From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 13:57:28 2004 Date: Sun, 01 Feb 2004 13:57:25 -0500 To: "Custer, Carl" , "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: Polar Bear ride At 12:26 PM 1/30/04 -0500, Custer, Carl wrote: >2 of 3. Evaporation: >Michael Lynch nailed it: " . . .Temperature is the measure of average >kinetic energy, and you'll get evaporation as soon as *any* of the water >molecules have enough to depart the surface of their immediate locale." Umm...that was me. It was in response to someone else correcting what I'd said previously, and that might have been Mr. Lynch...I don't recall. >But . . . Will the molecule escape or be bounced back? > >That's where humidity and altitude (A.K.A. "Free mean flight path") comes >in. >The more "stuff" above the body of water, the higher the probability the >escapee will be bounced back. The fewer "stuff" above the surface, the >higher the probability that it'll escape. At a given energy level, yeah. If it has more than enough energy, it can cope with more "stuff" blocking its escape path. I think this is why boiling point varies with air pressure (lower temp for lower pressure). [oops...just noticed that you said that later on... :^] >Thus, in drier or higher environments, less "average kinetic energy" is >needed for a noticeable amount of escapees. ("Ah ha " sez Bartman as he >considers a thread on pressure cookers, Arizona "dry heat" and boiling eggs >in Denver ;^) The thought never crossed my mind...but now that you mention it... :^) >Therefore, . . . >3 of 3: Damn air dryers and tepid water. > . . . whisking away recently escaped molecules with a stream of air >reduces the probability they'll be bounced back on your wet hand. >But, you still can't blow your nose with the damn things. True enough. And even if you could, you probably wouldn't want to. >My complaint is the tepid water in State roadside toilets. When it's >35C/95F out, I want to splash cold water on my fevered brow, not tepid >water. Sure I can wet my bandana, flap it around (to lessen the "average >kinetic energy") and then wipe my face but heck, I want instant >gratification . . . and cold handfuls of it. Alcohol? -- Mike B. **************************************************************************** * Mike Bartman * Puzzles Pondered Obfuscation Obliterated * * Omniphiles International * Confusion Canceled Opinions Offered * * omni@XXXXXX * Options Outlined Smiles Stimulated * *--------------------------------------------------------------------------* * "We do it all! No job too small! No price too high! * **************************************************************************** From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 14:56:53 2004 From: "ALTAAN CHOUDHRY" To: Subject: DC Bike Show Pictures Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 14:44:41 -0500 Guys/Gals Here are some picture I took at the recent Bike Show at the DC Convention Center. Some of the pictures on the page are Mike Troutman's. My pictures are about from the half way down on the page. www.dccycles.com/bswcc0104/C --Altaan From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 15:00:22 2004 Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 14:59:21 -0500 From: Skip CC: DCCycles Subject: Re: just dreaming... Leon Begeman wrote: > > Skip, you need to buy some winter clothes. > > Let me try again, this is prose, right, none of this > counting syllables stuff? I'm currently bikeless, so dreaming is all I can do. but I'm makin' payments on an 85 V65 sabre... spring is gonna be sweeeet! --skip From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 15:07:53 2004 From: "Sean Steele" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 15:07:19 -0500 Subject: Re: DC Bike Show Pictures X-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information This works: www.dccycles.com/bswcc0104 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 15:21:30 2004 Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 15:21:11 -0500 To: "ALTAAN CHOUDHRY" From: Troutman Subject: Re: DC Bike Show Pictures Cc: http://www.dccycles.com/bswcc0104/ (drop the C) I also added http://www.dccycles.com/india - Altaan's pictures of bikes in India. At 02:44 PM 1/30/2004, ALTAAN CHOUDHRY wrote: >Guys/Gals > >Here are some picture I took at the recent Bike Show at the DC Convention >Center. Some of the pictures on the page are Mike Troutman's. My pictures >are about from the half way down on the page. > >www.dccycles.com/bswcc0104/C > >--Altaan ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 15:24:40 2004 Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 12:24:11 -0800 (PST) From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: just dreaming... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- Skip wrote: > I sit here at work, fantasizing about a clear spring > morning, trees budding that vibrant spring green.... So you're in a meeting, eh? -- Larry __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 17:53:06 2004 From: "Michael Jordan" To: Subject: RE: Newbie Buyer Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 17:52:57 -0500 Welcome to the list. I too have memories of riding a motorcycle around Viet Nam. I had a Peugeot and a TWN. Barely running 2-strokes that were kept running by tin cans, bailing wire and faith. 'Course, this was in '68 and my riding area was somewhat limited... Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 18:16:30 2004 From: "Michael Jordan" To: Subject: RE: MotorcycleRoads.US: Possibly Interesting Web Site Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 18:16:28 -0500 Nice site - thanks. For another slice of roads, try this one: http://www.alpineroads.com/ Maintained by a couple of Brits that live entirely too close. Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 20:13:32 2004 Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 17:13:24 -0800 (PST) From: Adam Reinhardt Subject: RE: Newbie Buyer To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&category=6027&item=2457447975&sspagename=STRK%3AMESSE%3AIT I doubt you'll find a bike as good as the GS500 for starting on, and this one seems to be a good deal. The bike is easy to work on and has a great support web site called www.gstwin.com Adam Reinhardt 91 GS500 (maybe CBR F2 this weekend, we'll see) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Jan 30 22:04:21 2004 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "Timothy Duffy" , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Newbie Buyer Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 22:05:45 -0500 Lots of dealers have used bikes. Cad Cycles and Cycles SA will both have used bikes in the Mountgumery Co. area. Buying used from a person can also be a good deal. What kinda of bike are you looking for? I am a honda supporter since I think they have great reliability. I just bought a used 96 VFR last spring as my second bike. Make sure you get a bike that isn't a 1000CC+ hotrod. I started with a 600 CC (40 horsepower) Vtwin standard from honda (Hawk GT). Think small and light to learn on and trade it in when your ready for something nicer and bigger. Rob On Fri, 30 Jan 2004 17:56:06 +0000, Timothy Duffy wrote > Hello All, > > I'm looking to buy my first motorcycle this spring. I took a two-day > motorcycle trip with some friends in Vietnam last November and have > spent the entire winter daydreaming about weekend motorcycle cruises. > > Do you guys have any suggestions for buying used bikes here in the > DC area? What are the best sources? Are there any dealers that sell > used bikes? I'm looking to spend about $1000. What can I expect to > get for that? > > Any advice you all could give is appreciated. > > Thanks, > Tim > > _________________________________________________________________ > Let the new MSN Premium Internet Software make the most of your high- > speed experience. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/prem&ST=1 -- Rob Sharp 1996 Honda VFR 750 2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA Network Security Engineer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jan 31 00:20:48 2004 Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 21:20:15 -0800 (PST) From: matthew patton Subject: Re: Polar Bear ride To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX all this talk of physics is fine and all but I JUST WANT TO RIDE! *grin* I wouldn't recommend western MD for a ride given the weather pattern this last week or so but between the Horkster, Leon the 'nut', and myself I think we can pretty much vouch for the general Quantico area. There are lots of really good roads down here 50mi south. Anyone hankering for a ride should come down here where our roads are essentially fully clear. ===== * A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being the right person. * To forgive is to set the prisoner free and then discover the prisoner was you. * Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent. - Jim Quinn (WRRK) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jan 31 00:23:33 2004 Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2004 21:23:25 -0800 (PST) From: matthew patton Subject: RE: Newbie Buyer To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- Adam Reinhardt wrote: > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&category=6027&item=2457447975&sspagename=STRK%3AMESSE%3AIT > > I doubt you'll find a bike as good as the GS500 for Not to mention the 4 or 5 of us here on the list who own them and some of us have experience racing/rebuilding them. ===== * A successful marriage isn't finding the right person; it's being the right person. * To forgive is to set the prisoner free and then discover the prisoner was you. * Liberalism always generates the exact opposite of its stated intent. - Jim Quinn (WRRK) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jan 31 00:51:21 2004 Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 00:50:49 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: Newbie Buyer At 10:05 PM 1/30/04 -0500, Rob Sharp wrote: >Lots of dealers have used bikes. Cad Cycles and Cycles SA will both have used >bikes in the Mountgumery Co. area. So does Battley's. Call them and ask what they have. Some of it may even be appropriate for a beginner, but I doubt they have anything in the $1000 range. I know they have several ex-police bikes at the moment if anyone has always wanted one. The radios, lights and siren are removed, along with the police tires, but the rest is patrol-standard. -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jan 31 11:25:09 2004 Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 08:25:04 -0800 (PST) From: Carl Schelin Subject: Re: Polar Bear ride To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- matthew patton wrote: > all this talk of physics is fine and all but I JUST WANT TO RIDE! > *grin* > > I wouldn't recommend western MD for a ride given the weather pattern > this last week or so but between the Horkster, Leon the 'nut', and > myself I think we can pretty much vouch for the general Quantico area. Hey! I'm a nut too. I'll likely take a fast ride around PW today (hitting Chipotle's) just to spiffy up the bikes and charge the systems. Rita hasn't done more than starts hers up so I'll run that one around a bit too. Then I gotta find a mech. Hey Leon, do you think I should punch out the rockers to fit the axle or have someone turn the axle to fit the holes? > There are lots of really good roads down here 50mi south. Anyone > hankering for a ride should come down here where our roads are > essentially fully clear. > Yea, looks like a nice sunny day. Carl ===== 02 Harley FXSTI 95 Suzuki GSXR 750W 76 Honda Chopper (in progress) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jan 31 19:03:10 2004 Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 18:03:14 -0600 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Sean Jordan Subject: Motorcycle = router? Neat. http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/26/technology/26oxcart.html - Sean Jordan From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sat Jan 31 21:08:35 2004 From: "Rob Sharp" To: Sean Jordan , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Motorcycle = router? Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2004 21:09:51 -0500 Link so you don't have to register. Rob http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/26/technology/26oxcart.html?ex=1390539600&en=4187e49428719752&ei=5007&partner=USERLAND On Sat, 31 Jan 2004 18:03:14 -0600, Sean Jordan wrote > Neat. > > http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/26/technology/26oxcart.html > > - Sean Jordan -- Rob Sharp 1996 Honda VFR 750 2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA Network Security Engineer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Sun Feb 1 23:39:27 2004 Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2004 23:40:40 -0500 From: corey Reply-To: corey To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: sunday ride saw the thermometer hit a solid 35 degrees today and thought it'd be great to get at least an hour on the gs. i haven't really done any winterizing so it makes me happy to let 'er breathe at least once a month. been on a battery tender all month so i just hit the switch and it fired right up. my backyard and the sidewalk between the townhouses is still a solid 3 inches of ice, so i spread some salt and cleared as much of a path as i could and slipped and slid my way out to the cul-de-sac next door. a little hairy, but not as hairy as getting it back in (walking/sliding the front wheel down a steepish footpath... sketch-city). took 236 to 50 out to chantilly, main roads were in great shape. not much sand or melt to be seen. had to make an emergency detour to hudson trail outfitters to buy a neck gaitor. once that was in place i was pretty comfortable even up to 70 mph on 66 headed home. this is my 2nd ride with my new-to-me racetech springs and cannot get over the difference it makes in the ride quality. those stock springs are friggin death traps if you're over 175lbs. hope we get a couple more of these days in feburary! ___________________________________________ corey [journal] www.egoinc.org [portfolio] www.blanksky.com 93 GS500e From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 07:54:16 2004 From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" To: "'corey'" , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: sunday ride Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 07:54:08 -0500 What type of bike do you ride? I was thinking of upgrading my springs in my gsxr600. -----Original Message----- From: corey [mailto:corey@XXXXXX] Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2004 11:41 PM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: sunday ride saw the thermometer hit a solid 35 degrees today and thought it'd be great to get at least an hour on the gs. i haven't really done any winterizing so it makes me happy to let 'er breathe at least once a month. been on a battery tender all month so i just hit the switch and it fired right up. my backyard and the sidewalk between the townhouses is still a solid 3 inches of ice, so i spread some salt and cleared as much of a path as i could and slipped and slid my way out to the cul-de-sac next door. a little hairy, but not as hairy as getting it back in (walking/sliding the front wheel down a steepish footpath... sketch-city). took 236 to 50 out to chantilly, main roads were in great shape. not much sand or melt to be seen. had to make an emergency detour to hudson trail outfitters to buy a neck gaitor. once that was in place i was pretty comfortable even up to 70 mph on 66 headed home. this is my 2nd ride with my new-to-me racetech springs and cannot get over the difference it makes in the ride quality. those stock springs are friggin death traps if you're over 175lbs. hope we get a couple more of these days in feburary! ___________________________________________ corey [journal] www.egoinc.org [portfolio] www.blanksky.com 93 GS500e From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 09:29:41 2004 Subject: RE: Sunday ride Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 09:29:30 -0500 From: "Verde, Robert" To: "corey" , Sunday was a pretty nice day for a ride, the errant spots of moisture on the roads were (almost) all melted. I rode from Falls Church to Bowie via 495 and 214, then headed into DC and caught a film at the new E Street Cinemas. (Nice place, but spendy; tickets were 9.25 and no matinee pricing.) Parking on E Street, I shared a space with a nice older BMW (R75?), which left when I was getting coffee before the movie. Leaving the film later, the BMW spot had been claimed by a new Magna, so there were certainly other riders out. Riding in today was dry, but nippy, tomorrow promises to be interesting... Robert From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 10:28:09 2004 Subject: Ride and Eat Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 10:29:49 -0500 From: "Julian Halton" To: "corey" , I just spent ten minutes outside in a t-shirt. Apparently it is going to hit 40 and the weather is going to go to s$%t later so I am contemplating sneaking home, grabbing my gear and riding out to Carlyle Grand for lunch (Shirlington , VA- good burgers and fish). Anyone up for a lunch time ride From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 12:50:40 2004 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 12:49:18 -0500 From: Skip CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Motorcycle = router? What a cool job that would be... --skip Rob Sharp wrote: > > Link so you don't have to register. > > Rob > > http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/26/technology/26oxcart.html?ex=1390539600&en=4187e49428719752&ei=5007&partner=USERLAND > > On Sat, 31 Jan 2004 18:03:14 -0600, Sean Jordan wrote > > Neat. > > > > http://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/26/technology/26oxcart.html > > > > - Sean Jordan > > -- > Rob Sharp > 1996 Honda VFR 750 > 2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme > SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA > Network Security Engineer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 13:10:05 2004 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 12:10:12 -0600 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, mike@XXXXXX From: Sean Jordan Subject: Be the first one on your block... ...to own a Dodge Tomahawk! Only $550,000, please. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=10062&item=2456875016 - Sean Jordan From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 13:13:07 2004 From: "Custer, Carl" To: "'DCCycles'" Cc: "'timothy_duffy@XXXXXX'" Subject: Newbie Buyer Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:18:22 -0500 1. Welcome to the chaos Tim. 2. Yates is correct: "Auto trader & the Washington Post come to mind. Keep an eye on the list here too, somebody might decide to offload a backup bike cheap." Except Dave meant Cycletrader: 3. Plus the rest of his post. Dave surely wanted to add "Take a MSF course. A two day trip in 'Nam is no substitute for the survival skills a MSF course can give you." 4. Similar to the GS500 list, there are other lists that offer both technical support as well as camaraderie to keeping your vintage wheels rolling. E.g.: The Vintage Japanese Motorcycle club SabMag Why not European or 'Merican? Because you said, " I'm looking to spend about $1000. " 5. Gear: Two snaps and a "We don' wanna say, 'we told you so.'" You (& others) can save lotsa bucks on good gear by: a. checking out the local "Open houses". Pick up a copy of "Winding Roads -Motorcycle Times" (WRMT), a bimonthly freebie but a goodie at many local shops for lists. b. The Leather Exchange They're both local and DCCycles listers (How kewl is that?) c. Clearance areas. (Shhh, big secret but Battley's has a clearance area upstairs. I scored a pair of Held gloves for $50. They also have some "Fireside boots" that would look spiffy on Evil Carl, for $60. d. Coupon in WRMT good for 15% off of any one regular price "apparel item" at Bob's BMW (page 31) 6. Did I mention the MSF course? Carl in Bethesda Commuting into your nation's capital since 1981 through sun, rain, over snow, and around road ragers. '85 VF700S (Rocin-ahorito); '83 VF700F (666); '97 Aerostich Roadcrafter (Fred the Red); '02 JR Phoenix: (Amarillo Joe) Don't need no loud pipes; I got big honking tooters: http://members.tripod.com/~v65_magna/sos_99/sat_lunch2.jpg http://www.crosswinds.net/~denbrook/Motorcycles/Events/mmc-2-17-01/Carls_Sab re.jpg From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 13:19:12 2004 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 13:19:05 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: Paul Wilson Reply-To: Paul Wilson To: "Verde, Robert" , corey , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Sunday ride After shoveling a little snow out from around the VFR, I went out for a 45-minute ride on Sunday, followed by some wrenching, in the snow. Wrenching topic here - http://www.cs.wisc.edu/~lists/archive/vfr/200402/msg00024.html Hey, it's February, ya ride 'em and wrench 'em when ya can. And it was actually above freezing and it's not too bad kneeling in the snow when you're wearing the Motoport suit. :) Paul in DC 95 VFR - 86 VF500F -----Original Message----- From: "Verde, Robert" Sunday was a pretty nice day for a ride, the errant spots of moisture on the roads were (almost) all melted. I rode from Falls Church to Bowie via 495 and 214, then headed into DC and caught a film at the new E Street Cinemas. (Nice place, but spendy; tickets were 9.25 and no matinee pricing.) Parking on E Street, I shared a space with a nice older BMW (R75?), which left when I was getting coffee before the movie. Leaving the film later, the BMW spot had been claimed by a new Magna, so there were certainly other riders out. Riding in today was dry, but nippy, tomorrow promises to be interesting... Robert From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 13:35:54 2004 Subject: Re: Newbie Buyer From: Carl Schelin To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: 02 Feb 2004 13:32:19 -0500 On Mon, 2004-02-02 at 13:18, Custer, Carl wrote: > 2. Yates is correct: > "Auto trader & the Washington Post come to mind. Keep an eye on the list > here too, somebody might decide to offload a backup bike cheap." > > Except Dave meant Cycletrader: > Well it _is_ new. I just got the first issue a couple of weeks ago at the local 7/11. > 5. Gear: > Two snaps and a "We don' wanna say, 'we told you so.'" > You (& others) can save lotsa bucks on good gear by: > c. Clearance areas. > (Shhh, big secret but Battley's has a clearance area upstairs. I scored a > pair of Held gloves for $50. They also have some "Fireside boots" that > would look spiffy on Evil Carl, for $60. > Actually I'm looking at the Sidi Waterproof boots: http://www.newenough.com/sidi_on_road_sympatex_boots_page.htm or, if I can't find them, the Harley ones are second on my list. Hmm, can't find a link off hand. Anyway, my current GBX boots seem to work fine, and I don't particularly like the flame boots; I'm more subtle than that :-) > Carl in Bethesda Evil Overlord Carl From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 16:07:30 2004 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 16:06:00 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: So Quiet Today Saturday I spent the afternoon with my bike in the garage, a space heater, a toothbrush and a can of WD-40. My chain is now visibly metal, rather than pure grease and grime. No major wear on the sprocket or the chain at ~20k miles for each. I panned on finishing out with an oil change, but things came up. I'll save that for another day off. My driveway is gravel covered by thick ice. So thick, that my 4WD requires at least two attempts to get out to street level. The bike remains in the garage until I can see the ground. ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 16:23:44 2004 Subject: Re: So Quiet Today From: Carl Schelin To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: 02 Feb 2004 16:20:13 -0500 I'm busy fixing the little 'tweaks' done to the monitoring software while I was on vacation. It's amazing how people can't RTFM even with clear and complete on-line FM's. On Mon, 2004-02-02 at 16:06, Troutman wrote: > Saturday I spent the afternoon with my bike in the garage, a space heater, > a toothbrush and a can of WD-40. My chain is now visibly metal, rather > than pure grease and grime. No major wear on the sprocket or the chain at > ~20k miles for each. I panned on finishing out with an oil change, but > things came up. I'll save that for another day off. > Saturday I took all three bikes out for a little R&R (Riding and Replenishing). I check and topped off the air. It was cold enough that I couldn't feel my thumbs when I did the Suzuki. Then I rode them around for 30 to 45 minutes each. > My driveway is gravel covered by thick ice. So thick, that my 4WD requires > at least two attempts to get out to street level. The bike remains in the > garage until I can see the ground. > When I got back from vacation no one had shoveled the driveway or sidewalks so I had to break out the snow shovel _and_ the flat-edged shovel. The water had frozen at the meter last weekend. I spent two days talking to VA-American from Colorado to get it fixed. Then I had to call again on Friday because my neighbor had the same problem but no one had called. I got them out that afternoon and he was fixed up by the time he got home after midnight on Friday. How's that for service? The guy pulled up in a little Ranger, stuck a 1.5" diameter pvc pipe on to the exhaust of the truck and the other end was stuck into the access hole. In 5 minutes he had thawed it out enough that it was working. He packed it with insulation. I figure that since we were both out of town, there wasn't enough water running through the pipes to keep them clear. I seem to recall a comment about that several years ago about that very same thing. Anyway. It was a nice little ride in this morning and the mid-shift guy today thinks he's working late so I get to HOV home today as well. Rita caught the flu while in Winter Park so she's been sick all weekend. I keep thinking I'm catching it but the little twinges clear up after an hour or so (talking too much after two weeks of vacation=sore throat). Later. Carl From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 16:23:58 2004 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 16:23:46 -0500 From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: So Quiet Today X-AOL-IP: 12.36.128.140 zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz........huh? What? Oh, sorry. So bored at the office today that I'm about ready to fall asleep. I'm praying for a ton of bad weather tomorrow so I can stay home. :-) Scooter In a message dated 2/2/2004 4:06:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, mike@XXXXXX writes: > > > Saturday I spent the afternoon with my bike in the garage, a space heater, > a toothbrush and a can of WD-40. My chain is now visibly metal, rather > than pure grease and grime. No major wear on the sprocket or the chain at > ~20k miles for each. I panned on finishing out with an oil change, but > things came up. I'll save that for another day off. > > My driveway is gravel covered by thick ice. So thick, that my 4WD requires > at least two attempts to get out to street level. The bike > remains in the > garage until I can see the ground. > > ___________________________________________ > Mike Troutman > http://www.troutman.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 21:08:57 2004 From: "Mobacc" To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:57:25 -0500 With the Janklow and local sleepy driver affairs still warm, this on point discussion popped up yesterday. No real answers, lots of loose ends -- one poignant quote: "you have to punish that kind of negligence in order to keep people on their toes and to keep people from doing it again." "When Is An Accident A Crime?" http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/01/weekinreview/01dewa.html Bill S. / DC (IANAL) '99 VN750 > vote against both accidents and crimes Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Mon Feb 2 21:24:13 2004 Reply-To: From: "Michael H. Moore" To: Subject: AC Generator issues... Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:26:07 -0500 Yesterday while working on my bike I dropped the AC generator rotor. One magnet broke off. It looks like the magnet is unbroken. Can I service this piece by epoxying it back in place? If so, what type of adhesive can stand the conditions inside the engine? Or could this cause engine balance problems? Thanks, Mike From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 00:07:18 2004 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "Mobacc" , "DC-Cycles" Subject: Re: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:08:36 -0500 http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/01/weekinreview/01dewa.html?ex=1390971600&en=dc725e3b1e2c1f93&ei=5007&partner=USERLAND So you dont have to register : ) Rob On Mon, 2 Feb 2004 20:57:25 -0500, Mobacc wrote > With the Janklow and local sleepy driver affairs still warm, this on > point discussion popped up yesterday. No real answers, lots of > loose ends -- one poignant quote: "you have to punish that kind of > negligence in order to keep people on their toes and to keep people > from doing it again." > > "When Is An Accident A Crime?" > http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/01/weekinreview/01dewa.html > > Bill S. / DC (IANAL) > '99 VN750 > vote against both accidents and crimes > Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. -- Rob Sharp 1996 Honda VFR 750 2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA Network Security Engineer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 08:11:02 2004 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:10:41 -0500 (EST) From: "Daniel H. Brown" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: AC Generator issues... On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, Michael H. Moore wrote: > > Yesterday while working on my bike I dropped the AC generator rotor. One > magnet broke off. It looks like the magnet is unbroken. Can I service this > piece by epoxying it back in place? If so, what type of adhesive can stand > the conditions inside the engine? Or could this cause engine balance > problems? > I've posted similar thoughts previously... What's worth more, the price of a new one, or the cost of getting stuck on the side of the road because a repair job came undone? Me, I think I'd get a replacement, and see if I can get the old one refurbed professionally to save for a "spare." Is it a part that rotates? If so, balance while it is spinning would bother me. That said, have you looked at the specs for Ye-Oulde JB-Weld? -- Dan Brown brown@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 08:21:49 2004 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 05:21:41 -0800 (PST) From: matthew patton Subject: Re: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX The jury foreman, James G. Mitchell, said that even though the jurors had not wanted to convict Mr. Janklow this says it all. IMO the higher the stature of the person the harder they need to fall. I can't believe they bought that pathetic excuse of a defense. Nor ignored his history of blatent disregard for others on the highways and unappologetic attitude about his behavior. The citizens of SD don't deserve to have Sturgis. The jury in incompetent as is the judge. My parents barely escaped death 6 months ago. Rammed from behind at 70+mph (they were stopped) by a very drunk driver. Said driver's career was as a traffic defense attorney getting drunk drivers off. They guy missed killing a construction worker by inches. These are the sort of people you throw in prison and lose the key. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 08:43:38 2004 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:43:23 EST Subject: Re: AC Generator issues... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/2/2004 9:24:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, mhmoore@XXXXXX writes: > Can I service this > piece by epoxying it back in place? Not just no, but HELL NO!!! It will explode and take out lord knows what when it does. (Remember it spins at crank speed, damn fast.) (And you cannot weld one either (do not ask)) Loud pipes quell cells. 20-20 hindsight shows the future if you are not careful. John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC Honda ST1100X Pan European BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 09:12:16 2004 From: "Custer, Carl" To: "'DCCycles'" Subject: Waterproof Boots Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 09:17:31 -0500 Carl Said: "Actually I'm looking at the Sidi Waterproof boots: http://www.newenough.com/sidi_on_road_sympatex_boots_page.htm " I was disappointed that many Sidi's don't have ankle protection. Wazzup with that? The new Sidi City boot has it. Speed Cycles in Elkridge has 'em. The Oxtar Matrix got kudos from MCN; looks better in person than the picture at NewEnough. Bob's BMW has 'em for $199. Minus the 15% coupon in WRMT, that's a pretty good price. The Prexport WP 539 looked quite spiffy at the DC MC Show and they got a glowing review from a LDR. Equipped with the 10% off show coupon, I traipsed down to Richmond to try 'em on at Velocity Cycles. Tho I wear a 8.5-9 shoe, that translates to a 41-42, I could not get the 42 on my foot. The owner was anxious to order a 43 for me but, I dunno. The Oxtar 43 at Bob's fit quite well. > (Shhh, big secret but Battley's has a clearance area upstairs. I > scored a pair of Held gloves for $50. They also have some "Fireside > boots" that would look spiffy on Evil Carl, for $60. Schelin Claimed: " . . . I don't particularly like the flame boots; I'm more subtle than that :-)" Humm he's building a Honda chopper. Jackson wore a pastie because . . .? FCC Chief Powell had his family gathered around the TV for a celebration . .and kept them through the song"I'm gonna get you naked . . ." Oh gummimint worker. Bye. Carl in Bethesda From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 10:29:20 2004 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:29:17 -0800 (PST) From: Fish Flowers To: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime On Tue, 3 Feb 2004, matthew patton wrote: > These are the sort of people you throw in prison and lose the key. ... and then they become an ongoing financial burden on society. Better than a health hazard, perhaps, but I still wish there were a better solution. Felony, permanent revocation of driving privileges? Dunno. Fish. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 10:43:58 2004 Subject: The Ride In From: Carl Schelin To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: 03 Feb 2004 10:40:25 -0500 Well, I didn't ride the bike this morning :-) My driveway was a sheet of ice. After sliding down the hill to the street I walked up the snow, unlocked the car and threw my backpack into the passenger seat. Then I went around the front of the car. I did a controled slide holding the hood and then the left mirror. I opened the car door and as I slid by, I grabbed the jamb. Unfortunately I immediately hit the driveway landing on my back. I lay there for a sec and then slid the rest of the way down the hill. It took two more tries to get in to the car. Rita had the seat forward and up so I had to bend at an awkward angle to adjust the seat enough to get in and start the car. Now my back muscles are painful and there a sore feeling when I breathe deeply. There's a tingle up the right side of my neck and my right shoulder has a twinge. At least if I was riding the bike, I'd be well padded :-/ Good luck today if you rode :-) Carl From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:08:13 2004 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:08:07 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: Paul Wilson Reply-To: Paul Wilson To: matthew patton , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime -----Original Message----- From: matthew patton The jury foreman, James G. Mitchell, said that even though the jurors had not wanted to convict Mr. Janklow this says it all. IMO the higher the stature of the person the harder they need to fall. I can't believe they bought that pathetic excuse of a defense. Nor ignored his history of blatent disregard for others on the highways and unappologetic attitude about his behavior. The citizens of SD don't deserve to have Sturgis. The jury in incompetent as is the judge. .... On the other hand, given the tools at their disposal (the laws of state of South Dakota) I'm having a hard time seeing how the jury or the judge acted improperly in the Janklow case. The judge allowed Janklow to present a vigorous defense and he barred prejudicial evidence. I suspect if we were sitting at the defendant's table we'd want the same treatment. And, still, despite what we might rightly view as medical red herrings brought up by the defense, Janklow was convicted. The quote above from the foreman tells me the system worked in this case. The jurors did follow the law and did vote to convict, setting aside their personal feelings or their doubts about what constitutes an "accident." No "jury nullification" at work here folks. It seems our beef about people killing motorcyclists with impunity is a matter that should be taken up by the legislature, not the judiciary. Paul in DC 95 VFR - 86VF500F From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:10:05 2004 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:10:01 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: Paul Wilson Reply-To: Paul Wilson To: Carl Schelin , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: The Ride In No problems riding this morning, although the last 200 feet getting into the building (on foot) was the most hazardous part of the journey. Slip, slide, slip, slide.... Paul in DC - 95 VFR - 86 VF500F -----Original Message----- From: Carl Schelin Well, I didn't ride the bike this morning :-) My driveway was a sheet of ice. After sliding down the hill to the street I walked up the snow, unlocked the car and threw my backpack into the passenger seat. Then I went around the front of the car. I did a controled slide holding the hood and then the left mirror. I opened the car door and as I slid by, I grabbed the jamb. .... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:12:21 2004 From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" To: "'Carl Schelin'" , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: The Ride In Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:12:11 -0500 I was slipping and sliding today too. I slipped indoors on a little water on the floor from one of the kids and hit my head on the refrigerator. OUCH! I then fell outside trying to put the trash can out to the curb. The trash can went one way and I went the other. It even made me laugh. My head hurts. -----Original Message----- From: Carl Schelin [mailto:cschelin@XXXXXX] Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 10:40 AM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: The Ride In Well, I didn't ride the bike this morning :-) My driveway was a sheet of ice. After sliding down the hill to the street I walked up the snow, unlocked the car and threw my backpack into the passenger seat. Then I went around the front of the car. I did a controled slide holding the hood and then the left mirror. I opened the car door and as I slid by, I grabbed the jamb. Unfortunately I immediately hit the driveway landing on my back. I lay there for a sec and then slid the rest of the way down the hill. It took two more tries to get in to the car. Rita had the seat forward and up so I had to bend at an awkward angle to adjust the seat enough to get in and start the car. Now my back muscles are painful and there a sore feeling when I breathe deeply. There's a tingle up the right side of my neck and my right shoulder has a twinge. At least if I was riding the bike, I'd be well padded :-/ Good luck today if you rode :-) Carl From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:16:33 2004 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 11:16:47 -0500 To: matthew patton , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime At 05:21 AM 2/3/04 -0800, matthew patton wrote: > The jury foreman, James G. Mitchell, said that even though the >jurors had not wanted to convict Mr. Janklow > >this says it all. IMO the higher the stature of the person the harder >they need to fall. I can't believe they bought that pathetic excuse of >a defense. >From what I read, they didn't. The foreman said that they agreed he had a responsibility not to let his disability become a hazard...that he knew he had the condition and should have taken care of it. He was negligent. >Nor ignored his history of blatent disregard for others on >the highways and unappologetic attitude about his behavior. >From other articles I read on the case, I think the judge wouldn't allow his prior driving history to be admitted into evidence. If so, they weren't allowed to take that into account...though I'd say it was certainly relevant...it showed a history of disregard for the safety of others, and that he had been repeatedly informed that this wasn't good. It would remove any "I didn't know this could happen" excuse. >The citizens of SD don't deserve to have Sturgis. The jury in incompetent >as is the judge. The Jury convicted him. The judge let him off easy on the sentence. Whether SD deserves to have Sturgis or not depends on what they do about this sort of thing. I expect Sturgis will happen anyway, but there will be many who boycott it. >My parents barely escaped death 6 months ago. Rammed from behind at >70+mph (they were stopped) by a very drunk driver. Said driver's career >was as a traffic defense attorney getting drunk drivers off. They guy >missed killing a construction worker by inches. These are the sort of >people you throw in prison and lose the key. Agreed. On the other hand, my mother was once hit in the same way, but by a 16 year old kid driving his parents LTD. He wasn't drunk, just inexperienced and not paying enough attention to his driving (I suspect radio use was partly to blame). He expected cars on the interstate to be moving, but they weren't, and he was too close to stop by the time he realized it. Locked the wheels and slid into my mom's car. Luckily my mom was driving a '74 Cougar XR7 (several thousand pounds with a big V8), so, while the car was accordioned all the way up to the rear axle, and the car was shoved, with brakes locked, 20' forward into the car stopped in front of her, she got away pretty much uninjured (some pulled muscles). My mom was paying attention, and watching the rear view in case some loon did exactly what happened. When she realized he wasn't going to stop she put both feet on the brake, put her head back solidly on the head rest, and snugged the seat belt and shoulder belt. Staying alert is your best defense, no matter what you are driving or riding. -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:18:54 2004 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 11:17:45 -0500 From: Skip CC: DC-Cycles Subject: Re: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime not sure what they call it, but they make you stay at home, wear an anklet, and they call you a few times a day. cheaper than incarceration, and it accomplishes the same goal. Fish Flowers wrote: > > On Tue, 3 Feb 2004, matthew patton wrote: > > > These are the sort of people you throw in prison and lose the key. > > ... and then they become an ongoing financial burden on society. Better > than a health hazard, perhaps, but I still wish there were a better > solution. > > Felony, permanent revocation of driving privileges? Dunno. > > Fish. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:19:05 2004 Subject: RE: The Ride In Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:18:54 -0500 From: "Verde, Robert" To: "Carl Schelin" , Outside of the hassle of negotiating the compacted snow and ice dams that block the bike in the parking lot, the roads were pretty clear. Wet, and slushy in spots, but I suspect the residual salt from last week took care of any potential ice on the roads. It did get messier when I turned into my parking lot, more slush mixed with a half-inch of sand, made for some entertaining riding... ;-) Got slushier as I gained elevation, commute is from Falls Church to Reston. Turns out my tank bag leaks at the zippers, though, so the contents were a bit damp. My bike messenger bag kept everything dry, except for the laptop accessory I had forgotten in the external *mesh* pocket. D'oh! Got to get a Fog City, though, my face was pretty wet from cracking the visor to clear the fog. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:22:36 2004 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 11:21:27 -0500 From: Skip CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: AC Generator issues... "Daniel H. Brown" wrote: > > On Mon, 2 Feb 2004, Michael H. Moore wrote: > > > > Yesterday while working on my bike I dropped the AC generator rotor. One > > magnet broke off. It looks like the magnet is unbroken. Can I service this > > piece by epoxying it back in place? If so, what type of adhesive can stand > > the conditions inside the engine? Or could this cause engine balance > > problems? > > > > I've posted similar thoughts previously... What's worth more, the price of > a new one, or the cost of getting stuck on the side of the road because a > repair job came undone? > > Me, I think I'd get a replacement, and see if I can get the old one > refurbed professionally to save for a "spare." Is it a part that rotates? > If so, balance while it is spinning would bother me. That said, have you > looked at the specs for Ye-Oulde JB-Weld? having used both extensively, I've found that PC-7 works better than JB-Weld, which, according to the package, "is even better than baling wire" --skip, getting ready to epoxy the block on the Saturn. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:27:55 2004 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 11:27:37 -0500 From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime X-AOL-IP: 12.36.128.140 House Arrest. Scooter In a message dated 2/3/2004 11:17:45 AM Eastern Standard Time, skip@XXXXXX writes: > > > not sure what they call it, but they make you stay at home, wear an anklet, and > they call you a few times a day. cheaper than incarceration, and it > accomplishes the same goal. > > Fish Flowers wrote: > > > > On Tue, 3 Feb 2004, matthew patton wrote: > > > > > These are the sort of people you throw in prison and lose the key. > > > > ... and then they become an ongoing financial burden on society. Better > > than a health hazard, perhaps, but I still wish there > were a better > > solution. > > > > Felony, permanent revocation of driving privileges? Dunno. > > > > Fish. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:43:53 2004 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:43:48 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: Paul Wilson Reply-To: Paul Wilson To: "Custer, Carl" , "'DCCycles'" Subject: Re: Waterproof Boots I lurv my Sidi Vertebra 2 Te-pors. Absolutely dry, warm (also warm in summer, natch) excellent protection and come exclusively in cow-friendly Lorica. I can't vouch for their tractive properties on ice-covered bricks, though. Paul in DC -----Original Message----- From: "Custer, Carl" Carl Said: "Actually I'm looking at the Sidi Waterproof boots: http://www.newenough.com/sidi_on_road_sympatex_boots_page.htm " I was disappointed that many Sidi's don't have ankle protection. Wazzup with that? The new Sidi City boot has it. Speed Cycles in Elkridge has 'em. The Oxtar Matrix got kudos from MCN; looks better in person than the picture at NewEnough. Bob's BMW has 'em for $199. Minus the 15% coupon in WRMT, that's a pretty good price. The Prexport WP 539 .... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:55:11 2004 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 11:41:43 -0500 To: Carl Schelin , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: The Ride In At 10:40 AM 2/3/04 -0500, Carl Schelin wrote: >grabbed the jamb. Unfortunately I immediately hit the driveway landing >on my back. Ouch. I did that a few years ago. Luckily I'd ben going to Aikido class long enough at that point to know how to do a breakfall, so I didn't get hurt. It just stung a bit. I highly recommend that *everyone* who is even a little bit physically fit take enough Aikido to learn to fall properly. You don't have to be an athlete or in great shape (I'm not) to do it. We've had 70 year old women in the class, and while they weren't flinging around like the 20-something guys, they did learn to fall without getting hurt. I've had that training save me twice so far (the other fall was backwards down a short flight of steps (4) into my den (carpet over concrete)...not even any pain from that one...it was a good backroll with no real impact at all, though I did knock a hole in the wall with my hip on the way down). I've heard stories of others who have done forward rolls across car hoods when cars pulled out in front of them on their bikes (non-moto type). I don't know personally of anyone who's used it in a moto accident, but it couldn't hurt, and it is even fun. >Now my back muscles are painful and there a sore feeling when I breathe >deeply. There's a tingle up the right side of my neck and my right >shoulder has a twinge. Sounds like you've at the very least pulled some muscles, and you may have cracked a rib. You might want to consider getting looked over by a doctor just to find out for sure. They can't do much about the muscles except give you pain killers and muscle relaxants, but if you've busted a rib, it's best to know about it, though all they can do is tape you up to limit movement. You probably haven't, but.... >At least if I was riding the bike, I'd be well padded :-/ Nobody says you can't wear your bike gear in the car... :^) >Good luck today if you rode :-) Not me! I'm probably not going out at all...though it seems to be rain here...the snow's even melting. -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 11:56:54 2004 From: Michael Lynch To: "'Paul Wilson'" , "Custer, Carl" , "'DCCycles'" Subject: RE: Waterproof Boots Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 11:58:14 -0500 The Teknic Defenders let me down this morning. Both boots leaked on the inside of the feet, right at the ball of the foot. I'm about to say F it and buy the Sidi Sympatex. Also, the TourMaster pants leaked at the crotch :-/ and the Gericke Cordura/Goretex jacket soaked up about 20lbs worth of water!?? Didn't let any water _through_ but was SOAKED itself. Talk about major issues with gear all of a sudden... oye. Mike 98 XR400 96 VFR 76 CB400F > -----Original Message----- > From: Paul Wilson [SMTP:viffermaniac@XXXXXX] > Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2004 11:44 AM > To: Custer, Carl; 'DCCycles' > Subject: Re: Waterproof Boots > > I lurv my Sidi Vertebra 2 Te-pors. Absolutely dry, warm (also warm in > summer, natch) excellent protection and come exclusively in cow-friendly > Lorica. > > I can't vouch for their tractive properties on ice-covered bricks, though. > > Paul in DC > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Custer, Carl" > > > Carl Said: > "Actually I'm looking at the Sidi Waterproof boots: > http://www.newenough.com/sidi_on_road_sympatex_boots_page.htm " > > I was disappointed that many Sidi's don't have ankle protection. > Wazzup with that? The new Sidi City boot has it. > > Speed Cycles in Elkridge has 'em. > > > The Oxtar Matrix got kudos from MCN; looks better in person than the > picture > at NewEnough. > Bob's BMW has 'em for $199. Minus the 15% coupon in WRMT, that's a pretty > good price. > > The Prexport WP 539 .... From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 12:34:09 2004 From: "Custer, Carl" To: "'Michael Lynch'" , "'Paul Wilson'" , "'DCCycles'" Subject: Waterproof Boots Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 12:39:25 -0500 Michael Lamented. "The Teknic Defenders let me down this morning. Both boots leaked on the inside of the feet, right at the ball of the foot. I'm about to say F it and buy the Sidi Sympatex. Also, the TourMaster pants leaked at the crotch :-/ and the Gericke Cordura/Goretex jacket soaked up about 20lbs worth of water!?? Didn't let any water _through_ but was SOAKED itself." Even the mighty Aerostich has a reputation for leaking at the crotch after a few hours. FWIW, the two piece Dry Riders I had worked great (& fit well in the left pocket of my Quicksilver) until after several years, the pants wore through. (sigh) If you can wear a 42, Battley's had one pair of Sidis up in the clearance section. It's a Vertebra race boot, for $99. It's just to the right of the Harley Firesides. Carl in Bethesda From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Tue Feb 3 12:44:32 2004 Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 12:47:56 -0500 Subject: Re: AC Generator issues... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "garcia oliver" I've been able to epoxy magnets that don't spin (e.g. starter motor) or that spin while held inside a cage (some generators). In both cases these were repairs for magnets that had been initially held in place by epoxy. I wouldn't try it on a spinning part that will go flying if the epoxy fails. Actually, I did try that, in an experiment to make a magnetic trigger for a long-unavailable electronic ignition pickup coil. Worked for about 10 minutes. --garcia "I drank WHAT?" --Socrates > >> Yesterday while working on my bike I dropped the AC generator rotor. >One >> magnet broke off. It looks like the magnet is unbroken. Can I service >this >> piece by epoxying it back in place? If so, what type of adhesive can >stand >> the conditions inside the engine? Or could this cause engine balance >> problems? >> From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 08:47:27 2004 From: "Custer, Carl" To: "'DCCycles'" Cc: "'DC-Matthew Patton'" Subject: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:52:35 -0500 Matthew Proposed: " . . .The citizens of SD don't deserve to have Sturgis." Salt on the wound: and a little salve: Local newspaper article with local opinions. (he should have gotten more time) I for one will not go to Sturgis this year Never have and likely would not anyway. But, I do know a few who have and canceled this year's plans. Anyone have plans for Bike Week yet? Carl in Bethesda From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 09:11:22 2004 Subject: Re: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime From: Carl Schelin To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: 04 Feb 2004 09:07:51 -0500 On Wed, 2004-02-04 at 08:52, Custer, Carl wrote: > Matthew Proposed: > > " . . .The citizens of SD don't deserve to have Sturgis." > > Salt on the wound: > > > and a little salve: > Local newspaper article with local opinions. > > (he should have gotten more time) > > I for one will not go to Sturgis this year > Never have and likely would not anyway. I went to Sturgis SD but not to _Sturgis_ if you understand the difference. I went to Daytona... for two hours (long enough to drive through town). > But, I do know a few who have and canceled this year's plans. > > Anyone have plans for Bike Week yet? Which bike week? Daytona? Laconia? Sturgis? Biketoberfest? HSTA? :-) > Carl in Bethesda > Carl From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 12:17:57 2004 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:17:35 -0800 (PST) From: Leon Begeman Subject: RE: Daytona, was: murky waters To: "Custer, Carl" , "'DCCycles'" Cc: "'DC-Matthew Patton'" --- "Custer, Carl" wrote: > Anyone have plans for Bike Week yet? I have paid for the Iron Butt Dinner on Friday the 5th. Work tentatively has me start inventorying places in Florida on Monday the 9th. If it works out right, I'll have Friday, Saturday and Sunday in the Daytona area before riding around the country for the next 3 weeks. Leon Ninja 250 rider. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 14:16:03 2004 From: "Mobacc" To: "DC-Cycles" Cc: Subject: NYT link Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:12:09 -0500 Hello Rob-- That extra link language looks like quite a help. Does that same addon work for all free NYT article accesses? If so, I'll start adding it (as registered, signin is not an issue with me but want to make it easier for others). Thanks. Bill S. / DC '99 VN750 > easier for me too. Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From: "Rob Sharp" rob@XXXXXX http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/01/weekinreview/01dewa.html?ex=1390971600&en= dc725e3b1e2c1f93&ei=5007&partner=USERLAND So you dont have to register : ) Rob From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 14:35:34 2004 Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 14:41:14 -0500 To: DC-Cycles@XXXXXX From: "Kathleen E. Miller" Subject: Re: NYT link Hey guys. What's wrong with registering? Aw, come on, register. ;-) Kathleen E. Miller Research Assistant to William Safire The New York Times At 02:12 PM 2/4/2004 -0500, Mobacc wrote: >Hello Rob-- > > That extra link language looks like quite a help. Does that same addon >work for all free NYT article accesses? If so, I'll start adding it (as >registered, signin is not an issue with me but want to make it easier for >others). > >Thanks. > >Bill S. / DC >'99 VN750 > easier for me too. >Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. > > >From: "Rob Sharp" rob@XXXXXX > >http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/01/weekinreview/01dewa.html?ex=1390971600&en= >dc725e3b1e2c1f93&ei=5007&partner=USERLAND > >So you dont have to register : ) > >Rob From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 16:00:18 2004 Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 15:54:26 -0500 To: "DC-Cycles" From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: The murky waters of Accident vs. Crime At 08:52 AM 2/4/04 -0500, Custer, Carl wrote: >Matthew Proposed: > >" . . .The citizens of SD don't deserve to have Sturgis." > >Salt on the wound: > I wonder if he'll stay in there? I suspect not. > and a little salve: >Local newspaper article with local opinions. > >(he should have gotten more time) He should have gotten more time. It wasn't an accident. An accident is something unforeseen that happens. This was easily foreseen...that's why we have laws against doing what he was doing. He didn't intend to kill, but he did intend to break the law in a way known to kill all too often. He intentionally put others in a level of danger not allowed by our society...and then he killed one of them. That's not "just an accident". > I for one will not go to Sturgis this year Me either. > Never have and likely would not anyway. Me either. :^) >But, I do know a few who have and canceled this year's plans. Me too. rec.motorcycles.harley has a lively discussion going about it. There are those who feel very strongly both ways. I'm sure the attendance will be down this year. How much is open to guessing. >Anyone have plans for Bike Week yet? No, but they probably won't include going to Florida when I do. Maybe next year. Need to work up to long distance, multi-day rides I think. -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 16:00:53 2004 Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 16:00:11 -0500 To: "Kathleen E. Miller" , DC-Cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: NYT link At 02:41 PM 2/4/04 -0500, Kathleen E. Miller wrote: >Hey guys. What's wrong with registering? Aw, come on, register. >;-) 1. It's a hassle to do. Time is money and all that. 2. It's a privacy thing. 3. It's a hassle to remember the registration info for future sign ins that may or may not ever happen anyway (I've got dozens of username/password combinations to remember for work and other things I *have* to do, I'm not going to get more just to look at an article one time...I'll just miss it. Same goes for the Washington Post site and their sign-in thing, so it's nothing to do with the Times in particular.) 4. I get enough spam as it is. I'm not handing out contact info to anyone I don't have to (and when I do, it's usually a unique address...like this one...so I can tell who's been selling the info, or having it stolen by jerks...). 5. It's a hassle in general, and so annoying. 6. Yes, I saw the smiley, but I'm answering anyway. :^) -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 17:08:48 2004 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 17:08:42 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: NYT link To: Mike Bartman Cc: "Kathleen E. Miller" , DC-Cycles@XXXXXX Apologies for top posting... Mike, you forgot the single most significant reason not to object - It's the NY TIMES for G*d's sake! Satan's own Charmin... Dave >At 02:41 PM 2/4/04 -0500, Kathleen E. Miller wrote: >>Hey guys. What's wrong with registering? Aw, come on, register. >>;-) > >1. It's a hassle to do. Time is money and all that. > >2. It's a privacy thing. > >3. It's a hassle to remember the registration info for future sign ins that >may or may not ever happen anyway (I've got dozens of username/password >combinations to remember for work and other things I *have* to do, I'm not >going to get more just to look at an article one time...I'll just miss it. >Same goes for the Washington Post site and their sign-in thing, so it's >nothing to do with the Times in particular.) > >4. I get enough spam as it is. I'm not handing out contact info to anyone >I don't have to (and when I do, it's usually a unique address...like this >one...so I can tell who's been selling the info, or having it stolen by >jerks...). > >5. It's a hassle in general, and so annoying. > >6. Yes, I saw the smiley, but I'm answering anyway. :^) > > > >-- Mike B. > >'04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) > >Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes >is better. > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 17:16:53 2004 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 14:16:25 -0800 (PST) From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" Subject: Re: NYT link To: "Kathleen E. Miller" , DC-Cycles@XXXXXX Ms. Miller, Mike pretty well summed it up. I have to deal with at least a thousand emails a day, all but fifty or so spam, so that point's especially important to me. Don't discount the false information point. I've given the Post at least a thousand different false replies to their name, age, and zip screen since they began operation. I'd certainly do the same for you. I have been registered with the Times site since you began operation. However, with the Post's recent announcement, this is getting out of hand. My wife and I are Times and Post daily print subscribers who may well cancel both subscriptions over this issue. Requiring employment information is way, way over the top. Guess I'll have to get out my prized ollection of Bill Safire "On Language" response post cards and tear them up, since he and his staff don't seem to care about civil liberties any more. 8;) -- Larry --- Mike Bartman wrote: > At 02:41 PM 2/4/04 -0500, Kathleen E. Miller wrote: > >Hey guys. What's wrong with registering? Aw, come on, > register. > >;-) > > 1. It's a hassle to do. Time is money and all that. > > 2. It's a privacy thing. > > 3. It's a hassle to remember the registration info for > future sign ins that > may or may not ever happen anyway (I've got dozens of > username/password > combinations to remember for work and other things I *have* > to do, I'm not > going to get more just to look at an article one > time...I'll just miss it. > Same goes for the Washington Post site and their sign-in > thing, so it's > nothing to do with the Times in particular.) > > 4. I get enough spam as it is. I'm not handing out contact > info to anyone > I don't have to (and when I do, it's usually a unique > address...like this > one...so I can tell who's been selling the info, or having > it stolen by > jerks...). > > 5. It's a hassle in general, and so annoying. > > 6. Yes, I saw the smiley, but I'm answering anyway. :^) __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it! http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/ From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 18:50:20 2004 From: "Michael Jordan" To: "'DCCycles'" Subject: RE: Daytona, was: murky waters Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 18:50:18 -0500 > I have paid for the Iron Butt Dinner on Friday the 5th. Work > tentatively has me start inventorying places in Florida on > Monday the 9th. Leon, you absolutely amaze me. See you there Michael J. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 22:02:50 2004 Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 22:02:31 -0500 From: Dale Horstman To: Leon Begeman CC: "'DCCycles'" Subject: Re: Daytona, was: murky waters Leon Begeman wrote: > If it works out right, I'll have Friday, Saturday and > Sunday in the Daytona area before riding around the > country for the next 3 weeks. Have we mentioned how much WE HATE YOU lately? :) Horkster, envious -- Mandatory Second Line (Chatty Moron Trademark) Dale Horstman - horkster@XXXXXX '98 Concours - BugSlayer Dale City, Virginia, USA, Earth '99 Concours - Grape Nehi CM #001 NRA IBA COG '82 GS850G - Neat old bike The Mason Dixon 20-20 Endurance Rally: The Games People Play Come join us in 2004: http://www.masondixon20-20.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Wed Feb 4 23:53:58 2004 From: "Rob Sharp" To: "Kathleen E. Miller" , DC-Cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: NYT link Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 23:55:31 -0500 What kind of bike do you ride Kathleen ? Never heard from you on the list b4.. Rob On Wed, 04 Feb 2004 14:41:14 -0500, Kathleen E. Miller wrote > Hey guys. What's wrong with registering? Aw, come on, register. > ;-) > > Kathleen E. Miller > Research Assistant to William Safire > The New York Times > > At 02:12 PM 2/4/2004 -0500, Mobacc wrote: > >Hello Rob-- > > > > That extra link language looks like quite a help. Does that same addon > >work for all free NYT article accesses? If so, I'll start adding it (as > >registered, signin is not an issue with me but want to make it easier for > >others). > > > >Thanks. > > > >Bill S. / DC > >'99 VN750 > easier for me too. > >Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. > > > > > >From: "Rob Sharp" rob@XXXXXX > > > >http://www.nytimes.com/2004/02/01/weekinreview/01dewa.html?ex=1390971600&en= > >dc725e3b1e2c1f93&ei=5007&partner=USERLAND > > > >So you dont have to register : ) > > > >Rob -- Rob Sharp 1996 Honda VFR 750 2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA Network Security Engineer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 00:00:01 2004 Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 20:59:58 -0800 (PST) From: Steve Beck Subject: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! To: DC-Cycles@XXXXXX I will cheerfully end several years of just lurking to get a dig in on this one. By all means folks, you should register with completely false information to the NYT. After all, some of the reporters they hire have a penchant for filing stories with completely false information. We can get journalism like that by reading the headlines of the tabloids while standing in line at the grocery store. You know, like the one that reads "Saddam & Osama's gay wedding" or how about "Lose 70 lbs. in 15 days with flesh-eating bacteria" Now that's rivoting journalism. --- "Kathleen E. Miller" wrote: > Hey guys. What's wrong with registering? Aw, come > on, register. > ;-) > > Kathleen E. Miller > Research Assistant to William Safire > The New York Times __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 08:33:20 2004 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 05:33:15 -0800 (PST) From: Leon Begeman Subject: Re: Daytona, was: murky waters To: Dale Horstman Cc: "'DCCycles'" --- Retired Horkster wrote: > Have we mentioned how much WE HATE YOU lately? :) > Dale, If it weren't for the small matter of the paycheck, I'd gladly trade jobs with you and let you go on this trip. There's plenty of envy to go around. Leon. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 09:37:32 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 09:37:23 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa This story is starting to make some waves down in Tampa. http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf8&client=google&num=30&newsclusterurl=http://www.theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article%3FAID%3D/20040204/NEWS/402040365/1004 ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr 1997 Honda VFR 750 AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 09:51:57 2004 From: "Jim McGonigle" To: Subject: RE: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 09:51:07 -0500 What a biased article. The best they found is 2 tickets in 20 years??? He still deserves to be put away for a long time. 80mph isn't slightly speeding and if the bike really went 300 yards then he was going faster than that. -Jim -----Original Message----- From: Troutman [mailto:mike@XXXXXX] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 9:37 AM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa This story is starting to make some waves down in Tampa. http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf8&client=google&num=30& newsclusterurl=http://www.theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article%3FAID%3D/20040 204/NEWS/402040365/1004 ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr 1997 Honda VFR 750 AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 09:58:30 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 10:04:06 -0500 To: DC-Cycles@XXXXXX From: "Kathleen E. Miller" Subject: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! At 08:59 PM 2/4/2004 -0800, you wrote: > "Saddam & Osama's gay wedding" > >or how about > > "Lose 70 lbs. in 15 days with flesh-eating bacteria" > >Now that's rivoting journalism. My personal favorite is "A Space Alien Raped My Weedeater." And I ride a 1996 Honda VT600CD Shadow VLX Deluxe - not a beginner, but still scared stiff of the beltway. Hell, I'm scared of it in my car. Kathleen E. Miller Research Assistant to William Safire The Much Maligned New York Times ;-) (hey, I just work here.) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 10:07:33 2004 From: To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:07:26 -0500 > > From: "Kathleen E. Miller" > Date: 2004/02/05 Thu AM 10:04:06 EST > To: DC-Cycles@XXXXXX > Subject: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! > > At 08:59 PM 2/4/2004 -0800, you wrote: > > > "Saddam & Osama's gay wedding" > > > >or how about > > > > "Lose 70 lbs. in 15 days with flesh-eating bacteria" > > > >Now that's rivoting journalism. > > My personal favorite is "A Space Alien Raped My Weedeater." And I ride a > 1996 Honda VT600CD Shadow VLX Deluxe - not a beginner, but still scared > stiff of the beltway. Hell, I'm scared of it in my car. > > ...the spam mail is getting worse too. First it was "GAIN 8 INCHES TO YOUR MANHOOD! Then it changed to "GAIN 4" OF GIRTH TO YOUR ROD!" And just the other day I got a spam mail with the title: "ADD 3LBS TO YOUR PENIS!" Do you think someone is trying to tell me something? ;-) -aki From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 10:12:19 2004 From: "Custer, Carl" To: "'Custer, Mary'" , "'Custer, Steph'" , "'Dockery, Tony'" , "'Dockery, Donna'" , "'DCCycles'" Cc: "'jdhaydt@XXXXXX'" Subject: small pickup for sale Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:17:32 -0500 Contact him not me. Or pass it on to someone who wants a reliable vehicle from a reliable guy. Carl in Bethesda Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 07:15:54 -0600 From: John Haydt Anyone looking for a small pickup lemme know. I've got two: -1990 Nissan 4x4 3.0L V6 Extended Cab ($3000) with a freshly rebuilt transmission and electric everything. -2001 Mazda B3000 3.0L V6 Dual Sport ($10500). Extended Cab, etc. Gonna sell either one. Offlist will get you details and pix if interested. John Haydt Lansdale, PA Snow, it could be worse. Vintage bikers: http://www.knoxnews.com/kns/north_knox/article/0,1406,KNS_368_2624149,00.htm l "We want to be free to drink our espresso, ride our machines and not be hassled by the man." Oh gee, I recognize that parody From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 10:30:18 2004 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:30:11 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! To: DC-Cycles@XXXXXX KEM confesses: >My personal favorite is "A Space Alien Raped My Weedeater." [Dave] Would you be willing to look that article up for me? I have knowledge of where my former non working snow blower is, and would definitely like to know if this space alien has a fetish for snow blowers too. It has already suffered the fate of 10,000 sledgehammer hits, but as the final indignation, why not a raping by space alien? >And I ride a 1996 Honda VT600CD Shadow VLX Deluxe - not a >beginner, but still scared stiff of the beltway. Hell, I'm >scared of it in my car. [Dave] Good for you (the bike), and the beltway isn't that bad most of the time... except... rush hours in the morning, midday, and evening and when they're doing construction... which is, what? Perpetual... :-/ >Kathleen E. Miller >Research Assistant to William Safire >The Much Maligned New York Times ;-) >(hey, I just work here.) [Dave] Maybe since you're on DCC, we can overlook that ;-) Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 10:38:20 2004 From: To: "Custer, Carl" , "'Custer, Mary'" , "'Custer, Steph'" , "'Dockery, Tony'" , "'Dockery, Donna'" , "'DCCycles'" CC: "'jdhaydt@XXXXXX'" Subject: Re: small pickup for sale Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 10:38:11 -0500 > Snow, it could be worse. > ..above link doesn't work. ?? -aki From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 10:57:56 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 10:57:50 -0500 To: "Jim McGonigle" , From: Mike Bartman Subject: RE: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa At 09:51 AM 2/5/04 -0500, Jim McGonigle wrote: > >He still deserves to be put away for a long time. 80mph isn't slightly >speeding and if the bike really went 300 yards then he was going faster than >that. It also sounds like he lane split to hit her. THe article wasn't full of detail on the circumstances, but I ended up with a picture like this: Two lanes of traffic stopped at a red light. Bike approaches, going very fast, from the rear, as the light goes green. Rather than brake and wait his turn, he lane splits between the two lines of traffic, and accelerates, thinking "neat! I'll pass all this slow stuff before it can get going!" and he hits the lady in the crosswalk on the far side of the intersection after trying, and failing, to avoid the collision due to lack of time resulting from excessive speed. Don't know if that's what happened, but that's what it sounded like from the few bits in the four articles referenced, when combined with 30 years of driving experience and more than that learning about human nature. Another, "not an accident" situation.... -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 10:57:56 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 10:52:26 -0500 To: Troutman , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa At 09:37 AM 2/5/04 -0500, Troutman wrote: >This story is starting to make some waves down in Tampa. > >http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf8&client=google&num=30 &newsclusterurl=http://www.theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article%3FAID%3D/2004 0204/NEWS/402040365/1004 Wonder if this will result in calls to ban "assault bikes"? It certainly isn't going to do much for calls to allow "lane splitting". It only takes a few jerks to spoil things for everyone. One thing is pretty sure, they won't come down against jogging... -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 11:10:31 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 11:05:41 -0500 To: "Kathleen E. Miller" , DC-Cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! At 10:04 AM 2/5/04 -0500, Kathleen E. Miller wrote: >At 08:59 PM 2/4/2004 -0800, you wrote: > >> "Saddam & Osama's gay wedding" >> >>or how about >> >> "Lose 70 lbs. in 15 days with flesh-eating bacteria" >> >>Now that's rivoting journalism. > >My personal favorite is "A Space Alien Raped My Weedeater." "Expiring minds want to know..." Back when I worked at Goddard one of the guys in my group used to get those things for entertainment. Laughed himself silly at times. Only story I remember was about the lost fighters from the Bermuda Triangle incident in the 40's being found on the moon. They had a picture of a B-17 bomber sitting in a crater to "prove" it (apparently they thought a 4 engine bomber looks enough like a P-47 fighter that nobody would notice). Because we were at Goddard, we decided to ask around and see if we could identify the crater. The bomber completely filled the crater, so we started out looking for a small one, but as it turns out that crater is really over 200 miles across. We figured the vacuum had caused the bomber to expand in the same way that marshmallows do... :^) Weird Al did a song about that sort of article..."Midnight Star" I think it was. One of his first few albums. >And I ride a >1996 Honda VT600CD Shadow VLX Deluxe - not a beginner, but still scared >stiff of the beltway. Hell, I'm scared of it in my car. I'm not scared of the beltway, especially in my car, but I am *very* alert when I'm on it. People around here just can't drive. I figure they're giving out driver's licenses in boxes of Cracker Jacks or something. -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 11:10:33 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 11:10:25 -0500 To: , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! At 10:07 AM 2/5/04 -0500, adamme1@XXXXXX wrote: >...the spam mail is getting worse too. > >First it was "GAIN 8 INCHES TO YOUR MANHOOD! I'm tall enough, thank you very much...another 8" and I'd never find a production bike I could ride! >Then it changed to "GAIN 4" OF GIRTH TO YOUR ROD!" I don't need a fatter bike either! >"ADD 3LBS TO YOUR PENIS!" > >Do you think someone is trying to tell me something? ;-) They sell really small saddle bags? They are idiots, or they think you are? Or both? Why can't Janklow just start running down SPAMmers? No jury would convict him for that! -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 11:33:00 2004 Subject: RE: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa From: Carl Schelin To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: 05 Feb 2004 11:29:26 -0500 On Thu, 2004-02-05 at 10:57, Mike Bartman wrote: > Two lanes of traffic stopped at a red light. Bike approaches, going very > fast, from the rear, as the light goes green. Rather than brake and wait > his turn, he lane splits between the two lines of traffic, and accelerates, > thinking "neat! I'll pass all this slow stuff before it can get going!" > and he hits the lady in the crosswalk on the far side of the intersection > after trying, and failing, to avoid the collision due to lack of time > resulting from excessive speed. > One of the lines in the article mentioned that she had almost reached the grassy median. From that line I'd have to say he was on the shoulder/close to the curb. I'm not so sure about the light though. She seemed sure enough to cross the street even with traffic so a light had to have been involved but he was doing 80+ when he hit her. Maybe he was trying to dust her off and misjudged how close the car was to him/he was to her. Since she had headphones on, she wouldn't have heard him coming until maybe the last second and wouldn't have known to jump out of the way. > Don't know if that's what happened, but that's what it sounded like from > the few bits in the four articles referenced, when combined with 30 years > of driving experience and more than that learning about human nature. > > Another, "not an accident" situation.... > In any case, with his record and age (he should know better), he should certainly get more than 100 days :-/ > > -- Mike B. > Carl From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 12:56:35 2004 From: "Doug Allis" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Whats wrong with Registering? Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:44:58 -0500 Mainly this: I have had it with every GD web site that asks me for far too much personal information, makes me use another stupid password, so they know it is me evey time I go there. I get to keep track of almost two dozen usernames and passwords to get to any site worth going to. Then these sites load my PC with spyware, track how I use their site, or worse all my Internet usage. I get added to another e-mail list, which may not be resold immediately, but will at at some future date, after changing the site "privacy" policy, or after the company is reorganized or comes under new management, or just realized that they can increase revenue by making the list available to others. Most likely it will end up with some third party who will resell it to someone else who will put me on an internet porn SPAM list, choking up my work e-mail address with 50 messages a day. You don't think so, you say? Why do you think I keep this Hotmail address? All this so I get to look at the NYTimes or Washington Post for free? NOT ME. _________________________________________________________________ Scope out the new MSN Plus Internet Software ^[)BM-^W optimizes dial-up to the max! http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/plus&ST=1 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 13:06:05 2004 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 13:05:51 EST Subject: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/5/2004 9:59:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, millerk@XXXXXX writes: > 1996 Honda VT600CD Shadow VLX Deluxe Cool, (no pun) I for one like that bike > not a beginner, but still scared > stiff of the beltway. Hell, I'm scared of it in my car. Fear is not a bad thing. Unreasonable fear is a bad thing. There is nothing unreasonable about fearing the morons out on the beltway. Loud pipes quell cells. 20-20 hindsight shows the future if you are not careful. John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC Honda ST1100X Pan European BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 13:06:55 2004 From: "rich hall" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 12:55:29 -0500 Damn, making us SV Riders look like hooligans. >From: Troutman >To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa >Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 09:37:23 -0500 > >This story is starting to make some waves down in Tampa. > >http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf8&client=google&num=30&newsclusterurl=http://www.theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article%3FAID%3D/20040204/NEWS/402040365/1004 _________________________________________________________________ Scope out the new MSN Plus Internet Software ^[)BM-^W optimizes dial-up to the max! http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/plus&ST=1 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 14:00:02 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 13:58:57 -0500 To: Carl Schelin , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: RE: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa At 11:29 AM 2/5/04 -0500, Carl Schelin wrote: >On Thu, 2004-02-05 at 10:57, Mike Bartman wrote: > >> Two lanes of traffic stopped at a red light. Bike approaches, going very >> fast, from the rear, as the light goes green. Rather than brake and wait >> his turn, he lane splits between the two lines of traffic, and accelerates, >> thinking "neat! I'll pass all this slow stuff before it can get going!" >> and he hits the lady in the crosswalk on the far side of the intersection >> after trying, and failing, to avoid the collision due to lack of time >> resulting from excessive speed. > >One of the lines in the article mentioned that she had almost reached >the grassy median. From that line I'd have to say he was on the >shoulder/close to the curb. I thought it said she ended up there, not that she was almost there? Given that the rider ended up almost a block away, enough force to move her across half the street isn't out of the question. It also said that he was riding up the center-line, so if she'd been anywhere other than the middle of the street, he'd have missed her, unless he was losing control already or something. The article was a bit sparse on details like that. I suspect we'll hear more once they finish the investigation. Maybe he clipped a car while lane splitting at high speed and that took him out of control or something. >I'm not so sure about the light though. She seemed sure enough to cross >the street even with traffic so a light had to have been involved but he >was doing 80+ when he hit her. Right. That's why I pictured things the way I did. It was red, so she started across, it went green, so he didn't slow down, but ran between the lines of stopped traffic (they said that part). If that's the idiot thing he did, it's even more likely that he'd have been hit by someone running into the red the other way...no matter how you look at it, it's a stupid thing to do...if that's what happened. >Maybe he was trying to dust her off and >misjudged how close the car was to him/he was to her. Huh? What car? He was on a bike, she was in sneakers. Are we talking about the same accident? What do you mean by "dust her off"? The only contexts I have for that phrase involve either house cleaning or military airlift from an LZ, neither of which apply to this. What are you saying there? >Since she had >headphones on, she wouldn't have heard him coming until maybe the last >second and wouldn't have known to jump out of the way. It wasn't her responsibility to jump out of the way (pedestrians have right of way), though I'm sure she'd have tried if she'd seen or heard him...but at 80+ mph, he'd have covered the distance across the intersection before she could react anyway more than likely. The traffic he lane split past would have blocked most of the sound until he was past it too. >> Another, "not an accident" situation.... > >In any case, with his record and age (he should know better), he should >certainly get more than 100 days :-/ No idea what the law is down there. We'll see. -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 14:03:50 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 14:03:38 -0500 To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! At 01:05 PM 2/5/04 EST, PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: >In a message dated 2/5/2004 9:59:05 AM Eastern Standard Time, >millerk@XXXXXX writes: >> not a beginner, but still scared >> stiff of the beltway. Hell, I'm scared of it in my car. > >Fear is not a bad thing. >Unreasonable fear is a bad thing. >There is nothing unreasonable about fearing the morons out on the beltway. Yeah, if you aren't at least a little bit nervous you probably don't have enough experience yet. :^) Nervous is good...it indicates that you need to be extra careful. -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 15:18:03 2004 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:17:57 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: Paul Wilson Reply-To: Paul Wilson To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: John Kerry (95% moto content) According to Boston radio host and Boston Herald columnist Howie Carr, presidential front-runner Kerry is, among other things, a former Ducati owner who changed his moto image as part of his presidential bid. "Yet that same year [1993, when he made $135 in charitable donations according to Carr], he was somehow able to scrape together $8,600 for a brand-new, imported Italian motorcycle, a Ducati Paso 907 IE. He kept it for years, until he decided to run for president, at which time he traded it in for a Harley-Davidson like the one he rode onto "The Tonight Show" set a couple of months ago as Jay Leno applauded his fellow Bay Stater." ----- Hmmm, I'm not sure I get Carr's point. What's wrong with spending $8,600 for a bike, esp. a classic Italian sportbike? ;-) If he's trying to prove to me Kerry is a self-centered hedonist, he's going to have to do better than that. Heh. -=P From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 15:37:24 2004 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:37:20 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: Re: John Kerry (95% moto content) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Viffer Pablo reported: >According to Boston radio host and Boston Herald columnist >Howie Carr, presidential front-runner Kerry is, among other >things, a former Ducati owner who changed his moto image as >part of his presidential bid. [Dave] Paul, this is called foreshadowing. John wants to 'move backwards' from a duck to a HD, and take the country with him ;-) > >"Yet that same year [1993, when he made $135 in charitable >donations according to Carr], he was somehow able to scrape >together $8,600 for a brand-new, imported Italian >motorcycle, a Ducati Paso 907 IE. He kept it for years, >until he decided to run for president, at which time he >traded it in for a Harley-Davidson like the one he rode >onto "The Tonight Show" set a couple of months ago as Jay >Leno applauded his fellow Bay Stater." > >----- > >Hmmm, I'm not sure I get Carr's point. What's wrong with >spending $8,600 for a bike, esp. a classic Italian >sportbike? ;-) If he's trying to prove to me Kerry is a >self-centered hedonist, he's going to have to do better than >that. Heh. [Dave] good point. Proof that he's not _all_ bad. Is Kerry the only biker among potential candidates? what would other potential CIC's ride were they to be pro moto? Bush? AMF harley - he likes to spend, spend, spend ! Dean? Triumph speed triple - true to the 'hooligan' image Edwards? Goldwing - the Mr. Niceguy of bikes Clark? BMW1150GS for the rugged image - just like Wes's Advocate picture ;-) Sharpton? Riding would mess up his 'fro Kucinich? Moped. Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 15:45:59 2004 Subject: Re: John Kerry (95% moto content) From: Carl Schelin To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: 05 Feb 2004 15:42:28 -0500 On Thu, 2004-02-05 at 15:37, Dave Yates wrote: > Viffer Pablo reported: > > > >Hmmm, I'm not sure I get Carr's point. What's wrong with > >spending $8,600 for a bike, esp. a classic Italian > >sportbike? ;-) If he's trying to prove to me Kerry is a > >self-centered hedonist, he's going to have to do better than > >that. Heh. > > [Dave] good point. Proof that he's not _all_ bad. > Is Kerry the only biker among potential candidates? > I'd be _less_ likely to vote for him based on biker choice. Dropping a duc for a Harley just to get votes is poser mentality. 'course he'll get the poser crowd which is fairly large ;-) > what would other potential CIC's ride were they to be pro > moto? > > Bush? AMF harley - he likes to spend, spend, spend ! I didn't think he had a Harley that old. If he has an AMF HD, he's likely into oil reserves because of the constant trickle down. > Dean? Triumph speed triple - true to the 'hooligan' image Errr, likely he has lots of videos of bike events and magazines but no bike just yet. > Edwards? Goldwing - the Mr. Niceguy of bikes > Clark? BMW1150GS for the rugged image - just like Wes's > Advocate picture ;-) > Sharpton? Riding would mess up his 'fro > Kucinich? Moped. > > > Dave Yates > Carl From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 15:47:08 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:45:28 -0500 From: Skip CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: John Kerry (95% moto content) Dave Yates wrote: > > Viffer Pablo reported: > > >According to Boston radio host and Boston Herald columnist > >Howie Carr, presidential front-runner Kerry is, among other > >things, a former Ducati owner who changed his moto image as > >part of his presidential bid. > > [Dave] Paul, this is called foreshadowing. John wants > to 'move backwards' from a duck to a HD, and take the country > with him ;-) > c'mon... think about it... a Democrat on a Ducati? they'd laugh him right out of the party. he needs a "people's bike" to appeal to the blue collar union guy! From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 15:54:35 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:53:39 -0500 To: Dave Yates , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: John Kerry (95% moto content) At 03:37 PM 2/5/04 -0500, Dave Yates wrote: >Viffer Pablo reported: > >>According to Boston radio host and Boston Herald columnist >>Howie Carr, presidential front-runner Kerry is, among other >>things, a former Ducati owner who changed his moto image as >>part of his presidential bid. > >[Dave] Paul, this is called foreshadowing. John wants >to 'move backwards' from a duck to a HD, and take the country >with him ;-) Wow! When do we leave?!? :^) >what would other potential CIC's ride were they to be pro >moto? Well, who's left today? >Bush? AMF harley - he likes to spend, spend, spend ! Nah, Clinton had all the leaks... :^) >Clark? BMW1150GS for the rugged image - just like Wes's Too Yuppie. How about one of those German half-track bikes? Or an old WWII-era Harley with a sidecar. In olive-drab of course. >Sharpton? Riding would mess up his 'fro Have to be a flash custom chopper or he'll lose the city vote. Maybe OCC can do him up a theme bike that combines a religious halo with a power-hungry politico? -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 16:44:17 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:44:03 -0500 From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa X-AOL-IP: 12.36.128.140 Charges will most likely be pressed and he'll wind up serving more time than Janklow. Not that I'm saying this is wrong. I believe we need to be held just as accountable for our actions but, I'm sure people will throw this back in our faces that motorcyclists kill people too. I feel sorry for her family. Scooter In a message dated 2/5/2004 9:37:23 AM Eastern Standard Time, mike@XXXXXX writes: > > > This story is starting to make some waves down in Tampa. > > http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf8&client=google&num=30&newsclusterurl=http://www.theledger.com/apps/ > pbcs.dll/article%3FAID%3D/20040204/NEWS/402040365/1004 > > > ___________________________________________ > Mike Troutman > http://www.troutman.org/vfr > 1997 Honda VFR 750 > AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ > NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 16:47:03 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:46:50 -0500 From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: NYT link Bwa ha ha ha ha ha! X-AOL-IP: 12.36.128.140 In a message dated 2/5/2004 10:07:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, adamme1@XXXXXX writes: > "ADD 3LBS TO YOUR PENIS!" > > Do you think someone is trying to tell me something? ;-) > > -aki That you're a pencil-dick? :-) Sorry, couldn't resist. Scooter (ducking and running) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 16:52:01 2004 From: "Jim McGonigle" To: Subject: RE: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:51:23 -0500 Like everything, its not the object it's the person. Stupid, irresponsible, ignorant people kill people. Guns don't kill people. Cars don't kill people. Motorcycles don't kill people. Etc... Unfortunately as a society, we don't make people take responsibility for their actions. -----Original Message----- From: ScooterFZR@XXXXXX [mailto:ScooterFZR@XXXXXX] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 4:44 PM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa Charges will most likely be pressed and he'll wind up serving more time than Janklow. Not that I'm saying this is wrong. I believe we need to be held just as accountable for our actions but, I'm sure people will throw this back in our faces that motorcyclists kill people too. I feel sorry for her family. Scooter In a message dated 2/5/2004 9:37:23 AM Eastern Standard Time, mike@XXXXXX writes: > > > This story is starting to make some waves down in Tampa. > > http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf8&client=google&n > um=30&newsclusterurl=http://www.theledger.com/apps/ > pbcs.dll/article%3FAID%3D/20040204/NEWS/402040365/1004 > > > ___________________________________________ > Mike Troutman > http://www.troutman.org/vfr > 1997 Honda VFR 750 > AMA http://www.ama-cycle.org/ > NMA http://www.motorists.org From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 17:16:45 2004 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 14:16:36 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Withrow Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa To: Mike Bartman , Troutman , dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- Mike Bartman wrote: >> One thing is pretty sure, they won't come down > against jogging... > > Show me a jogger that runs fast enough to hit a motorcyclist and knock him 150yds, while mangling a chain link fence 300yds away. If joggers acted as stupid, and were as dangerous as many motorcyclist, then they would be regulated as well. Many try to prove to the world that motorcyclist should be more heavily regulated than we already are. I think he never saw her. Obviously his vision was obstructed by riding with his head up his ass. ===== AIM: Inf DS http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow ----------------------------------------------------------- Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to childproof the world. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 17:51:28 2004 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 17:51:07 -0500 Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Randy Moran The bike is a TL1000. You SV riders are still safe. RPM On Thursday, February 5, 2004, at 12:55 PM, rich hall wrote: > Damn, making us SV Riders look like hooligans. > >> From: Troutman >> To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >> Subject: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa >> Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 09:37:23 -0500 >> >> This story is starting to make some waves down in Tampa. >> >> http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF- >> 8&oe=utf8&client=google&num=30&newsclusterurl=http:// >> www.theledger.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article%3FAID%3D/20040204/NEWS/ >> 402040365/1004 > > _________________________________________________________________ > Scope out the new MSN Plus Internet Software ^[)BM-^W optimizes dial-up to > the max! http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=byoa/plus&ST=1 > From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 18:08:56 2004 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:08:49 -0800 (PST) From: "pltrgyst@XXXXXX" Subject: Maier moto case... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX As long as we're into legal cases, here's an interesting one: -- Larry =============================== Driver must pay less for accident involving Maier February 5, 2004 MUNICH, Germany (AP) -- The man convicted of negligent driving in the traffic accident that nearly cost Olympic skiing champion Hermann Maier his right leg had his fine reduced by a Munich court Thursday. The 75-year-old man, whose name was not released in keeping with German court practice, was ordered to pay $945, down from the original fine of $3,456. His one-month driving ban was also lifted. The man had appealed the original fine. The court ruled the man did not make an illegal left turn, but that he did not pay enough attention to the traffic behind him. It also ruled that Maier was passing on his motorcycle without a clear line of vision. The accident occurred in August 2001, 2001, when Maier was overtaking a column of in the town of Radstadt, near his home town of Flachau. Maier slammed into the car, which had just begun making a left turn when the accident occurred in Radstadt in August 2001. The crash nearly cost Maier his right leg, and he spent months recovering. The two-time Olympic champion returned to competition last season. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online. http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 18:15:31 2004 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:15:23 -0800 (PST) From: matthew patton Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Without the full story or a background on FL law I won't say too much. IF (and it's a big if) he was operating in a reckless manner like Jenklow was I hope the guy is brought up on vehicular manslaughter charges or even homicide. But if he does get brought up, then frankly I want to put SD on the spot for their coddling of a politico who was just as guilty of deliberately and criminally putting others lives at risk. Accident my ass! But we have to bear in mind also what the jogger was up to. Being a runner and avid bicyclist for many years myself, it was common for my peers to just cross the street against the red because they didn't want to stop. Disregarding traffic lights is sport in most cities with DC being but one handy example. If the bike had a green light and struck the runner in the middle of the road (which seems likely) then I would have to guess the runner attempted to cross the street on a full red on the notion that she could do so and get away with it since the cars were either just starting up or she disn't SEE (hint: MSF keyword) the oncoming threat. She didn't account for a flaming fool doing 2x the speed limit and she and her family paid the tragic cost of 30sec worth of impatience. Actually this notion that the rider was doing 80mph is IMO quite suspect. Bystander estimation of speed has been demonstrated to be wildly inaccurate. Not to mention there is the discrepency between reports of 300 FT vs YARDS with most of the articles citing feet which seems the most logical. If the account is correct so far it is not at all inconceivable that the rider was in the runner's blind spot (hiding behind the column of cars in the near lane) or equally possible given the sunrise time of 7am this time of year that at 6:15 it was pretty damn dark. A single headlight as we all know is hard to guage distance so it's not surprising the runner would have thought she could go for it. And lost. I hope for his sake the rider wasn't breaking the law but I wouldn't be surprised if he was - the scent of water must make people think they are superman or something...(Chicago Lake Shore Drive, GW Parkway, and now this) And while I'm very sorry somebody died in the encounter and if culpability can truely and properly be attributed that person needs to get hit hard. A better long-term benefit would be if we got serious about addressing the pathetic licensing scheme we have tolerated in this country for way too long. From mandatory if not (semi-)permanent license revokation of all intoxicated operators, stiff fines, graduated licensing, real driving tests for once, stiff tarrifs on high-powered vehicles (incl truck/car/bike) should be looked at and adopted. On the other hand, in the interests of liberty and keeping the gov'ts heavy hand out where it's not strictly needed are there enough incidents to justify intervention (aside from drunk-driving carnage which imo IS a clear and present danger)? What is the inflection point where the social and economic cost of regulation and removal of liberties can balance the number of lives "saved"? There are some that would say "even one life saved is worth it." To them I say get a bloody grip. In the immortal words of ol Franklin: "Those that would trade liberty for security deserve neither (or get either)." From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 19:46:32 2004 Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:45:42 -0500 From: Kendall Clark To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 02/05/04 Reply-To: kendall@XXXXXX Two dcc'ers opined, moronically, thus: > Sharpton? Riding would mess up his 'fro > Have to be a flash custom chopper or he'll lose the city vote. Maybe OCC > can do him up a theme bike that combines a religious halo with a > power-hungry politico? Wow, is this the dc-cycles list or tryouts for the next Imperial Grand Wizard slot at the local klavern? First, if you're gonna slander someone you really know nothing about, yo have to get at least *basic* facts right. Sharpton doesn't have a "'fro". In fact, he sometimes gets teased by black folks for having artificial hair, but he wears his hair that way as a kind of homage to James Brown (plus, I suspect Rev. Sharpton *likes* his hair style). He's toned it down in the past few years, such that his hair is hardly a big deal any more. Second, isn't it much more honest -- you right wingers like honesty, right? -- to just say what you mean directly? "City vote" is code for African Americans. So just say that. Third, as anyone with a bit of cultural sense knows, if there is a preferred style of bike among urban African Americans (and I'm not sure there is), it's *clearly* the most rad Japanese liter bike, like a Hayabusa or a Ninja. Last, if "religious halo" and "power hungry politico" were intended to be as derogatory as they sound, gee, check yr facts! The suggestion that Sharpton's religious faith is anything but sincere (he's a been a preacher since he was a very small boy) or that his political activism is merely a grab for power (would you go to jail for 40 days in support of yr principles?) are so much tacky grousing, at best. I for one would be very happy if this list stayed relatively apolitical; there are lots of political issues surrounding moto ownership -- couldn't we stick to them and leave the racism out? Kendall Clark '04 Speed Triple, Special Edition (and proud Sharpton supporter!) From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 19:49:35 2004 From: "lisagoddard" To: "'DC Cycles'" Subject: Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 19:54:07 -0500 Just jumping in to play devil's advocate here. I run about 20 miles per week and plenty of those miles have been run in the Bethesda/Chevy Chase area, somewhat urban streets with plenty of traffic. A few things I have noticed. Not all joggers pay any mind to traffic lights, crosswalks or even the fact that cars are oncoming. Not to mention the fact that many of the joggers I see doing this are often wearing stereo earphones which couldn't help his or her hearing as they are crossing a street. I cringe every time I see a jogger determined to keep his or her pace merrily bound across the street despite not having the light and there being plenty of cross traffic. I cringe even harder when I see rollerbladers do the same thing. I have seen this during the day and at night. Many of the joggers and rollerbladers are usually heading to or from the Capitol Crescent trail, a great path with no cars. But, the joggers/rollerbladers often seem to have forgotten that they are not on the trail at that particular moment, that they are on a street with cars and trucks. I have to wonder if she was one of those joggers who pay no mind to the traffic on the street and worry more about maintaining a good pace. The article mentioned she was heading out for a 9 mile run. She could have very well been paying all of her attention to her run, not her surroundings. I also have a few years of experience commuting in and out of Bethesda on my motorcycle. There were a few lights on my daily commute where just about every morning some pedestrian would cross right in front of me just after the light turned green in my favor. This was one of those lights where you have exactly two nanoseconds to move through the intersection before it turns yellow. The pedestrians seemed to pay less mind to me alone on the motorcycle than if I were in one lane with a cage sitting in the lane next to me. I got in the habit of revving my engine just as the yellow light appeared for the other street at the intersection, it helped a little but plenty of pedestrians would usually just continue on their path, regardless of the walk or don't walk sign. In other words it seemed that pedestrians just didn't take a motorcycle as seriously as they would a car. I can't help but to wonder if she (the jogger in Tampa) just thought to herself "oh, it's just a little motorcycle, not a 3,000 pound car, I'll just jog quickly across the street right in front of it, he won't mind". Just my $.02 Lisa Goddard '95 VFR '97 GSXR 600 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 20:22:01 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 19:22:00 -0600 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Sean Jordan Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa Interesting...the first article says the motorcycle traveled 300 yards...the other articles state 300 feet. I wonder which number is right? - Sean Jordan From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 21:51:03 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 21:50:01 -0500 To: kendall@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 02/05/04 At 07:45 PM 2/5/04 -0500, Kendall Clark wrote, after leaping to conclusions: >Two dcc'ers opined, moronically, thus: >> Have to be a flash custom chopper or he'll lose the city vote. Maybe OCC >> can do him up a theme bike that combines a religious halo with a >> power-hungry politico? >Second, isn't it much more honest -- you right wingers like honesty, >right? -- to just say what you mean directly? "City vote" is code for >African Americans. So just say that. First, who you callin' a "right winger"??? Second, if I'd meant "African Americans", I'd have said that. I didn't want to include those that don't live downtown, or exclude those who do who aren't black. Choppers aren't limited to black folks (not even a little bit) anyway. If you ask me, choppers are best used for bar hopping or other short rides...i.e. city travel. Yes, you can ride them long distance, but they aren't very good at that. Ditto for rough or winding roads. Billy Lane nearly bought the farm on one of the Biker Buildoff shows, when the hardtail chopper he was riding up the interstate hit a smallish pothole and it almost threw him over the bars. Jessie James rode his to Sturgis on a Motorcycle Maniacs show, and he looked like hell when he got there, and even commented on camera about it being more of a ride than he'd been expecting. Since I've never ridden a chopper, that's about all I have to go on, aside from some comments in various net places, but that's what led to the comment I made. Sorry if I hit a nerve and made your knee jump, but you were assuming more than was there. >Third, as anyone with a bit of cultural sense knows, if there is a >preferred style of bike among urban African Americans (and I'm not >sure there is), it's *clearly* the most rad Japanese liter bike, like >a Hayabusa or a Ninja. I don't think there is, because movies like Biker Boyz would give that impression, but my GF's neighbor's BF (who is black, but perhaps slightly more suburban these days, just so we're clear on that point) was sitting on a Kawasaki sport bike at the D.C. bike show a couple of weeks back when we ran into them. I asked how many he was going to buy, as a humorous hello, and he just about jumped off of it, exclaiming that he didn't want import crap, he wanted something American...he was just seeing how uncomfortable it was. He's looking at Harleys...though he agreed it might be worth a look at the Victory booth too. Probably a Road King though, based on what he said they wanted a bike for (weekend trips). There's a very pleasant black guy in the local HOGs with a Road King too, though there are others with other sorts of bikes, so I don't think Road Kings are it either. >I for one would be very happy if this list stayed relatively >apolitical; there are lots of political issues surrounding moto >ownership -- couldn't we stick to them and leave the racism out? *I* didn't bring any in... -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 21:54:29 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 21:54:30 -0500 To: Sean Jordan , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa At 07:22 PM 2/5/04 -0600, Sean Jordan wrote: >Interesting...the first article says the motorcycle traveled 300 >yards...the other articles state 300 feet. > >I wonder which number is right? Could be either, given that one article said the rider landed at the next intersection (check the street names carefully...). Depends how closely spaced the streets are there. I think we need to wait for the police report to get all the facts straight. Reporters seem to be pretty sloppy these days a lot more often than they should be. -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 21:58:24 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 21:58:41 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 02/05/04 At 09:50 PM 2/5/2004, Mike Bartman wrote: >I don't think there is, because movies like Biker Boyz would give that >impression, but my GF's neighbor's BF (who is black, but perhaps slightly >more suburban these days, just so we're clear on that point) was sitting on >a Kawasaki sport bike at the D.C. bike show a couple of weeks back when we >ran into them. I asked how many he was going to buy, as a humorous hello, >and he just about jumped off of it, exclaiming that he didn't want import >crap, he wanted something American...he was just seeing how uncomfortable >it was. He's looking at Harleys...though he agreed it might be worth a >look at the Victory booth too. Probably a Road King though, based on what >he said they wanted a bike for (weekend trips). There's a very pleasant >black guy in the local HOGs with a Road King too, though there are others >with other sorts of bikes, so I don't think Road Kings are it either. Why would there be any one type of bike specific to a race? Blacks are just like whites - a wide spectrum of preferences. I have black friends that ride sportbikes, and others with (ridiculously) every known piece of Harley logo merchandise - including their bike of course. But as you Harley guys know, first you buy all of the gear with the emblems, then save up for the actual bike ;-) As for Al Sharpton, his political views have come closer to mainstream in the last few years, but he is still a nut. _____________________________________ Mike Troutman mike@XXXXXX http://www.troutman.org/vfr '97 Honda VFR 750 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Thu Feb 5 22:59:29 2004 Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 22:59:24 -0500 To: Troutman , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Mike Bartman Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 02/05/04 At 09:58 PM 2/5/04 -0500, Troutman wrote: >At 09:50 PM 2/5/2004, Mike Bartman wrote: >>I don't think there is, because movies like Biker Boyz would give that >Why would there be any one type of bike specific to a race? Can't think of any reason. >that ride sportbikes, and others with (ridiculously) every known piece of >Harley logo merchandise - including their bike of course. But as you >Harley guys know, first you buy all of the gear with the emblems, then save >up for the actual bike ;-) Really? I did it backwards? Aw, shit... I probably should have done it that way and gotten H-D gear back when I was riding Hondas and Yamahas...it's good quality and it actually fits me. Most of the stuff I found at the Honda and Yamaha places was just a little on the small side, but getting the biggest stuff they had available worked well enough I guess. With H-D gear, they actually have stuff that's too big for me...and given how big I am, that's scary! Or, rather, the guy it fits would be! :^) >As for Al Sharpton, his political views have come closer to mainstream in >the last few years, but he is still a nut. That seems to be a pre-requisite for running for President lately...I guess no sane person would want to go through what it takes given the way we've let the process get. -- Mike B. '04 FLSTCI (H-D Softail Heritage Classic with EFI for the non-Harley folks) Learning from your mistakes is good. Learning from someone else's mistakes is better. From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 6 08:13:47 2004 From: "Silver, Arthur (NIH/NIGMS)" To: "'lisagoddard'" , "'DC Cycles'" Subject: RE: Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:13:39 -0500 Amen. I've seen that a lot of times too. Also I've seen a lot of bicycles that try and swerve into my lane. They just seem to assume I just don't mind. It isn't like they can't hear me coming, my bike is rather loud. -----Original Message----- From: lisagoddard [mailto:lisagoddard@XXXXXX] Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 7:54 PM To: 'DC Cycles' Subject: Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa Just jumping in to play devil's advocate here. I run about 20 miles per week and plenty of those miles have been run in the Bethesda/Chevy Chase area, somewhat urban streets with plenty of traffic. A few things I have noticed. Not all joggers pay any mind to traffic lights, crosswalks or even the fact that cars are oncoming. Not to mention the fact that many of the joggers I see doing this are often wearing stereo earphones which couldn't help his or her hearing as they are crossing a street. I cringe every time I see a jogger determined to keep his or her pace merrily bound across the street despite not having the light and there being plenty of cross traffic. I cringe even harder when I see rollerbladers do the same thing. I have seen this during the day and at night. Many of the joggers and rollerbladers are usually heading to or from the Capitol Crescent trail, a great path with no cars. But, the joggers/rollerbladers often seem to have forgotten that they are not on the trail at that particular moment, that they are on a street with cars and trucks. I have to wonder if she was one of those joggers who pay no mind to the traffic on the street and worry more about maintaining a good pace. The article mentioned she was heading out for a 9 mile run. She could have very well been paying all of her attention to her run, not her surroundings. I also have a few years of experience commuting in and out of Bethesda on my motorcycle. There were a few lights on my daily commute where just about every morning some pedestrian would cross right in front of me just after the light turned green in my favor. This was one of those lights where you have exactly two nanoseconds to move through the intersection before it turns yellow. The pedestrians seemed to pay less mind to me alone on the motorcycle than if I were in one lane with a cage sitting in the lane next to me. I got in the habit of revving my engine just as the yellow light appeared for the other street at the intersection, it helped a little but plenty of pedestrians would usually just continue on their path, regardless of the walk or don't walk sign. In other words it seemed that pedestrians just didn't take a motorcycle as seriously as they would a car. I can't help but to wonder if she (the jogger in Tampa) just thought to herself "oh, it's just a little motorcycle, not a 3,000 pound car, I'll just jog quickly across the street right in front of it, he won't mind". Just my $.02 Lisa Goddard '95 VFR '97 GSXR 600 From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 6 08:34:12 2004 Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 08:34:08 -0500 From: Dave Yates Subject: RE: Subject: Re: Speeding Moto kills jogger in Tampa To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > >Amen. I've seen that a lot of times too. Also I've seen a >lot of bicycles that try and swerve into my lane. They just >seem to assume I just don't mind. [Dave] When I worked on Wisconsin ave. daily I saw people cross against the light traffic conditions notwithstanding, sometimes while yakking on a cell. Once, I saw one of these yakkers about to step on to the 35 mph street, and yelled stop! at the top of my lungs. The woman gave me "the look" (usually reserved for husbands), resumed her conversation, and her stride... to be rudely awakened by a speeding car as she stepped off. She was startled, blurted out some profanities at the driver who had the green light and had it all along, but never dropped that cell... It's not that these types of people don't 'mind', they don't CARE. Not saying the jogger in this case wasn't paying attention, or was even remotely at fault. Nor do I mean to pass judgment on the biker. I will say that the thread title is like a NYT headline - sensationalized to draw attention... It worked, or I wouldn't have spent the last 4 1/2 minutes typing this. I would think that pre conviction, a more accurate portrayal would be "jogger dies in collision with motorcyclist"... > >Just jumping in to play devil's advocate here. > Dave Yates From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 6 10:18:06 2004 From: "Rob Sharp" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 02/05/04 Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 10:19:39 -0500 Bike Content ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- I knew a guy in my complex who hada a long history of racing Aprilla RS250's and have moved on to a Honda Goldwing. Bikers seem to have one common thread, they all like riding two wheeled vehicles. Right now I ride a sports bike but I have always though about getting a cruiser. Carl is a perfect example. He has a Harley, a Suzuki GSXR and is building his own chopper. Non Bike Content ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Oh and Kendall your proving to be more of a racist than anyone here. Black people are just damn people like everyone on this list. And until people stop making color an issue it's never gonna change. Next time you wanna defend your candidate leave their race outta it. Regards Rob On Thu, 05 Feb 2004 21:58:41 -0500, Troutman wrote > At 09:50 PM 2/5/2004, Mike Bartman wrote: > >I don't think there is, because movies like Biker Boyz would give that > >impression, but my GF's neighbor's BF (who is black, but perhaps slightly > >more suburban these days, just so we're clear on that point) was sitting on > >a Kawasaki sport bike at the D.C. bike show a couple of weeks back when we > >ran into them. I asked how many he was going to buy, as a humorous hello, > >and he just about jumped off of it, exclaiming that he didn't want import > >crap, he wanted something American...he was just seeing how uncomfortable > >it was. He's looking at Harleys...though he agreed it might be worth a > >look at the Victory booth too. Probably a Road King though, based on what > >he said they wanted a bike for (weekend trips). There's a very pleasant > >black guy in the local HOGs with a Road King too, though there are others > >with other sorts of bikes, so I don't think Road Kings are it either. > > Why would there be any one type of bike specific to a race? Blacks > are just like whites - a wide spectrum of preferences. I have black > friends that ride sportbikes, and others with (ridiculously) every > known piece of Harley logo merchandise - including their bike of > course. But as you Harley guys know, first you buy all of the gear > with the emblems, then save up for the actual bike ;-) > > As for Al Sharpton, his political views have come closer to > mainstream in the last few years, but he is still a nut. > > _____________________________________ > Mike Troutman > mike@XXXXXX > http://www.troutman.org/vfr > > '97 Honda VFR 750 -- Rob Sharp 1996 Honda VFR 750 2003 Chevy S10 Xtreme SSCP/CCSP/CCNA 2.0/CCSA Network Security Engineer From dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX Fri Feb 6 10:28:45 2004 Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 02/05/04 From: Carl Schelin To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: 06 Feb 2004 10:25:13 -0500 On Fri, 2004-02-06 at 10:19, Rob Sharp wrote: > Bike Content > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > I knew a guy in my complex who hada a long history of racing Aprilla RS250's > and have moved on to a Honda Goldwing. Bikers seem to