really but there are MC officers popping people for going to fast through > the smart tag lanes at the main toll plaza. > > I am not even sure how fast your supposed to go through them. I usaully slow > down to about 45mph. Posted for 35 mph. Prevailing speed is about 50. A bike going 35 through there has a new designation: speed bump. Maybe the LEO presence will calm things down. VDOT wants to raise the toll 25 cents at the main plaza and each exit. To pay the state's share of Dulles Metrorail extension. The Commonwealth Transportation Board is holding hearings this week on the hike. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 13:20:19 2005 From: "Perry Coleman" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:19:53 -0500 I have a feeling that they are trying to ratchet the speed down. I get on via the Spring Hill entrance as often as not, and you pretty much have to be going 35, or less, to get the system to register you and indicate that you've paid - and this is in the cage! I haven't tried it on the bike yet. Along I-95, at least in MD, the toll system makes you come almost to a complete stop before it registers the SmartTag/FastToll. If you go through too fast, you will get a notice in the mail. Perry >From: Paul Wilson >Reply-To: Paul Wilson >To: Rob Sharp >CC: DC-Cycles >Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? >Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:32:23 -0500 > >On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:40:40 -0500, Rob Sharp wrote: > > Not really but there are MC officers popping people for going to fast >through > > the smart tag lanes at the main toll plaza. > > > > I am not even sure how fast your supposed to go through them. I usaully >slow > > down to about 45mph. > >Posted for 35 mph. Prevailing speed is about 50. A bike going 35 >through there has a new designation: speed bump. Maybe the LEO >presence will calm things down. > >VDOT wants to raise the toll 25 cents at the main plaza and each exit. > To pay the state's share of Dulles Metrorail extension. The >Commonwealth Transportation Board is holding hearings this week on the >hike. > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 13:42:21 2005 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:42:14 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Perry Coleman Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:19:53 -0500, Perry Coleman wrote: > I have a feeling that they are trying to ratchet the speed down. I get on > via the Spring Hill entrance as often as not, and you pretty much have to be > going 35, or less, to get the system to register you and indicate that > you've paid - and this is in the cage! I haven't tried it on the bike yet. > > Along I-95, at least in MD, the toll system makes you come almost to a > complete stop before it registers the SmartTag/FastToll. If you go through > too fast, you will get a notice in the mail. > > Perry > Toll increase appears to be a done deal. Effective May 22. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A32341-2005Feb17.html As for the speed in the E-Zed-Pass lanes. Personal experience demonstrates they work at speeds considerably higher than the posted limits. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 13:47:11 2005 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:47:07 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Paul Wilson Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Cc: Perry Coleman , dc-cycles@XXXXXX > As for the speed in the E-Zed-Pass lanes. Personal experience > demonstrates they work at speeds considerably higher than the posted > limits. I have no idea how fast one can go so they will still register. I am not willing to state how quickly I have gone with a good tag read ;-) Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 13:50:14 2005 From: "Perry Coleman" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:49:25 -0500 I was relating my personal experience as well. Let's all be careful out there... >From: Paul Wilson >Reply-To: Paul Wilson >To: Perry Coleman >CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? >Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:42:14 -0500 > >On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:19:53 -0500, Perry Coleman > wrote: > > I have a feeling that they are trying to ratchet the speed down. I get >on > > via the Spring Hill entrance as often as not, and you pretty much have >to be > > going 35, or less, to get the system to register you and indicate that > > you've paid - and this is in the cage! I haven't tried it on the bike >yet. > > > > Along I-95, at least in MD, the toll system makes you come almost to a > > complete stop before it registers the SmartTag/FastToll. If you go >through > > too fast, you will get a notice in the mail. > > > > Perry > > >Toll increase appears to be a done deal. Effective May 22. > >http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A32341-2005Feb17.html > >As for the speed in the E-Zed-Pass lanes. Personal experience >demonstrates they work at speeds considerably higher than the posted >limits. > >-- >Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org >95 VFR - 90 KLR > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 14:24:28 2005 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:24:17 -0500 From: Aaron Maurer To: DC-Cycles Subject: DC Inspection Having done it today, I can confirm that motorcycles are now eligible for 2-year inspections and 2-year registrations in the District. Good news. Too bad we still have to journey to that shining throne of patronage -- the official DC inspection station -- to get it done when every state in the Union lets you go to any number of privately-owned service stations instead. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 14:48:21 2005 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:48:13 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Aaron Maurer Subject: Re: DC Inspection Cc: DC-Cycles On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:24:17 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: > Having done it today, I can confirm that motorcycles are now eligible > for 2-year inspections and 2-year registrations in the District. Good > news. > > Too bad we still have to journey to that shining throne of patronage > -- the official DC inspection station -- to get it done when every > state in the Union lets you go to any number of privately-owned > service stations instead. > That's not entirely true. In Illinois (Chicago and St. Louis metro areas) you had to go to a state-contractor-run facility for the emissions inspection. There is no general vehicle safety inspection in Illinois. At least the DC-employee inspectors have no economic incentive to find problems, unlike if you went to a sleazeball private garage. I think the West Virginia Ave. station is supposed to re-open during my lifetime. Then we're have *two* shining thrones of patronage once again. :) -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 16:08:42 2005 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:08:34 -0500 From: Aaron Maurer To: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: DC Inspection Okay, having been corrected, let me state that "any state in the Union" was hyperbole. But the DC inspection station setup still sucks. On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:24:17 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: > Having done it today, I can confirm that motorcycles are now eligible > for 2-year inspections and 2-year registrations in the District. Good > news. > > Too bad we still have to journey to that shining throne of patronage > -- the official DC inspection station -- to get it done when every > state in the Union lets you go to any number of privately-owned > service stations instead. > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 18:25:28 2005 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 18:21:34 -0500 From: skip CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Michael Jordan wrote: > > > As for the speed in the E-Zed-Pass lanes. Personal experience > > demonstrates they work at speeds considerably higher than the posted > > limits. > > I have no idea how fast one can go so they will still register. > > I am not willing to state how quickly I have gone with a good tag read ;-) > > Michael J. I have a friend who had that very question... so the first day he went through on his way home from work at 70. no issue. Next day 85. no issue. Next day, 100. no issue. He said to himself, "you know what? there doesn't seem to be a limit that I can reach where it won't register." next day he goes through at 35. there's a cop shooting radar. :~) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 19:41:21 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "Perry Coleman" , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:55:46 -0500 In Upstate NY along I90/Thruway it's 5mph and if you speed you get your photo taken and a ticket issued. I think it's that way because there are works in all the exits that may have to walk inbetween lanes and they don't want someone to get hurt. Rob On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:19:53 -0500, Perry Coleman wrote > I have a feeling that they are trying to ratchet the speed down. I > get on via the Spring Hill entrance as often as not, and you pretty > much have to be going 35, or less, to get the system to register you > and indicate that you've paid - and this is in the cage! I haven't > tried it on the bike yet. > > Along I-95, at least in MD, the toll system makes you come almost to > a complete stop before it registers the SmartTag/FastToll. If you go > through too fast, you will get a notice in the mail. > > Perry > > >From: Paul Wilson > >Reply-To: Paul Wilson > >To: Rob Sharp > >CC: DC-Cycles > >Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? > >Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:32:23 -0500 > > > >On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:40:40 -0500, Rob Sharp wrote: > > > Not really but there are MC officers popping people for going to fast > >through > > > the smart tag lanes at the main toll plaza. > > > > > > I am not even sure how fast your supposed to go through them. I usaully > >slow > > > down to about 45mph. > > > >Posted for 35 mph. Prevailing speed is about 50. A bike going 35 > >through there has a new designation: speed bump. Maybe the LEO > >presence will calm things down. > > > >VDOT wants to raise the toll 25 cents at the main plaza and each exit. > > To pay the state's share of Dulles Metrorail extension. The > >Commonwealth Transportation Board is holding hearings this week on the > >hike. > > -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 19:42:43 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: Paul Wilson , Perry Coleman Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:57:07 -0500 Wont register at 75 with the tag stuck in the windscreen/dash of my VFR ;-D I was going the speed of traffic too.. Rob On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:42:14 -0500, Paul Wilson wrote > On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:19:53 -0500, Perry Coleman > wrote: > > I have a feeling that they are trying to ratchet the speed down. I get on > > via the Spring Hill entrance as often as not, and you pretty much have to be > > going 35, or less, to get the system to register you and indicate that > > you've paid - and this is in the cage! I haven't tried it on the bike yet. > > > > Along I-95, at least in MD, the toll system makes you come almost to a > > complete stop before it registers the SmartTag/FastToll. If you go through > > too fast, you will get a notice in the mail. > > > > Perry > > > Toll increase appears to be a done deal. Effective May 22. > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A32341-2005Feb17.html > > As for the speed in the E-Zed-Pass lanes. Personal experience > demonstrates they work at speeds considerably higher than the posted > limits. > > -- > Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org > 95 VFR - 90 KLR -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 21:01:09 2005 From: "rich hall" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 21:00:15 -0500 I think you've got it in the wrong place then, from what I've heard. As for the 5mph speed limit, I was guessing this was because they have the Tag lanes mixed in w/ the cash lanes and it's to keep the speeds close. In NJ where they've moved the Tag lanes away from the cash lanes, they've also upped the speed in the Tag lane. >From: "Rob Sharp" >To: Paul Wilson , Perry Coleman > >CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? >Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:57:07 -0500 > >Wont register at 75 with the tag stuck in the windscreen/dash of my VFR ;-D >I was going the speed of traffic too.. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 17 22:43:41 2005 Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2005 19:43:18 -0800 (PST) From: "James O'Connor" Subject: Re: Toll increase on Dulles Toll Road? To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX This is where I keep mine on the ZRX. It is sandwiched between my gauge cluster and windscreen. I have it wrapped in a heavy sock that is rubber banded on, stuck inside a zip lock bag. Works just fine for me, though I haven't tested it above 50 or so, and I do aim to ride directly under the boxes that pick up/send data. fyi - stuck in sock to make it the right size to squeeze between windscreen and gauges. tested different layering combinations of sock/tag in the truck first, and found that no matter how many times i wrapped it up, it still registered. - Jimmy --- rich hall wrote: > I think you've got it in the wrong place then, from what I've > heard. > >From: "Rob Sharp" > >Wont register at 75 with the tag stuck in the windscreen/dash of > my VFR ;-D __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 08:19:19 2005 From: "W.S." To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: Re: DC Inspection Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:18:53 -0500 From: Paul Wilson . . .snip I think the West Virginia Ave. station is supposed to re-open during my lifetime. Then we're have *two* shining thrones of patronage once again. :) *********** From the WaPo District Extra this a.m. comes this pessimistic news: "With DMV Station in Limbo, NE Businesses Try to Hold On" http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A29121-2005Feb16.html (requires signin) Bill S. / DC (on digest) '99 VN750 > Shy. Don't like inspections. Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 11:45:38 2005 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 08:45:30 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Outstanding! To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Best news I've heard in weeks http://wtopnews.com/?sid=424274&nid=25 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 12:00:14 2005 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:59:55 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: Outstanding! To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Dysart: >Best news I've heard in weeks > >http://wtopnews.com/?sid=424274&nid=25 [Dave] Yabadabadooooo ! Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 12:42:23 2005 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 12:42:07 -0500 From: Aaron Maurer To: Dave Yates Subject: Re: Outstanding! Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX It's been debated at length before, here and other places, but my personal view is that red light cameras are not a bad thing. Now, speed cameras are a different beast entirely... On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 11:59:55 -0500, Dave Yates wrote: > Dysart: > > >Best news I've heard in weeks > > > >http://wtopnews.com/?sid=424274&nid=25 > > [Dave] Yabadabadooooo ! > Dave Yates > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 13:01:26 2005 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 10:01:04 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Outstanding! To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I guess that all depends on how you look at it. To me they are both evil. Glenn --- Aaron Maurer wrote: > It's been debated at length before, here and other > places, but my > personal view is that red light cameras are not a > bad thing. Now, > speed cameras are a different beast entirely... > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 13:04:30 2005 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:04:25 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: Outstanding! To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I just got an email from a friend who was at the meeting of MPPS. about a dozen UnFairTax officers there to boo hoo about it. BAD officer. No donut. > >I guess that all depends on how you look at it. To me >they are both evil. > >Glenn > >--- Aaron Maurer wrote: > >> It's been debated at length before, here and other >> places, but my >> personal view is that red light cameras are not a >> bad thing. Now, >> speed cameras are a different beast entirely... >> > > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! >http://my.yahoo.com > > Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 14:32:15 2005 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:33:37 -0500 To: Aaron Maurer From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Outstanding! Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I'm glad they decided against them for the reason they did...that's the objection I've had to them from day one. They could have decided against them for several other reasons and it shows a good level of understanding of the principles this country was founded on that they came down as they did. Bravo! -- Mike B. At 12:42 PM 2/18/05 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: >It's been debated at length before, here and other places, but my >personal view is that red light cameras are not a bad thing. Now, >speed cameras are a different beast entirely... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 14:57:16 2005 From: "Perry Coleman" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Outstanding! Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:56:29 -0500 Hmmm... Howzabout they put a couple of officers at different intersections, at different times, on different days and ticket everyone who runs the red light. Oh, wait! That's actual work. Besides, it is easier to sit back on a wide open road and pop 'em with Lidar... Perry >From: Dave Yates >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Re: Outstanding! >Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:04:25 -0500 > >I just got an email from a friend who was at the meeting of >MPPS. about a dozen UnFairTax officers there to boo hoo >about it. > >BAD officer. No donut. > > > > > > >I guess that all depends on how you look at it. To me > >they are both evil. > > > >Glenn > > > >--- Aaron Maurer wrote: > > > >> It's been debated at length before, here and other > >> places, but my > >> personal view is that red light cameras are not a > >> bad thing. Now, > >> speed cameras are a different beast entirely... > >> > > > > > > > > > >__________________________________ > >Do you Yahoo!? > >The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! > >http://my.yahoo.com > > > > >Dave Yates > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 17:07:44 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "Perry Coleman" , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Outstanding! Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 17:22:16 -0500 Are there any law enforcement officers on the list? Rob On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:56:29 -0500, Perry Coleman wrote > Hmmm... Howzabout they put a couple of officers at different > intersections, at different times, on different days and ticket > everyone who runs the red light. Oh, wait! That's actual work. > Besides, it is easier to sit back on a wide open road and pop 'em > with Lidar... > > Perry > > >From: Dave Yates > >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > >Subject: Re: Outstanding! > >Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 13:04:25 -0500 > > > >I just got an email from a friend who was at the meeting of > >MPPS. about a dozen UnFairTax officers there to boo hoo > >about it. > > > >BAD officer. No donut. > > > > > > > > > > > >I guess that all depends on how you look at it. To me > > >they are both evil. > > > > > >Glenn > > > > > >--- Aaron Maurer wrote: > > > > > >> It's been debated at length before, here and other > > >> places, but my > > >> personal view is that red light cameras are not a > > >> bad thing. Now, > > >> speed cameras are a different beast entirely... > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >__________________________________ > > >Do you Yahoo!? > > >The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! > > >http://my.yahoo.com > > > > > > > >Dave Yates > > -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 20:49:32 2005 From: Daniel To: Aaron Maurer Cc: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: DC Inspection Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:49:06 -0500 Did you have to wait in line long? there are a couple of guys there that ride.. and sometimes they'll call bikes to come up to the front.. On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:08:34 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: >Okay, having been corrected, let me state that "any state in the >Union" was hyperbole. But the DC inspection station setup still >sucks. > > > >On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:24:17 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: >> Having done it today, I can confirm that motorcycles are now eligible >> for 2-year inspections and 2-year registrations in the District. Good >> news. >> >> Too bad we still have to journey to that shining throne of patronage >> -- the official DC inspection station -- to get it done when every >> state in the Union lets you go to any number of privately-owned >> service stations instead. >> From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 20:54:21 2005 From: Daniel To: "Mike B." Cc: Aaron Maurer , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Outstanding! Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:54:10 -0500 I concur 100%. as far as safety, They should lengthen yellow slightly.. or delay between Red to green where all 4 are red for a split second longer.. something like that. Also have stiffer penalties for people who actually have/cause accidents.. maybe people would tail gate less if they know that they willl lose thier liscense if they are involved in an accidnet from tailgaiting.. On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:33:37 -0500, "Mike B." wrote: >I'm glad they decided against them for the reason they did...that's the >objection I've had to them from day one. They could have decided against >them for several other reasons and it shows a good level of understanding >of the principles this country was founded on that they came down as they >did. Bravo! > >-- Mike B. > >At 12:42 PM 2/18/05 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: >>It's been debated at length before, here and other places, but my >>personal view is that red light cameras are not a bad thing. Now, >>speed cameras are a different beast entirely... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 18 23:54:11 2005 Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:54:03 -0800 (PST) From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: Outstanding! To: dc-cycles At 12:42 PM 2/18/05 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: >It's been debated at length before, here and other places, but my >personal view is that red light cameras are not a bad thing. Now, >speed cameras are a different beast entirely... Apart from libertarian issues, which some of you seem to hold above the interests of public safety, I'm with Aaron on this one. I don't give a damn about speeding, except in obvious cases of recklessness, but we need all the redlight enforcement we can get, primarily because US drivers are, in general, selfish morons. For example, in Virginia, as in many other states, a yellow light mean "stop, unless you cannot do so safely". Not one in a hundred licensed drivers understands the legal or logical distinction between this and a requirement to "stop, if you can do so safely." -- Larry __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 19 02:48:40 2005 From: Daniel To: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" Cc: dc-cycles Subject: Re: Outstanding! Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 02:48:20 -0500 In maryland highschool drivers ed, I was taught yellow means clear the intersection safely, either by stopping or going through if you are carrying too much speed and have to. I _guess_ that's the same thing. On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:54:03 -0800 (PST), "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" wrote: >At 12:42 PM 2/18/05 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: >>It's been debated at length before, here and other places, but my >>personal view is that red light cameras are not a bad thing. Now, >>speed cameras are a different beast entirely... > >Apart from libertarian issues, which some of you seem to hold above the interests >of public safety, I'm with Aaron on this one. I don't give a damn about speeding, >except in obvious cases of recklessness, but we need all the redlight enforcement >we can get, primarily because US drivers are, in general, selfish morons. > >For example, in Virginia, as in many other states, a yellow light mean "stop, >unless you cannot do so safely". Not one in a hundred licensed drivers >understands the legal or logical distinction between this and a requirement to >"stop, if you can do so safely." > >-- Larry > > > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 19 08:07:29 2005 Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 05:07:18 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Withrow Subject: Re: Outstanding! To: Rob Sharp , Perry Coleman , dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- Rob Sharp wrote: > Are there any law enforcement officers on the list? > > Rob > No. They all left because they got tired of all the unmitigated fucksticks on this list that think cops lie, cheat and steal just to write a ticket. They also get tired of the whole "revenue generator" bullshit. Especially considering that Fairfax County spends more in police overtime just to man the cruisers than the County collects from traffic fines. They left because the whiney bitches who get traffic tickets piss and moan endlessly about how it is ok for THEM to speed through traffic because they are better than everyone else, but somebody should do something about those OTHERS that are hazardous. They got tired of folks complaining about some traffic/crime issue that needs to be addressed, the same people that don't want to pay taxes and hire more officers. They got tired of ignorant assholes complaining about shit they know nothing about. Did that answer your question? By the way, how do I unsubscribe? ===== AIM: Inf DS http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow ----------------------------------------------------------- Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to childproof the world. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 19 12:11:20 2005 Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:11:12 -0500 From: Aaron Maurer To: Daniel Subject: Re: DC Inspection Cc: DC-Cycles Not that long... about 1:30 from in to out. (10:45 am on a Thursday). I was not called up to the front, despite asking if there was a "separate" line for bikes when I first got there. Ridiculous, really. They didn't even do the half-hearted inspection (checking signals, brake lights, etc.) as I got last time. Just BSed about the bike and sent me around front to wait for my sticker. On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:49:06 -0500, Daniel wrote: > Did you have to wait in line long? there are a couple of guys there > that ride.. and sometimes they'll call bikes to come up to the > front.. > > On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:08:34 -0500, Aaron Maurer > wrote: > > >Okay, having been corrected, let me state that "any state in the > >Union" was hyperbole. But the DC inspection station setup still > >sucks. > > > > > > > >On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:24:17 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: > >> Having done it today, I can confirm that motorcycles are now eligible > >> for 2-year inspections and 2-year registrations in the District. Good > >> news. > >> > >> Too bad we still have to journey to that shining throne of patronage > >> -- the official DC inspection station -- to get it done when every > >> state in the Union lets you go to any number of privately-owned > >> service stations instead. > >> > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 19 16:47:11 2005 From: "Perry Coleman" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Outstanding! Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 16:45:31 -0500 Gosh, Todd, I didn't know that you spoke for all of the LEO's. Thanks for the insight. Since I don't want to speak for the list admin, I'll leave it for him to tell you how to unsubscribe - or for you to figure it out for yourself. Perry >From: Todd Withrow >To: Rob Sharp , Perry Coleman , >dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Re: Outstanding! >Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 05:07:18 -0800 (PST) > > >--- Rob Sharp wrote: > > > Are there any law enforcement officers on the list? > > > > Rob > > > > >No. They all left because they got tired of all the >unmitigated fucksticks on this list that think cops >lie, cheat and steal just to write a ticket. They also >get tired of the whole "revenue generator" bullshit. >Especially considering that Fairfax County spends more >in police overtime just to man the cruisers than the >County collects from traffic fines. They left because >the whiney bitches who get traffic tickets piss and >moan endlessly about how it is ok for THEM to speed >through traffic because they are better than everyone >else, but somebody should do something about those >OTHERS that are hazardous. They got tired of folks >complaining about some traffic/crime issue that needs >to be addressed, the same people that don't want to >pay taxes and hire more officers. They got tired of >ignorant assholes complaining about shit they know >nothing about. > >Did that answer your question? > > >By the way, how do I unsubscribe? > >===== >AIM: Inf DS > >http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow > >----------------------------------------------------------- >Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to >childproof the world. > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail - Easier than ever with enhanced search. Learn more. >http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 19 19:50:52 2005 From: Daniel To: Aaron Maurer Cc: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: DC Inspection Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2005 19:50:30 -0500 what kind of bike do you have? They might show bias to sportbikes, since they are younger and ride them.. well at least the two guys I know. On Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:11:12 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: >Not that long... about 1:30 from in to out. (10:45 am on a Thursday). > I was not called up to the front, despite asking if there was a >"separate" line for bikes when I first got there. > >Ridiculous, really. They didn't even do the half-hearted inspection >(checking signals, brake lights, etc.) as I got last time. Just BSed >about the bike and sent me around front to wait for my sticker. > > >On Fri, 18 Feb 2005 20:49:06 -0500, Daniel wrote: >> Did you have to wait in line long? there are a couple of guys there >> that ride.. and sometimes they'll call bikes to come up to the >> front.. >> >> On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 16:08:34 -0500, Aaron Maurer >> wrote: >> >> >Okay, having been corrected, let me state that "any state in the >> >Union" was hyperbole. But the DC inspection station setup still >> >sucks. >> > >> > >> > >> >On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:24:17 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: >> >> Having done it today, I can confirm that motorcycles are now eligible >> >> for 2-year inspections and 2-year registrations in the District. Good >> >> news. >> >> >> >> Too bad we still have to journey to that shining throne of patronage >> >> -- the official DC inspection station -- to get it done when every >> >> state in the Union lets you go to any number of privately-owned >> >> service stations instead. >> >> >> >> From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 20 09:09:30 2005 Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 09:09:23 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Aaron Maurer , DC-Cycles Subject: Re: DC Inspection On Sat, 19 Feb 2005 19:50:30 -0500, Daniel wrote: > > what kind of bike do you have? They might show bias to sportbikes, > since they are younger and ride them.. well at least the two guys I > know. > > On Sat, 19 Feb 2005 12:11:12 -0500, Aaron Maurer > wrote: > > >Not that long... about 1:30 from in to out. (10:45 am on a Thursday). > > I was not called up to the front, despite asking if there was a > >"separate" line for bikes when I first got there. > > > >Ridiculous, really. They didn't even do the half-hearted inspection > >(checking signals, brake lights, etc.) as I got last time. Just BSed > >about the bike and sent me around front to wait for my sticker. > > I've had dual-sports, standards and sport-tourers through the DC inspection mill. "How fast that thing go?" seems to be a standard question for DC bike inspections. :-\ I only had a problem once, for aftermarket driving lights. If the line is long, I'll just come back another day. My preference is to go when they first open: 6 AM. It's never taken more than a half hour from initial contact to being on my merry way with sticker attached. They should *love* bikes down there. Inspections are very quick and it no doubt helps them meet their productivity targets. Inspecting a cage requires real, actual work. That being the case, if I had more gumption I'd lobby the council and DMV to eliminate the bike inspection altogether. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 20 13:27:33 2005 Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 13:27:30 -0500 From: Michael Jordan To: Dc-Cycles Subject: MC Parking in Alexandria Does anyone know of any near the US Courthouse off Eisenhower Ave? Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 20 15:39:02 2005 Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 12:38:37 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Outstanding! To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" wrote: > > Apart from libertarian issues, which some of you > seem to hold above the interests > of public safety, I'm with Aaron on this one. I > don't give a damn about speeding, > except in obvious cases of recklessness, but we need > all the redlight enforcement > we can get, primarily because US drivers are, in > general, selfish morons. > Well the real problem IMO with those "Big Brother" red light camera's was this: If you pre-paid the ticket no points were added to your operators license. But try and fight it in court and lose and you get the points. That to me just shows these things were only about generating money. Hell in DC, the mayor admitted on TV they were for that! > For example, in Virginia, as in many other states, a > yellow light mean "stop, > unless you cannot do so safely". Not one in a > hundred licensed drivers > understands the legal or logical distinction between > this and a requirement to > "stop, if you can do so safely." > Where did you learn to drive? Red lights mean stop, not yellow. Glenn __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? All your favorites on one personal page )B– Try My Yahoo! http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 20 17:21:35 2005 Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 17:21:42 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: Cell phone jammers Since I started this topic some time ago, I did some research and found many already in production online. I will concede that jamming a car driver's cell near you may cause them to drive even more erratically when they try to fix the signal. But they would be mighty useful elsewhere. http://www.nypost.com/news/regionalnews/40168.htm Thanks to the list I made a great business contact last week. The Internet just never stops giving! _____________________________________ Mike Troutman mike@XXXXXX http://www.troutman.org/vfr '97 Honda VFR 750 AMA - http://www.amadirectlink.com/ NMA - http://www.motorists.org "I'd rather die while I'm living, then live while I'm dead." - Jimmy Buffett From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 20 17:49:36 2005 Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 17:49:28 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Outstanding! Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX On Sun, 20 Feb 2005 12:38:37 -0800 (PST), Glenn Dysart wrote: > > --- "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" wrote: > > > > > For example, in Virginia, as in many other states, a > > yellow light mean "stop, > > unless you cannot do so safely". Not one in a > > hundred licensed drivers > > understands the legal or logical distinction between > > this and a requirement to > > "stop, if you can do so safely." > > > > Where did you learn to drive? Red lights mean stop, > not yellow. > > Glenn > Back when I took driver's ed folk wisdom said it meant something the "floor it, the light's about to turn red." Here's what the Code of Virginia says: "Steady amber indicates that a change is about to be made in the direction of the moving of traffic. When the amber signal is shown, traffic which has not already entered the intersection, including the crosswalks, shall stop if it is not reasonably safe to continue, but traffic which has already entered the intersection shall continue to move until the intersection has been cleared. The amber signal is a warning that the steady red signal is imminent." -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 20 23:20:33 2005 Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 20:20:25 -0800 (PST) From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: MC Parking in Alexandria To: Michael Jordan , Dc-Cycles People are presently parking motos with impunity on the streets around the PTO, one block from the courthouse. No one has been ticketed yet. Obviously, no guarantees, though. Parking in the USPTO garages is $10 per day. You can park for free over at the big theater complex, but you'd have to walk a couple of blocks. -- Larry --- Michael Jordan wrote: > Does anyone know of any near the US Courthouse off Eisenhower Ave? > > Michael J. > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 21 10:21:45 2005 Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 10:21:32 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: MC Parking in Alexandria Cc: Michael Jordan , Dc-Cycles On Sun, 20 Feb 2005 20:20:25 -0800 (PST), pltrgyst@XXXXXX wrote: > People are presently parking motos with impunity on the streets around the PTO, > one block from the courthouse. No one has been ticketed yet. Obviously, no > guarantees, though. > > Parking in the USPTO garages is $10 per day. You can park for free over at the > big theater complex, but you'd have to walk a couple of blocks. > > -- Larry > > --- Michael Jordan wrote: > > > Does anyone know of any near the US Courthouse off Eisenhower Ave? > > > > Michael J. > > Perhaps it's different over by the PTO, but in Old Town proper, the meter maids and ticket writers (in their dorky three-wheelers) put their DC counterparts to shame when it comes to writing up penny-ante violations. This is where I got a two-fer ticket for (1) failing to park parallel to the curb and (2) a "no parking zone" violation for squeezing in between two cages. I park off-street now. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 21 10:44:16 2005 Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 07:44:09 -0800 (PST) From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: MC Parking in Alexandria To: Michael Jordan Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > PTO? > > That's a TLA I'm not familiar with Patent and Trademark Office (power take off, permeability tuned oscillator, etc.) -- Larry __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 21 12:40:29 2005 From: Daniel To: Paul Wilson Cc: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" , Michael Jordan , Dc-Cycles Subject: Re: MC Parking in Alexandria Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2005 12:40:06 -0500 >violations. This is where I got a two-fer ticket for (1) failing to >park parallel to the curb and (2) a "no parking zone" violation for >squeezing in between two cages. I park off-street now. That sounds like double jeapardy or something.. If there's no parking there, how can you park there improperly (or properly)? From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 22 07:33:05 2005 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 04:32:54 -0800 (PST) From: Steve Beck Subject: Re: Outstanding! To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- Todd Withrow wrote: > > --- Rob Sharp wrote: > > > Are there any law enforcement officers on the > list? > > > > Rob > > > > > No. They all left because they got tired of all the > unmitigated fucksticks on this list that think cops > lie, cheat and steal just to write a ticket. They > also Big snip of meaningless drivel. > get tired of the whole "revenue generator" bullshit. > to be addressed, the same people that don't want to > pay taxes and hire more officers. They got tired of > ignorant assholes complaining about shit they know > nothing about. > > Did that answer your question? > > > By the way, how do I unsubscribe? Maybe they left because they got tired of mental midgets who throw a tantrum and then can't figure out how to unsubscribe. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today! http://my.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 22 09:14:42 2005 X-Sasl-Enc: BZhh3EnpPGCJ0nIkZ0pO7E1x6hItV4Jfx8hMoxRIuXup 1109081674 From: "Louis F. Caplan" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Yom HaShoah Ride Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:14:34 -0500 For Jewish and even non-Jewish riders out there who may be interested, there are 5 Jewish Motorcycle groups from Miami to Toronto who will be meeting to ride to the Holocaust Memorial in Washington DC this May. They'll also be hitting the HD factory in York before hand. Details are still being worked out, but the overall plan is available here: http://www.jewishbikers.com/ Louis ======= "Admiral" Louis Caplan 1998 Kawasaki Concours Fairfax, VA Pls consider helping me support the Pediatric Brain Tumor Foundation: http://www.geocities.com/nighthawk700/rideforkids.htm From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 22 13:11:45 2005 Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 13:11:36 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Daniel Subject: Re: MC Parking in Alexandria Cc: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" , Michael Jordan , Dc-Cycles On Mon, 21 Feb 2005 12:40:06 -0500, Daniel wrote: > > >violations. This is where I got a two-fer ticket for (1) failing to > >park parallel to the curb and (2) a "no parking zone" violation for > >squeezing in between two cages. I park off-street now. > > That sounds like double jeapardy or something.. If there's no parking > there, how can you park there improperly (or properly)? > Don't ask me. I did get the ticket thrown out, but the adjudicator made no promises that I wouldn't be ticketed for it again. Alexandria City Code says a vehicles must be parked parallel to the curb: no exceptions. The no parking thing was probably because it was in the meter zone. There was a leftover space between two meter "boxes", not signed or painted as no parking. They wrote it up anyway, probably cheesed because seeing my plate required an exit from the climate-controller three-wheeler. :) -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 11:14:37 2005 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 11:14:19 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC Cycles Subject: Track day? Hey all... didn't someone attend a track day last weekend? If so, sorry I missed it, had husband-duties to attend. :( How'd it go? --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 12:49:19 2005 From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 12:49:05 EST Subject: American SuperCamp To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Hey gang, Can't remember who else was trying to sign up for the April 15-16 dates in DE but, I've got some news. I just called and found out it ain't looking good for e getting in that weekend. I'm still #4 on the list. However, he told me that they were going to be putting up some October dates sometime this week or next. I canceled my slot for April and am going to try and get in in October. Anyone else interested, keep an eye out. Scooter From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 18:48:37 2005 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 15:48:08 -0800 (PST) From: Ian Schmidt Subject: Websites/resources for finding Track Schools/Days To: DCcycles Hey everyone, I was just wondering where people were going to get info on trackdays and schools, in this area specifically. I haven't done a lot of searching yet but was wondering if there are better sites than others and that sort of thing. Ian 2000 R6-I like to think of her as a Sonya __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 18:56:01 2005 From: "Gary Foreman" To: "'DCcycles'" Subject: RE: Websites/resources for finding Track Schools/Days Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 18:57:35 -0500 Loudoun Motorsports has three track days lined up this year for Summit Point. 6/30 8/8 10/10 Gary Foreman -----Original Message----- From: Ian Schmidt [mailto:schmidtys311@XXXXXX] To: DCcycles Subject: Websites/resources for finding Track Schools/Days Hey everyone, I was just wondering where people were going to get info on trackdays and schools, in this area specifically. I haven't done a lot of searching yet but was wondering if there are better sites than others and that sort of thing. Ian 2000 R6-I like to think of her as a Sonya __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 19:10:29 2005 From: "Lisa Goddard" To: "DC Cycles" Subject: question, VA Driver's license Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:10:15 -0500 Hi everyone, I have an easy question for the Virginia licensed drivers out there. Are VA driver's licenses numbered by your Social Security number? Thanks, Lisa Goddard Maryland licensed '95 VFR '97 GSXR 600, track only From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 19:15:07 2005 From: "Bruce N" To: "Lisa Goddard" , "DC Cycles" Subject: Re: question, VA Driver's license Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:13:42 -0500 X-UserInfo: 491cc520d85f37050654855667ce7bc9:eef17f84dc61b2cfa83f34354b81b18b X-User: bcn@XXXXXX You have the option to have a generic number if you want. My wife and I both have them. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa Goddard" To: "DC Cycles" Subject: question, VA Driver's license > > Hi everyone, > > I have an easy question for the Virginia licensed drivers out there. Are > VA > driver's licenses numbered by your Social Security number? > > Thanks, > Lisa Goddard > Maryland licensed > '95 VFR > '97 GSXR 600, track only > > > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 19:20:56 2005 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:20:42 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC Cycles Subject: Re: question, VA Driver's license > > I have an easy question for the Virginia licensed drivers out there. Are > > VA > > driver's licenses numbered by your Social Security number? > You have the option to have a generic number if you want. My wife and I both > have them. Actually they changed that (end of last year I think). It used to be SSN by default or something else if you requested it. Now it's thier own funky number and not associated with your SSN number. --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 19:25:12 2005 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:25:27 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: Re: question, VA Driver's license not anymore. At 07:10 PM 2/23/2005, you wrote: >Hi everyone, > >I have an easy question for the Virginia licensed drivers out there. Are VA >driver's licenses numbered by your Social Security number? > >Thanks, >Lisa Goddard >Maryland licensed >'95 VFR >'97 GSXR 600, track only ______________________________________ Mike Troutman mike@XXXXXX http://www.troutman.org IM: mtroutma@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 19:49:02 2005 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:48:54 -0500 To: dc-cycles From: Aki Damme Subject: Re: question, VA Driver's license >Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 19:13:14 -0500 >To: "Lisa Goddard" >From: Aki Damme >Subject: Re: question, VA Driver's license > >At 07:10 PM 2/23/2005, you wrote: > >>Hi everyone, >> >>I have an easy question for the Virginia licensed drivers >>out there. Are VA >>driver's licenses numbered by your Social Security >>number? >> >>Thanks, >>Lisa Goddard >>Maryland licensed >>'95 VFR >>'97 GSXR 600, track only > > >not anymore. Only the old ones are but you can >remove your SSN anytime by >getting a duplicate and getting a random number assigned. > >-aki From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 23 23:08:36 2005 From: "Gary Foreman" To: "'dc-cycles'" Subject: OT: 2 Cages for sale Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2005 23:10:11 -0500 Excuse the intrusion :-) I have two Honda's for sale if you know anyone interested. Damn good in the snow! 1991 Accord LX 4D Sedan, Auto Transmission, 172K Miles Recently had Shift cable replaced. New tires, aluminum rims. Minor crunch on right front fender. Passes inspection, cosmetic only. New Axles CV joints/brake pads and rotors installed at 169k $2500 http://www.tl1000.com/91accord/91acrd04.jpg 1994 Honda Civic DX 4D Sedan, 5 Speed manual, 90K Miles I purchased in 2003 with 73K Had Timing Belt and Water Pump replaced when purchased. Replaced Rotors and pads when purchased. Tires were new when purchased. New clutch Master and Slave (OEM) being installed now. Installed LX Instruments with TACH AM/FM with CD Plus stock HU. Premium speakers. Has some hail dings in paint, minor scratches. Runs flawless. Tranny is tight. No rust. $3500 http://gwfweb.com/family/031025/civicdx4.jpg PS, if you live in Nigeria and want to pay me $20k for them....never mind. Gary Foreman From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 09:09:23 2005 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:00:30 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: Chris Weaver? Anyone heard from Chris? I have emailed him with no response, I have a new hosting provider for dccycles.com - I found 2U colo space for $110/month, so the site can stay on my server. But if I don't hear from Chris in the next week or two, he is going to lose the dccycles.com domain in the shuffle. ______________________________________ Mike Troutman mike@XXXXXX http://www.troutman.org IM: mtroutma@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 09:28:09 2005 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:28:01 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Dc-Cycles Subject: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City Subject line dedicated to the late Hunter S. Thompson. Anyway, I'd like to thank all the snowophobes who stayed home today. I had a very easy, uncongested ride to the office. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 09:37:41 2005 From: "Dave Yates" To: "'Dc-Cycles'" Subject: RE: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:37:38 -0500 X-ELNK-Trace: 956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec7942f434e461ab307bee81c9156ec2bf37350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c Subject line dedicated to the late Hunter S. Thompson. Anyway, I'd like to thank all the snowophobes who stayed home today. I had a very easy, uncongested ride to the office. [Dave] You're welcome! While I wouldn't go into DC anyway, I've exercised what I call a "Maryland Day". So named for the many Marylanders in the office that perpetrate working from home when the WW bridge backup is more than 15 minutes getting into our VA office. Exactly what does a secretary do working from home? Technically speaking, that would be "senior administrative assistant". While she is senior ( to me ), administrative assistant is playing fast and loose with the definitions. Anyway. 4wd or not, I suck driving in snow. I don't like driving in snow. Hell, my habitual tailgater wife drives better in the snow than me. So I'm doing my part to keep the area safe for bikers! From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 09:50:24 2005 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 06:50:16 -0800 (PST) From: Glenn Dysart Subject: Re: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Glad yours was better then mine. I had the typical a-holes clogging up the left lane on I-395 doing exactly 20 MPH. Glenn --- Paul Wilson wrote: > Subject line dedicated to the late Hunter S. > Thompson. > > Anyway, I'd like to thank all the snowophobes who > stayed home today. > I had a very easy, uncongested ride to the office. > -- > Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org > 95 VFR - 90 KLR > > __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Sports - Sign up for Fantasy Baseball. http://baseball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 09:54:40 2005 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:54:31 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Dave Yates Subject: Re: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City Cc: Dc-Cycles On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:37:38 -0500, Dave Yates wrote: > > Subject line dedicated to the late Hunter S. Thompson. > > Anyway, I'd like to thank all the snowophobes who stayed home today. > I had a very easy, uncongested ride to the office. > > [Dave] You're welcome! .... > > Anyway. 4wd or not, I suck driving in snow. I don't like driving in snow. > I guess my question is: snow? What snow? Snow on the grass, snow on the trees, snow on the parked cages, no snow on the roads. Things have come to a pretty pass when businesses alter their routines and schools close for something that hasn't even happened yet, and still might not happen at all. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 09:56:35 2005 From: "Dave Yates" To: "'Dc-Cycles'" Subject: RE: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:56:33 -0500 X-ELNK-Trace: 956056117932dab21aa676d7e74259b7b3291a7d08dfec7977c4e2eb4bdeaaebe14fa9bcff9d8226350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c It's the "thought" (of snow) that counts. ;-) Dave -----Original Message----- From: Paul Wilson [mailto:dcmcrider@XXXXXX] To: Dave Yates Cc: Dc-Cycles Subject: Re: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:37:38 -0500, Dave Yates wrote: > > Subject line dedicated to the late Hunter S. Thompson. > > Anyway, I'd like to thank all the snowophobes who stayed home today. > I had a very easy, uncongested ride to the office. > > [Dave] You're welcome! .... > > Anyway. 4wd or not, I suck driving in snow. I don't like driving in snow. > I guess my question is: snow? What snow? Snow on the grass, snow on the trees, snow on the parked cages, no snow on the roads. Things have come to a pretty pass when businesses alter their routines and schools close for something that hasn't even happened yet, and still might not happen at all. -- Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org 95 VFR - 90 KLR From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 09:57:35 2005 From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" To: "'Dc-Cycles'" Subject: RE: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:57:10 -0500 Going into Bethesda today was crappy folks are driving like they are blind running stop lights. Pedestrians and bicyclist walking/riding right out in the road. -----Original Message----- From: Dave Yates [mailto:dave@XXXXXX] To: 'Dc-Cycles' Subject: RE: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City Subject line dedicated to the late Hunter S. Thompson. Anyway, I'd like to thank all the snowophobes who stayed home today. I had a very easy, uncongested ride to the office. [Dave] You're welcome! While I wouldn't go into DC anyway, I've exercised what I call a "Maryland Day". So named for the many Marylanders in the office that perpetrate working from home when the WW bridge backup is more than 15 minutes getting into our VA office. Exactly what does a secretary do working from home? Technically speaking, that would be "senior administrative assistant". While she is senior ( to me ), administrative assistant is playing fast and loose with the definitions. Anyway. 4wd or not, I suck driving in snow. I don't like driving in snow. Hell, my habitual tailgater wife drives better in the snow than me. So I'm doing my part to keep the area safe for bikers! From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 10:10:05 2005 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 07:09:55 -0800 (PST) From: Tom De Subject: RE: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City To: Dave Yates , "'Dc-Cycles'" --- Dave Yates wrote: > > Anyway. 4wd or not, I suck driving in snow. I > don't like driving in snow. > Hell, my habitual tailgater wife drives better in > the snow than me. So I'm > doing my part to keep the area safe for bikers! > > I used to have a 4wd truck, but it doesn't matter if you have 4wd and you have won 5 baja 500 titles. you are at the mercy of 1000's of other drivers, so i stay home. I do UNIX stuff, so i could work (actuall work) from home most days... Tom de '03 ST1300 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 10:45:46 2005 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 10:41:33 -0500 From: skip To: DC Cycles Subject: Re: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City Paul Wilson wrote: > > Subject line dedicated to the late Hunter S. Thompson. I really, truly, hope they are able to honor his request to be shot out of a cannon. > Anyway, I'd like to thank all the snowophobes who stayed home today. > I had a very easy, uncongested ride to the office. I had no issues either. I anticipate that that will not be the case on the way home. I -love- driving in the snow. I relish it. it is what makes winter worth the headaches. I used to drive a 76 chevette, and had no issues in up to a foot of snow, driving around Great Falls. I love to go into a turn, tap the e-brake, and dirt track it. In fact, I live for it. hmmm. perhaps I should get a racecar and head out to Winchester.... nahhhhhh. too much money, and I can scare the crap outta people for free right here. :~) --skip From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 12:09:20 2005 From: "Rob Sharp" To: Paul Wilson , Dave Yates Cc: Dc-Cycles Subject: Re: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 12:24:56 -0500 Exactly. I just drove into work (I work 12-11pm) and the roads are completely fine. Hell they aren't even freezing yet. I495 from 270 till toll is fine. The Toll road got a bit slushie inbetween lanes. Rob On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 09:54:31 -0500, Paul Wilson wrote > I guess my question is: snow? What snow? Snow on the grass, snow > on the trees, snow on the parked cages, no snow on the roads. > Things have come to a pretty pass when businesses alter their > routines and schools close for something that hasn't even happened > yet, and still might not happen at all. > > -- > Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org > 95 VFR - 90 KLR -- Rob Sharp rob@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 14:36:40 2005 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 14:36:34 -0500 From: "Chris Norloff" To: Subject: Re: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City You don't have to say "a-hole" anymore, you can now say "Ashcroft". Check this out: Name-Calling in Its Purest Form http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A48619-2005Feb23.html "You're an Ashcroft! No, you're the Ashcroft!" :-) Chris ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Glenn Dysart Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 06:50:16 -0800 (PST) >Glad yours was better then mine. I had the typical >a-holes clogging up the left lane on I-395 doing >exactly 20 MPH. > >Glenn > >--- Paul Wilson wrote: > >> Subject line dedicated to the late Hunter S. >> Thompson. >> >> Anyway, I'd like to thank all the snowophobes who >> stayed home today. >> I had a very easy, uncongested ride to the office. >> -- >> Paul in DC - www.wilsonline.org >> 95 VFR - 90 KLR >> >> > > > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Sports - Sign up for Fantasy Baseball. >http://baseball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/ > > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 24 15:36:53 2005 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2005 12:36:43 -0800 (PST) From: Tom De Subject: Re: Fear and Loathing in a Snow-Phobic City To: Dc-Cycles --- Rob Sharp wrote: > Exactly. I just drove into work (I work 12-11pm) > and the roads are completely > fine. Hell they aren't even freezing yet. I495 > from 270 till toll is fine. > The Toll road got a bit slushie inbetween lanes. Its not the amount, it's not if it sticks, its who is on the road that matters. Tom de '03 ST1300 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 25 10:04:10 2005 Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 10:03:55 -0500 From: Aaron Maurer To: DC-Cycles Subject: Fantastic (and funny) response to OCC, Jesse James, etc. http://www.chopperflop.com/index.html From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 25 11:22:57 2005 Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2005 11:24:22 -0500 To: Aaron Maurer , DC-Cycles From: "Mike B." Subject: Re: Fantastic (and funny) response to OCC, Jesse James, etc. At 10:03 AM 2/25/05 -0500, Aaron Maurer wrote: >http://www.chopperflop.com/index.html Interesting to see how the guy is working on profiting from the current chopper craze himself... Too bad he doesn't know what he's talking about in the area he's named his domain over. "Chopper flop" isn't due simply to extended forks or rake angle...it's due to improper trail. You can have long forks and high rake angles without having a floppy front end...just keep the trail figure to 4-8" and you are fine, same as with any bike. If you have too much trail, or too little, the handling will suck and perhaps even be dangerous. Back in the early days when uneducated people (like this guy apparently) designed their own choppers they didn't understand the geometry of the situation and sometimes built bikes with floppy front ends, or ones that refused to turn at all without great effort. Others got it right and had bikes that handled pretty well...and most had no idea why. Today this stuff is pretty well understood, and easily learned (hell, *I* found the info when I first started looking into bike building! It wasn't hidden at all) so there's no excuse for a floppy front end on a bike today. Large turning radius? Yep. A 10' long bike with an extended front end isn't going to turn like a 5' long bike with an almost vertical set of forks...but then a Cadillac isn't going to turn like a VW bug either, so what? It matters in parking lots, but seldom makes a difference on the highway...outside of emergency evasive stuff. That said, I don't like choppers much either. They emphasize "cool" over utility...and to me, utility *is* what's cool. This is one reason why I don't find sport bikes cool either BTW. If someone gave me an OCC bike I'd probably sell it and buy a H-D Road King and maybe a BMW dual sport with the money...that would cover all the riding I'm likely to be interested in, and be much cooler than having an uncomfortable bike with limited uses (none of which I care about). I do like looking at custom bikes though (most of which aren't really choppers...). It's not because of the cool factor, but because many show some serious fabrication ability and I always like looking at good workmanship and trying to figure out how they did it. -- -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 26 21:47:21 2005 Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 21:47:10 -0500 From: smthng else To: DC Cycles Subject: Will work for boots! My quest for new boots goes sadly unfulfilled. :( I got sniped on eBay for a perfect pair of Sidi Vertigo's tonight... SIX SECONDS!!! Bastards! Anyway... I guess I'm going to have to do this the hard way. Does anyone know of a shop in the area that carries either Sidi Vertigo, Sidi Vertebra 2 or Oxtar ECS Ti race boots? Preferably one that's not going to out-and-out rape me. If the prices are reasonable, I'd buy from the shop... I'm morally opposed to using a brick-and-mortar shop to try on stuff then buying it on the Internet. Or... if anyone's done so before, a cheap and reliable (hah!) Internet site that won't mind me doing a swap if I pick a size and it doesn't fit right. Any ideas? TIA. Of course, anyone who happens to have a set of Vertigo's laying around in a size 43 that they don't want... ;) --smthng http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Feb 26 22:00:03 2005 Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 18:59:35 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: Will work for boots! To: you@XXXXXX, DC Cycles try http://www.newenough.com. or maybe http://www.motorcycleleatherexchange.com (lister jay goddard's shop) carries sidi. --- smthng else wrote: > My quest for new boots goes sadly unfulfilled. :( I got > sniped on > eBay for a perfect pair of Sidi Vertigo's tonight... SIX > SECONDS!!! > Bastards! Anyway... I guess I'm going to have to do > this the hard > way. > > Does anyone know of a shop in the area that carries > either Sidi > Vertigo, Sidi Vertebra 2 or Oxtar ECS Ti race boots? > Preferably one > that's not going to out-and-out rape me. If the prices > are > reasonable, I'd buy from the shop... I'm morally opposed > to using a > brick-and-mortar shop to try on stuff then buying it on > the Internet. > Or... if anyone's done so before, a cheap and reliable > (hah!) Internet > site that won't mind me doing a swap if I pick a size and > it doesn't > fit right. Any ideas? TIA. > > Of course, anyone who happens to have a set of Vertigo's > laying around > in a size 43 that they don't want... ;) > > --smthng > http://spaces.msn.com/members/smthng/ > > ===== Tom Gimer - 301 675-3980 (cell) - http://www.murphygimer.com - http://www.mgtitlellc.com __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 27 08:25:04 2005 Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2005 08:45:01 -0500 (EST) From: Wayne Edelen To: DC Cycles Subject: Re: Will work for boots! On Sat, 26 Feb 2005, smthng else wrote: > Or... if anyone's done so before, a cheap and reliable (hah!) Internet > site that won't mind me doing a swap if I pick a size and it doesn't > fit right. Any ideas? TIA. I bought my Sidi Vertabrae Race boots from Street and Track Imports. Originally ordered the same size as my Sidi Onroad Sympatex, but they were too small. Called, shipped them back, got my size, no problems. New Enough.com also has a great return policy. -- Wayne From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 28 10:49:55 2005 From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 10:49:39 EST Subject: Re: Will work for boots! To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Not sure about the Vertigos but, I bought my Vertebra's from Cycle Sport in Alexandria a couple years ago. The sales folks there are pretty good. Especially Fred. Yes, I'm on a first name basis with the folks at Cycle Sport. :-) They all know me as "the guy who road to California on an R6." lol I know they can order them for you. Might be able to get them to order a couple different sizes for you to try on. I'm sure they can sell the ones that don't fit. You can always give them a call and ask. 703-780-1245 Scooter In a message dated 2/26/2005 9:47:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, smthngelse@XXXXXX writes: My quest for new boots goes sadly unfulfilled. :( I got sniped on eBay for a perfect pair of Sidi Vertigo's tonight... SIX SECONDS!!! Bastards! Anyway... I guess I'm going to have to do this the hard way. Does anyone know of a shop in the area that carries either Sidi Vertigo, Sidi Vertebra 2 or Oxtar ECS Ti race boots? Preferably one that's not going to out-and-out rape me. If the prices are reasonable, I'd buy from the shop... I'm morally opposed to using a brick-and-mortar shop to try on stuff then buying it on the Internet. Or... if anyone's done so before, a cheap and reliable (hah!) Internet site that won't mind me doing a swap if I pick a size and it doesn't fit right. Any ideas? TIA. Of course, anyone who happens to have a set of Vertigo's laying around in a size 43 that they don't want... ;) --smthng From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 28 12:21:15 2005 From: To: Subject: Re: Will work for boots! Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 12:20:54 -0500 Thanks for the plug Tom, but we only carry Alpinestars. -- Thanks!! Jay Goddard Don't forget about our 2nd annual Daytona Party 301-340-0886 Jay@XXXXXX http://www.MotorcycleLeatherExchange.com Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2005 18:59:35 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: Will work for boots! To: you@XXXXXX, DC Cycles try http://www.newenough.com. or maybe http://www.motorcycleleatherexchange.com (lister jay goddard's shop) carries sidi. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 28 13:16:44 2005 Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2005 13:16:34 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Dc-Cycles Subject: It's Official - Va. Red Light Cams Dead Unless something extraordinary happens, the Virginia red light camera program will expire at the end of June. ------------- (AP) - Local pilot programs in Virginia Beach and northern Virginia that use cameras to catch red light runners will end as scheduled July 1 because of a parliamentary ruling Thursday (2/24) by House of Delegates Speaker William J. Howell. The House Militia, Police and Public Safety Committee last week rejected legislation to extend the "photo red" programs in several northern Virginia localities and Virginia Beach. However, the Senate revived the programs in a floor amendment to a bill requiring motorists to stop and provide their license plate number when they have an accident. Howell, R-Stafford, ruled the amendment was improper because the objects of the amendment and the bill were not closely related. "The original bill dealt with the duty of a driver to stop after an accident. The Senate substitute seems to have added something about red light cameras," Howell said. "...Even I can figure this one out. I don't believe it's germane." House Majority Leader H. Morgan Griffith of Salem asked for the ruling.