From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 00:40:08 2002 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 00:39:51 EST Subject: Re: Road rage incident To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 1/31/2002 5:33:04 PM Eastern Standard Time, lantech.cwd@XXXXXX writes: > I agree with the one-finger salute 100%! > But I also don't think it is worth it to try and prove who's got the right > of way. It is also a good bet that the guy was higher then a kite. Never assume they are sober or sane. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 00:49:50 2002 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 00:49:19 EST Subject: Re: Help me, please... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 1/31/2002 10:28:39 PM Eastern Standard Time, HOFOJOKO@XXXXXX writes: > a patrol car coming at me, how the hell can > he tell how fast I was going? He was moving too! He bounced a microwave signal off of you, a computer measured the Doppler shift converted it to the speed the two vehicles were closing on each other, read the speedometer of the cop car, simple subtraction, voala! you are busted. If it was any harder then that do you think they could do it? John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC Honda ST1100X Pan European (With all of the STs all of a sudden the Pan European is now necessary {and I still like it.}) BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 01:38:00 2002 Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 22:37:59 -0800 (PST) From: matthew patton Subject: survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consumer News? To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I have almost all (if not all) issues of Motorcycle Consumer News since Jan 1995, IMO the best and most useful of MC magazines. I'm in the process of scanning them all in and creating cross references between them so as to get a complete break-down on subject matter along the lines of Columns/Editorial, Bike tests, Product tests, Techincal HOwTo's, and Riding Technique, etc. Navigation will be via HTML links and also Acrobat PDF bookmarks. All magazine content is at 300dpi PDF. It's a ton of work but I think I'll enjoy doing it and providing it on CDrom to MSF students, etc. I'm also trying to see if I can interest MCN magazine staff and MCReports on the venture. But even if they don't bite, I would like to guage the interest level in such a resource and roughly how much you'd be willing to pay for it (1995 to 2000). $50? $75, $100? Annual editions would probably be like $30 and include the previous year or two. A reference point (cost wise) is MCReports which is $6 an issue so my product is a major cost savings not to mention actually useful and won't get torn or otherwise destroyed over time. I'm not setting out to make a mint here but rather following in the footsteps of the SV/RC51/Katana etc. communities that sell microfishe/manual CD's and such to their fellow riders. I think MCN is a fabulous magazine but am frustrated to no end that their website is utterly useless and there is nearly no way to know what they published and when. Let alone read the articles themselves. There is so much useful and good information within these pages that I think it's an utter waste not to get it into more hands. I think a CD such as this (purhaps limited to say 2 or 3 years worth) would be an absolute SMASH hit at the trade-show booths. I look forward to your comments. If you would like to forward this message on to other lists or parties, please CONTACT ME FIRST! Thank you __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 07:20:09 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 07:19:51 -0500 (EST) From: Peter Hartzler To: matthew patton cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consumer News? X-Loop-Detect: 1 How are you going to address the copyright issues? On Thu, 31 Jan 2002, matthew patton wrote in part: > I have almost all (if not all) issues of Motorcycle Consumer News since > Jan 1995 ... providing it on CDrom From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 08:22:53 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 05:22:51 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consumer News? To: matthew patton , dc-cycles@XXXXXX just as a guess i'd say you'd get sued for ~$1m for copyright infringement. there may also be criminal liability.... perhaps that wasn't the answer you were looking for.... ;) --- matthew patton wrote: > I have almost all (if not all) issues of Motorcycle > Consumer News since > Jan 1995, IMO the best and most useful of MC magazines. > I'm in the > process of scanning them all in and creating cross > references between > them so as to get a complete break-down on subject matter > along the > lines of Columns/Editorial, Bike tests, Product tests, > Techincal > HOwTo's, and Riding Technique, etc. Navigation will be > via HTML links > and also Acrobat PDF bookmarks. All magazine content is > at 300dpi PDF. > > It's a ton of work but I think I'll enjoy doing it and > providing it on > CDrom to MSF students, etc. I'm also trying to see if I > can interest > MCN magazine staff and MCReports on the venture. But even > if they don't > bite, I would like to guage the interest level in such a > resource and > roughly how much you'd be willing to pay for it (1995 to > 2000). $50? > $75, $100? Annual editions would probably be like $30 and > include the > previous year or two. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 08:24:14 2002 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 08:22:28 -0500 From: "William J. Huson" To: matthew patton CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consumer News? Best retain a good lawyer, you'll need one when MCN sues your butt off for copyright infringement. Task number one for your lawyer should be an attempt to contracturally obtian permission from MCN along with a royalty agreement. Bill intellectual property rights tis my bizz... matthew patton wrote: > I have almost all (if not all) issues of Motorcycle Consumer News since > Jan 1995, IMO the best and most useful of MC magazines. I'm in the > process of scanning them all in and creating cross references between > them so as to get a complete break-down on subject matter along the > lines of Columns/Editorial, Bike tests, Product tests, Techincal > HOwTo's, and Riding Technique, etc. Navigation will be via HTML links > and also Acrobat PDF bookmarks. All magazine content is at 300dpi PDF. > > It's a ton of work but I think I'll enjoy doing it and providing it on > CDrom to MSF students, etc. I'm also trying to see if I can interest > MCN magazine staff and MCReports on the venture. But even if they don't > bite, I would like to guage the interest level in such a resource and > roughly how much you'd be willing to pay for it (1995 to 2000). $50? > $75, $100? Annual editions would probably be like $30 and include the > previous year or two. > > A reference point (cost wise) is MCReports which is $6 an issue so my > product is a major cost savings not to mention actually useful and > won't get torn or otherwise destroyed over time. I'm not setting out to > make a mint here but rather following in the footsteps of the > SV/RC51/Katana etc. communities that sell microfishe/manual CD's and > such to their fellow riders. I think MCN is a fabulous magazine but am > frustrated to no end that their website is utterly useless and there is > nearly no way to know what they published and when. Let alone read the > articles themselves. There is so much useful and good information > within these pages that I think it's an utter waste not to get it into > more hands. I think a CD such as this (purhaps limited to say 2 or 3 > years worth) would be an absolute SMASH hit at the trade-show booths. > > I look forward to your comments. If you would like to forward this > message on to other lists or parties, please CONTACT ME FIRST! > > Thank you > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! > http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 08:38:55 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 05:38:54 -0800 (PST) From: matthew patton Subject: MCN copyright RE: [VRTP-Test] survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consum er News? To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I don't want to have to write a million messages saying the same thing. Yes, I am QUITE familiar with the copy-right issues and will take them up *AGAIN* with MCN. I tried almost a year ago and they weren't the least bit interested in even talking to me about it. With some example CD's in hand I can hopefully get their blasted attention. If nothing else my cross reference is all mine and I can do with it what I wish. The reason I"m asking about possible pricing is simple. I need to know the marketability of and demand for the product and have some data points to argue with MCN if they decry the "sky would fall" in their revenue stream. I would like nothing more than for them to buy the product off of me or agree to a revenue-sharing setup. I'm not out to screw MCN out of revenue nor for that matter MCReports.com which makes it's money doing reprints. I also need to know that if MCN would give me license and they want a cut, how much I can expect to make, and how much they can expect to make. But MCN in particular needs a major kick in the hindquarters to get them to pay the 'net and the digital age some attention. Just because they didn't grow up on Pc's doesn't mean none of their readership couldn't spend $300 for a scanner, CD writers and some labels and do what I'm doing. For crying out loud they should have had a product like this YEARS ago. Now, can i have some answers to original question please? Thank you again. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 09:20:52 2002 From: "ROBERSON, Brian" To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" Subject: RE: Help me, please... Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 09:20:46 -0500 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1AB2B.A3DAE660 Insurance going up? What insurance do you have? You know, they only find out about your tickets if they by chance do a checkup on your DMV records. When I worked for State Farm, there were random spot checks on policy holders, but they were FEW and far between. Sometimes a policy holder would get busted when they went to add/subtract a car from their policy and SF did a check on their record. Otherwise, I know quite a few people that got tickets, rode out the 3 year time period and never received a surcharge from their insurance. I AM SURE that some insurance companies do this differently.. Perhaps they check every year? AFAIK, State Farm does NOT do this. I wouldn't put it past geico or progressive to do this though... Others on the list may know. Brian 99 VFR, 81 CB750F, clean record, no points (yikes im screwed now) -----Original Message----- From: Howard J. Koontz [mailto:HOFOJOKO@XXXXXX] Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2002 10:28 PM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Help me, please... Hello - Well, it happened to me. For the first time in my storied driving career, I got stopped by John Law for speeding. Damn, he ruined my perfect streak. Well, anyway, I'm a newbie at this court trial thing, and need (a lot) some help. Can anyone recommend a person (preferably a lawyer, but not necessarily) who can answer some questions for me? BTW, it was in Howard County, MD. I was clocked (by a patrol car coming at me, how the hell can he tell how fast I was going? He was moving too! I digress...) by a county patrolman doing 62 in a 45. I'm so clueless I don't even know what more details to give or what questions to ask, but $70 seems like a lot to me, especially when it's going to result in my insurance rates going up this coming April!! Anyway, I'll be heading out of town (going to Cleveland to the IX Center to catch the C/W Int'l M/C Show with some friends) beginning Friday morning and will return late Sunday evening. Feel free to reply to me off-list. TIA. Howard J. Koontz hofojoko@XXXXXX 2001 Harley Davidson FLHT Electra Glide Standard 1972 Honda Z50AK3 Mini Trail Resto Project ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1AB2B.A3DAE660 RE: Help me, please...

Insurance going up?  What insurance do you = have?  You know, they only find out about your tickets if they by = chance do a checkup on your DMV records.  When I worked for State = Farm, there were random spot checks on policy holders, but they were = FEW and far between.  Sometimes a policy holder would get busted = when they went to add/subtract a car from their policy and SF did a = check on their record.  Otherwise, I know quite a few people that = got tickets, rode out the 3 year time period and never received a = surcharge from their insurance.  I AM SURE that some insurance = companies do this differently.. Perhaps they check every year?  = AFAIK, State Farm does NOT do this.  I wouldn't put it past geico = or progressive to do this though... Others on the list may = know.

Brian
99 VFR, 81 CB750F, clean record, no points (yikes im = screwed now)

-----Original Message-----
From: Howard J. Koontz [mailto:HOFOJOKO@XXXXXX]
Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2002 10:28 PM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX
Subject: Help me, please...


Hello - Well, it happened to me. For the first time = in my storied driving career, I got stopped by John Law for speeding. = Damn, he ruined my perfect streak. Well, anyway, I'm a newbie at this = court trial thing, and need (a

lot) some help. Can anyone recommend a person = (preferably a lawyer, but not
necessarily) who can answer some questions for me? = BTW, it was in Howard County,  MD. I was clocked (by a patrol car = coming at me, how the hell can he tell how fast I was going? He was = moving too! I digress...) by a county patrolman doing 62 in a = 45.

I'm so clueless I don't even know what more details = to give or what questions to ask, but $70 seems like a lot to me, = especially when it's going to result in my insurance rates going up = this coming April!!

Anyway, I'll be heading out of town (going to = Cleveland to the IX Center to catch the C/W Int'l M/C Show with some = friends) beginning Friday morning and will return late Sunday evening. = Feel free to reply to me off-list. TIA.


Howard J. Koontz
hofojoko@XXXXXX
2001 Harley Davidson FLHT Electra Glide = Standard
1972 Honda Z50AK3 Mini Trail Resto Project

------_=_NextPart_001_01C1AB2B.A3DAE660-- From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 09:22:00 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 09:21:53 -0500 From: To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Cc: Subject: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! I found this on Fox news - VA is going to use road side pipe sniffers with cameras to nab polluters. NOT to start a 'loud pipes' thread, but I wonder if an open pipe HD or piped & jetted sport bike would 'fail' ??? Dave
Supporters of the sensor call it a revolution in environmental safeguards, but opponents fear the radar equipment is reducing personal freedom from government surveillance. The laser sensor, which clocks cars' emissions to determine if they are in compliance with state standards, takes a photo image of violators' license plates, similar to the controversial cameras already used in some areas to bust speeders and traffic light violators. The state of Virginia is planning a pilot program at two remote stations along the roadways in the Washington area to test the technology and how it would be used. If the test, planned for 2003, is successful, a full program may be implemented in which the drivers of noxious cars would be notified by mail that their automobiles need to be fixed. "The least obtrusive way to maintain air quality, that's our focus," said Bill Hayden, a spokesperson for the Virginia Department of Environmental Quality. But opponents of the remote emissions tests say they are just another way for the government to spy on its citizens, this time using the environment to garner support for more cameras on the nation's roadways. "They're just expanding the same photo enforcement technology and they're going to keep expanding into more and more intrusive places," said Richard Diamond, a spokesman for House Majority Leader Dick Armey, who has been a vocal opponent of the red light cameras used in the D.C. suburbs of Virginia. True, the technology is not new. Developed by Donald Stedman and Gary Bishop of the University of Denver in the early 1990's, remote sensing has been tested and utilized in cities throughout North America, including California, which battles one of the worst air pollution problems in the U.S. Still the use of detection technology, including red light and speed cameras, is a source of apoplexy for civil libertarians, who are winning lawsuits against the cameras. At least three courts have ruled against the use of such cameras by municipalities in recent months. This week, a judge in Colorado shut down the use of photo radar cameras in Denver, saying the program violated both state and local laws. The judge dismissed the tickets of four defendants challenging the system and the city was forced to turn off the cameras. "The government should not be in the business of tracking its citizens unless they are committing a crime," Diamond said in support of the ruling. However, proponents of the cameras say traffic violators are committing crimes. "If you are doing something that is hurtful to others, then the government is supposed to track you and it's legitimate," said Arthur Green, chief scientist for the free-market Reason Public Policy Institute. "If you are driving a polluting vehicle than you are doing something wrong." Green said the remote sensor will only track cars that are not in compliance with the law, creating the possibility that laborious and expensive state inspections required of every driver could come to an end. That could be wishful thinking, however. Jim Harper, a privacy attorney and editor of Privacilla.org, said that adding the new sensors probably would not reduce government enforcement by other means. "One side of this may be that they will use this to replace the inspections M-^V you might reduce the burden for citizens. However, the chance that government would actually give up their inspections is slight and this could just be adding another layer of government." But Harper says if the government has probable cause M-^W like emissions violations M-^W to take a photo of one's license plate it is not a violation of privacy rights, as long as there is "a statutory and constitutional guarantee" that citizens' information would be used for nothing other keeping a statistical record of pollution in the area and to notify the driver of their car's violations. Diamond disagrees, and as a Virginia resident has had the personal experience to make his case. "I got a survey from the city of Alexandria, who said 'we know that you were traveling at this time of the day and we wanted to ask you some questions,' about an area construction project," he said. Diamond said the information was taken from a traffic photo camera, proving his point that the problem with the cameras is that they allow the government to track citizens' movements. The Texas American Civil Liberties Union concurs. That group called attention to a survey issued by the Texas Transportation Institute last summer based on the information gleaned by videotaped license plates at five spots along the Texas borders. ACLU activists say Americans should be protected from such intrusions. "One thing we have in this country is freedom of movement without being filmed and processed the entire time," Joann Bell, director of ACLU Oklahoma Foundation, said after the survey's release. -- Pop3Now Personal, Get quick remote access to your email accounts! Sign Up Now! Visit http://www.pop3now.com/personal From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 09:25:24 2002 From: RichH@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Help me, please... Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 09:24:47 -0500 Go to court. Don't pay for a lawyer. Ask for traffic school. It might land on a perfectly beautiful Saturday in April like mine did last year, but at least that offense never showed up on my record. "A Speeders Guide to Avoiding Tickets" is an easy read and talks a lot about what to do and say in court. I highly recommend the $6 for that over a lawyer fee. My parents made my spend $400 on one when I was 16, it was the only time I've been to traffic court and the offense wasn't at least lessened, yes I am still bitter. -----Original Message----- From: Howard J. Koontz [mailto:HOFOJOKO@XXXXXX] Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2002 10:28 PM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Help me, please... Hello - Well, it happened to me. For the first time in my storied driving career, I got stopped by John Law for speeding. Damn, he ruined my perfect streak. Well, anyway, I'm a newbie at this court trial thing, and need (a lot) some help. Can anyone recommend a person (preferably a lawyer, but not necessarily) who can answer some questions for me? BTW, it was in Howard County, MD. I was clocked (by a patrol car coming at me, how the hell can he tell how fast I was going? He was moving too! I digress...) by a county patrolman doing 62 in a 45. I'm so clueless I don't even know what more details to give or what questions to ask, but $70 seems like a lot to me, especially when it's going to result in my insurance rates going up this coming April!! Anyway, I'll be heading out of town (going to Cleveland to the IX Center to catch the C/W Int'l M/C Show with some friends) beginning Friday morning and will return late Sunday evening. Feel free to reply to me off-list. TIA. From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 09:30:11 2002 From: "LindaT." To: "DC-CYCLES" Subject: RE: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 09:28:10 -0500 Well, unless they're checking for Db, there's no problem as bikes don't have to pass an emissions test. Hallelujah, check some of those rolling smoke factories out there. I suppose they can ticket out of state vehicles, too. LindaT. Custom TankBags Springfield, VA (suburb of our nation's capital) AMA IBA HSTA BMWBMW 99 R1100RT Mr. Buzzy 95 F3 Purple Haze (69K miles and counting...) 00 KLR250 Super Sherpa Tenzing http://www.geocities.com/ljtanner sdave@XXXXXX [said: I found this on Fox news - VA is going to use road side pipe sniffers with cameras to nab polluters. NOT to start a 'loud pipes' thread, but I wonder if an open pipe HD or piped & jetted sport bike would 'fail' ??? Dave **snippage** _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 09:30:20 2002 From: RichH@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 09:29:55 -0500 With VA emissions testing wouldn't this affect mostly out of state drivers that don't have to do emissions testing? -----Original Message----- From: sdave@XXXXXX [mailto:sdave@XXXXXX] Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 9:22 AM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! I found this on Fox news - VA is going to use road side pipe sniffers with cameras to nab polluters. NOT to start a 'loud pipes' thread, but I wonder if an open pipe HD or piped & jetted sport bike would 'fail' ??? Dave
Supporters of the sensor call it a revolution in environmental safeguards, but opponents fear the radar equipment is reducing personal freedom from government surveillance. The laser sensor, which clocks cars' emissions to determine if they are in compliance with state standards, takes a photo image of violators' license plates, similar to the controversial cameras already used in some areas to bust speeders and traffic light violators. The state of Virginia is planning a pilot program at two remote stations along the roadways in the Washington area to test the technology and how it would be used. If the test, planned for 2003, is successful, a full program may be implemented in which the drivers of noxious cars would be notified by mail that their automobiles need to be fixed. "The least obtrusive way to maintain air quality, that's our focus," said Bill Hayden, a spokesperson for the Virginia Department of Environmental Quality. But opponents of the remote emissions tests say they are just another way for the government to spy on its citizens, this time using the environment to garner support for more cameras on the nation's roadways. "They're just expanding the same photo enforcement technology and they're going to keep expanding into more and more intrusive places," said Richard Diamond, a spokesman for House Majority Leader Dick Armey, who has been a vocal opponent of the red light cameras used in the D.C. suburbs of Virginia. True, the technology is not new. Developed by Donald Stedman and Gary Bishop of the University of Denver in the early 1990's, remote sensing has been tested and utilized in cities throughout North America, including California, which battles one of the worst air pollution problems in the U.S. Still the use of detection technology, including red light and speed cameras, is a source of apoplexy for civil libertarians, who are winning lawsuits against the cameras. At least three courts have ruled against the use of such cameras by municipalities in recent months. This week, a judge in Colorado shut down the use of photo radar cameras in Denver, saying the program violated both state and local laws. The judge dismissed the tickets of four defendants challenging the system and the city was forced to turn off the cameras. "The government should not be in the business of tracking its citizens unless they are committing a crime," Diamond said in support of the ruling. However, proponents of the cameras say traffic violators are committing crimes. "If you are doing something that is hurtful to others, then the government is supposed to track you and it's legitimate," said Arthur Green, chief scientist for the free-market Reason Public Policy Institute. "If you are driving a polluting vehicle than you are doing something wrong." Green said the remote sensor will only track cars that are not in compliance with the law, creating the possibility that laborious and expensive state inspections required of every driver could come to an end. That could be wishful thinking, however. Jim Harper, a privacy attorney and editor of Privacilla.org, said that adding the new sensors probably would not reduce government enforcement by other means. "One side of this may be that they will use this to replace the inspections - you might reduce the burden for citizens. However, the chance that government would actually give up their inspections is slight and this could just be adding another layer of government." But Harper says if the government has probable cause - like emissions violations - to take a photo of one's license plate it is not a violation of privacy rights, as long as there is "a statutory and constitutional guarantee" that citizens' information would be used for nothing other keeping a statistical record of pollution in the area and to notify the driver of their car's violations. Diamond disagrees, and as a Virginia resident has had the personal experience to make his case. "I got a survey from the city of Alexandria, who said 'we know that you were traveling at this time of the day and we wanted to ask you some questions,' about an area construction project," he said. Diamond said the information was taken from a traffic photo camera, proving his point that the problem with the cameras is that they allow the government to track citizens' movements. The Texas American Civil Liberties Union concurs. That group called attention to a survey issued by the Texas Transportation Institute last summer based on the information gleaned by videotaped license plates at five spots along the Texas borders. ACLU activists say Americans should be protected from such intrusions. "One thing we have in this country is freedom of movement without being filmed and processed the entire time," Joann Bell, director of ACLU Oklahoma Foundation, said after the survey's release. -- Pop3Now Personal, Get quick remote access to your email accounts! Sign Up Now! Visit http://www.pop3now.com/personal From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 09:52:05 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 09:52:04 -0500 From: "Chris Norloff" To: "'Dc-Cycles (E-mail)" Subject: RE: Road rage incident ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: "Lantech (DCOP)" >But I'd rather be a little slow and paranoid than a little flat >and broken. I agree with the sentiment, but not always with the actions. I was deliberately run off the road last night while trying to enter I-270 in Rockville, and I should have accelerated out of harm's way. I was in the merge lane, accelerating, with my turn signal on. A lady pulled up next to me on the left, rear bumper about even with my leg, and moved over into the merge/exit lane pushing me out. She was also apparently deaf to the twin 110 decibel Fiamms. With big rear lights, a flashing turn signal, and wearing a new red Aerostich it's clear she saw me, and her choice was to run me off the road. So there are times when I think it pays to move fast. I should have gauged the approach speed of the car and moved out quicker than she could get at me. Sort of like that time-honored way of survival for mammals - be small, fast, and stay the hell out of the way. Chris Norloff From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 09:55:05 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 09:54:44 -0500 (EST) From: hcaldwell To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consumer News? It sounds like a good idea but I doubt MCN will let you get away with reprinting their magazine for profit. Hugh From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 09:57:48 2002 From: "Rob Keiser" To: broberso@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Coolant Flush Procedure for VFR800 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 09:46:30 -0500 Hey Brian. I'm not sure on the procedure, since I had the shop do it with the valve check, but I can bring my manual over for you if you like. Let me know. Rob '98 VFR800 From: "ROBERSON, Brian" To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" Subject: Coolant Flush Procedure for VFR800 Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 16:15:57 -0500 I know, I know.. I should have the manual for this!! I have flushed radiators with cars so I know the gist of the procedure. I was not sure if the dual radiators called for some special procedures. Anyone having any input/advice, please let me know... Thanks! Brian _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:00:03 2002 From: "Paul Wilson" To: , Subject: Re: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 10:04:18 -0500 This was in the Washington Post a couple of weeks ago. It seems they want to go after the cars that actually contribute the most to the region's poor air quality instead of making everyone submit to bi-annual emissions testing, especially in cleaner late model vehicles. I think the argument could be made that nabbing the actual polluters rather than having everyone submit to testing is actually less intrusive to the average citizen. Bikes are not tested in DC, cars get it every two years. FWIW, when in lived in Chicago, they had a random emissions testing program. You got a notice from the DMV and you had to show up within 60 days. I suspect owners with older vehicles got pulled in more often. We don't have to ditch the aftermarket exhausts, the jet kits and the Power Commanders just yet, but it may only be a matter of time until bikes get snared by the emissions dragnet too. Paul in DC ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 9:21 AM Subject: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! > I found this on Fox news - > VA is going to use road side pipe sniffers with cameras to nab > polluters. NOT to start a 'loud pipes' thread, but I wonder if an > open pipe HD or piped & jetted sport bike would 'fail' ??? > > Dave > >
> Supporters of the sensor call it a revolution in environmental > safeguards, but opponents fear the radar equipment is reducing > personal freedom from government surveillance. > > The laser sensor, which clocks cars' emissions to determine if they > are in compliance with state standards, takes a photo image of > violators' license plates, similar to the controversial cameras > already used in some areas to bust speeders and traffic light > violators. > From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:05:20 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 10:05:19 -0500 From: "Chris Norloff" To: "List-dc cycles" Subject: Road Rage Documentation I carry disposable cameras in all my vehicles in case I need to document something, like a wreck. I figure the more evidence I have the better off I am. I wonder if this would help document a Road Rage incident for prosecution? It could show the other vehicle (and tag) and the driver - assuming you can get close enough afterwards to get a picture. In Garcia's case it might not be wise to get close to the assailant! While helmet video cams are intriguing, a cheap disposable camera would be more practical for most of us. Thoughts? Chris Norloff From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:11:29 2002 From: "C C" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: VFR in DC WANTED Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 15:11:22 +0000 hello, please email me at pierfconsa to let me know if you have a HONDA VFR for sale available in DC. I am really looking at the 98 model, but please let me know. I also like triumph bikes, especially the ST and the tiger. Pierfrancesco _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:15:40 2002 From: "Jon Strang" To: Subject: RE: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 10:14:28 -0500 > Paul wrote: > It seems they want > to go after the cars that actually contribute the most to the > region's poor air quality instead of making everyone submit to bi-annual emissions > testing, especially in cleaner late model vehicles. I think the argument > could be made that nabbing the actual polluters rather than > having everyone submit to testing is actually less intrusive to the average citizen. Or is it: (a) a pretty nifty excuse to get more cameras up so The Government (aka Big Bro) can monitor your comings and goings (b) the announcement of a new government revenue stream disguised as "good for the environment" (c) a misdirection to conceal the true goal: contain poor people to their own neighborhoods (no $500 chevy is gonna be on the roads after this) (d) a brilliant Libertarian multimedia troll to show the true motives of Dems (and many Repubs) (e) another source of wealth for the environmental-government complex (the bastard child of the military-industrial complex that lived in many 70s and 80s movies) Any other ideas? I can't wait for the laser-sniffers that check my BAC whilst I drive down the road. That would be less intrusive than actually pulling me over and asking me to submit to a breathlyzer. And Think Of The Children it would save! --jon 01B12 From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:16:34 2002 From: "Jon Strang" To: "List-dc cycles" Subject: RE: Road Rage Documentation Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 10:15:22 -0500 This would only work if the camaras are made by Lockheed Martin and they get a kickback on every arrest made. > -----Original Message----- > From: Chris Norloff [mailto:cnorloff@XXXXXX] > Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 10:05 AM > To: List-dc cycles > Subject: Road Rage Documentation > > > I carry disposable cameras in all my vehicles in case I need to > document something, like a wreck. I figure the more evidence I > have the better off I am. > > I wonder if this would help document a Road Rage incident for > prosecution? It could show the other vehicle (and tag) and the > driver - assuming you can get close enough afterwards to get a > picture. In Garcia's case it might not be wise to get close to > the assailant! > > While helmet video cams are intriguing, a cheap disposable camera > would be more practical for most of us. > > Thoughts? > > Chris Norloff > > > From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:17:44 2002 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 10:18:33 -0500 To: matthew patton , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Larry Larson Subject: Re: MCN copyright RE: [VRTP-Test] survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consum er News? At 08:38 AM 2/1/2002, matthew patton wrote: >Yes, I am QUITE familiar with the copy-right issues and will take them >up *AGAIN* with MCN. I tried almost a year ago and they weren't the >least bit interested in even talking to me about it. But Matthew, it doesn't sound like you are "familiar with the issues." You are announcing plans to break the law. >With some example >CD's in hand I can hopefully get their blasted attention. If nothing >else my cross reference is all mine and I can do with it what I wish. That is incorrect. So long as your CD contains their registered copyright information, it is illegal. You have no right to create the usual software "single backup copy for personal purposes" of a print publication; you may make a facsimile copy of a particular article for *fair use*, but that's about it. A court can (and will, if MCN asks it to) take *all* copies of your CD from you. >I would like nothing more than for them to buy the >product off of me or agree to a revenue-sharing setup. There is nothing for them to buy off you. There is nothing new or nonobvious here -- many magazines, including Sys Admin and others, do this already. If they like it, they can simply take the idea and do with it what they wish. I'd recommend you talk to an intellectual property lawyer before proceeding. And to answer your most important question, I, for one, wouldn't pay anything for such a product. Regards, Larry From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:21:55 2002 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 10:20:11 -0500 From: "William J. Huson" To: sdave@XXXXXX CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! sdave@XXXXXX wrote: > I found this on Fox news - > VA is going to use road side pipe sniffers with cameras to nab > polluters. NOT to start a 'loud pipes' thread, but I wonder if an > open pipe HD or piped & jetted sport bike would 'fail' ??? YES! Air cooled engines are exempt fom emmisions testing because they don't stand good chance of passing the routine car oriented test. The old air cooled VWs also slide by. California requires catylitic converters on M/C but very few out of CA bikes have them. Manufacturors have to jet and tune to meet a minimum EPA/DOT standard but the moment a wrench turns to chnage those factory settings the bike is done RE emmisions. Bill From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:23:12 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 10:23:09 -0500 From: "Chris Norloff" To: "List-dc cycles" Subject: Road Rage Documentation I carry disposable cameras in all my vehicles in case I need to document something, like a wreck. I figure the more evidence I have the better off I am. I wonder if this would help document a Road Rage incident for prosecution? It could show the other vehicle (and tag) and the driver - assuming you can get close enough afterwards to get a picture. In Garcia's case it might not be wise to get close to the assailant! While helmet video cams are intriguing, a cheap disposable camera would be more practical for most of us. Thoughts? Chris Norloff From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:28:35 2002 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 10:26:51 -0500 From: "William J. Huson" To: RichH@XXXXXX CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! RichH@XXXXXX wrote: > With VA emissions testing wouldn't this affect mostly out of state drivers > that don't have to do emissions testing? > Nope. We have a right to travel without hinderance so I believe that negates all *local* laws which aren't related to safety = speed, headlights on, etc etc... VAs notorious anti-jackemup high law can't be enforced on out-of-state hi-riders. If we wanted to clean the air BUST THE TRUCKS! Diesals do NOT burn clean. Tons of soot are left behind every day, not to mention the nasty nitrogen oxides. The NO prob also comes from jet airplanes. The engineers are busting hump to clean turbines up. Bill From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:43:41 2002 From: "Paul Wilson" To: , "dc-cycles list" Subject: Re: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 10:48:28 -0500 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jon Strang" > > > Paul wrote: I think the argument > > could be made that nabbing the actual polluters rather than > > having everyone submit to testing is actually less intrusive to the > average citizen. > > Or is it: > (a) a pretty nifty excuse to get more cameras up so The Government (aka Big > Bro) can monitor your comings and goings > (b) the announcement of a new government revenue stream disguised as "good > for the environment" > (c) a misdirection to conceal the true goal: contain poor people to their > own neighborhoods (no $500 chevy is gonna be on the roads after this) > (d) a brilliant Libertarian multimedia troll to show the true motives of > Dems (and many Repubs) > (e) another source of wealth for the environmental-government complex (the > bastard child of the military-industrial complex that lived in many 70s and > 80s movies) > > > Any other ideas? > ! Or (f) the real issue here is that the region is habitually out of compliance with the Clean Air Act and if it can't comply or get the law changed, the hammer will come down on federal road funding. The jurisdictions are out of options since vehicle miles keep rising and they're getting a little desperate, hence the sniffers. So even as the vehicle fleet as an aggregate gets cleaner, the region's air quality isn't really improving. One might say the announcement of draconian measures is to stimulate a huge outcry in order to get the law changed. If your beef is with the Clean Air Act and its mandates--a perfectly legitimate viewpoint--then why not come out and say it? > > --jon > 01B12 From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:43:47 2002 From: bernescut@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Help me, please... Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 10:43:41 -0500 My .02 worth: My wife and I have used Geico for years and accidentally forgot to tell them about her speeding ticket on I-95 (yes, it does happen occasionally) and they never noticed, so they must use random checks only. One nice thing I found out last night is that if you ride year round like I do and label your car as a pleasure vehicle (my wife gasped at this one, but this is a family list so I can't go into any details) the rates drop dramatically. Also, Geico has sponsorship agreements with many organizations that drop rates as well, including my employer. They did drop our rates dramatically after we got married, so much so that I feel that a polygamist might actually earn money, but my wife was not enthusiastic about that approach. Alas, I am one zip code too close to DC to get comprehensive coverage for my CBR under Geico's motorcycle division of Cycle Guard and they are unable to offer multiple vehicle discounts between Cycle Guard and Geico, so my bike is covered by State Farm which treated me quite well when the F3 was stolen, especially after the legal suppository I received from Progressive (yech!) Cedric I AM SURE that some insurance companies do this differently.. Perhaps they check every year? AFAIK, State Farm does NOT do this. I wouldn't put it past Geico or progressive to do this though... Others on the list may know. Brian 99 VFR, 81 CB750F, clean record, no points (yikes I'm screwed now) From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 10:53:10 2002 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 09:48:50 -0600 From: "George Cole" To: , Subject: Re: Coolant Flush Procedure for VFR800 Brian, I did this twice on my VFR last year once to try Evans coolant (don't bother). In the end I used EngineIce and that worked better than std coolant mix. In addition to the coolant drain plug, there is a another drain type screw that need to be opened and drained on the right front cylinder (not sure why) The key thing for me at least was burping the new coolant to get all the bubbles out of the system. The manual states to snap the throttle a few times with the cap off to burp it. I found that tapping on the radiators and hoses was also necessary to get all the air out. Take your time. Regards, George 01 FZ1 >>> "ROBERSON, Brian" 01/31/02 04:15PM >>> I know, I know.. I should have the manual for this!! I have flushed radiators with cars so I know the gist of the procedure. I was not sure if the dual radiators called for some special procedures. Anyone having any input/advice, please let me know... Thanks! Brian From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 11:01:18 2002 From: "Jon Strang" To: "dc-cycles list" Subject: RE: Stinky cage sniffers coming ! Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 11:00:06 -0500 Paul wrote: > Or (f) the real issue here is that the region is habitually out of > compliance with the Clean Air Act and if it can't comply or get the law > changed, the hammer will come down on federal road funding. The > jurisdictions are out of options since vehicle miles keep rising > and they're > getting a little desperate, hence the sniffers. So even as the vehicle > fleet as an aggregate gets cleaner, the region's air quality isn't really > improving. One might say the announcement of draconian measures is to > stimulate a huge outcry in order to get the law changed. > > If your beef is with the Clean Air Act and its mandates--a perfectly > legitimate viewpoint--then why not come out and say it? Nah, I was looking at my front fender vice up the trail or road. My beef was with the means, not the end. But now that you mention it.... --jon From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 11:04:25 2002 From: "Paul Wilson" To: "dc-cycles list" Subject: Re: Road Rage Documentation Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 10:56:01 -0500 There's a piece in the latest Motorcycle Consumer News on a related topic. It was written by a crash reconstruction expert. The author recommends carrying chalk (to mark the tire position) and a camera at all times to document thoroughly the crash scene. A little extreme in my opinion but something to think about. Paul in DC ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Norloff" > I carry disposable cameras in all my vehicles in case I need to document something, like a wreck. I figure the more evidence I have the better off I am. > > I wonder if this would help document a Road Rage incident for prosecution? It could show the other vehicle (and tag) and the driver - assuming you can get close enough afterwards to get a picture. In Garcia's case it might not be wise to get close to the assailant! > > While helmet video cams are intriguing, a cheap disposable camera would be more practical for most of us. > > Thoughts? > > Chris Norloff From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 11:10:25 2002 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 11:08:39 -0500 From: Dale Horstman Subject: Re: AMI vs. MMI To: Thomas Jordan Cc: DC Cycles Thomas Jordan wrote: > > I'm considering attending AMI or possibly MMI. Does anyone here have > any experiences with either of these schools? > -- Bob Higdon wrote up in sometimes painful detail his experiences at AMI (I think) down in Daytona. It used to be linked on the Ironbutt website....hang on... Scroll down to the bottom of the page linked here: http://www.ironbutt.com/higdon/higindx.html I think it would be a worthwhile (if long) read if you are interested in attending one of these schools. Horkster -- MSL! SMG! (Chatty Moron TM's) Dale Horstman - the.horkster@XXXXXX Dale City, Virginia, USA, Earth AWSHIDT #322 - Completed. 99 Highway Signs! '98 Kawasaki Concours - BugSlayer '99 Kawasaki Concours - Grape Nehi '82 Suzuki GS850G - work in progress From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 11:52:12 2002 From: "ROBERSON, Brian" To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" Subject: RE: Coolant Flush Procedure for VFR800 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 11:52:03 -0500 This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand this format, some or all of this message may not be legible. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1AB40.C5F68A50 Thanks guys, I figured while I had the plastics off doing the oil change I might as well do a coolant flush. Rob, I may take you up on that offer! Brian -----Original Message----- From: George Cole [mailto:George.Cole@XXXXXX] Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 10:49 AM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX; broberso@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Coolant Flush Procedure for VFR800 Brian, I did this twice on my VFR last year once to try Evans coolant (don't bother). In the end I used EngineIce and that worked better than std coolant mix. In addition to the coolant drain plug, there is a another drain type screw that need to be opened and drained on the right front cylinder (not sure why) The key thing for me at least was burping the new coolant to get all the bubbles out of the system. The manual states to snap the throttle a few times with the cap off to burp it. I found that tapping on the radiators and hoses was also necessary to get all the air out. Take your time. Regards, George 01 FZ1 >>> "ROBERSON, Brian" 01/31/02 04:15PM >>> I know, I know.. I should have the manual for this!! I have flushed radiators with cars so I know the gist of the procedure. I was not sure if the dual radiators called for some special procedures. Anyone having any input/advice, please let me know... Thanks! Brian ------_=_NextPart_001_01C1AB40.C5F68A50 RE: Coolant Flush Procedure for VFR800

Thanks guys, I figured while I had the plastics off = doing the oil change I might as well do a coolant flush.  Rob, I = may take you up on that offer!

Brian

-----Original Message-----
From: George Cole [mailto:George.Cole@XXXXXX= om]
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2002 10:49 AM
To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX; broberso@XXXXXX
Subject: Re: Coolant Flush Procedure for = VFR800


Brian,

I did this twice on my VFR last year once to try = Evans coolant (don't bother). In the end I used EngineIce and that = worked better than std coolant mix.

In addition to the coolant drain plug, there is a = another drain type screw that need to be opened and drained on the = right front cylinder (not sure why)

The key thing for me at least was burping the new = coolant to get all the bubbles out of the system. The manual states to = snap the throttle a few times with the cap off to burp it. I found that = tapping on the radiators and hoses was also necessary to get all the = air out. Take your time.

Regards,

George
01 FZ1


>>> "ROBERSON, Brian" = <broberso@XXXXXX> 01/31/02 04:15PM >>>
I know, I know.. I should have the manual for this!! = I have flushed radiators with cars so I know the gist  of the = procedure.  I was not sure if the dual radiators called for some = special procedures.  Anyone having any input/advice, please let me = know... Thanks!

 
Brian
 

------_=_NextPart_001_01C1AB40.C5F68A50-- From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 12:56:51 2002 From: "Doug Allis" To: t_gimer@XXXXXX, garicao@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Road rage incident Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 17:56:36 It was actually fun. I wasted only about 3 hours on the whole incident. The look on her face when she was told she had to pay $50 in court costs in addition to the fine was priceless. Revenge is sweet. The fine was more like $100. >From: Tom Gimer >To: Doug Allis , garicao@XXXXXX, >dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Re: Road rage incident >Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2002 15:11:38 -0800 (PST) > >improper driving??? if i remember correctly, that's a ~$70 >fine and it carries ~3 points on a va. license. that ranks >right up there with a 1-9 mph-over speeding ticket!! > >i remember the heated discussion on this list when the >incident first occurred. how much time did you invest, in >total? was it worth all of your trouble? more to the >point, do you believe it will it affect the driving habits >of the woman who was convicted? > > > > >--- Doug Allis wrote: > > I took a similar nut to Fairfax County traffic court. I > > was without a > > witness but the got driver convicted of improper driving > > and fined. I'd say > > you got a pretty good chance of exacting legal revenge, > > especially with a > > witness willing to testify in your favor. I'd say your > > first move is to > > insist that the Park Police file a charge against the > > owner. Tell the Park > > Police that you have a witness, give the person's name > > and phone number and > > insist that the police do their job, or insist that they > > tell you exactly > > how to formally file the complaint yourself (A.K.A. > > making a "citizen's > > arrest in some states). Be prepared to ID the driver in a > > line up. If you > > can't ID the driver and neither can your witness, then > > drop the matter now. > > In my case I was fairly sure that I could ID the driver. > > I picked her out > > the moment she walked into the courtroom (late). It was > > easy and she was > > stupid. > > > > Standard Disclamer: your results may not be the same. I > > have no idea how DC > > courts would handle this. > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! >http://auctions.yahoo.com _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 13:52:32 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 10:52:29 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: Re: MCN copyright RE: [VRTP-Test] survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consum er News? To: matthew patton , dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- matthew patton wrote: > The reason I"m asking about possible pricing is simple. I > need to know > the marketability of and demand for the product and have > some data > points to argue with MCN if they decry the "sky would > fall" in their > revenue stream. I would like nothing more than for them > to buy the > product off of me or agree to a revenue-sharing setup. > I'm not out to > screw MCN out of revenue nor for that matter > MCReports.com which makes > it's money doing reprints. I also need to know that if > MCN would give > me license and they want a cut, how much I can expect to > make, and how > much they can expect to make. > > But MCN in particular needs a major kick in the > hindquarters to get > them to pay the 'net and the digital age some attention. > Just because > they didn't grow up on Pc's doesn't mean none of their > readership > couldn't spend $300 for a scanner, CD writers and some > labels and do > what I'm doing. For crying out loud they should have had > a product like > this YEARS ago. > > Now, can i have some answers to original question please? if i weren't violating the law, i'd pay $10-20 for something like you're talking about. mcn does provide an end-of-year article index, so i would basically be paying for (i) portability, (ii) the issues that i lost along the way, and (iii) the ability to link to another article within the file. while you may think otherwise, i'd be very surprised if mcn isn't in the process of dealing with the technology component. that will obviously only become apparent when it updates its presence on the net. good luck! (you'll definitely need it to succeed with this project) -- tg __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 13:55:26 2002 From: "Kevin Bechtel" To: Subject: New U.S. Motorcycle manufacturer Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 13:58:06 -0500 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C1AB28.793F07E0 At a press conference late Monday, the CEO of Johnson Marine, makers > of Johnson outboard marine engines and other recreational equipment,=20 > unveiled a > new line of heavyweight cruiser style motorcycles designed to compete > head to head with industry leader Harley-Davidson. Peter Long, Johnson > brands marketing manager said, "We have studied the market and > determined that Harley, while highly successful, has narrowly missed=20 > the mark when targeting > motorcycle buyers". Long added, "We, at Johnson, are convinced our > product hits the target dead center and promises to draw sales away=20 > from Harley-Davidson in a way no other motorcycle has been able to=20 > accomplish". > > The new line of bikes, marketed under the name 'Big Johnson > Motorcycles', will, according to Long, deliver what Harley has only=20 > promised. "Our research show that this, a Big Johnson, is what Harley=20 > buyers are really after". > > At the unveiling of the new line Monday, several current Harley owners > agreed. "When I bought my Harley, what I really needed was a Big > Johnson", said one Harley owner." But I see now that riding a Harley=20 > is no replacement > for having a Big Johnson." > > Manager Long also said that his company would follow the lead of > Harley-Davidson and cash in on a huge market for non-motorcycle=20 > related products. "We realize that not every guy can have a Big=20 > Johnson", said Long, > "But image is very important to people. If they don't have a Big > Johnson, they at least want to project the image of having one." > > Asked if he anticipated Big Johnsons showing up in the hands of Harley > owners, Long said it was unlikely. "I just don't see the need to have > a Harley if you have a Big Johnson", he said. "And I can't imagine=20 > someone who > spends all their resources to acquire a Harley having a Big Johnson. I think > it boils down to this - You either have a Harley, or you have a Big Johnson, > but you are not likely to have both. "Given the choice", said Long. " > I think most guys will opt for the Big Johnson". > > Another force driving sales for the company will come from women. A > survey of the wives and girlfriends of nearly 1,000 potential=20 > motorcycle buyers indicates less than 5% would approve of their=20 > partner spending $15,000 on a > Harley Davidson. But, when asked if they would be willing to pay the > same amount of money to get their partner a Big Johnson, nearly 4 out=20 > 5 thought that would be money well spent. > > One female present at the product unveiling was quoted as saying, > "There is > no way I will let Lonnie drop 15 grand on another one of those > Harleys, but > 15 grand to get him a Big Johnson? Well, that something we could both enjoy > and it's something he really needs." > > Carla Roundheel, manager of the dealership network now being > established, said her motto is simple. "I service what we sell." Big=20 > Johnson motorcycles > will be traded on the stock exchange under the abbreviation P-ENVY. > > ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C1AB28.793F07E0
At a press conference late Monday, the CEO of Johnson Marine,=20 makers
> of Johnson outboard marine engines and other recreational = equipment,
> unveiled
a
> new line of heavyweight = cruiser style=20 motorcycles designed to compete
> head to head with industry = leader=20 Harley-Davidson. Peter Long, Johnson

> brands marketing = manager said,=20 "We have studied the market and
> determined that Harley, while = highly=20 successful, has narrowly missed
> the mark = when
targeting
>=20 motorcycle buyers". Long added, "We, at Johnson, are convinced = our
>=20 product hits the target dead center and promises to draw sales away =
>=20 from Harley-Davidson in a way no other motorcycle has been able to =
>=20 accomplish".
>
> The new line of bikes, marketed under the = name 'Big=20 Johnson
> Motorcycles', will, according to Long, deliver what = Harley has=20 only
> promised. "Our research show that this, a Big Johnson, is = what=20 Harley
> buyers are really after".
>
> At the = unveiling of=20 the new line Monday, several current Harley owners

> agreed. = "When I=20 bought my Harley, what I really needed was a Big
> Johnson", said = one=20 Harley owner." But I see now that riding a Harley
> is=20 no
replacement
> for having a Big Johnson."
>
> = Manager=20 Long also said that his company would follow the lead of
> = Harley-Davidson=20 and cash in on a huge market for non-motorcycle
> related = products. "We=20 realize that not every guy can have a Big
> Johnson",=20 said
Long,
> "But image is very important to people. If they = don't have=20 a Big
> Johnson, they at least want to project the image of having = one."
>
> Asked if he anticipated Big Johnsons showing up in = the=20 hands of Harley

> owners, Long said it was unlikely. "I just = don't see=20 the need to have
> a Harley if you have a Big Johnson", he said. = "And I=20 can't imagine
> someone
who
> spends all their resources = to=20 acquire a Harley having a Big Johnson. I
think
> it boils down = to this=20 - You either have a Harley, or you have a Big
Johnson,
> but = you are=20 not likely to have both. "Given the choice", said Long. "
> I = think most=20 guys will opt for the Big Johnson".
>
> Another force = driving sales=20 for the company will come from women. A
> survey of the wives and=20 girlfriends of nearly 1,000 potential
> motorcycle buyers = indicates less=20 than 5% would approve of their
> partner spending $15,000 = on
a
>=20 Harley Davidson. But, when asked if they would be willing to pay = the
>=20 same amount of money to get their partner a Big Johnson, nearly 4 out =
> 5=20 thought that would be money well spent.
>
> One female = present at=20 the product unveiling was quoted as saying,
> "There
is
> = no way=20 I will let Lonnie drop 15 grand on another one of those
>=20 Harleys,
but
> 15 grand to get him a Big Johnson? Well, that = something=20 we could both
enjoy
> and it's something he really=20 needs."
>
> Carla Roundheel, manager of the dealership = network now=20 being
> established, said her motto is simple. "I service what we = sell."=20 Big
> Johnson
motorcycles
> will be traded on the stock = exchange=20 under the abbreviation P-ENVY.
>
>
------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C1AB28.793F07E0-- From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 14:32:51 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 11:32:44 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Gimer Subject: RE: Help me, please... To: RichH@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX my opinion: either your lawyer was a bum, you got a hanging judge, or you came off as a real prick. re: your advice: going without a attorney is a risk, but of course it won't always hurt you. however, you're the first person i've ever heard hint that going WITH an attorney WILL hurt you. --- RichH@XXXXXX wrote: > Go to court. Don't pay for a lawyer. Ask for traffic > school. It might > land on a perfectly beautiful Saturday in April like mine > did last year, but > at least that offense never showed up on my record. > > "A Speeders Guide to Avoiding Tickets" is an easy read > and talks a lot about > what to do and say in court. I highly recommend the $6 > for that over a > lawyer fee. My parents made my spend $400 on one when I > was 16, it was the > only time I've been to traffic court and the offense > wasn't at least > lessened, yes I am still bitter. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 16:02:29 2002 From: "thomas jordan" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2002 05:02:16 +0800 Subject: Re: MCN copyright RE: [VRTP-Test] survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consum er News? If I'm not mistaken, as long as you have hard-copies of the magazines, you can posess the info on the CD. And you'd actually be paying M.Patton for his time taken to compile the information, the CD, etc. So no copyright violations would apply. -- From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 16:28:21 2002 Date: Fri, 01 Feb 2002 16:29:05 -0500 To: "thomas jordan" , dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Larry Larson Subject: Re: MCN copyright RE: [VRTP-Test] survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consum er News? At 04:02 PM 2/1/2002, thomas jordan wrote: >If I'm not mistaken, as long as you have hard-copies of the magazines, you >can posess the info on the CD. And you'd actually be paying M.Patton for >his time taken to compile the information, the CD, etc. So no copyright >violations would apply. Sorry, but you *are* mistaken. You can make copies of your own items for your own use or for "fair use" only. Whether or not a recipient or buyer also owns a copy of any or all the items you reproduce is immaterial. -- Larry From dc-cycles-request Fri Feb 1 19:43:06 2002 From: MikeWHD@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 19:42:43 EST Subject: Re: [VRTP-Test] survey: how much for 5 years of Motorcycle Consumer News? To: pattonme@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX --part1_76.16b2da26.298c9003_boundary This should NOT be on the VRTP site! --part1_76.16b2da26.298c9003_boundary This should NOT be on the VRTP site! --part1_76.16b2da26.298c9003_boundary-- From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 01:20:02 2002 Date: Fri, 1 Feb 2002 22:20:00 -0800 (PST) From: Aaron To: pattonme@XXXXXX Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Re: your idea of scanning the MSF and selling on CD-ROM. Two words: copyright infringement. I wouldn't do it without an explicit release from MCN _AND_ the authors of the articles. (not legal advice, yada yada) -Aaron __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 07:30:53 2002 Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2002 04:30:52 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Withrow Subject: Re: Help me, please... To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: > He bounced a microwave signal off of you, a computer > measured the Doppler > shift converted it to the speed the two vehicles > were closing on each other, > read the speedometer of the cop car, simple > subtraction, voala! you are > busted. > > If it was any harder then that do you think they > could do it? > Close but no cigar. To compute the speed while moving, the radar unit bounces a second signal of the ground and computes it's own speed. It is not hooked up to the speedo. Thus you can use a handheld radar unit while moving. ===== AIM: Inf DS http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow ----------------------------------------------------------- Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to childproof the world. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 10:29:01 2002 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2002 10:28:05 EST Subject: Re: Help me, please... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/2/2002 7:31:03 AM Eastern Standard Time, mtwithrow@XXXXXX writes: > the radar unit bounces a second signal of the ground > and computes it's own speed. Sorry no can do as described. The signal MUST bounce from a relatively flat surface at right angles to the sending unit to get a _true_ speed of any kind. Microwaves follow the same physical laws as anything else, Think of a billiard ball, If it bounces from the sides at 90deg. it will come right back, but if it hits the sides at an angle it will bounce away. The road surface "seen" from a unit attached to or held outside of a car is at a very steep angle indeed. Also note there is an error factor in any angled reflection from a radar unit: An extreme example would be that if the reflection is from an object moving at 90deg. from the sending unit, (point the gun directly down at the road) there would be no Doppler shift at all, it would read _0mph._ Thats right 0mph! To get a absolutely true reading a radar (or laser) gun *must* be directly in your line of travel (No it will not work in court if the cop is to the side, the further out of line the unit is the *lower* the recorded speed will be, so if the gun says 65mph. it means you were going _at least_ 65 and the courts know that.) Also the gun has no way of knowing that it is bouncing a signal from an object that is not moving (the road) or one that is moving (another vehicle) so its reading of its own speed would be questionable. There may well be free standing radar units out there (I have never seen one they always seem to have a cable to the car) but I expect if you check it out you will find some kind of link to some sort of sending unit hooked to the car (I know that at least some of the early units used a magnetic pick up unit (much like the timing unit of your bike) attached to the drive shaft of the car (I worked in an auto shop back when radar was new.) OR the easy and cheapest way (and I shudder to think of many cops out there doing the math.) the cop could simply look at the his/her cars speedometer and do the simple subtraction (or addition) necessary to compute your speed. What the gun read (the total closing speed of your two vehicles) and subtract the cop cars speedometer reading = your speed. It is just too easy. Subject to correction. John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC Honda ST1100X Pan European (With all of the STs all of a sudden the Pan European is now necessary {and I still like it.}) BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 13:09:03 2002 From: "dannie davis" To: mtwithrow@XXXXXX, PenguinBiker@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help me, please... Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2002 18:08:23 oh man it just sounds like your busted :( crystal city dan davis >From: Todd Withrow >To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Subject: Re: Help me, please... >Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2002 04:30:52 -0800 (PST) > > >--- PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: > > He bounced a microwave signal off of you, a computer > > measured the Doppler > > shift converted it to the speed the two vehicles > > were closing on each other, > > read the speedometer of the cop car, simple > > subtraction, voala! you are > > busted. > > > > If it was any harder then that do you think they > > could do it? > > > >Close but no cigar. To compute the speed while moving, >the radar unit bounces a second signal of the ground >and computes it's own speed. It is not hooked up to >the speedo. Thus you can use a handheld radar unit >while moving. > > >===== >AIM: Inf DS > >http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow > >----------------------------------------------------------- >Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to >childproof the world. > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! >http://auctions.yahoo.com _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 13:20:07 2002 From: "mobacc" To: "DC-Cycles" Subject: 2005 moto Xmas gift of the year! Date: Sat, 2 Feb 2002 10:53:51 -0500 This just came into view. The highend home market certainly next. Walking tools problems now solved (according to maker)! (Darn. No more blaming kids and neighbors for left-behinds). Bill S. / DC '99 VN750 --> Yes, yes. Put it in a sidecar. Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. ******begin San Diego is the first airport in the nation to utilize Vistant products for security purposes. A wholly-owned division of Cardinal Health, Inc (NYSE: CAH), Vistant's mission is to introduce automated dispensing technology that was originally developed for healthcare into new growth markets such as manufacturing and aviation security The Vistant system features a series of computerized cabinets Maintenance workers identify themselves at the cabinet with a biometric fingerprint scan. Once properly identified, the worker requests a specific tool on the system's touchscreen. The cabinet then opens a single drawer, enabling the worker to remove a screwdriver, wrench, carpet cutter or any other potentially dangerous instrument. The computer records each transaction and can send an electronic notification to a supervisor if the worker leaves their shift without returning the tool or part to the Vistant system "The safety and security of the traveling public is our topmost priority," said Thella Bowens, Senior Director, Aviation, for the Port of San Diego. "We are moving quickly to implement new technologies that will further safeguard our airport against individuals and processes that could compromise security in any way. We are impressed with the ability of the Vistant system to track and control access to tools and supplies that are necessary to the daily operations of our facilities, but which also need to be closely monitored for security purposes. This technology was developed here in San Diego and we envision broad application for it throughout the commercial aviation industry." ******end From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 21:10:45 2002 From: "Pierre C" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Insurance in DC Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2002 01:59:11 +0000 Hello, I am seeking quotes on motorcycle insurance in DC. My current insurance company (Merkel) asked $1,450 to insure a VFR (which is what i would like to buy). However, i heard about people paying $350 for the same bike (although they are residents of the metro area in VA). Is there anyone who knows where i could go to get a cheaper rate? When i inquired with the major companies (state farm, progress, ..., other companies, i am not from the US, i don't remember all the names, but I inquired with all the major ones) they all told me that they don't insure motorcycles in DC. Hope someone can be of help to get me driving a wonderful VFR. Pierfrancesco Consalvo _________________________________________________________________ Join the worldM-^Rs largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 21:43:29 2002 Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2002 21:44:07 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Larry Larson Subject: Re: dc-cycles digest for 02/02/02 At 07:00 PM 2/2/2002, The dc-cycles list administrator wrote: >Walking tools problems now solved (according to maker)! (Darn. No more >blaming >kids and neighbors for left-behinds). Does this mean the end of the Dagwood comic strip? Please? Regards, Larry -- '01 Aprilia Mille SL Falco '02 Honda 919 (backup and commuter bike) '84 Interceptor 500 (small emergency backup bike) '95 Miata R, modified '02 BMW 325i '72 Elden FF From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 21:44:32 2002 Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2002 21:47:26 -0500 From: Paul Wilson To: Pierre C , Dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Insurance in DC What vintage VFR are you looking at? I have a 95 and the old Interceptor and I'm paying a little less than half that for both bikes, through Markel. Other data points, 36 years old, safe rider discount (MSF training and MSF instructor), no tickets, (bike or cage), no claims or accident involvement in the past five years. I do have a high collision deductible on the VFR and no comp./collision on the rat bike. Insurance can be hard to get in DC, I'll grant you that. Some companies like GEICO Cycle Guard won't wite comprehensive policies in DC. Paul in DC 95 VFR / 86 VF500F Pierre C wrote: > Hello, > I am seeking quotes on motorcycle insurance in DC. My current insurance > company (Merkel) asked $1,450 to insure a VFR (which is what i would like to > buy). However, i heard about people paying $350 for the same bike (although > they are residents of the metro area in VA). Is there anyone who knows > where i could go to get a cheaper rate? When i inquired with the major > companies (state farm, progress, ..., other companies, i am not from the US, > i don't remember all the names, but I inquired with all the major ones) they > all told me that they don't insure motorcycles in DC. > > Hope someone can be of help to get me driving a wonderful VFR. > > Pierfrancesco Consalvo > > _________________________________________________________________ > Join the worldM-^Rs largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. > http://www.hotmail.com From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 22:35:08 2002 Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2002 22:35:54 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Larry Larson Subject: V65 Sabre? Forgot to ask before -- while at PowerRide in Falls Church last Saturday, I saw a guy on an V65 Sabre leaving the lot -- one sweet looking, like-new bike. A lister by any chance? Regards, -- Larry '01 Aprilia Mille SL Falco '02 Honda 919 / Hornet 900 (backup and commuter bike) 84 Interceptor 500 (small emergency backup bike) From dc-cycles-request Sat Feb 2 23:18:38 2002 Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2002 23:18:27 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Rob Winters Subject: Harley dresser with training wheels? At 10:35 PM 2/2/2002, Larry Larson wrote: >Forgot to ask before -- while at PowerRide in Falls Church last Saturday, >I saw a guy on an V65 Sabre leaving the lot -- one sweet looking, like-new >bike. A lister by any chance? Since we're playing "spot the motorcycle"... I was on Route 4 South (caged) headed outbound from the Beltway, and I found myself opposite a single rider on a black Harley FLH Ultra Chassic. The bike had what appeared to be permanent outrigger wheels (about trailer-sized), with matching black fenders. The wheels seemed to make a (4-wheeled) "trike" out of the Harley, and I think I saw suspension components (leaf springs). Anyway, the bike turn off toward Chesapeake Beach (260?). Does anyone know anything about this beast? Just curious. /// Rob From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 02:05:31 2002 From: "Pierre C" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: F650ST for sale--Loaded--Cheap Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2002 07:05:23 +0000 F650ST Orange, 1997, perfect conditions, selling to buy a bigger bike and go out for a trip, BMW serviced, BMW hard bags, BMW tank bag, GIVI topcase (holds two helmets) hot grips, light buddies, front fairing, 14K miles, chain/sprokets 1,5k miles, brakes 1.5 k miles, front tire 2K miles, battery less than a year old and treated with battery tender. Price: 3,950 Location: Washington, DC Contact Pierfrancesco Consalvo at Telephone 202 285 5725 (cell) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 07:28:33 2002 Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2002 04:28:32 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Withrow Subject: Re: Help me, please... To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: > > > correction, but I do understand the > physics of speed radar and do not expect any.> > I have no doubt that you understand the physics of it. But I don't think you understand the practical application of it. > In a message dated 2/2/2002 7:31:03 AM Eastern > Standard Time, > mtwithrow@XXXXXX writes: > > > the radar unit bounces a second signal of the > ground > > and computes it's own speed. > > Sorry no can do as described. The signal MUST bounce > from a relatively flat > surface at right angles to the sending unit to get a > _true_ speed of any > kind. Microwaves follow the same physical laws as > anything else, Can you see the road? If light can bounce off the road and back to your optic nerves, then a microwave can also. The road surface is textured, so some of the surface is actually at or near a right angle to you. That is why the road is harder to see in the rain at night. The texture is filled in with rain water and less light from your headlights bounces back to you. > Subject to correction. > > > > > John Walters (Long John) > PenguinBiker@XXXXXX > Up near DC > ===== AIM: Inf DS http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow ----------------------------------------------------------- Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to childproof the world. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 09:26:17 2002 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2002 09:25:54 EST Subject: Re: Help me, please... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/3/2002 7:29:03 AM Eastern Standard Time, mtwithrow@XXXXXX writes: > Can you see the road? If light can bounce off the road > and back to your optic nerves, then a microwave can > also. _Back_ to my optic nerve? The light your refer to did not originate in my eyes but from an unfocussed source, the sun/sky, not from a (relatively) focused source, a radar gun (or in the case of laser an extremely focused source.) . And yes of course _some_ microwaves will bounce back, but only some, and that scattered. Also, even if enough of the original signal bounces back to read, the angle error will throw the speed reading off. And not just off but off depending on the angle of the sending unit in relation to the road which will change constantly with a hand held unit. In other words the speed reading would be completely unreliable and one would hope inadmissible in court. (Yea right.) The simple solution is a mechanical speed reading from a sending unit on the cop car, OR simple subtraction or addition as I stated in my post. John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 12:12:12 2002 Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2002 09:12:10 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Withrow Subject: Re: Help me, please... To: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- PenguinBiker@XXXXXX wrote: > In a message dated 2/3/2002 7:29:03 AM Eastern > Standard Time, > mtwithrow@XXXXXX writes: > > > Can you see the road? If light can bounce off the > road > > and back to your optic nerves, then a microwave > can > > also. > > _Back_ to my optic nerve? The light your refer to > did not originate in my > eyes At 7:30am I am still tired. I did not mean that the light originated from your eyes. Excuse my grammer. > Also, even if enough of the original > signal bounces back to > read, the angle error will throw the speed reading > off. The angle from the sending unit to the road is negligible. It is less than the angle from the sending unit to the target vehicle in most cases. The sending unit is mounted either on the B pillar, 5' off the roadway, or on the dash, 4' off the roadway. If the signal is bouncing back from 100' down the road, that is not much of an angle. Another thing to keep in mind, is that the microwaves are bouncing off everything, the mailboxes, road signs, trees, etc. Not just the road surface. > The simple solution is a mechanical speed reading > from a sending unit on the > cop car, OR simple subtraction or addition as I > stated in my post. > It is simple math, computed by the radar unit. One method of checking the calibration on a radar unit. Is to drive with the unit on, and compare the reading against the speedometer. As long as the speedo has been calibrated and certified, this verifies the radar in moving mode. > > John. > PenguinBiker@XXXXXX ===== AIM: Inf DS http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow ----------------------------------------------------------- Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to childproof the world. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 12:31:20 2002 Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2002 12:31:07 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: Rob Winters Subject: Re: Help me, please... So, neither of you, in fact, know what was installed in the patrol car that stopped this guy, nor can you help him in any way. Not only that, 13 messages ago (by my count), he very considerately asked for replies off-list in the first place, since he's not even in town. So enough already! /// Rob From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 12:44:59 2002 Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2002 12:43:14 -0500 From: "William J. Huson" To: Rob Winters CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Harley dresser with training wheels? Rob Winters wrote: > Since we're playing "spot the motorcycle"... > > I was on Route 4 South (caged) headed outbound from the Beltway, and I > found myself opposite a single rider on a black Harley FLH Ultra Chassic. > The bike had what appeared to be permanent outrigger wheels (about > trailer-sized), with matching black fenders. The wheels seemed to make a > (4-wheeled) "trike" out of the Harley, and I think I saw suspension > components (leaf springs). > > Anyway, the bike turn off toward Chesapeake Beach (260?). Does anyone know > anything about this beast? Just curious. > Seen adverts for add-on wheels that deploy (touch down) when you roll to a stop. Also an advert for an axle/wheel combo that hasa suspension and uses the original M/C rear wheel for propulsion. Both are Butt-F-----g-Ugly! When and if I get that old and feeble I'm going with a sidecar. Bill From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 13:28:47 2002 Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2002 10:28:45 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Withrow Subject: Re: Help me, please... To: Rob Winters , dc-cycles@XXXXXX --- Rob Winters wrote: > So, neither of you, in fact, know what was installed > in the patrol car that > stopped this guy, nor can you help him in any way. > Not only that, 13 > messages ago (by my count), he very considerately > asked for replies > off-list in the first place, since he's not even in > town. So enough already! > > /// Rob > So what you are saying, is that you have no interest in physics or how a radar unit works. Fine, stop reading. Some people have an interest in such things. Particulary in how it may affect them. Todd W. ===== AIM: Inf DS http://www.geocities.com/mtwithrow ----------------------------------------------------------- Used to be that we "worldproofed" our children. Now society wants to childproof the world. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 13:59:08 2002 From: "rdrdr" To: Subject: RE: Radar units (was: Help me, please...) Date: Sun, 3 Feb 2002 13:58:41 -0500 The Withrow is on the money - enough signal bounces back and in fact, car mounted police units ARE built so that they read the police car's speed AND the oncoming vehicle's speed. I don't know if all of them or just some, but I know that is a popular method and is widely used in this area. Go to http://www.copradar.com/index.html for more information. Niv BMW F650ST PenguinBiker@XXXXXX _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 16:40:14 2002 From: "Pierre C" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Help on paper work in DC Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2002 21:40:08 +0000 Hello, i am a resident of DC, and a VA resident would like to buy my bike. How shoudl I handle this? shall i just give him the title (and get a deposit) so he can get temp tags then give him the bike when his paperwork is done (and get the final check)? Regards, Pierfrancesco consalvo _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com From dc-cycles-request Sun Feb 3 16:59:22 2002 Date: Sun, 03 Feb 2002 17:00:14 -0500 From: Chuck and Karen Pena To: Pierre C CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC Pier, Get full payment for your m/c. When he gives you the cash, you give him the keys and title. It's his problem to get it tagged in VA, not your's. Chuck Pierre C wrote: > Hello, > i am a resident of DC, and a VA resident would like to buy my bike. How > shoudl I handle this? shall i just give him the title (and get a > deposit) so he can get temp tags then give him the bike when his > paperwork is done (and get the final check)? > Regards, > Pierfrancesco consalvo > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com > > From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 06:41:49 2002 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 06:41:40 EST Subject: Re: Help me, please... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/3/2002 12:12:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, mtwithrow@XXXXXX writes: > The angle from the sending unit to the road is > negligible. > If the signal is bouncing back from 100' down the road, that > is not much of an angle. Sorry, but no it is not, it will throw the reading off just as it does with a car, only now the cop car will read slower then it is really traveling and THAT will result in an apparent _increase_ in the speed of the target car. We require (as you suggest later in your post) that speedometers in cop cars be calibrated and certified to remove any mechanical errors, how can we accept deliberately inputting an error that can so easily be avoided. > If the signal is bouncing back from 100' down the road, snip > the microwaves > are bouncing off everything, the mailboxes, road > signs, trees, etc. Not just the road surface. > Indeed! And the gun has NO way of determining if the echo it is getting back is from a stationary object or one that is moving which would throw the reading off. What you have done is to point out another problem with the "second signal" > It is simple math, computed by the radar unit. Yes the _math_ is simple. It is the reliability of the "second signal" that I am calling into question. I simply see no way for the gun to calculate its own speed with any accuracy. > As long as the speedo has > been calibrated and certified If the speedometer has been calibrated and certified then the cop can do the math, easy and cheap. Scan in a page from the operators manual (preferably one that explains how it works) or link me to a manufacturers website, or even a reliable magazine article and I will eat a large crow pie right here. But I just do not see a solution short of a sending unit on the car, or cop math. Having fun: John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 06:46:24 2002 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 06:45:54 EST Subject: Re: Harley dresser with training wheels? To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/3/2002 12:45:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, bhuson@XXXXXX writes: > Seen adverts for add-on wheels that deploy (touch down) when you roll to a > stop. Had one of these in an ERC once, the guy could not complete the first exercise with the wheels up. If you think about it the bike goes from counter steering with the "training" wheels up to steering with them down. The guy was clearly doing himself no favors by using that set up. John Walters (Long John) PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Up near DC Honda ST1100X Pan European (With all of the STs all of a sudden the Pan European is now necessary {and I still like it.}) BMW R80RT 200,000+ miles Honda 1976 CR250M Motowhat racer From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 07:02:49 2002 From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 07:02:31 EST Subject: Re: Radar units (was: Help me, please...) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 2/3/2002 2:02:14 PM Eastern Standard Time, rydin@XXXXXX writes: > Go to http://www.copradar.com/index.html Thanks for the goto. I checked it (quickly I was short on time) and saw nothing about a "second signal" or any other explanation of how they read cop speed. Could you tell me where to look? thanks John. PenguinBiker@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 09:04:55 2002 Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 06:04:53 -0800 (PST) From: Chris Weaver Subject: Re: Harley dresser with training wheels? To: "William J. Huson" , Rob Winters Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I think those things are marketed not toward the "old and feeble" but to the handicapped. The only real hurdle for those folks to overcome aside from moving the shifter and rear brake is the fact that the bike will fall over when one comes to a stop. Chris --- "William J. Huson" wrote: > Seen adverts for add-on wheels that deploy (touch > down) when you roll to a > stop. Also an advert for an axle/wheel combo that > hasa suspension and uses the > original M/C rear wheel for propulsion. Both are > Butt-F-----g-Ugly! When and > if I get that old and feeble I'm going with a > sidecar. > > Bill > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 09:06:49 2002 From: "Danny Thompson" To: , "D.C. Cycles" Subject: SPAM: '98 SH for sale Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 09:08:38 -0500 I have to sell my Superhawk, now that I have it all setup--grrrr!, due to financial needs. Here are the details: '98 with 5500 miles, never down, excellent condition Extras: Sargants World Seat with color matched pillion, Two Brothers carbon cans with high and low mounts- full system, excellent jetting done by previous owner who was the service manager of a local shop, Penske Sport shock- sprung for 220lbs (installed less than 300 miles ago), Traxxion reworked front end; emulators, .95 springs, new oil (installed less than 200 miles ago), New BT56SS tires (less than 400 miles), Heli-bars, Two Brothers Lower, stock seat included (I sold the original exhaust). This is a sweet SuperHawk that I hate to sell, but I must. Asking $6500. Also have a 2001 Honda Shadow Ace Tourer for sale. E-mail me if you are interested in either. Danny '02 XR 250R '00 SV (racebike) '98 Superhawk '01 Shadow ACE Tourer www.onewayracing.org ...................................... From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 09:14:46 2002 From: "Bruce Norton" To: "DC Cycles" Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 09:17:46 -0500 I'm selling my VFR to Pierfrancesco. I live in VA, he lives in DC. How do we work this so he can get plates to ride the bike away from Va? I'm a trusting soul and Pier seems like a good guy. My plan was to take a deposit from him at which point I would go ahead and give him the title so he can get his loan from his bank and go to DC DMV and get plates. Then he comes to my house with the check from his bank and legal plates ready to ride. How else could we do this so he can legally ride the bike away? Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck and Karen Pena" > Pier, > > Get full payment for your m/c. When he gives you the cash, you give him > the keys and title. It's his problem to get it tagged in VA, not your's. > > Chuck > > Pierre C wrote: > > > Hello, > > i am a resident of DC, and a VA resident would like to buy my bike. How > > shoudl I handle this? shall i just give him the title (and get a > > deposit) so he can get temp tags then give him the bike when his > > paperwork is done (and get the final check)? > > Regards, > > Pierfrancesco consalvo From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 10:09:33 2002 Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 07:09:31 -0800 (PST) From: stephen cutchins Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX He gets the VIN#, goes to his bank, gets the loan, bank makes check out to you, he goes to DMV and gets tags, he brings check to you, you give him title, keys, and bike. Good guy or not, DO NOT let him ride away without money in your hand and the title signed over to him. Worst case scenario, he's in an accident and injures someone. If the title is in YOUR name then YOU are liable also. Just don't do it!! --- Bruce Norton wrote: > I'm selling my VFR to Pierfrancesco. I live in VA, > he lives in DC. How do we > work this so he can get plates to ride the bike away > from Va? > > I'm a trusting soul and Pier seems like a good guy. > My plan was to take a > deposit from him at which point I would go ahead and > give him the title so > he can get his loan from his bank and go to DC DMV > and get plates. Then he > comes to my house with the check from his bank and > legal plates ready to > ride. > > How else could we do this so he can legally ride the > bike away? > > Bruce > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chuck and Karen Pena" > > > > > Pier, > > > > Get full payment for your m/c. When he gives you > the cash, you give him > > the keys and title. It's his problem to get it > tagged in VA, not your's. > > > > Chuck > > > > Pierre C wrote: > > > > > Hello, > > > i am a resident of DC, and a VA resident would > like to buy my bike. How > > > shoudl I handle this? shall i just give him the > title (and get a > > > deposit) so he can get temp tags then give him > the bike when his > > > paperwork is done (and get the final check)? > > > Regards, > > > Pierfrancesco consalvo > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 11:09:42 2002 Subject: RE: Re: Help on paper work in DC From: "cvkgpena@XXXXXX" Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 11:09:37 -0500 To: "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" , "bnorton@XXXXXX" Bruce/Pier, I will echo Stephen's comments about letting go of your title without full possession of the moolah plus a bill of sale to prove that you sold it. No dis' on Pier, just not a smart thing to do ... period. Having the model, year, and VIN should be good enough for the bank ... assuming the bank is willing to make a loan on a used m/c for a private party sale. A lot of banks won't do this. Unless Pier is just using a line of credit or some other financial instrument (i.e., not a specific motorcycle loan). And this is probably another good reason not to let go of your title before cash/certified check is exchanged. Pier needs to know that his bank will give him the loan he wants/needs. If that part of the transaction goes as planned, then: 1. You give Pier the title, keys, and bill of sale. He goes to the DMV to get the bike registered in his name and temp tags. He comes back to affix tags and ride the bike home. 2. If you don't need your m/c tags (at least right away), you let Pier ride it home and you get your tags back after he gets the bike registered and tagged. 3. You guys find someone with a trailer/pick-up truck who can haul the bike. Chuck Original Message: ----------------- From: stephen cutchins stephen_cutchins@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 07:09:31 -0800 (PST) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC He gets the VIN#, goes to his bank, gets the loan, bank makes check out to you, he goes to DMV and gets tags, he brings check to you, you give him title, keys, and bike. Good guy or not, DO NOT let him ride away without money in your hand and the title signed over to him. Worst case scenario, he's in an accident and injures someone. If the title is in YOUR name then YOU are liable also. Just don't do it!! --- Bruce Norton wrote: > I'm selling my VFR to Pierfrancesco. I live in VA, > he lives in DC. How do we > work this so he can get plates to ride the bike away > from Va? > > I'm a trusting soul and Pier seems like a good guy. > My plan was to take a > deposit from him at which point I would go ahead and > give him the title so > he can get his loan from his bank and go to DC DMV > and get plates. Then he > comes to my house with the check from his bank and > legal plates ready to > ride. > > How else could we do this so he can legally ride the > bike away? > > Bruce > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chuck and Karen Pena" > > > > > Pier, > > > > Get full payment for your m/c. When he gives you > the cash, you give him > > the keys and title. It's his problem to get it > tagged in VA, not your's. > > > > Chuck > > > > Pierre C wrote: > > > > > Hello, > > > i am a resident of DC, and a VA resident would > like to buy my bike. How > > > shoudl I handle this? shall i just give him the > title (and get a > > > deposit) so he can get temp tags then give him > the bike when his > > > paperwork is done (and get the final check)? > > > Regards, > > > Pierfrancesco consalvo > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 11:42:17 2002 From: "Paul Wilson" To: "dc-cycles list" Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 11:47:03 -0500 This won't work because DC won't issue temp tags w/o title (and proof of insurance.) Furthermore, DC won't issue a new title and tags until the bike is inspected and you need temp tags to ride the thing legally to the testing station. I'm not sure how the bank's interest in the vehicle (the lien) gets recorded in the interim with all this rigmarole, so I don't know how the seller is going to get paid. Perhaps through some sort of escrow arrangement. With DC cages you just walk in with the title and get the new title and lien recorded. I'm not sure why DC insists on inspecting bikes before the fact when cages get 30-day grace period until they must be inspected. I've never financed a bike before so I can't give a definitive answer. Paul in DC ----- Original Message ----- From: "stephen cutchins" > He gets the VIN#, goes to his bank, gets the loan, > bank makes check out to you, he goes to DMV and gets > tags, he brings check to you, you give him title, > keys, and bike. Good guy or not, DO NOT let him ride > away without money in your hand and the title signed > over to him. > > Worst case scenario, he's in an accident and injures > someone. If the title is in YOUR name then YOU are > liable also. Just don't do it!! > From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 11:52:16 2002 Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 08:52:15 -0800 (PST) From: stephen cutchins Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX But the buyer lives in VA, right? Then why are you worrying about DC temp tags? If nothing else, he can get a friend with a pickup to get the bike for him. I have sold multiple bikes, each time either the buyer comes with a truck or with his own tags, pays in full, I sign the title, and off he goes. Don't let him leave with that bike unless it is totally signed over to him, because I will say I told ya so when someone sues the pants off of you because he injures someone while riding a bike that can still be legally determined to be "yours." I don't remember the particulars, but it has happened before, if I remember correctly the person lost a great deal of cash and a bike to boot. --- Paul Wilson wrote: > This won't work because DC won't issue temp tags w/o > title (and proof of > insurance.) Furthermore, DC won't issue a new title > and tags until the bike > is inspected and you need temp tags to ride the > thing legally to the testing > station. I'm not sure how the bank's interest in > the vehicle (the lien) > gets recorded in the interim with all this > rigmarole, so I don't know how > the seller is going to get paid. Perhaps through > some sort of escrow > arrangement. > > With DC cages you just walk in with the title and > get the new title and lien > recorded. I'm not sure why DC insists on inspecting > bikes before the fact > when cages get 30-day grace period until they must > be inspected. I've never > financed a bike before so I can't give a definitive > answer. > > Paul in DC > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "stephen cutchins" > > > > He gets the VIN#, goes to his bank, gets the loan, > > bank makes check out to you, he goes to DMV and > gets > > tags, he brings check to you, you give him title, > > keys, and bike. Good guy or not, DO NOT let him > ride > > away without money in your hand and the title > signed > > over to him. > > > > Worst case scenario, he's in an accident and > injures > > someone. If the title is in YOUR name then YOU > are > > liable also. Just don't do it!! > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 11:57:36 2002 From: "Jon Strang" To: "dc-cycles list" Subject: m/c rentals in area or WV Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 11:56:21 -0500 Hey, all; I've got two left coast relatives coming out in mid-July. I'd like to rent a couple of bikes for a 2 or 3 day excursion; can anyone out on the list make any recommendations, or anti-dations for that matter, on m/c rental companies in the DC Metro area or out in WV? As far as bike types, she's inseam challenged; she currently rides some Honda Davidson (1100 Sabre?) with a low seat height. He rides an ST1100...and his hockey-deflicted knees will probably be happiest with a distinctly non-sport riding position. --jon 01 Suz Bandit 1200 From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 12:10:15 2002 From: "Paul Wilson" To: "stephen cutchins" , Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 12:14:37 -0500 Buyer lives in DC and will be titling the bike there. Paul in DC ----- Original Message ----- From: "stephen cutchins" > But the buyer lives in VA, right? Then why are you > worrying about DC temp tags? If nothing else, he can > get a friend with a pickup to get the bike for him. From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 12:16:07 2002 From: Michael.Brocchi@XXXXXX Content-return: allowed Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 12:15:36 -0500 Subject: RE: m/c rentals in area or WV To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I'm not sure of details at all, but I do know that Patriot Harley in Fairfax rents their bikes out. The availability might not be so great, so I would look into it ASAP, same with any other place. any recommendations, or anti-dations for that matter, on m/c rental companies in the DC Metro area or out in WV? From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 12:19:51 2002 Subject: RE: Re: Help on paper work in DC From: "cvkgpena@XXXXXX" Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 12:20:35 -0500 To: "pawilson@XXXXXX" , "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" This is beginning to sound like something out of Catch-22. DC won't issue temp tags without a title (and proof of insurance). But DC won't issue a new title until the m/c is inspected and you need the temp tags to ride it to the testing station! Then throw into the works the possibility of a lien on the title from the bank. Yikes! Assuming the bank is willing to do a loan on a private party transaction, seems like the way to do this is to exchange money for bike, keys, and title and then load the thing on a trailer/truck to transport it. Then deal with the bureaucratic mess that is the DC DMV. BTW, this is basically what I did when I bought my FZR from out-of-state (CO). Had it shipped to my then office in VA. Lister Chris Weaver was kind enough to come over and bring it back to my condo garage on his trailer. I went to the DMV with the title to get a new title and temp tags. I then got the bike inspected for VA. But the difference was that I didn't have to get it inspected first to get the new title and temp tags. Chuck (in VA, who likes DC but just wouldn't live there, in part because of the mess described by Paul!) Original Message: ----------------- From: Paul Wilson pawilson@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 11:47:03 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC This won't work because DC won't issue temp tags w/o title (and proof of insurance.) Furthermore, DC won't issue a new title and tags until the bike is inspected and you need temp tags to ride the thing legally to the testing station. I'm not sure how the bank's interest in the vehicle (the lien) gets recorded in the interim with all this rigmarole, so I don't know how the seller is going to get paid. Perhaps through some sort of escrow arrangement. With DC cages you just walk in with the title and get the new title and lien recorded. I'm not sure why DC insists on inspecting bikes before the fact when cages get 30-day grace period until they must be inspected. I've never financed a bike before so I can't give a definitive answer. -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 13:35:49 2002 From: laura granato To: "dc cycles" Subject: Wanna lend a hand? Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 13:35:47 -0500 I am currently looking for a job in the DC Area...If anyone knows of a company that needs an editor/writer, can I pass my resume along to you? Thanks in advance! :-) Laura From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 14:10:47 2002 From: "Lantech (DCOP)" To: "'Dc-Cycles (E-mail)" Subject: RE: Help on paper work in DC Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 14:07:39 -0500 The drill in DC is (or at least was in May when I brought a bike from PA to DC): bring title, bill of sale, proof of insurance and DC Driver's license to the DMV; they will NOT actually transfer the title yet, and you won't pay the sales tax yet, but they will give you temp tags. There is a fee, I think it is $15. It includes the inspection fee. They are the exact same temp tags as you get on a car (same size and all). Then take the paperwork they give you and the bike, get the inspection, get your stickers and another form. Then back to the DMV with the stickers and the inspection form. Make sure you take the stickers because they want to see them. Then you get your hard tags. You'll need the seller's title and your bill of sale, insurance, etc. both visits to the DMV. So I'd suggest the buyer pays for the bike, takes the title (and keys if they want) and does all the running around. You take your tags off the bike at that time. Then the buyer comes back with the paper tag, puts it on the bike and goes for the inspection. For the buyer, make sure you take a bill of sale to DMV because they frequently cannot locate the Kelley Blue Book and they are not really nice about just taking your word for it. Also FYI the main DMV at 301 C Street NW is closed for about a month, starting this week. There is a satellite office in Georgetown Park Mall and another one at 6th and H NE. They all keep kind of strange hours so you should check their web site: http://dmv.dc.gov/main.shtm. Also there is some discrepancy between what the web page says each location offers, and what their flyer about being closed says, so you may want to call first to make sure you are going to the right place. Good luck! -patti Patti the Lantech '95 Virago 750 From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 14:31:47 2002 From: "Paul Wilson" To: "Lantech \(DCOP\)" , "'Dc-Cycles \(E-mail\)" Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 14:36:32 -0500 Upon more mature reflection, this is how the transaction will go down, if it goes down at all dependent on finding an agreeable bank. This is based on my experience financing a cage via a bank through a private sale. Go to you bank/credit union. They will assess the value of the vehicle to see if the sale price is in line with the bike's value. You come to terms on the downpayment, etc. You will then fill out the forms, culminating in signing a promissory note for the amount of the sale less your downpayment, with vehicle of VIN such and such as collateral. They will issue a check payable to both you and the seller. Both seller and buyer endorse the check. Money changes hands, you get keys, signed title and bike. Either leave it at the sellers, go get your temp tags and ride away, or better, have the seller ride or trailer the bike to your place and complete the transaction. Activate the insurance and then follow Patti's outline below for the rest of the DC rigmarole. DC DMV will record the lien when they finally issue a title. Paul in DC 95 VFR750F - 86 VF500F ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lantech (DCOP)" > > > The drill in DC is (or at least was in May when I brought a bike from PA to > DC): bring title, bill of sale, proof of insurance and DC Driver's license > to the DMV; they will NOT actually transfer the title yet, and you won't pay > the sales tax yet, but they will give you temp tags. There is a fee, I think > it is $15. It includes the inspection fee. They are the exact same temp > tags as you get on a car (same size and all). Then take the paperwork they > give you and the bike, get the inspection, get your stickers and another > form. Then back to the DMV with the stickers and the inspection form. Make > sure you take the stickers because they want to see them. Then you get your > hard tags. You'll need the seller's title and your bill of sale, insurance, > etc. both visits to the DMV. > > So I'd suggest the buyer pays for the bike, takes the title (and keys if > they want) and does all the running around. You take your tags off the bike > at that time. Then the buyer comes back with the paper tag, puts it on the > bike and goes for the inspection. > > For the buyer, make sure you take a bill of sale to DMV because they > frequently cannot locate the Kelley Blue Book and they are not really nice > about just taking your word for it. > > Also FYI the main DMV at 301 C Street NW is closed for about a month, > starting this week. There is a satellite office in Georgetown Park Mall and > another one at 6th and H NE. They all keep kind of strange hours so you > should check their web site: http://dmv.dc.gov/main.shtm. Also there is > some discrepancy between what the web page says each location offers, and > what their flyer about being closed says, so you may want to call first to > make sure you are going to the right place. > > Good luck! > > -patti > > Patti the Lantech > '95 Virago 750 > From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 15:08:55 2002 Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 15:07:08 -0500 From: "William J. Huson" To: stephen cutchins CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC I concur, get cash, remove your m/c tag, hand him title, and wave goodbye. It's HIS problem how to get the bike home. He can push it, ride illegal as all hell, or borrow a truck. Cargo vans rent for $19.95 a day. Even then you're not totally safe. My tale - Two brothers pick up a Ymaha enduro my kid sold them. A week goes by *knock knock* the Fairfax County Poo-leece. Do I own a 125 Yamaha? Nope, sold that sucker. Seems younger bro "found" an m/c tag, hung it on the bike, and was haul assing thru the streets with his bud on the back. Car turns *KEEERUNCHHH* Young bro is bashed up good and bud is in a coma. Bike was never regeistered, bro had no permit, DMV still had me as owner. Had someone sued I'd be able to beat it, witnesses galore to the sale and pickup, but my lawyer would driving a new Mercedes and I'd be driving a fifteen year old Dodge Dart. Bill stephen cutchins wrote: > But the buyer lives in VA, right? Then why are you > worrying about DC temp tags? If nothing else, he can > get a friend with a pickup to get the bike for him. I > have sold multiple bikes, each time either the buyer > comes with a truck or with his own tags, pays in full, > I sign the title, and off he goes. Don't let him > leave with that bike unless it is totally signed over > to him, because I will say I told ya so when someone > sues the pants off of you because he injures someone > while riding a bike that can still be legally > determined to be "yours." I don't remember the > particulars, but it has happened before, if I remember > correctly the person lost a great deal of cash and a > bike to boot. From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 15:29:29 2002 Subject: RE: RE: Help on paper work in DC From: "cvkgpena@XXXXXX" Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 15:29:28 -0500 To: "lantech.cwd@XXXXXX" , "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" All I have to say is ... What a PIT(F)A! It will probably be easier for Pier to move to VA! Original Message: ----------------- From: Lantech (DCOP) lantech.cwd@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 14:07:39 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Help on paper work in DC The drill in DC is (or at least was in May when I brought a bike from PA to DC): bring title, bill of sale, proof of insurance and DC Driver's license to the DMV; they will NOT actually transfer the title yet, and you won't pay the sales tax yet, but they will give you temp tags. There is a fee, I think it is $15. It includes the inspection fee. They are the exact same temp tags as you get on a car (same size and all). Then take the paperwork they give you and the bike, get the inspection, get your stickers and another form. Then back to the DMV with the stickers and the inspection form. Make sure you take the stickers because they want to see them. Then you get your hard tags. You'll need the seller's title and your bill of sale, insurance, etc. both visits to the DMV. So I'd suggest the buyer pays for the bike, takes the title (and keys if they want) and does all the running around. You take your tags off the bike at that time. Then the buyer comes back with the paper tag, puts it on the bike and goes for the inspection. For the buyer, make sure you take a bill of sale to DMV because they frequently cannot locate the Kelley Blue Book and they are not really nice about just taking your word for it. Also FYI the main DMV at 301 C Street NW is closed for about a month, starting this week. There is a satellite office in Georgetown Park Mall and another one at 6th and H NE. They all keep kind of strange hours so you should check their web site: http://dmv.dc.gov/main.shtm. Also there is some discrepancy between what the web page says each location offers, and what their flyer about being closed says, so you may want to call first to make sure you are going to the right place. Good luck! -patti Patti the Lantech '95 Virago 750 -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ . From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 17:08:42 2002 Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 17:02:17 -0500 Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC To: stephen_cutchins@XXXXXX Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX From: "garcia oliver" stephen_cutchins@XXXXXX writes: > I >have sold multiple bikes, each time either the buyer >comes with a truck or with his own tags, pays in full, >I sign the title, and off he goes. I have, on occasion, ridden the bike to the new owner's home and gotten a (car) ride back from him/her. --garcia From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 17:53:52 2002 Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 14:53:50 -0800 (PST) From: Leon Begeman Subject: Re: Help on paper work in DC To: Pierre C , dc-cycles@XXXXXX If the buyer is from Virginia, isn't this a Virginia paperwork question? I would think the proper way to do it is that all the money changes hands at the same time as the title and bike. Buyer shows up with a trailer to take the bike home. Once the buyer has the title signed over to him, the bike is his. If I have any suspicion of a problem, cash is used for the transaction and the name on the title is checked against some identification by the seller. Buyer's ID is irrelevant if cash is used. Leon. --- Pierre C wrote: > Hello, > i am a resident of DC, and a VA resident would like > to buy my bike. How > shoudl I handle this? shall i just give him the > title (and get a deposit) so > he can get temp tags then give him the bike when his > paperwork is done (and > get the final check)? > Regards, > Pierfrancesco consalvo > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: > http://messenger.msn.com > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 20:11:51 2002 From: "Ken Shephard" To: jmstrang@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: m/c rentals in area or WV Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 20:00:04 -0500 jon... Try Mountain Thunder in downtown Charles Town. Its right on the Main Drag, on 340 through town, on your left if you were heading towards Summit Point as you drove through town. They frequently have a number of bikes sitting out front in the summer. I've never stopped there, although I have meant to. Maybe this summer. >any recommendations, or anti-dations for that matter, on m/c rental >companies in the DC Metro area or out in WV? > >--jon >01 Suz Bandit 1200 > Ken S........ Ride Safe and Forever Free Inwood WV HDKnight@XXXXXX AIM HDKnight1 ICQ #32289311 _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 20:15:38 2002 From: "Ken Shephard" To: jmstrang@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: m/c rentals in area or WV Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 20:03:48 -0500 Sorry forgot to paste the URL for Mountain Thunder http://www.wvbiker.com/ Ken S........ _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 20:23:28 2002 Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 20:23:35 -0500 From: Chuck and Karen Pena To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX CC: Gary Jaehne Subject: Euro/UK '94 FZR 600R question Anyone know what the differences are between a US-spec FZR600 and a Euro/UK-spec '94 FZR600R. I know that essentially from '93 onwards, the US FZR600 remained unchanged. But I don't know how the Euro/UK model evolved. I'm trying to figure out if rearsets for a '94 onwards Euro/UK FZR600R would fit my US-spec '93 FZR600. A nice set (Raask) are up for auction on eBay and I'm interested in them (if they are, in fact, racing rearsets that move the pegs up and back). Thanx! http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1700182171 Chuck From dc-cycles-request Mon Feb 4 20:44:58 2002 Date: Mon, 04 Feb 2002 20:44:43 -0500 Subject: Moto Rental From: Bob McKeithen To: on 2/4/02 7:00 PM, The dc-cycles list administrator at dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX wrote: > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > __ /-----\ __ 'dc-cycles' is an unmoderated email discussion list > (__\/ _____ \/__) about motorcycling in the Washington D.C. area. > =( \___/ )= > \ ___ / An archive of the dc-cycles list is available at: > | / _ \ | http://www.dc-cycles.org/ > \ || || / > \|| ||/ Subscribe/unsubscribe requests should be sent to: > \| |/ dc-cycles-request@XXXXXX > |_| > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > From: PenguinBiker@XXXXXX > Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2002 06:41:40 EST > Subject: Re: Help me, please... > To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX > > In a message dated 2/3/2002 12:12:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, > mtwithrow@XXXXXX writes: > >> The angle from the sending unit to the road is >> negligible. > >> If the signal is bouncing back from 100' down the road, that >> is not much of an angle. > > Sorry, but no it is not, it will throw the reading off just as it does with a > car, only now the cop car will read slower then it is really traveling and > THAT will result in an apparent _increase_ in the speed of the target car. We > require (as you suggest later in your post) that speedometers in cop cars be > calibrated and certified to remove any mechanical errors, how can we accept > deliberately inputting an error that can so easily be avoided. > >> If the signal is bouncing back from 100' down the road, > snip >> the microwaves >> are bouncing off everything, the mailboxes, road >> signs, trees, etc. Not just the road surface. >> > > Indeed! And the gun has NO way of determining if the echo it is getting back > is from a stationary object or one that is moving which would throw the > reading off. What you have done is to point out another problem with the > "second signal" > >> It is simple math, computed by the radar unit. > > Yes the _math_ is simple. It is the reliability of the "second signal" that I > am calling into question. I simply see no way for the gun to calculate its > own speed with any accuracy. > >> As long as the speedo has >> been calibrated and certified > > If the speedometer has been calibrated and certified then the cop can do the > math, easy and cheap. > > Scan in a page from the operators manual (preferably one that explains how it > works) or link me to a manufacturers website, or even a reliable magazine > article