From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 01:15:16 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 01:14:28 EST Subject: Re: Racing classes To: gixer_racer@XXXXXX CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 11/30/99 11:05:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, gixer_racer@XXXXXX writes: > Along the reasoning given so far, why wouldn't we change the rules for > middle weight bikes so that FZR 600s are competitive?? It's a change > in technology. Let's move on. The SV has raised the bar, so lets hope > the other manufacturers take note and start building something of their > own!! GGGARARRRRHHGHHH!!! Why does everyone miss the point here? The SV shouldn't BE in Lightweight in WERA. The *only* reason its in lightweight is because a rule was changed to allow the underpowered, lightweight twin, Honda Hawk into the class. The Displacement was bumped up to a whopping 67% over water cooled 4 cyl. You analogy using the FZR600 doesn't work here Fagan (BTW, I'm still waiting for those two kidneys you owe me from Sat). The Analogy is "Why wouldn't we change the rules so that a Ducati 996 is allowed to race in the middleweight class?". The answer is: "It would destroy everything else in the class due to its 67% displacement advantage". > Another personal observation.... I disagree with some of the arguments > about lightweight classes... from everything that I have seen, the > people winning in that class are on super heavily modified lightweight > bikes... that means $$$$$$. $3000 bucks bought me that 70+ hp championship winning fzr with a ton of spares. SpeedWerks does a year-end refresh for < $1000. I changed the oil a few times over the summer... well, and that unfortunate T1 incident at summit, but that doesn't count :) Now the FZR400RR.... ok, that's another story, but it was so shiny and sparkly.... > The horsepower difference in the > lightweight classes are extreme! ranging from 90+ hp FZR565's down to > stock EX's and hawks putting out around 50hp or so...It's a scary > class. Especially because it is combined with experts... I've seen > closing speeds down towards turn one in excess of 40 mph or so! > A newbie entering that class will NOT be competitive unless they are on > a well built machine...ask Brian Roach how nice his FZR's 70+ is :) Only CCS allows FZR560's, and those will be competitive with SV SuperBikes. Unfortunately, everyone in CCS seems to bump up from Lightweight SuperSport into lightweight Superbike, even though there's a 30hp diff and they have no feasible chance of running up front. Also, while CCS might combine experts and novices, WERA doesn't except for the Solo20 races on Sat, and even then you don't have the insane HP diff because (except for the SV) everyone has comparable horsepower because WERA doesn't run a lightweight SuperSport class. (Can ya count the reasons not to race CCS on one hand? I usually can't :) ) > Not to toot my own horn too much, but my GSXR750 was/is bone stock... > right down to the paper air filter. (and I didn't have ram air ducts > all season). It put out a very average (for GSXR's) 108 hp on the > dyno. I had a good season... I won most of the races I entered, and > never finished farther back than 7th all year (all but one were top > 4!!) and that's against other bikes with in excess of 120hp. But > that's still only 12 hp difference... not 30 or more... And I agree here... for the *novice class*, even with a hp advantage the big difference is the rider. I had a monster fzr400 but for the first 3/4 of the season I prob wasn't even using it to 75% of it's capabilities (Now I'm prob up near 90%, but not nearly 100%). However, give me a 20% horsepower edge instead of a 5% one, and I bet I make up some time on the straights... that'll be the diff at 90hp vs. 70hp. On top of that, the SV chassis alone is worth 2 seconds at Summit (Ask Randy or John). However, equal riders... the guy on the SV wins. Same thing with your class... if you had more HP, I bet you could go faster. If you had Ernie's bike, you'd have to park at the end and wait for everyone to show up. > ick I ramble!! The point I am attempting to make, is that a > manufacturer put up the R&D money to build a better bike. Why punish > them by changing the rules for some very good bikes that aer just > getting outdated??? Let them go to vintage!! Otherwise, the > manufacturers might as well jsut stop building new bikes all together.. > I mean, cmon, an R1 has what?? 140 or so hp stock!!! 5 years ago, only > factory superbikes had that kind of power... Back to the displacement thing. The R1 is a natural progression, getting more hp every year out of the same displacement. Same with the 600cc bikes. Same size motor, better performance. This is a fluke where a rule was changed a while ago to allow a underperforming bike in, and now there's an excellent performing bike that has the same displacement and falls under the same rule. The Rule, allowing a 67% displacement advantage, is wrong. If it wasn't, then every class would have the same adjustment, instead of the 25% - 33% allowance they do have. They don't, because the twins would have a huge advantage. I have yet to have one person tell me that indeed, a 996 should be allowed into middleweight. After all, Ducati spent all that R&D money to produce a better bike, right? ;) The SV has a class tailor made for it - lightweight twins. FZRs cannot run in that class, and would not be competitive. I'm all for advancements in technology - I love my 400RR, and *wish* it, and the CBR400RR, and the NC-30, and ZXR, etc would be imported into the States. Everyone seems to be jumping on the twins bandwagon, so maybe Honda will come out with an updated Hawk next year to go up against the SV... they'll both fit right into lightweight twins and the class will be chock full. If the SV were a 550cc machine, you wouldn't see me arguing - that's 33% over the 420cc allowed the FZR, and is in line with the allowance in WERA C and B classes (800cc vs 600cc and 1000cc vs 750cc). To say that the SV is being punished if the rules change is incorrect - it's being given special privilege under the current WERA D-Super Rules. As always, my $.02 - Bri From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 01:28:20 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 01:27:43 EST Subject: Re: racing classes To: jmoran@XXXXXX CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 11/30/99 8:31:42 PM Eastern Standard Time, jmoran@XXXXXX writes: > I still feel that the SV will win in a contest of evenly skilled riders, > simply because the SV is so easy to ride. It really has to be > experienced to be believed. I would be happy to let you take a practice > or two on mine next year. Of course, that would mean that your little > "gray market" sweetie would be all alone in the pits...It would be a > shame to waste a practice... I think the SV is easier to ride as well... even against my little RR. The RR you still have to wind up like a top and keep it up there (or else). As added fun, I discovered in SC that it will indeed spin up the rear in a tight corner at about 13.5k RPM in second gear (turn one... it was a real eye opener, let me tell you). I think the RR has a stiffer chassis and I'm building a real Superbike out of it (It's got a penski rear shock and emulators up front, and the engine is about to be turned over to Jon at SpeedWerks), but I *have* to do that to run against the SVs... I'll get stomped coming out of corners and on the straights otherwise. And I'm still going to have to be a better rider to get everything out of the bike. Going into turn nine at summit at 13k is kinda scary... at least for me, but you have to do it on a fizzer. Same with turn 10. ::Shrug:: I was planning on getting an SV, but I really didn't want to race a twin and the RR was kinda cool. I'm hoping it'll all turn out ok once the season gets rolling :) I'm also going to downtune the US fzr and make it a rain bike.... that SV's torque may be a disadvantage in the wet! - Bri From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 06:16:25 1999 From: Boiade@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 06:15:42 EST Subject: Re: Racing classes To: gixer_racer@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 11/30/99 11:05:15 PM Eastern Standard Time, gixer_racer@XXXXXX writes: << The FZR has been around for over 10 years, it's had its hayday, now its time to move on. Both are eligible for vintage now anyhow. >> Collin, If they were built before 1990, they would only be eligible for WERA Vintage 6 where they would have to race against the likes of GSXR 1100s, Yamaha 5-Valve 1000ccs, Factory RR bikes up to 750 cc (i.e. ex factory racers) etc. In AHRMA Vintage they would be too new. Maybe the EX would be eligible for AHRMA BOT (Battle of the Twins) but I think (not sure) the cut-off date is earlier than 1990. Ciao, Fred From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 08:50:14 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: reply to re: Racing Classes (a little long) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 08:51:01 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Thanks for all the responses, I didn't mean to start anything that would get people riled up. :) It looks like I will be going back to the stock pipe and will probably have to play with the jetting as a result so that I can run production class. I really am looking forward to racing this coming season and know it will be a blast. As I continue to get ready, I am starting to see just how costly this "fun" is. I am putting in my order to Barnicle Bill for leathers, and got some good gloves at Fast Lanes last night. Rick, at Fast Lanes, was a great help in providing suggestions and advice. They also give people who are trying to get into racing a good discount on stuff to help out because it is so expensive to get into. (and looks like it might cost some $ to stay in also). I found out that 'DOT' tires come in 2 catagories, ones you can race and ones you shouldn't race so it looks like I will be spending more on tires than I expected, D207 gp's I guess. I also found out I will need to get a steering dampener even though the SV doesn't need it at my level. There goes another chunk of change. Anyone have a steering dampener they want to sell? There is more but I won't get into at this time. Suffice it to say I will be looking for a lot of stuff soon. Thanks, Danny '99 VFR '99 SV From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 09:36:33 1999 From: "Brad Faas" To: Subject: Paging Brian LeSalle Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 09:36:10 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Uh, don't know if I spelled the last name right, but you know you are. :-) Rides a yellow Nighthawk 750, lives down Croom Rd somewhere. If anyone has his email addy, could you please send it to me? Or Brian, if you see this, give me a shout. Thanks, Brad 99 CBR600 F4 88 FZR400 From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 10:02:29 1999 From: christopher.a.weaver@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 09:51:39 -0500 Subject: Re: Racing classes To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Content-disposition: inline X-Lotus-FromDomain: AMERICAS-US@INTL Brian Roach wrote: I have yet to have one person tell me that indeed, a 996 should be allowed into middleweight. --- Well, a VTR makes about 100-105 hp, and would fit right in with the 600cc bikes! How 'bout THEM apples?! :^) Chris Weaver '98 Guess What ---------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 10:02:51 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: beginning racing costs Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 10:03:40 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 > Danny, > > For those of us thinking about racing, it would be instructive to get > a feel for what it costs you to get into it. You are riding the bike > I would most seriously consider to start out on, and are riding in > the same place I would be, so I would be very interested in finding > out what it really costs you. snip..... Ned, (et al) OK. I didn't want to bore those who have already been through it (didn't want to scare anyone away either :) ), but... To date: $4800 for the SV, used with 3k miles, full TBR exhuast, stage 1 jet kit, Buell bug screen, and upgraded fork oil The exhaust will be replaced with the stocker for now. The bug screen is a must in my opinion, and the forks will probably be re-valved. $950 plus shipping for custom leathers from Barnicle Bill (could have spent less but I know crashing is part of racing and learning and would rather minmize the medical expenses and pain expenses) $150 for clip-ons $150 for race gloves (see leathers) Still to buy: Penske rear shock ($700) after a lot of research and considering of a gsxr shock with rework (~$350) I have decided to go this route. This is area where $$ could be saved but I think you would eventually do the aftermarket route and that would be wasted $$ on the gsxr shock. Tires (D 207 gp's) ~$340 / set mounted new. After this 1st set I will probably use race take-offs, unless I can find some race take-offs before this season that will pass for race school. Race-tech gold valves ~$200 belly catch pan (new rule) ~$? rear sets ~$175 steering dampener ~$200 race boots ~$200 (see leathers) extra levers, foot pegs, handle bars, etc. ~$100(?) AAAUUGGGHH! This makes me cringe as I write it all down. To those who have already been there / done that, have I missed anything? Danny '99 VFR '99 SV From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 10:18:22 1999 From: christopher.a.weaver@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 09:59:59 -0500 Subject: Re: racing classes To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Content-disposition: inline X-Lotus-FromDomain: AMERICAS-US@INTL Since I'm feeling talkative, I'll throw my two cents in even though I don't race... Brian wrote: I think the SV is easier to ride as well... even against my little RR. I had a chance to ride Danny's SV not long ago. I'm sure Brian and the others are right here - the SV certainly dumped into turns like a champ. Its one failing, it seemed to me, was that it took a lot of attention to keep it on its line in a corner. That quick steering has a price, I guess. The RR will probably feel a lot more planted while railing around those corners, and may make up for the torque advantage of the SV in the same places. I'm no expert, but it seems logical. Chris Weaver '98 VTR ---------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 10:31:43 1999 X-Sender: mtroutma@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 10:31:20 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, vfr@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: Cold Fingers My fingers have thawed out enough to type. I am using a thin pair of fleece gloves inserted into my leather gauntlets. The rest of my body (besides my toes and a quarter sized spot on my neck) stayed toasty today. My toes - I can warm up by dipping them below the brake and shift levers on the VFR. Once the bike has warmed up, it churns out good heat in that area. The balaclava blocks all but a little tiny spot on my neck. Now the fingers.....two glove sets don't work. What is next - heated grips? Someone suggested battery powered hunting gloves - anyone try this? Any other ideas, besides hippopotamus gloves? I think it was in the mid 20s this AM. I don't plan on riding in anything below 20 degrees. Too much black ice around here (DC-Metro Area). ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr '97 Honda VFR 750 Eat right. Stay fit. Die anyway. From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 10:39:41 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 07:39:22 -0800 (PST) From: Hugh Caldwell To: Troutman cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, vfr@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Cold Fingers My Hein Gericke gloves come with rain mittens that help a lot when the weather is cold. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Hugh A. Caldwell BeGeek Simpleton#9 ZR750-C2 VFR800FI ---------------------------------------------------------------- From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 10:41:40 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 10:41:04 -0500 (EST) From: Kirk Roy X-Sender: kirk@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Cold Fingers Organization: Northern Virginia Internet Access Cooperative On Wed, 1 Dec 1999, Troutman wrote: > Now the fingers.....two glove sets don't work. What is next - heated > grips? Someone suggested battery powered hunting gloves - anyone try > this? Any other ideas, besides hippopotamus gloves? What's wrong with "hippopotamus" gloves? I love the fact that I can wear my summer gloves and still have warm hands. Without the bar covers ("hippopotamus" gloves) this would not be possible, even with heated grips. There are also heated gloves... Another option is mittens. Let your fingers stay together and keep each other warm. With equivalent insulation a mitten will be warmer than a glove. I've got some mittens that I can hardly wear they're so warm (and this is on a naked bike with no hand protection whatsoever). Kirk From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 10:50:51 1999 From: Jeannette.Zell@XXXXXX X-Lotus-FromDomain: SPPT To: Troutman cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, vfr@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 10:44:57 -0500 Subject: Re: Cold Fingers Content-Disposition: inline Electric gloves with wires down the fingers have worked for me. It's the only thing that keeps my hands toasty. I'm not sure if you're trying to stay away from electrics or not, but if not, try: http://www.gerbing.com The coldest I've ridden in was the Polar Bear ride one New Year's. It was 28 degrees, I think, and I'm not sure what the wind chill was. It was COLD. When the temps dip below 28 I don't think I'll be out. LOL - Jeannette '86 VFR 700 F2 http://www.geocities.com/motorcity/speedway/3081 Troutman on 12/01/99 10:31:20 AM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, vfr@XXXXXX cc: Subject: Cold Fingers My fingers have thawed out enough to type. I am using a thin pair of fleece gloves inserted into my leather gauntlets. The rest of my body (besides my toes and a quarter sized spot on my neck) stayed toasty today. My toes - I can warm up by dipping them below the brake and shift levers on the VFR. Once the bike has warmed up, it churns out good heat in that area. The balaclava blocks all but a little tiny spot on my neck. Now the fingers.....two glove sets don't work. What is next - heated grips? Someone suggested battery powered hunting gloves - anyone try this? Any other ideas, besides hippopotamus gloves? I think it was in the mid 20s this AM. I don't plan on riding in anything below 20 degrees. Too much black ice around here (DC-Metro Area). ___________________________________________ Mike Troutman http://www.troutman.org/vfr '97 Honda VFR 750 Eat right. Stay fit. Die anyway. From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 10:54:28 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: Re: racing classes Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 10:55:18 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Well... not any more Chris. I put the Woodcraft clip-ons on and it now has to be turned a little more aggressively, but holds its line really well. :) Still fairly flickable but much smoother and tracks much better. New tires will help this also. Danny '99 VFR '99 SV ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 1999 9:59 AM Subject: Re: racing classes > Since I'm feeling talkative, I'll throw my two cents in even though I don't > race... > > Brian wrote: > I think the SV is easier to ride as well... even against my little RR. > > I had a chance to ride Danny's SV not long ago. I'm sure Brian and the > others are right here - the SV certainly dumped into turns like a champ. > Its one failing, it seemed to me, was that it took a lot of attention to > keep it on its line in a corner. That quick steering has a price, I guess. > The RR will probably feel a lot more planted while railing around those > corners, and may make up for the torque advantage of the SV in the same > places. I'm no expert, but it seems logical. From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 11:06:29 1999 From: "Brad Faas" To: "Danny Thompson" , Subject: RE: beginning racing costs Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:06:16 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 -----Original Message----- From: Danny Thompson [mailto:dthompso1@XXXXXX] >AAAUUGGGHH! This makes me cringe as I write it all down. To those who have >already been there / done that, have I missed anything? - Back protector. Wouldn't catch me on a track without one. ~ $150. I don't know how good the "built-in" back protectors in some leathers are, since my leathers don't have one. - Race school. ~ $130, unless you corner work two weekends, in which case you get a discount. If you put down an advance $60 deposit, you save even more. I took my school for $90. - Fairing? U.S. SVs come naked, right? I know you mentioned the belly pan, so I'm assuming you'll need some fairing to attach the belly pan to. I could be wrong here; I don't know how the SVs are being setup for this. ~$400 - Not really required, but stuff I know I bought the first race weekend: Good tire gauge, stopwatch, numbers, and a couple colors of duct tape: ~$90. Brad 99 CBR600 F4 88 FZR400 From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 11:10:55 1999 From: jnewman@XXXXXX To: Troutman Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:11:19 -0500 Subject: Re: Cold Fingers CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I've got a pair of expedition gloves from Eastern Mountain Sports that I use for everything. The gloves come in two parts, the outer 3 ply gortex shell, and the inner "windblock" fleece glove. Usually the windblock fleece is sufficient for riding in temps down to about 40deg. Anything below that, & I shove the gloves in their gortex shell. When used as a set, I have yet to suffer from cold fingers... -John N. 88 FZR 400 Date sent: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 10:31:20 -0500 To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX, vfr@XXXXXX From: Troutman Subject: Cold Fingers > My fingers have thawed out enough to type. > > I am using a thin pair of fleece gloves inserted into my leather > gauntlets. The rest of my body (besides my toes and a quarter sized spot > on my neck) stayed toasty today. > > My toes - I can warm up by dipping them below the brake and shift levers on > the VFR. Once the bike has warmed up, it churns out good heat in that > area. The balaclava blocks all but a little tiny spot on my neck. > > Now the fingers.....two glove sets don't work. What is next - heated > grips? Someone suggested battery powered hunting gloves - anyone try > this? Any other ideas, besides hippopotamus gloves? > > I think it was in the mid 20s this AM. I don't plan on riding in anything > below 20 degrees. Too much black ice around here (DC-Metro Area). > > ___________________________________________ > Mike Troutman > http://www.troutman.org/vfr > > '97 Honda VFR 750 > > Eat right. Stay fit. Die anyway. > From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 11:16:54 1999 Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 11:22:42 -0400 From: Randy Moran Reply-To: Randy Moran Organization: TRW X-Accept-Language: en CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: beginning racing costs Yes, Danny, you are forgetting the frontal lobotomy. A very expensive initial outlay, but the result is well worth it. Helps all the rest of it go down like a spoonful of sugar. You're welcome. Randy Moran > > Danny wrote, Along list of expensive parts, then: > AAAUUGGGHH! This makes me cringe as I write it all down. To those who have > already been there / done that, have I missed anything? > > Danny > '99 VFR > '99 SV From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 11:17:43 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: Re: beginning racing costs Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:18:30 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Thanks for filling in some of the gaps Brad. Yep, back protector for sure. I have signed up for race school already, but there is only one weekend to cornerwork beforehand this year, hopefully they will credit me for one from last year. I have the Buell fairing (bug shield) and I am going to call that enough, I'll find a way to attach the belly pan. I will need the number plate also. Still adding.... Danny '99 VFR '99 SV > - Back protector. snip.... > > - Race school snip > > - Fairing? snip > > - Not really required, but stuff I know I bought the first race weekend: > Good tire gauge, stopwatch, numbers, and a couple colors of duct tape: ~$90. > > > Brad From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 11:26:18 1999 From: "Nassif, Joe" To: , , "Troutman" Subject: Re: Cold Fingers Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 09:25:10 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2014.211 Mike Troutman asked; > Any other ideas, besides hippopotamus gloves? Yeah, Widder electric gloves. They work wonders (as I've mentioned before.....;-) Joe Nassif SFNM From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 11:29:28 1999 Content-return: allowed Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 11:26:47 -0500 From: "Horstman, Tracy L" Subject: RE: Cold Fingers To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX There's something to be said about those hippo gloves - my hands were great today. I have these gloves although they say they are thin - they seem thick to me and the gauntlet goes way up my arm. With my electric liner from Gerbing under my Kilimanjaro, there's enough heat that escapes out my sleeves to warm up my hands in those gloves. I wear only my jeans under my rain pants, 1 pair of socks and my hikers. Could have rode all day. Can't wait for it to actually get cold. :) Tracy Horstman '99 Kawasaki Concours GPNEHI COG #3104A FiTE '99 From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 11:38:31 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 08:20:05 -0800 (PST) From: Leon Begeman Reply-To: mrider@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Cold Fingers To: Troutman , dc-cycles@XXXXXX, vfr@XXXXXX I recently bought a pair of trigger-finger mittens at Manassas Honda for about $40. They have a thumb, index finger and mitten for the other three fingers. Quite warm; I wore them yesterday. This morning I wore Widder electric gloves (about $100). Toasty. Leon. --- Troutman wrote: > My fingers have thawed out enough to type. > > I am using a thin pair of fleece gloves inserted > into my leather > gauntlets. The rest of my body (besides my toes and > a quarter sized spot > on my neck) stayed toasty today. > > My toes - I can warm up by dipping them below the > brake and shift levers on > the VFR. Once the bike has warmed up, it churns out > good heat in that > area. The balaclava blocks all but a little tiny > spot on my neck. > > Now the fingers.....two glove sets don't work. What > is next - heated > grips? Someone suggested battery powered hunting > gloves - anyone try > this? Any other ideas, besides hippopotamus gloves? > > I think it was in the mid 20s this AM. I don't plan > on riding in anything > below 20 degrees. Too much black ice around here > (DC-Metro Area). > > ___________________________________________ > Mike Troutman > http://www.troutman.org/vfr > > '97 Honda VFR 750 > > Eat right. Stay fit. Die anyway. > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 11:39:40 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: Re: beginning racing costs Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:40:32 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 ----- Original Message ----- From: Randy Moran Cc: Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 1999 10:22 AM Subject: Re: beginning racing costs > Yes, Danny, you are forgetting the frontal lobotomy. A very expensive initial > outlay, but the result is well worth it. Helps all the rest of it go down like > a spoonful of sugar. snip... Ohhh, maybe I should have done that to begin with. Maybe that explains a lot about some of the other racers I've met. :) From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 12:38:15 1999 From: JinnSinn@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 12:37:49 EST Subject: cracks in tires To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX ok - I've asked this before about the little cracks appearing on my at least two-year-old tires-that-were-on-the-bike-when-I-bought-it ...... and quite a few people suggested I wait until AFTER winter to get new tires (something about excessive wear int he winter) ... BUT yesterday I took a look at the back tire and there is a good inch-wide strip now that is filled with tiny little cracks. It's not going to pop or wnything is it??? ;D but seriously. how "cracked" can they get before I'm endangering myself? Marcy From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 12:40:13 1999 From: JinnSinn@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 12:39:17 EST Subject: Re: Cold Fingers To: mike@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX, vfr@XXXXXX if you're worried about ice you shouldn't ride below 32 degrees (freezing point) :D I've3 heard nothing but good things about heated grips...may have to get some myself. Marcy In a message dated 12/1/99 10:38:16 AM, mike@XXXXXX writes: << I think it was in the mid 20s this AM. I don't plan on riding in anything below 20 degrees. Too much black ice around here (DC-Metro Area). >> From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 12:40:54 1999 From: JinnSinn@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 12:40:11 EST Subject: Re: Cold Fingers To: kirk@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX ski mittens in particular will keep you NICE and warm In a message dated 12/1/99 10:48:11 AM, kirk@XXXXXX writes: << Another option is mittens. >> From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 12:53:40 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 12:53:04 EST Subject: Re: beginning racing costs To: dthompso1@XXXXXX CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/1/99 10:09:56 AM Eastern Standard Time, dthompso1@XXXXXX writes: > belly catch pan (new rule) ~$? You'll want to get the SharkSkinz SV full bodywork set. Yes, WERA and CCS both will be requiring catch pans next year. http://www.sharkskinz.com/Suzuki/suzprod.html#l I hate to type this but... 3061 1-PC. UPPER 305.00 3062 1-PC. LOWER 215.00 3063 TAIL 195.00 3064 FRONT FENDER 95.00 3065 BRACKET KIT FOR ABOVE 105.00 You could use the stock tail though and save a few bucks. - Bri From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 13:01:12 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: Re: cracks in tires Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 13:00:46 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Marcy, Do the smart thing and get yourself a new tire(s). It is not worth the risk of a blowout mid-turn. Danny '99 VFR '99 SV snip... >...BUT yesterday I took a look at the > back tire and there is a good inch-wide strip now that is filled with tiny > little cracks. It's not going to pop or wnything is it??? > ;D > but seriously. how "cracked" can they get before I'm endangering myself? > > Marcy From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 13:27:09 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 13:28:43 -0500 From: "Horkster" Reply-To: To: , Troutman Subject: Re: Cold Fingers ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Troutman Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 10:31:20 -0500 > The rest of my body (besides my toes and a quarter sized spot >on my neck) stayed toasty today. Ditto that. Hands got a little cold for me, everything else a-ok. I haven't even put in the electric pants liners into my Gerbing Ultimate Suit yet, running with just the jacket liner. If it gets much colder than this morning (28 degrees) then I'll consider it. I only ran the jacket thermostat on half power today. Sweet. >My toes - I can warm up by dipping them below the brake and shift > levers on the VFR. The Connie is also pretty good at keeping the feet nice and warm. No complaints here. :) >Now the fingers.....two glove sets don't work. Polypropylene glove liners are the best I've found - even better than those white metallic things Todd will probably tell you about. They look like blue wool. I've gotta go find my pair, they are AWOL at home somewhere. > What is next - heated grips? I've heard these work well. > Someone suggested battery powered hunting gloves? I've heard that these don't. > Any other ideas, besides hippopotamus gloves? MX-type hand guards, to keep the wind off? I've been toying with making a set out of some empty plastic jugs we've got at home here. At this point of the year, warmth wins out over style. > I think it was in the mid 20s this AM. I don't plan on riding in > anything below 20 degrees. Too much black ice around here > (DC-Metro Area). For me, it all depends on road conditions. The Connie is too expensive to drop, so I won't be riding if there's any ice. Cold days and clear roads are not a problem. I can do cold. :) Ride warm, ride safe! Horkster -- Dale Horstman (The Horkster) horkster@XXXXXX Dale City, VA, USA, Earth 1998 Concours - His - BugSlayer II - VA Plate: BGSLYR 1999 Concours - Hers - Grape Nehi - VA Plate: GPNEHI "I started riding away from home in order to feel the sweet sensation of missing it at the same time I love leaving it." - Melissa Holbrook Pierson "The Perfect Vehicle" -- From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 13:39:04 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 13:41:11 -0500 From: "Horkster" Reply-To: To: , Subject: Re: Cold Fingers ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: JinnSinn@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 12:39:17 EST >if you're worried about ice you shouldn't ride below 32 degrees (freezing >point) :D Respectfully disagree here. I'm worried about ice - but I don't care what the temperature is. If it hasn't rained/snowed in a few days, then the roads will generally be clear enough to ride. There may be small patches of ice here and there (water mains breaking, people farting around washing cars, etc. etc. but you can generally see these & avoid them beforehand. If the roads are clear, I'm riding. Period! :) Horkster -- Dale Horstman (The Horkster) horkster@XXXXXX Dale City, VA, USA, Earth 1998 Concours - His - BugSlayer II - VA Plate: BGSLYR 1999 Concours - Hers - Grape Nehi - VA Plate: GPNEHI "I started riding away from home in order to feel the sweet sensation of missing it at the same time I love leaving it." - Melissa Holbrook Pierson "The Perfect Vehicle" -- From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 13:47:35 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 10:45:49 -0800 (PST) From: Leon Begeman Reply-To: mrider@XXXXXX Subject: Re: cracks in tires To: DCCycles I've ridden bikes with pretty terrible looking tires. I've never had a motorcycle tire come apart while riding it. I did have a trailer tire come apart due to old age once. First the tread came off, then the road wore through the cords and the tire went flat. The biggest problem I notice with old tires is that they don't have much traction. As the tire gets old it gets harder, hard rubber doesn't stick to the road as well as fresh new soft rubber. Ride more, then the tires wear out before the cracks appear. Leon. --- JinnSinn@XXXXXX wrote: > ok - I've asked this before about the little cracks > appearing on my at least > two-year-old > tires-that-were-on-the-bike-when-I-bought-it ...... > and quite a > few people suggested I wait until AFTER winter to > get new tires (something > about excessive wear int he winter) ... BUT > yesterday I took a look at the > back tire and there is a good inch-wide strip now > that is filled with tiny > little cracks. It's not going to pop or wnything is > it??? > ;D > but seriously. how "cracked" can they get before I'm > endangering myself? > > Marcy > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 13:48:10 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 13:49:54 -0500 From: "Horkster" Reply-To: To: CC: "DC Cycles" Subject: Re: Cold Fingers ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Leon Begeman >I recently bought a pair of trigger-finger mittens at >Manassas Honda for about $40. They have a thumb, >index finger and mitten for the other three fingers. >Quite warm; I wore them yesterday. Leon, Olympia waterproofs, right? I've had a pair of these for a couple of years now. They hold up well, are still pretty warm. Got a little bit overwhelmed this morning, so I've gotta find those polyprop liners! They are a little on the bulky side, so it's harder to manipulate the small controls (turn signal/headlight, etc. etc.) They are too warm to wear if the temps are 40+ degrees, though! :) Horkster -- Dale Horstman (The Horkster) horkster@XXXXXX Dale City, VA, USA, Earth 1998 Concours - His - BugSlayer II - VA Plate: BGSLYR 1999 Concours - Hers - Grape Nehi - VA Plate: GPNEHI "I started riding away from home in order to feel the sweet sensation of missing it at the same time I love leaving it." - Melissa Holbrook Pierson "The Perfect Vehicle" -- From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 14:21:00 1999 From: "Jay St. Peter" To: Subject: Re: beginning racing costs Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 14:30:11 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 I think my racing costs were less than anyone elses. I think I had a total of about $3700 into everything after my first weekend. Bike ('93 F2 that has been race thrashed its whole life) $2500 Tires $320 Used rashed leathers (nice Vansons with a really nice built in back protector) $300 Misc parts/wire/tools (borrowed some stuff for the first couple of weekends) $200 Cheap Boots $25 Race School $120 First Weekend Race Fees $100 License $100 Of course, $400/weekend after that * 8 weekends/year is another $3200. Plus a couple of non-recurring parts costs (I needed a new battery and clutch throughout the year). The $400/weekend includes recurring parts like brakes (I bought some take-offs 90% good for $5/pair), oil etc. My maintenance: Tuned up the bike before the season Changed the oil every 2-3 weekends Rode smooth (or slow) and got a season out of a set of tires. Many weekends I would come only for Saturday. I would run the middlewieght and heavyweight GT/Solo 20 races and leave. This is $100 for 40 laps + practice. Sunday sprint races cost the same per race but are 8 laps each. So, if I ran 2 middleweight and 1 heavyweight on Sunday cost would be @$130 for 24 laps. My one budgetary mistake was the endurance race. That was very expensive, and the entire strategy used was flawed. I had to get new bodywork (which Brian M. crashed after 7 laps), new tires (split by the racers). The mistake was getting 4 riders. I essentially rode 2 stints during the race. I was hoping for serious track-time, but wound up just like riding 2 Solo 20s on a saturday. I still think endurance racing can be the best bang-for-the-buck racing around, you just have to use the right strategy: Get in shape, ride very long stints, minimize number of riders to maximize track time. Jay St. Peter From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 15:12:45 1999 From: GOINGRIDING@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 15:12:00 EST Subject: Re: beginning racing costs To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX ""AAAUUGGGHH! This makes me cringe as I write it all down. To those who have already been there / done that, have I missed anything?"" I didnt see anything about front and rear stands (no kickstands on racers) at about $250 per set. Also I didnt see anything about fresh fluids ($50 including filter, oil, brake fluid, coolant). Hmm, what else? You havent even touched the stuff that comes a little later. ~$100 for the race school and another $100 for the license. Then yur talkin $35-$50 PER race during the season. Oh yeah, what about your replacement tires? You covered replacement clutch and brake levers but what about cracked and broken plastics, bent wheels, destroyed gas tanks, etc. You get the picture. I spent nearly $7500 and I only ran in 6 races all season (in Florida). From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 15:21:23 1999 From: "Jay St. Peter" To: , Cc: Subject: Re: beginning racing costs Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 15:30:45 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Brian Wrote: You'll want to get the SharkSkinz SV full bodywork set. Yes, WERA and CCS both will be requiring catch pans next year. Actually on the endurance weekend (where catch pans were already required), I saw a bunch of people who had made pans out of sheet metal. They bent it up and pop-riveted it together. Of course they mostly attached it to their old style lowers on the inside. I suspect most of the vintage racers will have to take this route though. I'm sure someone will make a catch pan lower for the SV w/brackets. I would recommend sharkskinz if you get full bodywork though. I have 2 sets of multi-tech and they are pretty crappy (even before Brian M. crashes them). The Sharkskinz I've seen are real nice (but twice the $). Jay From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 15:59:19 1999 From: JinnSinn@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 15:58:55 EST Subject: Re: cracks in tires To: motofranz@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX oooo baby - show me the money! LOL anybody riding on cracked tires? :D just email me some cyber cash... Marcy In a message dated 12/1/99 3:26:04 PM, motofranz@XXXXXX writes: << I Wouldn't even THINK about riding a bike with tires that have cracks in them.A car maybe. Tell you what you worry me.....I'll give you the money for new tires !!!!! >> From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 16:09:20 1999 From: McKeithen@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 16:08:08 EST Subject: Re: Cold Fingers To: mike@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX I rode from Charles Town WV to Harrisburg Pa today with a pair of polartec gloves inside Army surplus mittens. My hands stayed toasty warm. I find that when the temps drop down much below the forties, only mittens of some type will do the job. Bob McKeithen From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 16:18:11 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 16:17:25 EST Subject: Re: beginning racing costs To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/1/99 3:22:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, GOINGRIDING@XXXXXX writes: > Then yur talkin $35-$50 PER race during > the season. $180 buys a Solo20 and 3 races on Sun (The FZR races D-Super, F2, and Vintage6) > Oh yeah, what about your replacement tires? Lightweight bikes don't eat tires like the big bikes (no wheel spin). I ran a whole season and only had to replace my tires once. This is running slicks, but the DOTs should be about the same in terms of wear and tear. The faster you get, the more tire you'll use... I'll prob go three sets next year at least... $290 a set from JB. > You covered > replacement clutch and brake levers but what about cracked and broken > plastics, bent wheels, destroyed gas tanks, etc. You get the picture. > I spent nearly $7500 and I only ran in 6 races all season (in Florida). And the lesson here is: Don't crash :) Finishing top-10 every week during the second half of the season, no crashes... except during *practice*. ::sigh:: I need to stop that. Anyway, even with that the repair bill wasn't horrible, 60mph lowside at summit, T1. - Brian From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 16:18:28 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 13:18:24 -0800 (PST) From: Hugh Caldwell To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: beginning racing costs Egads! And to think I was actually considering it. I think I'll just pick up a heroin habit, I hear it's less addictive and cheaper. I'll even save on the cost of the frontal lobotomy. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Hugh A. Caldwell BeGeek Simpleton#9 ZR750-C2 VFR800FI ---------------------------------------------------------------- From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 16:54:54 1999 From: christopher.a.weaver@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 16:06:08 -0500 Subject: Re: beginning racing costs To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Content-disposition: inline X-Lotus-FromDomain: AMERICAS-US@INTL Danny wrote: ""AAAUUGGGHH! This makes me cringe as I write it all down. To those who have already been there / done that, have I missed anything?"" -- Are YSR and Pocketbike racing starting to look good yet? ;^) Chris Weaver '98 VTR ---------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 17:49:19 1999 From: "Jay St. Peter" To: Cc: Subject: Re: beginning racing costs Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 17:42:21 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 > Are YSR and Pocketbike racing starting to look good yet? ;^) I'd like to try that sometime. If I could get 1/2 the thrills on one of those I'd go for it. I just have a feeling it will be like hopping on a 5HP go-cart after driving a Ferrari :). I think it'll just feed the addiction. Jay St. Peter have taken to playing the lottery for the 1 in a million chance I will be able to afford more racing next year. From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 18:08:54 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: Re: beginning racing costs Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 18:09:49 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Can you say soapbox derby? :) Danny '99 VFR '99 SV ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 1999 4:06 PM Subject: Re: beginning racing costs > Danny wrote: > ""AAAUUGGGHH! This makes me cringe as I write it all down. To those who > have > already been there / done that, have I missed anything?"" > -- > > Are YSR and Pocketbike racing starting to look good yet? ;^) > > Chris Weaver > '98 VTR > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to > which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged > material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or > taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or > entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received > this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any > computer. > > From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 18:16:08 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 13:11:10 -0800 (PST) From: Leon Begeman Reply-To: mrider@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Cold Fingers To: horkster@XXXXXX, mrider@XXXXXX Cc: DC Cycles Yes, those are the ones. They do seem to be useful only in a very narrow temperature range. They're too hot above 45 or so, and not warm enough below 35. They aren't much more bulky than the Widder gloves. I got them because I want the Widders to last longer. Different subject. Would you be interested in building a couple of pair of the cheap Walmart Projector lights as described on the LDRider list this morning? I'm thinking about getting a set for the ZX6. At that price, I might even put one of those on the new moped, the low beam on it only lasted 15 miles. Enhanced alternator output has it's downsides as well as advantages. --- Horkster wrote: > Olympia waterproofs, right? I've had a pair of > these > for a couple of years now. They hold up well, are > still > pretty warm. Got a little bit overwhelmed this > morning, > so I've gotta find those polyprop liners! > > They are a little on the bulky side, so it's harder > to > manipulate the small controls (turn > signal/headlight, etc. > etc.) They are too warm to wear if the temps are > 40+ > degrees, though! :) > > Horkster > > -- > Dale Horstman (The Horkster) > horkster@XXXXXX > Dale City, VA, USA, Earth > > 1998 Concours - His - BugSlayer II - VA Plate: > BGSLYR > 1999 Concours - Hers - Grape Nehi - VA Plate: GPNEHI > > "I started riding away from home in order to feel > the sweet > sensation of missing it at the same time I love > leaving it." > - Melissa Holbrook Pierson "The Perfect Vehicle" > -- > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 19:53:52 1999 From: FGrefe@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 19:52:58 EST Subject: Re: cheap Walmart projector lights To: mriderleon@XXXXXX CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/1/99 6:23:14 PM Eastern Standard Time, mriderleon@XXXXXX writes: > > Different subject. Would you be interested in > building a couple of pair of the cheap Walmart > Projector lights as described on the LDRider list this > morning? Could you post this info to the list. I tried getting on the LDRider list once, but it didn't work. Is it a restricted list? Thanks, Fred Grefe GTS1000 From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 21:33:05 1999 Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 18:32:29 -0800 (PST) From: "Collin T. Fagan" Subject: RAcing stuff To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX For the SV and other naked bikes, there was discussion of using a one piece lower only with brackets... works well for Buell riders, and looks pretty decent. Not mentioned, but the BEST investment in my opinion is ZIP TIES and DUCT TAPE!!! Of course the spending can be what you want it to be... Personally, I could care less how ugly the bike is (and mine was really ugly!!) A lot of crash damage can be repaied with zip ties, safety wire, duct tape, and cardboard!! YES, Cardboard!! lol Unless of course you're Jeff Ozman and freak at the first smudge of dirt ;-) if you buy a decent fiberglass bodywork (like the sharkskinz), wonders can be performed with fiberglass repair kits...again, don't expect pretty, but in my opinion I'd rather spend my money on entry fees and tires ... You can pick up a decent race bike for 3-5K ... I got my 97 GSXR for $3500, $400 for a top of the line rotary steering damper, and $50 on a set of take offs, and I was racing...of course, I rapidly got faster, and takeoffs were no longer cutting it, so I started going to one set of tires per weekend. (750's are hard on tires, and I am even worse with my dirt bike background...I slide the back end around a lot...) After the first couple of weekends, I went to an aftermarket shock, but mostly because I got a deal on it rather than absolutely needing it...Luckily, the valving in the GSXR forks is very nearly identical to gold valves by racetech, so I bypassed that... All said and done, this season I was running about $700 or so per weekend... but $340 of it or more was tires...next season will be o Bridgestones at $290/set... Did I mention ZIP TIES AND DUCT TAPE!! lol Collin PS: GoingRiding... glad to hear you got some racing in down in FL.. you'll have to tell us more.... ===== Collin T. Fagan DC-Cycles Racing http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Track/9350/ Proudly sponsored by: Fast Lane Cycles (www.fastlanecycles.com) Dixie Cycles Bell Helmets, and EBC Brakes __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 22:07:53 1999 Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 22:07:22 -0500 From: Dale Horstman To: mrider@XXXXXX CC: DC Cycles Subject: Re: Cold Fingers Leon Begeman wrote: > > Different subject. Would you be interested in > building a couple of pair of the cheap Walmart > Projector lights as described on the LDRider list this > morning? I'm thinking about getting a set for the > ZX6. Dunno yet, I'd have to see them first. Sounded too good to be true. Any rules in VA about mounting aux lights? I've been toying with mounting them to the Rifle windshield base (above the stock headlamp) - Don't know if it's legal or not, but it sure would be effective... Dale From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 22:15:21 1999 Reply-To: From: "RMeyer" To: Subject: RE: Cold Fingers Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 22:15:03 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 > > My fingers have thawed out enough to type. > Now the fingers.....two glove sets don't work. What is next - heated > grips? Someone suggested battery powered hunting gloves - anyone try > this? Any other ideas, besides hippopotamus gloves? I've been very pleased with Widder 'lectrics, and have heard good things about Gerbings, too. No regular glove is going to keep you as warm as heated gloves. If you're fingers start to get cold in a regular glove, there's nothing you can do. But Widder gloves ADD heat, and can warm up your fingers even after they've gotten cold. FWIW, I find a pair of thin glove liners under the Widders helps distribute the heat more evenly. I've also tried heated grip covers and Widders. I prefer the gloves. The grip covers are very warm, but concentrate their heat on the palms of your hands, while the backs of your hands and fingers are more exposed to the wind. Widder gloves apply the heat to the backs of the hand and fingers. Also, if you're covering the brake with one or two fingers, heated grips don't help those fingers at all. In The Wind, Bob Meyer 1992 ST1100 (Red STag), STOC #1157 ============================================= People are more violently opposed to fur than leather, because it's safer to pick on rich women than biker gangs. From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 22:17:51 1999 From: MOTO748@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 22:17:09 EST Subject: Racing stuff To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Hey, Collin I heard that. You really can't say a whole lot about me since by the end of the season my bike was more tape than plastic. p.s. I think SV's should be thrown in with Heavy Weight twins, I'm tired of being the guy with a knife in a gunfight. Jeff Ozmen DUC 748 W.E.R.A. # 86 CCS # 268 From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 22:21:02 1999 Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 22:19:12 -0800 From: JEM Broga Subject: Head Count For Racers, Looking for Jeff Ozmen To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Lately the list has been talking a lot about racing and it got me wondering how many listers are going to race this year, what bikes they are on and what series they plan to run. Seems like the momentum continues to build - Also, Jeff O. are you out there still? Are you racing in 2000, or are you selling your stock in yellow duct tape and taking a break? :^) Jonathan From dc-cycles-request Wed Dec 1 22:42:25 1999 From: MOTO748@XXXXXX Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 22:41:49 EST Subject: Head count To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Jonathan, Here. Present, and Yes I am racing in the next millinium. I'll be in the area until around June. Ducati? Absolutely, it wouldn't be racing if I wasn't throwing away large amounts of money. I'll also be racing the YZF. Jeff Ozmen rolling mass of duct tape(yellow) # 86 From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 01:21:20 1999 From: daniel_ex250@XXXXXX To: "vfr 800" Cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: FS: Share of Tire Changer Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 09:24:00 GMT I'm interested in this, could you give me all the details? Thanks -Daniel On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 17:53:19 PST, you wrote: |>Due to me leaving the DC area for the land west, (Kalifornia), I am = selling=20 |>my share of the DC cycles tire changer collective. |> |>$30 obo. |> |>Thanks!! (Yes, you will ALL be missed) |> |>John |> |> |>______________________________________________________ |>Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 01:28:36 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 01:27:50 EST Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers, Looking for Jeff Ozmen To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/1/99 10:27:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbroga@XXXXXX writes: > Lately the list has been talking a lot about racing and it got me wondering > how many listers are going to race this year, what bikes they are on and > what series they plan to run WERA, every race, FZR400RR with a FZR400 backup/rain bike... If I can beat Randy I might win a couple this year :) To anyone going racing next season: I have a decent sized truck and trailer (Prob upgrading both for next year, actually). Brad has first dibs as a traveling partner, but as he's been bitten by the bug and bought a truck... I might have room on any given weekend. I do not like to travel without a partner, so there's a good chance there will be space (Even with Brad going... I'm going to get a big truck and a 6x10 trailer for next year, we can prob haul 4 bikes and 3 people). Traveling alone is generally a bad idea as you end up with Murphy as a partner... driving home with a broken ankle or collarbone REALLY bites. - Brian From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 06:53:33 1999 Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 03:53:29 -0800 (PST) From: "Louis F. Caplan" Subject: Re: Cold Fingers -> Aux lights To: DC Cycles Guy Young (COG guru) and I did some investigation into the Virginia inspection code. He was originally told that you could not have auxillary lights above the main headlight. But I was told it was okay. What we found was for cars, it specifies that the aux lamps have to be under the headlights, but is silent on the issue for motorcycles. Thus we assumed silence = acceptance in this case. Louis --- Dale Horstman wrote: > Leon Begeman wrote: > > > > Different subject. Would you be interested in > > building a couple of pair of the cheap Walmart > > Projector lights as described on the LDRider list this > > morning? I'm thinking about getting a set for the > > ZX6. > > Dunno yet, I'd have to see them first. Sounded too > good to be true. > > Any rules in VA about mounting aux lights? I've been > toying with mounting them to the Rifle windshield base > (above the stock headlamp) - Don't know if it's legal > or not, but it sure would be effective... > > Dale > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 07:28:16 1999 From: "Brad Faas" To: "JEM Broga" , Subject: RE: Head Count For Racers, Looking for Jeff Ozmen Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 07:28:13 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 FZR 400, Every WERA race I can sneak it into. :-) Thinking about heading to one of the CCS events in Daytona just to say "I raced there". Brad -----Original Message----- From: JEM Broga [mailto:jbroga@XXXXXX] Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 1:19 AM To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Head Count For Racers, Looking for Jeff Ozmen Lately the list has been talking a lot about racing and it got me wondering how many listers are going to race this year, what bikes they are on and what series they plan to run. Seems like the momentum continues to build - Also, Jeff O. are you out there still? Are you racing in 2000, or are you selling your stock in yellow duct tape and taking a break? :^) Jonathan From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 07:44:40 1999 Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 07:36:26 -0500 From: Bill Huson To: "Louis F. Caplan" CC: DC Cycles Subject: Re: Cold Fingers -> Aux lights I seem to recall the maximum number of lights on front is six. I also note that H-D sells quartz aux lamps to be mounted on the nerf bar which would raise the total frontal lights on a dresser/bagger to eight. In the US the "passing lamps" on an H-D only work on low beam (???) This is a DOT stunt that I plan to override as soon as I can figure out the wiring system, which apparently was designed by Lucas Electrics. Bill Louis F. Caplan wrote: > Guy Young (COG guru) and I did some investigation into the Virginia inspection > code. He was originally told that you could not have auxillary lights above > the main headlight. But I was told it was okay. What we found was for cars, > it specifies that the aux lamps have to be under the headlights, but is silent > on the issue for motorcycles. Thus we assumed silence = acceptance in this > case. > > Louis > > --- Dale Horstman wrote: > > Leon Begeman wrote: > > > > > > Different subject. Would you be interested in > > > building a couple of pair of the cheap Walmart > > > Projector lights as described on the LDRider list this > > > morning? I'm thinking about getting a set for the > > > ZX6. > > > > Dunno yet, I'd have to see them first. Sounded too > > good to be true. > > > > Any rules in VA about mounting aux lights? I've been > > toying with mounting them to the Rifle windshield base > > (above the stock headlamp) - Don't know if it's legal > > or not, but it sure would be effective... > > > > Dale > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. > Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 09:52:27 1999 From: jnewman@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 09:52:53 -0500 Subject: Proposed WERA rules 2000 Regarding the race classes discussion, here are the proposed rules for the WERA lightweight class. It doesn't look like there are any special rules regarding the SV. Anyway, it looks like the rules are going to pan out like this: D Super - FZR's to 430cc, Twins to 700cc, SV's performance indexed to SS rules with slicks. F2 - FZR's to 565cc, all twins (including the SV) to 700cc LW Twins - no change so that does allow the SV to 750cc if anyone wants to go for it :-) At this point this is the fairest to all concerned that we could come up with. It won't please everyone and is not cast in stone for another few days so feel free to pick away at it and point out any problems. As noted above this is not cast in stone so pick apart if necessary :-) Sean P. Clarke WERA Motorcycle Roadracing From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 10:34:15 1999 Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 07:34:03 -0800 (PST) From: Hugh Caldwell To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Dec 4 & 5 Washington DC Area Ride - It's a Go! (fwd) ---------------------------------------------------------------- Hugh A. Caldwell BeGeek Simpleton#9 ZR750-C2 VFR800FI ---------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 1 Dec 1999 20:08:22 -0500 From: David M2 Thompson To: vfr@XXXXXX Cc: Hugh Caldwell , Brad Hogue , Ned Suesse , steve Price , mike Troutman Subject: Dec 4 & 5 Washington DC Area Ride - It's a Go! I just checked the Washington DC area forecast - Highs in the low 60s & no threat of rain. Definitely rideable weather! The Route sheet is loaded, the map is printed & the bike goes on the trailer in the morning (after sweeping ~ 6" snow off). So far, the riders are: Steve Price ('87 VFR) Hugh Caldwell (VFR 800) Brad Hogue (F4) Ned Suesse (F3) As stated earlier, the start point is at the entrance to the Montgomery County Fairgrounds, just off Chestnut St. in Gaithersburg. Meet ~ 9:30 Leave @ 10:00 after greetings & earplug insertion ceremony. The Route is mostly backroads - Northwest to Catoctin Mtn, South to Harpers Ferry, South then Northeast to Point of Rocks, East to Lily Ponds/Thurston Rd, then return to Gaithersburg. ~180 miles. Routing Ad libs are welcome. If any other listers are interested, just show up! David "RoutemeiSTer" Thompson AMA# 504560 STOC# 840 Current STable 90 Suzuki DR350S 91 Honda ST1100 94 Honda VFR From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 11:42:01 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: gruntled.office.aol.com: cerberus owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 11:41:20 -0500 From: Dave Paper X-Sender: cerberus@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Dec 4 & 5 Washington DC Area Ride - It's a Go! (fwd) Greetings, Nice route. Since the subject says Dec 4th & 5th, does this mean the same ride will happen both days? Thanks, -dave -- Dave Paper AOL Database Operations cerberus@XXXXXX MCSE = Must Consult Someone Experienced --Jay From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 12:42:43 1999 From: "Dave Cross" To: Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 12:51:20 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 The doctor says my collar bone will be very susceptible to a re-break for the next year due to the way in which the pieces are coming together, but . . . . . . if I do make it back onto the track next season I will be running by 53hp, stock pipe and jetting, FZR400 in the expert class, trying very hard to avoid finishing last. I had a best finish of 4th in the amatuers at Summit Last season, I think I ride pretty well (by this I mean smooth, not neccesarily fast), and will be very glad to get out of the amatuer ranks and avoid the hazards riding amoungst such varying skill levels. Dave Cross From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 12:42:24 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 12:40:57 EST Subject: Re: Proposed WERA rules 2000 To: jnewman@XXXXXX CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Huh? What do you mean? The first line you posted lists the special rule for the SV. It's restricted to SuperSport Rules - that means you can't bore it (not even 1mm) and you can't modify internal engine parts. They also raised us FZR guys to 430cc, which allows 2mm pistons (was 1mm this year). It puts everything at about even footing. My FZR400RR is being seriously built, and should have like 75hp at the rear when I'm done with it - a SuperSport SV will have about 73hp (but more torque). - Brian In a message dated 12/2/99 9:59:58 AM Eastern Standard Time, jnewman@XXXXXX writes: > Regarding the race classes discussion, here are the > proposed rules for the WERA lightweight class. It > doesn't look like there are any special rules regarding the > SV. > > > Anyway, it looks like the rules are going to pan out like this: > > D Super - FZR's to 430cc, Twins to 700cc, SV's performance indexed to SS > rules with slicks. From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 13:35:31 1999 From: "Custer, Carl" To: "'DCCy'" Cc: "'mriderleon@XXXXXX'" Subject: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 13:34:53 -0500 Leon Begeman asked: Different subject. Would you be interested in building a couple of pair of the cheap Walmart Projector lights as described on the LDRider list this morning? I'm thinking about getting a set for the ZX6. At that price, I might even put one of those on the new moped, the low beam on it only lasted 15 miles. Enhanced alternator output has it's downsides as well as advantages." FWIW: Picture at: http://members.aol.com/sabmagpatch/fog.jpg Downside is the cost ~$20 for the pair I bought a set of "driving lights" at Wally Mart on sale last summer for $17. Plus these use the H-3 bulbs, ~$4.00; cheaper than the $9.00 ones Gaget Dan is cobbling up. The cheap chrome will rust before Dan's heavy duty galvanized holders but the kit included a switch and wire. For those commuting through the winter, I recommend a set of driving-fog lights. Not so much for lighting up the road but for making yourself more conspicuous. There's no question about you "not being seen" when the BDC starts to cut you off. That's when the big honking tooters convince them to keep in their place. http://members.tripod.com/~v65_magna/sos_99/sat_lunch2.jpg (Those are not the $17 driving lights) Carl in Bethesda From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 13:56:53 1999 Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 13:55 -0500 From: "Tom Zell" To: "Custer; Carl" , "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" Cc: "mriderleon@XXXXXX" Subject: Re:LDRider: was... Aux lights now... Headlights Hey... now that we're on the subject of lighting... I'm going to convert my old VFR from a single headlight to a dual headlight configuration and was planning on either trying to locate a stock GSXR setup (probably less hassle) or make my own (more fun). Question is though... if I go the completely fabricated route what can I use for the lights? I believe that they have to be DOT approved to be used on the highway but I've seen guys get away with using projector beam type setups. I can always get my VFR through inspection... that's no big deal. However, I don't want to run into any problems with "the law" if I happen to get stuck riding it in the dark (I usually try to ride during daylight hours). Any ideas? Thanks, Tom '86 VFR750 From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 14:08:12 1999 Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 14:01:14 -0500 From: Todd Peer Subject: RE: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford To: "Custer, Carl" , "'DCCy'" Cc: mriderleon@XXXXXX X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Those look like the tenzo auxilliories. My freind John Kozyn used these on his 86VFR750. What I'd like to find out is how to get a couple of strings of Christmas lights on, converting over from a 12v system. Now THAT couldn't be missed by a BDC. Todd > -----Original Message----- > From: Custer, Carl [mailto:Carl.Custer@XXXXXX] > > Leon Begeman asked: Different subject. Would you be interested > in building > a couple of pair of the cheap Walmart Projector lights as described on the > LDRider list this morning? > > > That's when the big honking tooters > convince them to > keep in their place. > http://members.tripod.com/~v65_magna/sos_99/sat_lunch2.jpg > (Those are not the $17 driving lights) > > Carl in Bethesda > From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 14:28:25 1999 From: Steve_Beck@XXXXXX X-Lotus-FromDomain: ISI To: Todd Peer cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 14:25:40 -0500 Subject: RE: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford Content-Disposition: inline The easiest way to do that would be to use a 12V to 120V inverter and just plug them right into the inverter. Or you could rewire the string for 12 volts. For example if the string had 50 lights wired in series to work off of 120 volts then you could simply rewire it so that each set of 5 bulbs receives 12 volts. Steve From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 14:37:26 1999 From: Mark Petty To: "'DCCy'" Subject: RE: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 14:36:31 -0500 Years ago, a friend of mine rigged up two strings of christmas lights on his vw wagon (what the hell where they called, anyway?) and strung them through his roof rack. They went on and off with his turn signals. He also had christmas lights in every room of his apartment that blinked whenever the phone rang. Year round. -Mark -----Original Message----- From: Todd Peer [mailto:todd.b.peer@XXXXXX] Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 2:01 PM To: Custer, Carl; 'DCCy' Cc: mriderleon@XXXXXX Subject: RE: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford Those look like the tenzo auxilliories. My freind John Kozyn used these on his 86VFR750. What I'd like to find out is how to get a couple of strings of Christmas lights on, converting over from a 12v system. Now THAT couldn't be missed by a BDC. Todd > -----Original Message----- > From: Custer, Carl [mailto:Carl.Custer@XXXXXX] > > Leon Begeman asked: Different subject. Would you be interested > in building > a couple of pair of the cheap Walmart Projector lights as described on the > LDRider list this morning? > > > That's when the big honking tooters > convince them to > keep in their place. > http://members.tripod.com/~v65_magna/sos_99/sat_lunch2.jpg > (Those are not the $17 driving lights) > > Carl in Bethesda > From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 14:43:29 1999 From: Cedric Bernescut Reply-To: "bernescut@XXXXXX" To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" Subject: modulators ?, was RE: aux lights Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 14:38:13 -0500 Organization: NCEA Interesting idea, maybe one of those little singing Christmas trees? Seriously, has anyone out there used one of the headlight modulators? I understand that it gives good visibility without breaking the law (the light is never completely off, so it doesn't count as "flashing") I read at one point that one of the manufacturers had terrible quality control and the units failed regularly, but others are supposedly good. Any thoughts? Cedric 1996 CBR600F3 AMA 663626 Annandale, VA "I am having an out of money experience." What I'd like to find out is how to get a couple of strings of Christmas lights on, converting over from a 12v system. Now THAT couldn't be missed by a BDC. From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 15:51:03 1999 Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:50:38 -0500 (EST) From: Kirk Roy X-Sender: kirk@XXXXXX To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" Subject: Re: modulators ?, was RE: aux lights Organization: Northern Virginia Internet Access Cooperative On Thu, 2 Dec 1999, Cedric Bernescut wrote: > Seriously, has anyone out there used one of the headlight modulators? I wouldn't have it working if you come out on a group ride though, very irritating! Kirk From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 16:41:05 1999 Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 13:40:58 -0800 (PST) From: Hugh Caldwell To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Dec 4 & 5 Routes - No! There's a second one (fwd) ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 16:26:49 -0500 From: David M2 Thompson To: Hugh Caldwell Subject: Re: Dec 4 & 5 Routes - No! There's a second one Hugh, I waited 'til the weather outlook was confirmed & did a Port Royal Loop last night for the second run. I don't care which we do first. Regards, Dave Thompson ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 11:41:20 -0500 From: Dave Paper To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Dec 4 & 5 Washington DC Area Ride - It's a Go! (fwd) Greetings, Nice route. Since the subject says Dec 4th & 5th, does this mean the same ride will happen both days? Thanks, -dave -- Dave Paper AOL Database Operations cerberus@XXXXXX MCSE = Must Consult Someone Experienced --Jay From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 16:52:59 1999 Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 16:46:47 -0500 From: Todd Peer Subject: RE: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford To: "'DCCy'" X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Vanagan(sp) or Westfalia, or mini-Bus. Cool cages, as far as cages go, IMHO only! T > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Petty [mailto:mark.petty@XXXXXX] > Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 2:37 PM > To: 'DCCy' > Subject: RE: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford > > > Years ago, a friend of mine rigged up two strings of christmas > lights on his > vw wagon (what the hell where they called, anyway?) From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 17:14:22 1999 Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 17:07:05 -0500 From: Todd Peer Subject: RE: Dec 4 & 5 Routes - No! There's a second one (fwd) To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-MSMail-priority: Normal > > MCSE = Must Consult Someone Experienced --Jay > HAHAHAHA, I like it! Todd From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 17:19:30 1999 From: "Brian McCoy" To: Subject: Crashing Bodywork.. & racing startup.. Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:12:53 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 LOL Jay.. Man.. that bodywork made it more than 7 laps into the race.. *grin* 2 people rode the bike before I ever go on it.. :P And I thought it held up REALLY well in the 2 crashes I put it through.. well, ok, the 2nd high-side in T1~T2 kinda tore it up a bit. Other associated racing costs.. $10 for Motrin (buy the Economy size!) Spare gloves/helmet (for when Collin.. er, I mean a friend crashes theirs and still wants to race). TOOLS! you don't need enough to tear apart the engine at the track, but a good set is a must at the track. You'll need to see to personal comfort aswell.. an EZ-up for shade, chairs, coolers, food and drinks for each weekend.. and when you become addicted, travel costs to other tracks, hotels. Don't forget the insurance premium (if your current carrier doesn't cover.. there are 'racing' insurance places that cover for like $250/year). ppssstt... I've got an RS125 FS.. who wants to start racing.. ;) LOL Brian McCoy (displaced DC-Cycles Racing team co-founder, and current MMI student.. yeeehaw!) From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 17:27:51 1999 Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 14:05:10 -0800 (PST) From: Leon Begeman Reply-To: mrider@XXXXXX Subject: RE: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford To: Todd Peer , DCCycles --- Todd Peer wrote: > > What I'd like to find out is how to get a couple of > strings of Christmas > lights on, converting over from a 12v system. Now > THAT couldn't be missed > by a BDC. > The little ones are usually wired in series. I think the bulbs are about 6 volts each. Wire two or three in series, and put strings of them in parallel. You ought to be able to put up as many lights as needed. Perhaps the local GWRRA chapter can also help with this project. Leon. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 17:29:49 1999 X-Authentication-Warning: gruntled.office.aol.com: cerberus owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 17:29:12 -0500 From: Dave Paper X-Sender: cerberus@XXXXXX To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Dec 4 & 5 Routes - No! There's a second one (fwd) On Thu, 2 Dec 1999, Todd Peer wrote: > > > > MCSE = Must Consult Someone Experienced --Jay > > > > HAHAHAHA, I like it! Yeah, well I've been around a few, and that's all I ever hear them say "let me check the MS knowledge base, I don't know how to fix this" "ummm if you have to do that, then how did you manage to get your MCSE certification?" "......." Looks like I may make the ride on Sunday. Thanks for the info! -dave 84 shadow 700 -- Dave Paper AOL Database Operations cerberus@XXXXXX MCSE = Must Consult Someone Experienced --Jay From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 17:40:54 1999 X-Originating-IP: [204.193.255.42] From: "Doug Allis" To: todd.b.peer@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Off subject: VW Bus; was Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 14:40:18 PST Hey folks... I'm not that old (37) but if memory serves and you are talking about the 1960s van like thing it was a "VW Micro-Bus". It WAS cheap, but it seldom had airconditioning and its air cooled engine was not really that reliable. The Vanagon came in the late 70s, so it could have been that too. Westfalia builds fiberglass pop-up tops for lots of vans. Back to motorcycles (sort of) : I remember getting one Harley in the back of a Vanagon. The bike was a real piece of sh... err... work; made in Italy it was always breaking down. The chain oiler leaked all over the van. >From: Todd Peer >To: "'DCCy'" >Subject: RE: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford >Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 16:46:47 -0500 > >Vanagan(sp) or Westfalia, or mini-Bus. Cool cages, as far as cages go, >IMHO >only! > >T > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Mark Petty [mailto:mark.petty@XXXXXX] > > Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 2:37 PM > > To: 'DCCy' > > Subject: RE: LDRider: Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford > > > > > > Years ago, a friend of mine rigged up two strings of christmas > > lights on his > > vw wagon (what the hell where they called, anyway?) > > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 18:15:22 1999 From: "Jon Schumer" To: Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 18:14:20 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 I'll be racing part time next year. Looking forward to passing a few SV's on my outdated Hawk. 8^) Jon From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 18:43:47 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: Re: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 18:43:30 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Is this where we SV racers (OK, want-to-be SV racers) chime in about wake up, your dreaming or something to that extent? :) Danny '99 VFR '99 SV Warrenton, VA ----- Original Message ----- From: Jon Schumer To: Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 1:14 PM Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers > I'll be racing part time next year. Looking forward to passing a few SV's > on my outdated Hawk. 8^) > > Jon > > > From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 21:14:56 1999 Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 18:14:53 -0800 (PST) From: Sean Sullivan Subject: Re: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers To: Danny Thompson , dc-cycles@XXXXXX Trash talking already. Looks like 2000 will be a good year for the spectators! Sean Sullivan --- Danny Thompson wrote: > Is this where we SV racers (OK, want-to-be SV > racers) chime in about wake > up, your dreaming or something to that extent? :) > Danny > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jon Schumer > > I'll be racing part time next year. Looking > forward to passing a few SV's > > on my outdated Hawk. 8^) > > > > Jon > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 21:24:19 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: Re: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers Date: Thu, 2 Dec 1999 21:22:01 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 That was not trash talking...I asked a simple question. :) '99 VFR '99 SV Warrenton, VA ----- Original Message ----- From: Sean Sullivan To: Danny Thompson ; Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 9:14 PM Subject: Re: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers > Trash talking already. Looks like 2000 will be a > good year for the spectators! > Sean Sullivan > > --- Danny Thompson wrote: > > Is this where we SV racers (OK, want-to-be SV > > racers) chime in about wake > > up, your dreaming or something to that extent? :) > > Danny > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Jon Schumer > > > I'll be racing part time next year. Looking > > forward to passing a few SV's > > > on my outdated Hawk. 8^) > > > > > > Jon From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 21:33:13 1999 Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 21:29:32 -0500 From: Todd Peer Subject: RE: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers To: Sean Sullivan , Danny Thompson , dc-cycles@XXXXXX X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-MSMail-priority: Normal What are you talking about? You're playing deep in turn #1. T > -----Original Message----- > From: Sean Sullivan [mailto:redsullivan@XXXXXX] > Sent: Thursday, December 02, 1999 9:15 PM > To: Danny Thompson; dc-cycles@XXXXXX > Subject: Re: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers > > > Trash talking already. Looks like 2000 will be a > good year for the spectators! > Sean Sullivan > > --- Danny Thompson wrote: > > Is this where we SV racers (OK, want-to-be SV > > racers) chime in about wake > > up, your dreaming or something to that extent? :) > > Danny > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Jon Schumer > > > I'll be racing part time next year. Looking > > forward to passing a few SV's > > > on my outdated Hawk. 8^) > > > > > > Jon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. > Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com > From dc-cycles-request Thu Dec 2 22:26:17 1999 Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 22:28:21 -0500 From: Tim Morrow X-Accept-Language: en To: DC Cycles Subject: Race Survey and Virginia Driving Lights Race Survey: George Vensko and I will be contesting all 16 Mid-Atlantic CCS events this year. Flamin' Duc Racing will be fielding two old, antiquated, vintage, 2-valve, air-cooled, steel- framed, straight-rate shock linkage, DOT-tired Ducati 750SS's in most of the Lightweight classes. We intend to get our skinny old-guy butts seriously whipped by the fast kids on the blocks on their SV650's and have fun doing it. I'll also be racing LW Sportsman on my new(!) 1996 Kawi Ninja 500 bought from Ted Johnson (#855 last year). Oh yeah, we'll both be on white plates this year. Virginia Driving Lights: Had PIAA 910's on my ST1100; no Va inspection problems. VRTP: Teaching the last two weekends of the Loudon Campus MRC:RSS classes this weekend and next. If you're riding west on Route 7, drop by and say "hello"! Tim -- MSF #21769 1997 Triumph T509 Speed Triple - Street Flamin' Duc Racing: CCS #432 WERA #430 1992 Ducati 750SS 1996 Kawasaki Ninja 500 -- A member of the Morrow family in Herndon, Virginia E-mail respondants: change the number ‘2’ in the reply-to address to the word “to”. The correct reply-to address should read ‘tomorrow erols.com’. From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 00:40:34 1999 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 00:40:01 -0500 From: "Gil Nissley" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX X-Originating-IP: [140.185.62.14] Subject: Re: Cold Fingers -> Aux lights On Thu, 02 Dec 1999 07:36:26 -0500 Bill Huson wrote: In the US the "passing lamps" >on an H-D only work on low beam (???) This is a DOT stunt that I plan to override >as soon as I can figure out the wiring system, which apparently was designed by >Lucas Electrics. Rewiring them was discussed alot on re.moto.harley. Check out the site www.world-wide-glide.com and search around. They used to have info on this. The BuellBoy Emeritus. dynaryder@XXXXXX HSB#38D GATB#1121 <*> '98 Dyna Convertible '80 CB750F Sign up for your FREE Email at http://mail.chek.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 00:50:22 1999 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 00:50:55 -0500 From: "Gil Nissley" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX X-Originating-IP: [140.185.62.14] Subject: Re:LDRider: was... Aux lights now... Headlights On Thu, 02 Dec 1999 13:55 -0500 Tom Zell wrote: >I'm going to convert my old VFR from a single headlight to a dual headlight >configuration and was planning on either trying to locate a stock GSXR setup >(probably less hassle) or make my own (more fun). Question is though... if I go >the completely fabricated route what can I use for the lights? Check that streetfighters site that was posted a few months ago. Also,I've seen several dual-light conversions advertised in the back of _Superbike_ and _Performance Bikes_ and seem to recall seeing one for older VFR's. You could also fit racing bodywork and cut it for lights from another bike. I'd recommend CBR900RR's. Best set of headlights I've ever used. The BuellBoy Emeritus. dynaryder@XXXXXX HSB#38D GATB#1121 <*> '98 Dyna Convertible '80 CB750F Sign up for your FREE Email at http://mail.chek.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 01:28:30 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 01:27:56 EST Subject: Re: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/2/99 6:48:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, dthompso1@XXXXXX writes: > Is this where we SV racers (OK, want-to-be SV racers) chime in about wake > up, your dreaming or something to that extent? :) I figure a SuperStock SV, well tuned, is looking at 74hp. I *will* have a 400 putting out that much power next year. It's gonna cost me, but I'm going to do it. I am not going to get motored by any Stinkin' SVs. Muhahahahahahahaha ::ahem:: Sorry, got carried away. :) - Bri From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 06:13:04 1999 From: Boiade@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 06:12:11 EST Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers To: fzr_mofo@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX Hi Jon: After sorting out this season's minor reliability problem, the RD may be back on the track next year. Ciao, Fred From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 08:21:48 1999 From: "Brad Faas" To: , Subject: RE: Head Count For Racers Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 08:21:19 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 From: Boiade@XXXXXX [mailto:Boiade@XXXXXX] >After sorting out this season's minor reliability problem, the RD may be back >on the track next year. Geez, I guess all those things that went wrong with my bike the first weekend weren't really problems - if one defines showering the front straight with pieces of one's engine as "minor reliability problems". :-) BTW, I just realized this is the most the list has talked about racing since I've been on it. AND IT'S WINTER!! Acck, I can't wait for next season. :-) Brad From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 09:32:09 1999 From: Boiade@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 09:31:21 EST Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers To: f4rider@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/3/99 8:21:43 AM Eastern Standard Time, f4rider@XXXXXX writes: << if one defines showering the front straight with pieces of one's engine as "minor reliability problems". :-) >> Well, maybe not so minor.:-) Ciao, Fred From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 09:54:32 1999 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 06:54:01 -0800 (PST) From: Hugh Caldwell To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers Well I've signed up for the MARRC school, But I don't have a race bike yet and the costs are starting to frighten me. ---------------------------------------------------------------- Hugh A. Caldwell BeGeek Simpleton#9 ZR750-C2 VFR800FI ---------------------------------------------------------------- From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 10:34:52 1999 From: "Jay St. Peter" To: Cc: Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 10:44:28 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 -- Hugh Wrote: Well I've signed up for the MARRC school, But I don't have a race bike yet and the costs are starting to frighten me. Might be a good time for me to mention my F2 for sale. Ready to go (except that it is now winterized) and extremely reliable. $2K. Just e-mail me for more details if you're interested. New house and new baby are forcing me into poverty (racing is chump change compared to daycare). Don't think I'll be able to race next year. Hopefully I'll be able to swing a few track days. Jay St. Peter From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 10:49:15 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 10:48:05 EST Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers To: twg@XXXXXX CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/3/99 10:03:13 AM Eastern Standard Time, twg@XXXXXX writes: > Well I've signed up for the MARRC school, But I don't > have a race bike yet and the costs are starting to frighten me. Hugh - If you don't get a racebike by then, or are still deciding, you're more than welcome to use my FZR400 for the school. - Brian From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 10:53:11 1999 From: Jon Broga To: "'dc-cycles@XXXXXX'" Subject: Getting started/money/the bug Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 10:54:16 -0500 I can't speak for your financial position, and I'm not trying to be some patron saint of roadracing, but it really doesn't have to be that bad. Ya know how women can never remember the pain of childbirth, else they would never do it again? Maybe I've got a similair type of memory problem, but this past summer doesn't seem like it was that bad. I think what happens is your priorities shift. I ended up giving up stuff to finance my racing, specifically my street bike, a beautifully set up Superhawk. But I didn't notice or care because I was having so much fun. Simply going out for pizza made me think twice about cash, but it was so worth it because the weekends were adding a whole new demension to life, one that street riding or eating out would never bring. You'll never ever look back and tell your grandkids, or whoever, about the steak you once had, or how cable TV really made life great. And there aren't any trophy's waiting at the end of street rides. It will change your attitude towards money, and you'll value things in terms of racing. If you are like a lot of guys, once you get the hang of it you'll have trouble picturing a life without it. Its just that fun. Jonathan Broga Century Pool Management 703.923.7946 x112 -----Original Message----- From: Hugh Caldwell To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Date: Friday, December 03, 1999 10:08 AM Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers > > Well I've signed up for the MARRC school, But I don't >have a race bike yet and the costs are starting to frighten me. > >---------------------------------------------------------------- >Hugh A. Caldwell BeGeek Simpleton#9 ZR750-C2 VFR800FI >---------------------------------------------------------------- > > From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 10:55:57 1999 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 10:55:48 -0500 (EST) From: Kirk Roy X-Sender: kirk@XXXXXX To: DC-Cycles Mailing List Subject: Re: Head Count For Racers Organization: Northern Virginia Internet Access Cooperative On Fri, 3 Dec 1999, Jay St. Peter wrote: > New house and new baby are forcing me into poverty That sucks, ask me how I know! :) > (racing is chump change compared to daycare). Indeed, let's see, we were paying over $900/mo for 2 kids (not infants) in non-commercial (home) day care. Ouch! A single infant in commercial day care is even more than that... All these $$$s for racing has confirmed my decision not to do the road racing thing. Enduros are a lot cheaper... Kirk 2000 Kawasaki KLX300 (http://dirtrider.net/planetklx/) 1998 Honda VTR1000 (http://members.nova.org/~kirk/Kirk1.jpg) From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 11:32:32 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: Re: Getting started/money/the bug Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 11:33:46 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Hugh wrote: > > Well I've signed up for the MARRC school, But I don't > >have a race bike yet and the costs are starting to frighten me. and Jon responded: > snip... I think what happens is > your priorities shift. I ended up giving up stuff to finance my racing, > specifically my street bike, a beautifully set up Superhawk. But I didn't > notice or care because I was having so much fun. Simply going out for pizza > made me think twice about cash, but it was so worth it because the weekends > were adding a whole new demension to life, one that street riding or eating > out would never bring... snip I haven't even been on a track before (well, Mid-Ohio parade laps don't count) and I already understand what Jon is saying. I could spend less money to get started (I am for some things except protective gear / safety) and you could also. I didn't have to have the clip-ons, rearsets, suspension upgrades (which I have decided to go cheap on for now) or new tires, it was a choice. I figure I would do it about halfway extra's wise for now. Next year may be different. Technically all you NEED is: gloves, boots, helmet, leathers, a prepped motorcycle, good enough tires for race school, $$ to pay for race school, license, entry fees, and gas. Everything else (that I can think of off the top of my head) you could get by without. Danny '99 VFR '99 SV From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 12:00:37 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 11:59:58 EST Subject: Re: Getting started/money/the bug To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX I couldn't have said it better myself :) While my financial position makes it a bit easier for me, I have no regrets about any of the money I spent this year racing. I've met some of the greatest people, had some of the best times, and that's something that can never be taken away. I also will not be the 40 year old guy who has some sort of mental collapse because he never did any of the things he wanted to when he was younger (Ok, So I'll be the 40 year old guy who's psyched because he now qualifies for CCS Formula40... but that's WAY better). Realistically, you can get by spending a little less money - here's a basic rundown of what you *need* to go racing next year: Bike: $2 - $3k, fully prepped racebike with spares. Stand: $130 (If the bike didn't come with one) Leathers: $500 - $1000 Boots: $150 - $250 Gloves: $100 Race School: $100 (I think?) Someone who already races to give you a hand: Free That's all I had at the beginning of this year. The last one is the key, but as everyone on the list has seen, there are quite a few of us willing to help out. Beyond that, you will spend $200 a weekend, and need to buy oil, gas, and occasionally tires. You might invest in some tools ($100 - ??), extra spares ($200), a canopy ($179), etc.. but those are not *needed* to start racing. Between CCS and WERA, you can race 8 times at Summit a year - for many people, that's plenty. If you don't own a truck and for some reason can't hitch a ride for your bike to the track, U-Haul will rent you a pickup for $20 a day. You can buy a $400 utility trailer at Home Depot that a honda civic could pull, and will get you to Summit every time without problems. If you *really* get hooked, THEN you're going to spend some money. But to just get your feet wet, it's not cheap, but it's not undoable. - Brian In a message dated 12/3/99 11:01:10 AM Eastern Standard Time, JON@XXXXXX writes: > You'll never ever look back and tell your grandkids, > or whoever, about the steak you once had, or how cable TV really made life > great. And there aren't any trophy's waiting at the end of street rides. It > will change your attitude towards money, and you'll value things in terms of > racing. If you are like a lot of guys, once you get the hang of it you'll > have trouble picturing a life without it. Its just that fun. From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 12:35:20 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: racing licenses Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 12:36:20 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Can you race CCS with a WERA license (or vise-versa)? Danny '99 VFR '99 SV From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 12:43:57 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: , Subject: bt 58's vs D207 gp's Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 12:45:06 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 How do these two tires compare on the track? Thanks, Danny '99 VFR '99 SV From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 12:56:52 1999 From: Boiade@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 12:56:14 EST Subject: Sunday Ride To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Thinking about a Sunday ride in Maryland. Would like to start out at the Borders in Bowie. (Intersection of route 50 and 301) From DC take 50 East from Beltway, exit on 301 South and turn right at the first light (there is an Exxon Station). Borders is in the shopping area. Would like to leave at about 1:30- 2:00 and end up in Annapolis at about 4. Ciao, Fred From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 13:02:38 1999 From: "Brad Faas" To: "Danny Thompson" , Subject: RE: racing licenses Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 13:02:17 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Nope. They want your money. :-) But having one license does qualify you for the right to *purchase* the other's license. (I.e., you don't have to take seperate race schools) Brad -----Original Message----- From: Danny Thompson [mailto:dthompso1@XXXXXX] Can you race CCS with a WERA license (or vise-versa)? Danny '99 VFR '99 SV From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 13:15:36 1999 X-Originating-IP: [208.197.3.43] From: "Donnie Biser" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Dec. 4th and 5th ride. Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 10:14:48 PST Hey guys I might be a little slow with this, but what are the ride plans again? I live right off rt.77 in catoctin mt. so this is definitely in my neck o' the woods so to speak. Thanks in advance. Donnie 95 rf600 ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 13:37:10 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 13:36:30 EST Subject: Re: racing licenses To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/3/99 12:42:57 PM Eastern Standard Time, dthompso1@XXXXXX writes: > Can you race CCS with a WERA license (or vise-versa)? No, you have to buy both each year. - Brian From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 13:53:05 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: , Subject: re-springing a shock Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 13:54:16 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 I have a heavier spring to put on a GSXR shock. Can anyone tell me how to do this. Is it very difficult? TIA Danny '99 VFR '99 SV From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 14:08:50 1999 Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 14:05 -0500 From: "Tom Zell" To: "Danny Thompson" , "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" Subject: Re:re-springing a shock Have no idea about the GSXR's setup but my FOX requires a hydraulic press to remove the spring. Tom '86 VFR750 ____________________Reply Separator____________________ Subject: re-springing a shock Author: dthompso1@XXXXXX (Danny Thompson) Date: 12/03/1999 1:54 PM I have a heavier spring to put on a GSXR shock. Can anyone tell me how to do this. Is it very difficult? TIA Danny '99 VFR '99 SV From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 14:09:06 1999 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 11:08:58 -0800 (PST) From: Hugh Caldwell To: Donnie Biser cc: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: Dec. 4th and 5th ride. This is a ride being setup by David Thompson of the VFR list who is gonna be in town over the weekend and is bringing his bike. The basic plan is to meet at the entrance of the Montgomery County Fairgrounds at 9:30 am on Saturday and/or Sunday and go riding. Dave has apparently setup routes for both days. On Fri, 3 Dec 1999, Donnie Biser wrote: > > > Hey guys I might be a little slow with this, but what are the ride plans > again? > I live right off rt.77 in catoctin mt. so this is definitely in my neck o' > the woods so to speak. > > Thanks in advance. > > Donnie > 95 rf600 > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > ---------------------------------------------------------------- Hugh A. Caldwell BeGeek Simpleton#9 ZR750-C2 VFR800FI ---------------------------------------------------------------- From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 14:34:03 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 14:33:27 EST Subject: Re: re-springing a shock To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/3/99 2:15:11 PM Eastern Standard Time, TZell@XXXXXX writes: > Have no idea about the GSXR's setup but my FOX requires a hydraulic press to > remove the spring. You can avoid this by getting one of the "spring compressor" things from sears... it's this thing that attaches to the spring in 4 places, then you ratchet it down to hold the spring in a compressed state for insertion/removal. - Brian From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 14:41:04 1999 From: "Jay St. Peter" To: , Cc: Subject: Re:re-springing a shock Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 14:50:38 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 I think they make spring compressors for motorcycle shock springs similar to those use on cages. I'd personally send it somewhere and get it done. I have seen a pickup spring come free of the compressor and it is pretty scary. Kinda made me paranoid of springs I guess. Jay St. Peter From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 15:31:13 1999 From: MotorLE@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 15:30:30 EST Subject: Re: Off subject: VW Bus; was Cheap, tiny, aux lights you can afford To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX >Back to motorcycles (sort of) : I remember getting one Harley in the back of >a Vanagon. The bike was a real piece of sh... err... work; made in Italy it >was always breaking down. The chain oiler leaked all over the van. Now THAT sure triggered a moto memory....About 15 years ago, I and my then-boyfriend drove 380 miles from Berkeley to Pasadena (CA) to pick up a Norton Commando and a BSA Lightening. We took his '72 VW bus, which had a bench that turned into a bed and a little sink with some cupboards already taking up space inside. We did manage to get both bikes in by taking off the front wheels and fenders, but part of the BSA stuck out so that we couldn't quite close the side door and had to tie it shut with rope. The van had had a little trouble going over the hills on Interstate 5 that separate the central valley from the LA basin, so we decided to take Highway 101 instead, which is nearly 100 miles longer, but more flat. In Santa Barbara we picked up a hitchhiker who happened to want to go back to Berkeley. Not too far north from Santa Barbara there are some hills, which had never seemed big to me before, but in that van with three people and the bikes, our top speed was 15 mph. We probably wouldn't have made it at all if we had gone the shorter route. The hitchhiker even had the nerve to complain, and that was after we bought some food for him, the ungrateful deadhead! The weird thing is that if someone offered to sell me an old WV bus, I would probably want it. Colleen From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 16:14:09 1999 Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 16:11:36 -0500 Subject: new tire From: "Charles L. Rosen" CC: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Picked up a big shard of metal in my pirelli dragon. Still had about half it life left too. Any recs where locally to get a new one? I used to go to Art's place. -charles ---------- >From: "Jay St. Peter" >To: , >Cc: >Subject: Re:re-springing a shock >Date: Fri, Dec 3, 1999, 5:50 PM > > > I think they make spring compressors for motorcycle shock springs similar to > those use on cages. I'd personally send it somewhere and get it done. I > have seen a pickup spring come free of the compressor and it is pretty > scary. Kinda made me paranoid of springs I guess. > > Jay St. Peter > From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 16:52:38 1999 From: "Jon Schumer" To: Subject: Re: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 16:51:46 -0000 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 > Is this where we SV racers (OK, want-to-be SV racers) chime in about wake > up, your dreaming or something to that extent? :) > Danny Don't let those words come back to haunt you. 8^P Sounds like we're gonna have a fun racing season in the lightweight class. Jon From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 17:13:59 1999 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 17:15:41 -0500 From: "Horkster" Reply-To: To: "DC Cycles" Subject: Beemer sighting last night Caught up to and rode with somebody on a Beemer oil-head through Clifton, VA after work last night. Big hard bags. Rider wore a FirstGear Kilimanjaro jacket. We talked briefly at the light, I said "I was glad I wasn't the only nut out here tonight!" Anyone on the list? Just curious. That's a fun way to ride home. Horkster -- Dale Horstman (The Horkster) horkster@XXXXXX Dale City, VA, USA, Earth 1998 Concours - His - BugSlayer II - VA Plate: BGSLYR 1999 Concours - Hers - Grape Nehi - VA Plate: GPNEHI "I started riding away from home in order to feel the sweet sensation of missing it at the same time I love leaving it." - Melissa Holbrook Pierson "The Perfect Vehicle" -- From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 19:55:13 1999 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 16:55:09 -0800 (PST) From: "Collin T. Fagan" Subject: Re: head count, racing stuff, and tires.... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX ===== Collin T. Fagan DC-Cycles Racing http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Track/9350/ Proudly sponsored by: Fast Lane Cycles (www.fastlanecycles.com) Dixie Cycles Bell Helmets, and EBC Brakes __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 20:10:15 1999 Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 17:10:11 -0800 (PST) From: "Collin T. Fagan" Subject: Re: head count, racing stuff, tires, and some parts FS..... To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX oops.. sorry bout the blank message prior to this one..... I'll be racing a full schedule next year... jsut not sure what that schedule will be. Most likely I will run all GLRRA events (a good excuse for you LD types to get out an about :-)) and some of the Fasttrax endurance races at Nelson Ledges (But I have to find a kidney donor first!!). I do plan to run one or two Summit Rounds so I can see all my friends too!! And currently, the plan is to attempt qualifying for the AMA 750 SS race at Mid-Ohio...may not even make it to the grid, but I'll have a grand ole time trying (assuming money doesn't become an issue) Danny, I don't know about that particular model of Bridgestone, but I have seen nothing but good results from the BT-56 SS's (I think that's what the race tire was called this year.. the new one whatever its name is...) every bit the same grip as 207's, longer life, and $50 cheaper! I honestly would have switched to them this season had I not been in a points battle... I didn't want to waste a weekend figuring out new suspension settings for the tires... As for the GSXR Spring, give Fast Lane a call or your local shop out there if you're in good with them.. they can probably swap the spring over about 50 times faster than you can with much less frustration.. and I really couldn't imagine it costing more thand $15 or $20 if that much even... Also, I wish I had known you were getting a set of clipons as well... I have a spare set of Woodcrafts in the shed.. although they may be too big of a diameter... I would rather have gotten the Vortex ones myself, but the woodcraft that Rick got me weren't too bad... Also, Mike Frye(??) of Superbike Accessories has them at an awesome price: $135 delivered!! www.sbaccess.com he's got great prices on lots of stuff and free shipping... (I'm not sponsored by him or anything.. just like him and his business) Also, I have about 20 sprockets, about half of which are new, between 41 and 47 teeth... they were for a 93-97 GSXR-11 which tells me they will most likely also fit a 93-05 GSXR 750... not sure what the setup is on the SV's, but we can measure bolt patterns if you're interested... I'm sure I could be talked out of them at a much cheaper than new rate :) I also have some miscellaneous parts for said gixers in the shed.. I don't have one, so I wouldn't mind seeing them go! some clutch parts, stock rearsets, linkage rods, 3 pistons (no idea where the 4th went :)), an ignition advancer still in plastic wrap (fits RF900s and 93-95 GSXR750, 93-97 GSXR1100, and a fwe others I believe)... If anyone's interested, let me know... just taking up valuable shelf space! Collin ===== Collin T. Fagan DC-Cycles Racing http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Track/9350/ Proudly sponsored by: Fast Lane Cycles (www.fastlanecycles.com) Dixie Cycles Bell Helmets, and EBC Brakes __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. All in one place. Yahoo! Shopping: http://shopping.yahoo.com From dc-cycles-request Fri Dec 3 22:05:21 1999 From: SBave@XXXXXX Date: Fri, 3 Dec 1999 22:05:04 EST Subject: Sunday ride To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Due to the nice weather this weekend I've decided to have an informal ride this Sunday around the Winchester, VA and surrounding area of W.VA. Meet at 10:00 am at the McDonald's at the intersection of Rt. 50 and 340 (VA)...from the DC area continue west on Rt. 50 past Middleburg..it is about 8-10 miles east of Winchester on the right. Length to be determined by group and weather (approx. 120-160 mi). Have 4 interested so far so it's a go...let me know if you have any questions.. Steve Broadstreet SBave@XXXXXX From dc-cycles-request Sat Dec 4 05:50:18 1999 From: "Danny Thompson" To: Subject: Re: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999 05:49:46 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Subject: Re: passing SV's, was Head Count For Racers > > Is this where we SV racers (OK, want-to-be SV racers) chime in about wake > > up, your dreaming or something to that extent? :) > > Danny > > Don't let those words come back to haunt you. 8^P > Sounds like we're gonna have a fun racing season in the lightweight class. > > Jon (In best innocent tone...)I don't know what your talking about? What words? Haunt? I never said anything....:) If racing is half as fun as I think it will be, it will definately be a fun season! Danny '99 VFR '99 SV Warrenton, VA From dc-cycles-request Sat Dec 4 07:41:20 1999 From: Gawthrop@XXXXXX Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999 07:40:43 EST Subject: Kawasaki Zephyr 500 for sale To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX CC: frank@XXXXXX Thought you folks might be interested in this: Frank Gwozdz in Crofton, MD, is selling his 1990 Kawasaki Zephyr - 550. It has about 25,000 miles, maintained well and looks good. He can be contacted at: frank@XXXXXX Bill Gawthrop Maryland From dc-cycles-request Sat Dec 4 19:54:17 1999 Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 19:52:21 -0800 From: JEM Broga Subject: VIR To: DC-Cycles Mailing List X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Anyone have any info on VIR? Check out this aerial view http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.asp?S=12&T=1&X=300&Y=4727&Z=17&W=2- it is of the whole track, which can be run as a big track, but has now been broken down to offer a North or South track option, see http://www.virclub.com/files/newmap.htm. Can you imagine running the whole track? Just look at that straight! (170+ for Hvywieghts?) I'm wondering if anyone on list knows how track will be run. Jonathan From dc-cycles-request Sat Dec 4 20:20:10 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Sat, 4 Dec 1999 20:19:52 EST Subject: Re: VIR To: jbroga@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX There's an open house next weekend (12/11 and 12) that a bunch of people from the FZR400 list are planning on going to... you get to walk the track, check the place out,etc. It should be a pretty cool place. A couple guys made the first open house, and say it looks like it will be a great place to race. I'm probably going to go... my company X-mas party is on the eve of the 11th, so I'll be heading down on Sun the 12th. Also, Keith Code is holding his California Superbike School there in May. Myself, Brad, and possibly a couple other people are planning on going - great school, and we'll get to learn the track before WERA runs it in Jul and Aug ::grin:: - Brian In a message dated 12/4/99 7:58:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbroga@XXXXXX writes: > Anyone have any info on VIR? Check out this aerial view > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.asp?S=12&T=1&X=300&Y=4727&Z=17&W=2- > it is of the whole track, which can be run as a big track, but has now been > broken down to offer a North or South track option, see > http://www.virclub.com/files/newmap.htm. Can you imagine running the whole > track? Just look at that straight! (170+ for Hvywieghts?) I'm wondering if > anyone on list knows how track will be run. > From dc-cycles-request Sun Dec 5 05:15:11 1999 From: McKeithen@XXXXXX Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 05:14:33 EST Subject: Where to rent??? To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Anybody know where I rent a bike for Sunday. Had I ride planned, but picked up a screw in the rear tire and can"t get a replacement til Tuesday. Bob From dc-cycles-request Sun Dec 5 11:27:42 1999 From: "mobacc" To: "Dc Cycles" Subject: Kaw getting scarce locally Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:27:08 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3612.1700 Is this news? (I've missed a few posts recently.) I was told by a Coleman's manager today that they and Cycle Sports are no longer Kawasaki dealers, apparently fallout from the recent changes in ownership to structures not in line with Kaw's policies. He said C'n no longer can get Kaw parts or deal with Kaw officially (warranties, etc.). He referred to Manassas Honda and Cycles USA. Kind of a shock. I figured Kaw would be with C'n 'til global warming seared the paint. (This just in. Someone else said Honda is likewise no longer at C'n.] Bill S. / DC 99 VN750 Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From dc-cycles-request Sun Dec 5 12:07:13 1999 From: "George Howell" To: "mobacc" , "Dc Cycles" Subject: RE: Kaw getting scarce locally Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 11:54:50 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Perhaps Kawasaki doesn't like Coleman any more than the rest of us? ---------------------------------------- -George Howell ghowell@XXXXXX ghowell@XXXXXX georgehowell@XXXXXX "I ride because dogs have the right idea about car windows" From dc-cycles-request Sun Dec 5 15:30:02 1999 Date: Sun, 05 Dec 1999 15:27:56 -0500 From: "Charles V. Pena" X-Accept-Language: en To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: Re: VIR Bryan et al, I'm signed up for CSS Level One at VIR on May 19th (Friday). Looking forward to a great learning experience from Obi-Keith Code-obi! :^) Another friend of mine is also signed up for Level One and another friend is doing Level Two. Chuck '93 GSXR 750 BryanRoach@XXXXXX wrote: > > Also, Keith Code is holding his California Superbike School there in May. > Myself, Brad, and possibly a couple other people are planning on going - > great school, and we'll get to learn the track before WERA runs it in Jul and > Aug ::grin:: -- "Wherever you go, there you are." -- Buckaroo Banzai visit us at http://www.geocities.com/SouthBeach/Lagoon/5098 From dc-cycles-request Sun Dec 5 16:21:26 1999 Date: Sun, 05 Dec 1999 16:19:47 -0800 From: JEM Broga Subject: Re: Kaw getting scarce locally To: Dc Cycles X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Nothing I would love more than to see Coleman reduced to Puch mopeds. Except maybe seeing its sales managers homeless and begging on the streets. Jonathan > Perhaps Kawasaki doesn't like Coleman any more than the rest of us? From dc-cycles-request Sun Dec 5 18:02:58 1999 From: FGrefe@XXXXXX Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 18:02:16 EST Subject: Re: Kaw getting scarce locally To: mobacc@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/5/99 11:31:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, mobacc@XXXXXX writes: > Is this news? (I've missed a few posts recently.) Its news to me. > I was told by a Coleman's manager today that they and Cycle Sports are no > longer Kawasaki dealers, What a shame. > (This just in. Someone else said Honda is likewise no longer at C'n.] But they still have Whizzers! I went by the Falls church store on Friday and they had new Kawasakis on display (Hondas too I think). Selling out the remaining stock at low prices? Fred Grefe GTS1000 From dc-cycles-request Sun Dec 5 22:51:02 1999 Date: Sun, 05 Dec 1999 22:49:11 -0800 From: JEM Broga Subject: VIR - North Course in 2000 To: DC-Cycles Mailing List X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 On the WERA BBS Sean wrote back and let me know that they will run the North Course in 00, perhaps both in 01. For those who haven't been there yet the WERA BSS is pretty useful for racers with questions. Sean Clarke seems to respond to people pretty quick. Jonathan From dc-cycles-request Sun Dec 5 23:45:59 1999 From: "mobacc" To: "Dc Cycles" Subject: RE: Kaw getting scarce locally Date: Sun, 5 Dec 1999 23:45:23 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3612.1700 >-George Howell said: >Perhaps Kawasaki doesn't like Coleman any more than the rest of us? ---------- The word I got from the C'n manager was that K.. doesn't like chain dealerships, which apparently the new owners of both C'n and Cycle Sport are. Hmmm. >Fred Grefe said: >But they still have Whizzers! >I went by the Falls church store on Friday and they had new Kawasakis on >display (Hondas too I think). Selling out the remaining stock at low >prices? My bet. But if someone runs across conflicting relationship info, would love to see it. Bill S. / DC 99 VN750 --> changing shopping centers (health, basics, accessories) Join the AMA. Help protect my riding fun. From dc-cycles-request Mon Dec 6 02:06:22 1999 From: BryanRoach@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999 02:05:45 EST Subject: Re: VIR To: cvkgpena@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX I'm going to call tomorrow and sign up for level two and three over both days... Looks like we should have a good group going down! Also ... looks like I'm taking both my race bikes down with me as a friend from work wants to take level one. He's 99% sure he's only going for the first day, so if someone else was interesting in taking a class on the second day, my US FZR400 will be available (if you promise not to hurt her!) - Brian In a message dated 12/5/99 3:34:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, cvkgpena@XXXXXX writes: > I'm signed up for CSS Level One at VIR on May 19th (Friday). Looking > forward to a great learning experience from Obi-Keith Code-obi! :^) > Another friend of mine is also signed up for Level One and another > friend is doing Level Two. From dc-cycles-request Mon Dec 6 09:55:20 1999 From: christopher.a.weaver@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1999 09:52:23 -0500 Subject: RE: Kaw getting scarce locally To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Content-disposition: inline X-Lotus-FromDomain: AMERICAS-US@INTL I believe I heard about this a little while ago in reference to Cycle Sport. It doesn't suprise me that the same is happening to Coleman, given Kawasaki's apparent reasoning. It seems a bit strange to me that Kawasaki would do this (limit themselves to one-off dealerships). It's probably supposed to be a shot in the arm to local Mom & Pop dealers, but it seems like instead they're shooting themselves in the foot in terms of sales. The big chain dealers do the lion's share of the business, evidenced by the fact that they were prosperous enough to become chains in the first place. Given their large number of new and highly-updated (and hideous, IMO*) bikes for 2000, it seems doubly dangerous to big K's future sales. I hadn't heard anything about Honda doing the same thing, FWIW. On the other hand, like many of us here on the list, I'm certainly happy to hear that Coleman is suffering to some degree. Perhaps this will make them a little more humble. I suspect, though, that it will cause them to price-gouge and cheat their customers to an even greater degree to make up for their losses. This doesn't bother me too much, since it might alienate even more potential Coleman customers and I don't shop there much anyway. Good riddance, I say. BTW, what on earth's a "whizzer"? Chris Weaver '98 VTR 1000 To: Dc Cycles cc: From: mobacc The word I got from the C'n manager was that K.. doesn't like chain dealerships, which apparently the new owners of both C'n and Cycle Sport are. Hmmm. ---------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer. From dc-cycles-request Mon Dec 6 10:07:00 1999 From: "Jordan, Michael" To: dc-cycles@XXXXXX Subject: RE: Kaw getting scarce locally Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999 07:06:19 -0800 >BTW, what on earth's a "whizzer"? Oooh - you ARE a youngster. Basically a production motorized bicycle - late '40s to late '50s. Belt drive to rear wheel (V belt, that is) Had an old one briefly when I was in High School Michael J. From dc-cycles-request Mon Dec 6 10:12:54 1999 From: FGrefe@XXXXXX Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999 10:12:20 EST Subject: Re: Kaw getting scarce and Whizzers To: christopher.a.weaver@XXXXXX, dc-cycles@XXXXXX In a message dated 12/6/99 10:02:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, christopher.a.weaver@XXXXXX writes: > BTW, what on earth's a "whizzer"? I might have spelled it wrong, but its a modern version of what looks like a 100 year old motorized bicycle. They have one on the showroom floor and a sign on the door advertising that they sell Whizzers. Fred Grefe GTS1000 From dc-cycles-request Mon Dec 6 11:38:25 1999 From: Cedric Bernescut Reply-To: "bernescut@XXXXXX" To: "dc-cycles@XXXXXX" Subject: RE: Kaw getting scarce locally Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1999 11:37:43 -0500 Organization: NCEA My guess is that the chain dealers are probably trying to negotiate better pricing from Kawasaki corporate and the company is basically telling them where they can stick their price book :0 . The same thing has been happening big time in the automotive dealership industry over the last couple of years as most of the independent dealers are getting bought up by chains who are squeezing the manufacturers for lower prices exclusive to their dealership group. I too, was told